A little history first. My wife and I have been married for 11 years and have been together for 16 years. We have two wonderful children. I have always absolutely adored my wife, and she has always been very aware of this. Our current work schedules keep us apart 4 nights/week, and we haven't made it a point for the past year to focus on "us" time. We made a conscious decision (mutually) that I work my swing shift so that one of us is always with our children (they are not quite old enough yet to be left alone).

I noticed a huge difference in her behavior approximately 3 weeks ago, and confronted her. She told me that she did not know if she loved me anymore, and thought that we needed to spend time apart. She also told me that there was a lack of attaction towards me. Needless to say, this was like a huge kick in the gut. I told her that we had spent the last year apart, and that spending more time apart was not going to help. She agreed.

The first week I was really emotional (remember, I adore her). She said that this just pushed her away. I told her that she couldn't just expect me to accept what she had told me like it was nothing. The second week I began to catch my breath, and she appeared to be coming around. She wanted to go visit family for a 4 day weekend because she wanted space. I gave her the space, and I took our kids with me to my mother's for the weekend. When she came home, she was angry with me and totally withdrawn.

I have been doing all of the work to try to save what has been an incredible relationship. She acknowledges that we have had a great relationship until recently and insists that I have done nothing wrong. I am 100% certain that there is not another man. I have set several things in place to allow us to spend much more time together (change of work schedule, coming home for dinner, etc...). I read "The 5 Love Languages" by Dr. Chapman, and it really helped me to refocus. I asked my wife if she would read it and give me feedback. She said she would, but hasn't. She has told me that she would do several things, but does not follow through. I have also read all of the sections on this site, which helped. She has not provided me with any feedback on what I can due to try to help her through this. When I try to talk to her, she walks away. I am now withdrawing and getting upset.

I am really fighting to keep this family together. Our kids figured out what was going on even though we have made every effort to not discuss things in front of them. I am constantly trying to reassure them, but late night phone calls of worry are starting to really affect me. I feel sorry for the kids.

She finally told me that she would be willing to go to couples counseling. We have plans to talk tonight, and things seem to be relaxing a little (mostly because I have). It's almost like the more I appear to withdraw the more interested she becomes in trying to work things out (this is odd for her).

Looking for suggestions on how to proceed. Sorry so long, but lots of history on this.

Have you gone into sleuth mode to see if she is having an affair?

No, and I won't. She is a very spiritual person, and it is not her style. She doesn't have time, because when I'm not with the kids, she is. I think that this is simply a lack of quality "us" time. That has been lacking for quite some time. I trust her, and always will.

Also, she has been showing some signs of coming around. I guess I'll know more tonight.

She might and you should!!!

My EX had an affair with a minister in our last church. She claims to be spiritual herself. Your wifes mood and actions leads me to believe she is either seeing someone, or really wants to. Why am I thinking this you ask? My EX.....(EX).....started acting the same exact way.....saying the same exact things. I didnt think she was having an affair either until she started being up/down like your wife is acting. Dont be suprised if there is someone else.

Trust me, that was the first thing that crossed my mind. But why would she agree to MC? She has to know that it will come out. I can see why you would think that is the case, but I am not convinced. I'm not trying to stick my head in the sand on this. I just didn't see any deception when I asked (3 times). Her entire family also doesn't believe that there is someone else (they've all asked). I could be wrong, but don't think that is what is going on.

first off i was in your situation 2 months ago. WS are the greatest liers in the world they will say anything to anybody. when me and her family would ask her if there was someone else her defense was to get very angry and and say why can't anyone understand that i can feel this way (love u but not in love) without there being someone else? if i were u i would snoop!!! if i didnt our marriage would be scores worse than it is right now. im so glad i snooped. because we are working on recovering instead of me believing how innocent she said she was.

The BIBLE talks about things done in secret taste sweet, but bitter as gall in the stomach.

Do not trust anything until you yourself have proof that it aint so.

My WW was i n the same position. Now i weep from not listening to my instincts.

It is part of protecting your family.

protect her.

My EX denied she was having an affair even after I found hard evidence.......50-75 phone calls to one number on her cellphone bill. My kids telling me that they went to dinner with some guy (became her B/F) after we divorced.

Her own parents asked her.....she said "there was noone else". They called me and said "we asked our daughter, she would not lie to us". They said I was too jealous and to not be so controlling. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

My EXs-Inlaws can hardly look me in the eye now.

I agree - it can happen to even the most 'spritual' My FWS never missed a Sunday.

It was so out of character for him. I was stunned.

I thought he didn't have time either. He was always at work. Yep, he was- at work chatting and emailing with her.

She may be in an Emotional Affair and maybe she agreed to the MC because she wants to stop it. Maybe.

Waywards lie - they get real good at it.

Snoop like crazy. Hopefully you won't discover an affair but it sure sounds like it from reading your post.

My EX was spending ALOT of her free time at church......hmmmmm??? Also she worked overtime quite a bit during that time. Does your wife have any othe outside activities during the week? Does she work extra hours???

These could lead to a red flag or two.

bg, I don't mean to alarm you, but my husband agreed to counseling in January, and he LIED through his TEETH for four months. The counseldor didn't even catch on that he was having an affair.

I really hate to say this, but she's showing ALL the signs. Believe me, I went through the SAME thing. I had NO IDEA husband was carrying on, just got all that babble talk about not be sure what he wanted, if he loved me, blah blah.

Check into it bg. I'm sorry. I know these words stab your heart. I know the sheer terror at the thought of it, but I think she's having an affair, or at least close to having one. I said the same thing, I was "100%" sure. Everyone tried to tell me. I refused to believe. Then the ax fell ...

PS--My WS is spiritual, too. Even took OW to church with him! How crazy is that?

God Bless ...

RLT

I am sorry to tell you this, but she is probably having an affair. She is saying all the classic things like "I need space," "I am not in love" "I am not attracted anymore." Her withdrawn behavior is CLASSIC affair behavior.

Of course she will be deceptive, because she knows very well it is wrong. It is unrealistic to expect her to bust herself if she is in an affair.

Most waywards ARE very good people who know right from wrong but when they are in an affair, they become professional, adept liars to cover up the affair.

The first thing you must do, my friend, is RULE OUT an affair. And I do not mean asking her if she is having an affair [that is a completely useless tactic] but in doing some sleuthing on your own.

Check your phone bill, put a keylogger on your computer, put a tap on your phone, put a voice activated recorder in the car, hire a PI. Go check her emails on the computer. But do this all on the sly.

That way, if she is innocent, you won't have insulted her by insinuating there is an affair. And if you do find something, you will know what is really going on. And you can't move forward here until you do have all the facts.

Have you verified her whereabouts for this entire weekend? Needing "space" is ALWAYS code for need "space" to carry on my affair.

bg... I have to agree with Mel and the rest on here.

The signs are classic for an A... even if it has not turned physical, an emotional affair is just as deadly and sometimes worse for a M.

My W and OM also attended church together. Her twin sister and other close people assured me that this was not happening...my W would not do this and OM would never hurt his wife. It was happening. She lied to everyone.

We have kids, we both worked, attended church functions (we were both in a worship team along with OM) my MIL was even living in the house with us... not lots of time to conduct an A, but it was mostly happening at her work. OM would meet her for lunch, etc..

I thought my W was "not the type" as well. We never believe it can happen to us. It sounds like a similar M in that I treated my W like a queen (so I thought... there is a lot more about this topic I won't go into here).

As to agreeing to MC. This may be a positive step....but if she is having an A, this could end up being the "nail on the coffin". Someone in an A needs to justify and rationalize. They need to believe they are still good and doing what is best for everyone. Going to MC could mean that she can further rationalize that she tried to save the M and it just wasn't meant to be. She put the effort in so her family will understand when it ends.

I hope that I am wrong with all of this. But it is better to know the truth and be wrong, then to lose your M because you would not entertain this possibility. Do the work. Your W won't tell you if it is happening so you need to find out in other ways.

You will get a lot of help through this here if it is happening.

Shaden

EXACTLY! Well said!

Last night went horribly. She is totally shut down and will not listen to what she knows is right. I have always suspected the possibility of someone else, but had told myself that I was not going to demonstrate jealous behavior. I had already begun trying to check emails, which she can quickly get rid of. I've also tried to find out who all of our contacts are on instant messaging. Today I contacted her cell phone company, the phone is in my name, and requested past phone records. I wanted text messages as well, but they said they couldn't provide that.

My gut tells me that it is somebody at her work. She is the type of person who would feel guilty even if it were an emotional affair, although I haven't ruled out physical. She has a lot to lose, and has every reason to lie. Also, she knows that infidelity is the one thing that I am not willing to forgive.

I am now staying at my brother's house, and told her that I will not be in contact with her. She knows where I am, and can come to me. I am also going to schedule a marriage counseling session, and call her to tell her when and where it is. If she shows, great, if not, I have my answer.

My goal is to take back some power. Maybe she will realize what she is losing. At this point, I think it is wishful thinking.

Many here probably thought that way before it happened... and I think it is ok to set this as a boundary as you have. But most react differently when it does happen... and if it has, it is not the end of the world. The stuff I am learning about myself and how our marriage is growing leads me to believe I am going to have a better, more fulfilling marriage in the future. Personally I didn't have this boundary before simply because I didn't even think about it. I guess I grew up sheltered and naive... I knew it was prevalent in this world, but it never crossed my mind that it would happen...EVEN knowing the fact that my W had an EA five years prior. Taking that step to PA was not a possibility to me.


I hope that you are meaning your goal is to show some power... to be confident and bold... believing in yourself. Because "taking back" power indicates that you believe this is a competition for one to win and another to lose. The goal is to become a strong, confident person who is capable of being a partner in a strong, committed relationship.



...bin there, done that. This manipation does not work. Again I think you probably mean something slightly different than your words say... but it is a fine line between fighting her and fighting for your marriage. You can manipulate external factors, like exposing an A or gathering facts. But you cannot manipulate another persons thoughts or feelings.

I have often thought this way... maybe she will realize what she will lose... but instead you want to focus on showing her what she can gain. Slight differences in thinking, maybe, but huge differences in results.


If you try to force her to hear what you think is right, she will run further away. She has to come to this on her own. She may or may not.

What happened that you think last night went horribly? Why did you move out? Are you ready for Plan B... not in contact with her? If so, you should not be going to MC with her. I think most here would say, though, that it is too early for Plan B.

What answer are you looking for? It appears like you have already made up your mind.

Keep posting and asking questions. This is not over by a longshot, but you will need to take a step back from your emotions and get some help in seeing where you are at and deciding on a plan. There are many here who can help.

You are doing alright... this is a shock to any who go through it. Try not to make any rash decisions when you are angry, upset, or afraid. This is when you make your worst decisions. In your first post, you sounded like you wanted to hold onto your marriage... don't let your emotions change what you know is right.

Patience,

Shaden

It sounded from your last post, bg, that you are now accepting the possibility of an A. I believe that is a step forward. Getting clarity on what you are fighting against puts the battle on better ground.

Shaden

I appreciate all who are helping.

I certainly do not look at this as a battle. I am fighting for my marriage and the woman whom I love dearly. This is not a me vs. her situation. I have been a very good husband to her, and she was a great wife (until recently).

My whole thought process has been that the only way we can overcome this is to do it together. I am now realizing that the only way we may overcome this is if we are apart. I told her this morning that I am giving her all of the space that she wants, and that I will not be contacting her.

I have not made up my mind about this marriage being over, not by a long shot. I have told her that I will not agree to a divorce until we have tried everything possible to save what has been a great marriage. I am done pursuing her, and know that it just pushes her further away (which is really twisted).

I guess some information may come to light when I receive the phone records. I pray that I am wrong, but am trying to prepare myself for the worst.

Actually, what often happens... when someone is moving away from you and you pursue, they feel threatened and run further away... this is not the "play hard to get" from high school. But when you stop pursuing and work on yourself, even move in the opposite direction, they will stop running and sometimes move back toward you.

This is talked about in the book "Tough Love".

Plan A takes on some of these characteristics... to become the rock standing firm... not pursuing or being needy. To work on yourself, to be loving and patient, to set personal boundaries, etc.. This is about becoming the best you and the best husband you can be. Other than finding out about an A and doing things to attack the A, you cannot do anything to change your W.

If your W is in an A, giving her "space" usually does not work. That is what they want... the freedom and time to pursue their new "love". Plus they further rationalize that you are not caring or there for them.

It is a narrow path, but I think the most effective way is to be there, be visible, but not pursuing. Being a fantastic person and husband, but not clinging or needy. Enjoy life, be charismatic and strong. Be the person your W fell in love with to begin with.

When I mentioned a battle... it was fighting against the A if there is one... not fighting your W. If you are fighting against an A, you are fighting a fantasy... one without bills or dirty diapers or todo lists. That is why it is important to find out for certain if there is an A. Your plan changes according to this "little" detail. If there is one, there are things that can be done to shine the light on the fantasy and show it for what it really is.

You said you are trying to prepare yourself for the worst... and you may be right in saying this. But in my situation, I went 2 months how you are now, and it was agonizing. When I finally found out the truth that there was an A, my mental state became tougher. I knew what I was fighting, and once I read about the nature of A's, I realized all that I was hearing from my W was fog talk. It still hurt, but there was hope.

Patience,

Shaden