Riding on fumes.....that sputtering gets to wear you down, doesn't it?

{{{{LLG}}}}

Does your H's chain of command know about his infidelity? You don't have to get anyone court-martialed to get results.

TL,

The OW'sH you mentioned....other than working on himself during the deployment, did he do anything else in terms of MB?

Those who don't know, I am in Iraq right now.

Those who do, I am still trying to get a last name and unit #.

Have a good one all.

TreadingLightly,


Well yes and no. His immediate superior did know. He was a real respectful, caring person. He got onto both of them right off and seperated them (in the same office only though). However he just left. PCS somewhere else. Now I don't know who is over my H.

I was keeping in contact with his superior every so often because my H dind't want to talk much about it and her H but stopped b/c I thought she was about to meet him where he is. I'm seriously considering talking to him again and my H's boss also again.

LLG, if I were you, I'd tell my H that if he didn't do something to insure NC, I would. I'd then march my hiney right into that office and let his superiors know, if that's what it took. If there's one thing you don't need, it's the instability of daily contact. Your H will NOT be an asset to the unit if he's saddled with divorce proceedings, so it's in the unit's best interests to make efforts to separate these two PERMANENTLY. Most commanders (most...don't want to paint any sweeping generalizations) are supportive of marital issues when you respectfully present your predicament and don't expect them to move mountains. Let your WH's superiors know that you don't want to interfere with their mission or with unit cohesion, but that your H's current working conditions are placing a severe hardship on your marriage and you'd like to know if there is ANY way for things to be altered in favor of rebuilding marital unity. There is also a good chance that the commander could give your husband a "strong suggestion" (just short of an order) to attend counseling.

USSoldier, the OW'sH in our sitch is divorcing his W, all of the marriage-building he tried to do was prior to D-day. This was his second bout with her infidelity and he just finally decided he'd had enough. He was pretty active on this forum a while ago, the folks here ended up being pretty much his only support. He did the best he could, but he ended up losing all feelings for his W. He also spent the last two and a half years off and on antidepressants, lost his position due to PTSD that was compounded an hundredfold thanks to his W's actions, and was "grounded" from any deployment. I really wish he'd have had someone he could have leaned on emotionally. He's a close family friend and I love the man dearly, but even though I offered *some* support, he needed more than I could morally or ethically give him. I'm not saying this to depress you, but please, make sure you've got someone watching your back, ok? Even if you can't do everything you'd be able to do offensively and defensively for your M if you were home, your mind and your heart need to stay intact.

USS, I've done a little more mind-bending to try to remember some of the things the OW'sH did from a distance before his heart gave out. He actually did more from thousands of miles away than my own H ever did--it broke my heart to see the man trying so hard only to have his efforts thrown back in his face. He sent his WW little teddy bears (she had amassed quite a collection of the Me to You bears in the time he was away), romantic notes, called her constantly, emailed all the time, sent her a copy of HN/HN that they read through and discussed together, he really did everything he could to meet her EN's for conversation and affection. Problem was, she was involved with my H. Nothing her H did made any deposit at all in her Love Bank, because she'd convinced herself that her own H didn't care.

See, that's unfortunately the power of that elusive "fog" everyone talks about. While the WS's head is in it, nothing the BS does makes a hill of beans. That's why ending the A is so important--until that supply of Love Unit deposits is cut off from the OP (and yes, even a slight "fix" will keep that account open and very much active), all the work in the world won't endear the WS to the BS. By the time the A was outed in our sitch, the OW's H was so exhausted and his Love Bank was so overdrawn....well, there was nothing left.

I can fully understand why you want to do things in the order you're planning. Just be careful with yourself. Don't focus on doing "everything she needs" until you know for absolutely certain that the A is over and that NC is in place. Your energies need to go to self-preservation right now, mentally and physically. It sounds like you're doing well. Keep it up.

I don't quite have the nerve for this one again. When we had an argument recently my H made a statement that concerned me. But I let it go. Now to find out that OW is still on the job....I'm wondering. I did talk to her H. He said there was a sitch with her orders so that's why she hasn't left yet.

He seems to be a little concerned but doesn't want to get in worry mode since he is far away. Can't do anything about it right now. But he is in a higher position I would think he could talk to soemone to have the sitch observed from afar.

LLG, I'm not sure I understand your second paragraph. Were you talking about the OW'sH being concerned but not wanting to be in worry mode? I think I'd be more than a "little" concerned if I were in his boots.

If you don't have the nerve to deal with the military side of things, I'd like to suggest you read "Love Must Be Tough". You may be able to glean something from it that will back up the Plan A and prompt your H to act in favor of your M.

Hang in there.

Hi Treadlightly, I meant to say that I thought that the deployments / travel associated with the military lifestyle make cheating more tempting and easier, but I think that other than that-the dynamics if infidelity are roughly the same as with a non-military couple.

I wanted to read the other folks' experiences to actually confirm whether this was the case or not...

Yes, I meant her H. He is trying to stay out of worry mode. I felt also that he might want to look deeper into the sitch but I think he just feels the sitch will roll over.


Yes, I'm a little shaky and tired to do it again.
THinking about going through the days of him being angry and not talking to me, just seems a waste of effort. He hasn't done things any differently than he is doing them now.

That book sounds interesting, "Love Must Be Tough". I'll look into it. I'm trying to read "His needs Her needs" also.

Well, CinnamonSugar, my H hasn't traveled or been deployed since 2003. His A occurred right under my nose while he was at home. He hasn't been away from me except for work since D-day, but his secure computer gave him ample means to continue contact with the OW. I'm not sure that the military made anything "easier" with respect to him having his A but some of the things that are paramount to recovery that we've found "extra" challenges with are:

**Transparency and radical honesty--this only goes so far when you literally have a gag order on your daily activities due to operational security, and it's impossible for me to have access to my H 24/7. I literally did not sleep every night he was on staff duty after D-day. I laid awake shaking uncontrollably and slept only when he was home next to me.
**Extraordinary precautions--there is only so much we can do to insure NC. Dr. Harley advocates even moving to another state if necessary to prevent contact with the OP, but unless the military says so, we have no choice but to stay put. Jobs stay the same. My H and I were blessed to have a fluke happen just four months past D-day when we got orders for an overseas assignment, but that rarely happens. In a good number of cases I've seen even on this forum, military couples are "stuck" trying to maintain NC without moving, and quite often they're located in a small town where the OP is also "stuck" waiting for another assignment.
**Timelines--these are a nightmare. When you have a "deadline" of an upcoming field exercise or deployment or even a PCS, everything (including the marriage) gets pushed off to the side. It has to.
**Stigmas--I personally detest these. In our seventeen years, I have only known a very small handful of military folks whose marriages were affected by infidelity. Yet there are countless millions willing to say that infidelity "runs rampant" in the military. I truly don't think it's any more "rampant" in the military than out, to be honest. My H was not some stereotypical beast just waiting for the opportunity to cheat, and his A shocked everyone who knew him--military and otherwise. Yet when I have approached anyone in the military community for help since D-day, I was looked down on as yet another poor sod who couldn't keep her wandering husband faithful. I've also heard "When the cat's away, the mouse will play" so many times in reference to the "typical" left-behind, sex-crazed housewife that I was left wondering if these folks even believe military marriages CAN be infidelity-free. Maybe stigmas are one of those things that crosses over into civilian life, I don't know. I just know that I got to a point where I stopped asking for help within the military community, because I felt like an instant outcast.
**Distance from family/close friends--this was the biggest problem for me, personally. When I fell apart on D-day, I was 5 hours away from the nearest family member, 5 hours away from my best (female) friend, and I really did feel like I had nowhere to run and no support. My local "friends" were instant problems. I dealt with a nervous breakdown completely by myself, and I quite literally had not a single person (other than my H, who was reeling from the whole mess himself and working 24-hour-shifts anyway) to help me through it. All this while taking care of a newborn and a one-year-old. I was a wreck, and it kills me that all of my support was so far away. It was weeks before I was able to venture out of the immediate area and visit my parents. Now that we've moved overseas, even the 5-hour drive is an impossibility. During the worst of my H's withdrawal and when I was literally ready to walk out the door, all (and I do mean ALL) of my "shoulders to lean on" were and are a long-distance phone call away. Of course this does happen in civilian marriages as well, but not nearly as often as with military ones. Just another perk of the job.

I'm not saying we have it "harder" in recovery, but there certainly are challenges there that wouldn't be there if the primary breadwinner wore a suit instead of camouflage. One of the biggest hurdles that my H and I have had to overcome is the emotional distance that 15 years of military service caused. We had no choice over those years but to put a bit of a wall between us. If we hadn't, we'd have never survived the hardships. Problem is, we were never given the tools to bring the wall down when we no longer needed it. Defense mechanisms are good when you're under attack, but they really make life difficult when you're trying to make peace and foster healthy relationships.

We are having to re-learn SO much--about everything. It's not coming easy. Soon (ok, so three years isn't exactly soon, but it feels that way!) we'll have the luxury of putting the POJA and PORH into practice for REAL, spend that good chunk of time together, and we'll be in a situation where our marriage can, at last, be a priority. But for now, mission first.

They say the Internet has made cheating easy / convenient. They also say the Internet has generated new ways of cheating too...

I found your comments to be interesting


I would tend to think that this concept applies to relationship issues, not workplace issues.


I think Dr. H has some great things to say; however I do not necessarily agree with some aspects of his philosophy on this one...It seems to me that a cheater will cheat, and if one mistress becomes unavailable they'll simply find a new one.


You made a good point here. I would say that the miltary draws its numbers from the general population so trends among military memners will closely mimic those in the civilian world. But-people always have something negative to say about "those military people."



This is a very good point, but I don't see this as being directly related to cheating unless we're talking about the recovery stage. In some cases family and friends can make things worse though. It depends on their values and whether they are supportive & respectful of your marriage.

Oh, and just as a bit of a sidenote, I was not "on board" with all of Dr. Harley's advice for those in infidelity recovery when I originally came here (under another username) over a year ago. Then again, I never fully believed until I was confronted with the reality that this had indeed happened in MY marriage that I'd do anything but immediately move out and divorce my H for breaking our vows. You learn and grow from real-life experience, and the tools found in Harley's books (as well as several others) and on this site have been integral to my personal and marital recovery. I shot myself in the foot on many occasions by trying to "fix" things with the OW personally (between me and her) and I didn't fully believe that NC for life and taking extraordinary precautions was of utmost importance. Over the last 16 months, my beliefs have changed 100%, and so have those of my H. I have found more comfort in extraordinary precautions and the principles that will protect and preserve romantic love than I have found in any other "method" of caring for a marriage.
My point in starting this thread was not to wallow in a "woe is me, life is so hard" pity party at the military's expense, but rather to learn from other military couples how to better integrate Harley's principles into military life, because there are of course many concessions that have to be made. There are some amazingly creative and intelligent people here; I have learned much already, I seek only to learn more, to improve the marriage my H and I are rebuilding.

Peace to you, CinnamonSugar. I hope that you never find yourself in the circumstances that the vast majority of people on this board have come here for help with.

TL,

Ok, I've been urged by several people to look into this matter again regarding H with working with OW. It is suppose to be that she is leaving soon. I think I want to talk to my H a little first. I found out who is the new person over him but I don't thnk I need to stop at this person. With your being aware more than I being that you and H have been in military system longer how would you suggest I find out who is over his direct superior? Thanks.

TL,

Hi. I've added u to my address book. I saw you were out here. If you don't mind and you have time would you mind posting to my thread. And I haven't talked to my Hs superior yet, if you remember me. I'm the chick wh's H's 2nd OW worked with him.

H may be angry enough to look into the big "D"

LLG,

Your H should have a recall roster that should give the chain of command. If it doesn't go up that far, you might want to see who typed the roster and contact them for more information. JMHO