I'm going to paste in my post from the Plan A/Plan B site. Well, it's been a long while since I've posted here. Things with WH had been ok,going through Plan A although he had moved out. Still seeing him for dinner with kids two nights a week and on weekends. Even took me out for my birthday. Wanted to do something nice for me on my special day last Sunday.

Then last night while 2 boys were staying with grandpa, DD and I went to check up on WH. She was asleep, only a baby, but I still feel like a bad mom. Found car at OW place at 6am, having been there all night. We had been there at 9:30. Decided I was going to confront when he came for another scheduled date, just the two of us. But instead sat down and wrote Plan B letter and left it for him on the door. Also sent copy with extra note to OW as in SAA.

He had, I know, fog talk, told me repeatedly that he hadn't gone past the kissing stage and wouldn't further jeopardize things with us by doing so. It's obvious that was more lies. He arrived 2 hours early last week for my birthday dinner date and I had it confirmed by his sister, where he is currently living, that he didn't come home that night either. It was the final blow.

Have made arrangements with my best friend who is married to the guy at the next desk to WH at work. They will handle communications for arranging time with kids. My mom will have them for him to pick up and for at least the first day, relieve him when it's time for him to leave. I'll probably have him return the kids to mom's, but unsure yet.

If there is anyone with advice on how to handle the transfers, it would be greatly appreciated.

Told the kids all the important stuff about us both loving them, none of this is their fault, daddy still wants to see them as he has been but mommy won't be there when he comes b/c daddy has hurt her feelings too much and I can't talk to him. So hard without giving the full truth, but they're only 8 and 6, and the baby girl is only 17 months.

Any help? Thoughts? Advice?

Looking into IC more now. Talked with GP and got a referral but thought I should try to cope on my own before. Am reconsidering with all the pain I feel right now. Luckily I have a student teacher and she will be taking over the classroom responsibilities over the next couple of weeks. That will take some pressure at work off and I'll be able to leave if I feel a crying jag come on.

I've also been thinking of sending him a box of condoms with a note to at least be smart in that regard. Too much?

I had broke my NC already only becasue the note he left in response said that he understood this next step to be because he hadn't made a decision or move towards NC. He seemed to think I made this to further pressure him to make a decision soon. Left a voicemail message to be certain that he knew I knew about staying overnight and that it wasn't part of playing a pressure game. Wasn't certain his sister would let him know we talked and she confirmed his staying.
I need help!! I'm loisng it!

I just finished a long ranting email to my WH. Iback tracked a bit on the plan, we can make arrangements over email, but I can't see him. It hurts so much! I ranted, rambled, gushed, MAJOR LOVE BUSTERS!

I haven't sent yet but really want to.

WHAT TO DO!?????

The more you stick with NC in plan B the easier it w/b to recover. The more contact you have with a WS, the slower your personal recovery will be.

Note: The WS wants to see you in pain and anguish. It is your choice NOT to let that happen.

Reduce the contact. Keep it to a minimum. Via a 3rd party w/b best. Expect at some point for the 3rd party contact to end or when you w/b strong enough to handle the WS w/o it inflicting unbearable pain.

The more you WANT to contact, the more you should NOT.

JMHO,
L.

Are you saying you want to go to plan b...

if so you need to write a love-letter defining boundaries.

not a knee jerked angry letter or a box of condoms...

have you written a plan B letter yet....

ARK

orchid -- I have to disagree that the WS "wants" to see the BS in pain and anguish. Its a result of their selfish addiction -- but its not the purpose. They don't begin an affair as a way to hurt the BS. The BS isn't in the equation at all.

arky -- she said she wrote it and left it on his door (2nd paragraph)

angie -- do not contact him! And absolutely NOT on the condoms. You just left him a letter telling him that it was too painful to you and to give you peace. You have to stay true to that. Otherwise you are crossing your own boundries. Let him wonder about you.

Can you tell us what your letter said??

lexxxxxy,



I disagree with that statement. The properties of an A are very strongly based on anger aimed at the BS and directed inward at the WS themselves.

Well, Cy -- all dynamics are different. But having been in those shoes I feel qualified to say that it was never my intent to "hurt" my spouse. I intended for him to never know about it. At the point of my affair, I just wanted him to leave me alone, and I wanted nothing to do with him.

It was never because I WANTED him to have PAIN and ANGUISH.

I would agree with Lexxxy here.

I still don't know what my W has discovered about her reasons for her A... but from what I've perceived and figured out... that it was not to hurt me. I believe she lost herself from so many reasons... childhood issues, bad job, kids, smothered by a fearful, doting husband, her Mom moved in with us and was taking control... so many "reasons"... but none, I believe, aimed at hurting me.
(maybe it's just easier to believe this)

In some cases this does happen... as in the case of an exit affair. But it is different situations and different reasons. (IMHO)

Lexxy,



Sorry but I just blew my coffee out of my nose after reading your statement. An A is the most vile act perpetrated on a BS. Any statement by a WS that tries to negate that overpowering destruction rendered at their BS and their M is either very naive or very, very self serving. That statement is one that is often blurted out by children as an excuse for their actions

I know I absolutely did not have my EA to hurt my BH. I wasnt' thinking of him at all, just my selfishness. He doesnt' believe it, but that is true. I in no way thought about the hurt it would do to him or our family. It just "felt good" so I did it. Pathetic, but true for me.

Cy --
I don't want to battle to the death over this, we're getting off track of helping Angie.

We are talking about INTENT here. I seriously doubt many WS think "hmmmmm....what can I do that will cause my spouse the most possible PAIN and ANGUISH...oh!...I think I'll have an affair!"

Like MrsRob said -- I never thought about him at all. I never even considered his feelings. He hardly existed to me other than to get in my way when I wanted to call or see OM.

Cy -- I am not a WS anymore -- so I don't condone those actions. I'm simply talking about the thought-process a WS goes through.

Now -- Angie. Can you post your plan B letter so we know its contents?
Have you talked to your intermediaries about the MB methods? It might help them understand their role and what your ultimate goal is.
Please let your Plan B work on your WH. You don't need to correct his thinking. He is right -- this IS one of the consequences of him continuing his affair. He need to know that and feel the pain of it.
Now stop communicating with him, and focus on yourself.

Lexxy,

U know I respect your posts. You bring good insight to us. My point about the WS wanting to see the BS in pain and anguish is usually not the plan at the beginning but becomes so as the A progresses. The urge to bring mental, emotional and sometimes physical pain from the Ws to the family (especially the BS) has been atested to by many WS.

The plain fact that most xWS' can't believe they acted this bad shows how much this selfish virus is deeply entrenched.

Bottom line is the pain is real and the so is the source.

JMHO,
L.

Lexxy and all-
sorry it's taken a bit for me to respond to the many posts. I forgot that I had moved my question here until tonight.

My letter was pretty much what is in the SAA. When i read the one in there, I couldn't have said anything much better. I used the tone and outline for my letter. I told him how much his affair and lying had hurt me, what pain it's bringing to me and our children, that seeing him is too painful. I took responsibility for my part in creating the environment that pled to the A, and said that I felt we could still have a happy life, we had done so before after he had contacted her, no PA then, and we could do so again.

It probably seems wrong or whatever that I used that as a guide. It wasn't verbatim. I added many things to suit my/our situation and other things that I knew would come up.

But I also feel like I can't handle not seeing him. My chest hurts, I've lost 5 pounds in 5 days from not eating, and I can cry at the drop of a piece of dust. I struggle all day at work teaching 1st graders and worry that I'm going to break down in front of them or when I'm alone and then have to try to recover and explain red eye s and nose. I look SO horrible when I even tear up.

I want to take it back and see him despite what I discovered to get to that point, writing the letter. Each day feels like a month, and I've already renigged on talking. We only do through email, and I know I shouldn't, but it's so hard. I didn't want to inconvenience others in my life with my mess having them be around for when he gets the kids. So he picks them up at my mom's, I hide upstairs, and I park out front at an agreed time for him to drive out and then I go in.

Last night was the first time since the letter he came for the kids. i sat out front, for nosey neighbors to see and all, and he had to wait at the end of the drive in front of me for traffic. From the moment I saw him start down the drive till he passed me, I kept my head and eyes down.

This hurts so much. I finally called a shrink today for an appt. Waiting for the call back to schedule. I think I starting to feel a bit on the suicidal, not that I want to hurt myself b/c I do'nt want that for my kids, but I wish I wasn't going through this so much that I would rather be dead, or gone, or something. It's worse than if he had died. Iwant him so much, to be with him, for him to confort me like he does when I feel horrible, eve though he's the one that's made me this way. I fear it is over and that I will never feel whole or happy or be able to stop crying. Mu chest hurts, my head hurts, my stomach hurts.

It was a bit amusing that my WS told me DS, age 6, said lastnight that I told DS daddy was saying mean things to mommy. I talked to son and at that age it equates at school to someone saying something mean when your feelings are hurt.

I just don't know how to handle this pain. I have slept about 5 hours in the last two nights, not easy with 3 kids home and 20 at school.

I need help getting through this and hate even talking to my best friend about it b/c it causes her pain and I don't want to be the always depressed, killer or a good day kind of friend. So I put on my brave face and try not to talk about it b/c even at school when I do I crash and breakdown.

I want my life, my marriage, my husband back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just for the record. I didn't do the box of condoms. I did mention calmly that I hoped he agreed/understood that she wasn't to have any contact with our children and that I hoped he was smart enough to take precautions to keep another child from coming into this mess. Just the thought of him sleeping with her, even before coming to see me and kiss me, makes me want to throw up

get on anti-depressents -- they will help you over the sharp pain.

Now that you have implemented Plan B -- let it work. Don't chat with him, don't see him!

I get the impression from your post that you are communicating with him during pick-up/drop-offs or at some other point. This undermines your boundry. He will have no respect for it if you don't enforce it.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{angiemoose}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
I'm so glad to see you came back here for support!

All I can do is support what others are saying. Email with your h is still contact. You have to stop all contact between the two of you. I remember someone describing it as "going dark."

I took Excedrin PM to help me sleep. Until you see a doctor, that would be an easily available help for you to get sleep. Lack of sleep and exhaustion will weaken your ability to deal with this stress.

Energy is focusable (is that a word? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />). You can direct energy .... channel it. Try to move your stress and anxiety (energy) toward something positive and healthy. Throw that energy into fun things with your kids, with your friends, with your classroom.

Surround yourself with positive energy. Ditch anything that pulls you down (for me Country music became taboo for awhile). I listened to classical or gospel music in my car. This was absolutely vital! Car drives were an opportunity for my mind to drift and dwell on things.

If you are having trouble eating, make sure what you eat has as much nutrition as possible. I kept 'energy bars" (my favorite was crunchy oats and honey) with me all the time. And I tried very hard to eat at least two a day.

Get physical exercise. I don't remember the whole science of it .... but I do remember that physical exercise will release important {insert scientific word here} that helps us deal with extreme stress. Take the kids out for a walk. Dance with the kids to upbeat fun music.

{{{{{Angie}}}}}}
As much as you can, control your environment for awhile to keep you safe, well, and strong. Underline strong --- emotionally physically and spiritually. I believe you are your number one priority right now. Because if you are taking care of yourself, it will be easier to take care of those who depend upon you.

Don't second guess yourself on this, Angie. You've made a decision. Now you work it. Start thinking NOW about what your h will absolutely have to agree to before you will resume contact with him. Focus yourself on what is next not what was.

{{{{{{{Angiemoose}}}}}}
hns

Thanks Lexxxy and Heart. Heart - I've been coming back almost daily but not much new had been happening till tis weekend. Good to hear from you again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I know you're both right but I worry/second guess anyway because I miss him so much. I only found out about the A 2 months ago. After one month I asked him to move out b/c he wouldn't be honest and open. Too soon?, but this isn't the first time with her since we've been married, just the first PA, I think. Then when I found him there at in the very early morning, even though things were very pleasant and we were learning to talk to one another again, I couldn't do it anymore. MOre lies when I gave him SOOOO many chances to tell me the truth.

Even in the not so great times, he was still my best friend and I feel lost without him. I want to take it all back no matter how hard just to be able to have some part of him. I know I can't. Yesterday there was email communication about us and the letter for Plan B and I knocked myself again today and tried to reinforce my will power to not talk to him at all. I sent very brief message with only necessary items for kids when he picked them up tonight. No niceties, no "I love you or miss yous", just this is homework, they need showers.

I know I have to not talked to him, it's so hard and hurts so much. I've called the shrink but haven't heard back and can't reach. Left messages with service. Taking Tylenol PM would be an option but DD of 17 mos. tomorrow still gets up and I worry that I won't be able to get up. I've taken it once before and was so groggy. I think I'll try just 1. I only slept 3 hours last night.

His repsonse to my letter said he still wanted to move forward with us and knows what he needs to do and agrees with it, but right now he needs her in his life as much as me but in a different way, as a friend. Yesterday my final email to him was that he was still avoiding the main reason we are where we are now with NC between us. Is he sleeping with her and how long has he been lying to me about it. Of course I got no answer and very little today from him, so, no news is bad news. I told him at one point that I can't believe he still refers to it as a freindship, I don't sleep with my friends.

I am so afraid that I've lost him forever. I don't want to. Everyone around me says to call the lawyer, not to take him back, etc. But I want him back despite it. I know it doesn't have to be the end but also that it will take a long time.

WHY did you feel the need to cope on your own? If you break a leg, will you feel the need to suffer and limp along for a week before you get help? I hope not! It is ok to accept help. And I realize you have started the process now, so I just want to encourage you. It is ok to get help. And sometimes it takes a while to get your first appointment, and sometimes you have to try more than one counselor before you find one that works for you, but please follow through. It is also OK to take anti depressants! You have been through a major trauma. You are very likely suffering with a situational depression. You can get the anti depressants from you regular doctor - you do not need to see the counselor first. You can call your doctors office and tell the advice nurse that you are going through a very traumatic time right now and need information about anti D's. If you are too uncomfortable making the call, have a friend call and make the appointment, and then drive you there, but please do this! The meds will not make you “happy” but they will help you to even out your moods, and get through the day. You will still have sad times, but not as many crying jags. And you usually have to take the meds for a week or so before they start ‘kicking in” so please, get going! There is nothing wrong with getting help. It will most likely only be for a few months, just to help you think straight for a while.

I want you to listen to what I am about to say: Most A’s do not last. His is not any different. This OW just comes and goes from his life whenever she wants to – your WH is headed for ANOTHER huge fall. The best thing you can do for him, right now, is to go into a serious, dark, plan B. He needs to finally, finally know what his life will be like if he leaves you for this two-bit wh*re! I don’t care how much YOU want to talk to him; you have got to go dark!! He needs to stop this nonsense for once, and for all. Period. He has dragged this thing on for way too long. If you keep communicating with him and – as he said himself – being too easy on him, that two-bit wh*re is going to keep showing up whenever she dang well pleases. Is that the model you want to be for your girls? Do you want them to some day settle for a marriage to a man who keeps bouncing back and forth between them and his mistress? No way! So you need to finally let him know that he is not going to treat you with such open dis-respect any more. You keep giving him time to get off the fence, time to choose you, etc, but after awhile it is ok to say “that is it! Marriage is between 1 man and 1 woman. I am taking a stand for my marriage, right now, and if you want to be my friend, my wife, my partner in life, then you will need to take whatever drastic measures are necessary to end it with that woman forever.”
That woman is not his friend – a friend would not cause such harm to him, his kids, and his whole family. She just likes to string him along. I would imagine that she only calls him when her other “boyfriends” have broken up with her. She needs to know that someone is always waiting in the wings for her. I wish your H would finally tell her to take a hike, and leave him alone.

Hang in there. You still have a lot of crap ahead of you. But Angie – you are obviously an intelligent, loving, caring woman. If you continue to let your H treat you this way – bouncing back and forth between you, his WIFE, and his wh*re mistress, you will eventually lose all love, and respect you have for him. You have got to put a stop to his horrible behavior now. Go into your dark plan B while you still have some love left for him.

His A will most likely end. Most of them do. The question is, where will you be when that happens? Will you be so disgusted with him that you can’t possibly take him back? Or will you be able to hold onto some of your feelings for him, enough to get you through recovery?
My WxH did try to come back after his A ended, but by then I was so disgusted with him I could care less. Months of hearing about his OW , soul mate, best friend that he could not live without and made me completely lose any love for him. I hope you can finally do a good plan B, show him the reality of the path he is taking.

One last thing – I am sorry to bring this up – but you have got to face reality. His A has been PA for a very long time. I know that deep down you realize that. He has hidden the truth from you for a long time (Ok, he lied). But the reality is that a man who has been having SF on a fairly regular basis for many years, as you and your H have been, does not then get into a heavy duty emotional A and just “kiss”. It just doesn’t happen. That OW is throwing everything at him she can, and there is no way that either of them have said “we have to stop at kissing” they were all ready hiding their R from time to time, over the years, so why not hide that too? I only bring this up, because it seems to be a point that you are sort of stuck on “at least it isn’t PA” or “at least it only recently became PA” that just isn’t reality.

Hang in there. My heart breaks for you.

womanoffaith -- great post.

please please please let him face his consequences!
Do you see what he said to you? He wants you AND her.
He can't have both. You can't live like that. So you have to take away everything you give him until he realizes its YOU he wants.

you're following a plan -- so let it work. Be strong and get everything on your side. Get your support in place, financial, emotional, etc.

(((hugs)))

Wow! Thanks woman and lexxy,again. I can't tell you how your posts made me feel, woman especially. I know everything you're saying is true and going dark is needed. I want to do whatever I can to help him see the light and come home.

When I first discovered A and we had many, many productive talks about everything for about two weeks, we had several conversations about their history and how she never contacts him, it's always him, and seemingly after the birth of a child when things get tough or stale. I repeated the tale he told me about how she treated him and how he knew there would never be anything between them. She's moving 90 miles, I know, still too close, to a new job the middle of this month. At least I think she's moving. He's said as much, but....I have told him many times that what will he do if he continues this way and when she moves and starts her new life, once again there's no place for him in her world. Then he'll want to come back and what happens if we're not here for him anymore?

One night he had a mini breakdown. I've never seen nor heard of him being this way. Rather hoping this next step I've taken will bring another on to drive the reality home. During this episode he said that the gravityof everything backed up on him. But I'm beginning to feel like he has no feelings for me and it helps a little to get over the hurt, I think I'm moving into an anger stage. I certainly hope that he comes back and I pray that I haven't moved on by then.

Help with advice about the kids. I am avoiding everything, promise, except the facts about the kids. I still think maybe there should be some basic info exchanged there, like the email simply stating they needed showers and do homework. No other info about me, us, or thoughts, feelings or questions. When he is leaving he drives by me and I won't look at him at all.

As far as my being a loving, intelligent woman,... true <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
He's commented so many times how patient I'm, how I'm trying to have faith in him and us, and how he certainly now can never doubt the depth of my love for him. I cling to those words and that he will realize that's the most important thing I have to offer that she, to my knowledge, never has. He's always, recently, saying how reserved she is. So opposite of me. I wear my emotions, especially for him, on both my sleeves. I hope that he soon draws tired of this B*!#ch and her reserved ways and comes home to someone who openly, readily and passionately shows her love and emotions for him.

I think I'm going to print out these posts. They certainly can be used to help keep me motivated and keep the hope and dream alive that the A will go south and he'll want to return and work on us. I promise to do my very best to go as dark as possible and to keep coming here for help and support. I really can't express enough what these posts here have meant to me. There is NO ONE who comes close to supporting me this way.

Also, if I can't get ahold of the shrink for an appt by the end of next week, I'll make another appt with GP and see about AD's. Thanks again. Much love and returned hugs. TTFN ( ta ta for now)

Angie,

You shared a really good insight here:
“She never contacts him, it's always him, and seemingly after the birth of a child when things get tough or stale”

Your H needs to get help. You have got to stand firm in defense of your M and say “I will NOT tolerate this any longer!!” because the behavior is showing, will only get worse as he gets older. I remember when my WxH first left, I was shocked that it would happen after 18 years of marriage, we were over 40, the kids were almost grown, why then? I now have a better understanding of the process we all go through, as we grow older, and in reality men (perhaps women too) become more determined to “live their dream” or “pursue their own happiness for once”
There are many people on these boards who have been married 15 years or longer before their WS does something stupid like this. Your WS has been doing this on and off for years now – if he doesn’t do some serious digging into himself and figure out why he keeps doing this, and how to stop it, he is going to continue to do some really stupid things.
I could be totally of base here, but for instance:
I suspect there is something painful, deep inside of him that he tries to bury or ignore by having another baby, or spending money on a trip, or buying a house, or adding onto a house. There is some gaping wound inside of him that needs to be cleansed and healed. When he starts to feel “stable or stale” then the hurt tries to come to the surface. So he tries to cover it up with something else. At times, he has used this other woman as his way to cover it up. I would love to beat that OW to a bloody pulp – it would have been nice if she would have told him, years ago “quit calling me, you are married, and have children!” But she doesn’t do that – for whatever reason – and even if she did tell him to leave her alone, he would eventually look for another OW, or he would find some other way to bury his pain, like charging too much money on credit cards for frivolous stuff, or drinking, or deciding that the answer to all his problems is to pack up and move to another state. There are a lot of things that people do, as adults, to try to “self medicate” and a lot of these things have long-term negative consequences.

I have a sister in law whose H is doing a lot of this stuff. In the beginning of their M, he would get depressed, and tell her he thought they really needed to have another baby. After 3 kids she told him “no more” so then he insisted that they had to have a bigger house, a nicer car, brand new landscaping, etc, until they finally ended up bankrupt. They filed bankruptcy, lost it all, and started it all over again. They bought another house, borrowed against it several times, and finally had to sell it before the bank took it away. During all that time, he would go through cycles of bad moods, depression, etc, and she Finally, recently, got to the point where she could not take it any longer and filed for D. That was when he finally said “I need help”. He ahs been in counseling for months now, and she is cautiously optimistic. She has put the D on hold, but it ha taken her many years to finally see that she could not be everything he needed, or do everything he needed, to finally be emotionally healthy. He needed true healing. She wanted to love him enough, protect him enough, to heal him herself, but it just doesn’t work.

I see your H headed down the same path.

OW is not some super woman soul mate that your H is meant to be with. If your H were to D you tomorrow, and run off to be with her, it would not take long for him to se that she is just a woman, like you and me, and eventually that R would end, just as it did so many years ago.

I am curious – why did OW break up with him that first time?

You asked about communicating about the kids – you need to keep that line open, obviously, but keep it simple. Dates, times, that sort of thing. I don’t think you need to remind him when they need showers – they will survive without a shower. Just keep it short a simple.

Do you go to church?

I think too that there's something bothering him. When she first broke upwith him it was 20+ years ago in high school. After d-day, when we had such great discussions, he told me that he knew he needed to give her up for us to go forward, but that he had unrespoved issues with her and that if he didn't find out what he needed to know he wouldn't be able to move towards NC. They had to do with why it was that they could never be together in the past. Obviously an excuse to be together and prolong the A. There was a time when she told him as much or he finally realized it, before we got together. But they have this strange and long friendship and he has to figure out why he still has these feelings for her. I even stupidly agreed to a "compromise" after d day that allowed him to see her and discuss what has happenend in her past to make it such that their R is at it had been. Before she was never willing to discuss these things and now she is, I hate her as much as I can imagine. I know, and it bit me in the butt big time. He lied to me openly and I busted him several times, and that led to him refusing to give me his cell phone password for on-line. He wasn't sure why, maybe b/c there would be some times when he talked to her that he didn't tell me. Come to find out when the bill came, it was probably more the 450 text messages that cost $.08 each he didn't want me to see.

The weird thing about this whole thing is that it has brought me to a greater sense of God's input in our lives, I always find out about the things he's lying to me about. Something, and I know for certain now,led me to this site, gave me the strength in the beginning before things got really bad to fight for us, and He has shown me things I should know. I related this to WS and told him that it's obvious God's intervening in our lives.

I've asked him to go to MC and at one point before my NC, he said that he would consider it. He's very disenchanted with IC b/c he's been down that road before. Back when she first dumped him, he had lots of problems dealing with it and ended up in IC with meds. That experience has left with the feeling that a stranger who doesn't know the history can't help and he doesn't see the sense in rehashing the past w/stranger.

When middle child was born, he went through a period of depression, not sleeping, not happy, etc. I was very worried and wanted him to get help. He ended up registering for an on-line dating service, that I found by accident (God's hand). We eventually made a recovery from that and we were very happy for a few years, which led us to wanting and having another child. When she was 6 mos. we were talking about another but he felt with the troubles I had with her,it wasn't a good idea and talked about adopting when she was about 4-5. So I don't disagree there's something there. But I see little hope for him going to find out what.

I did very well with keeping communication very simple today. No conversation in anything when he emailed about getting the kids for Sunday. I'm still so suspicious about his motives and actions. He told me not too long ago in a conversation about why he doesn't tell me what he wants from us and is feeling that he's tried to tell me with his actions, asking me to go along to a park for the weekend wedding of his brother, helping me with things, etc. But if I'm to take his actions for his intentions, they aren't good. I'm going to try to remain as "dark" with him as possible.

I have first appt. with shrink today. I hope we click and I feel it's worth my time. I'm not sure what to expect and such and feel more resigned and numb today than I have been all week. Finally slept more than 3 hourslast night and I think that certailnly helped immensely.

I do go to church although with everything going on here and circumstances before WH leaving, I hadn't been since DD baptism. I've been exploring and opening myself up more to God's words lately through readings with Joyce Meyer, bought several books to help, Gary Chapman and other Christian authors for dealing with my own sense of self and the separation/marriage. My best friend fulfilled a wish I have had for about 6 mos. and got me the Women of Faith study bible for my birthday. My bible was still an old paraphrased one for children I've had forever. Before WS left my oldest son and I had been going together and enjoying both church and our time together. But the other two kiddos have a difficult time sitting in church and I have no one to ask to watch them so we can go still. The boys will start Sunday school next week and they're looking forward to it.