It sounds like Noodle has got the situation pegged really well. And I'm glad that Noodle waited until things calmed down a bit. I was so afraid when AmI's WH took off with the kids. Not knowing them personally, I was scared that something tragic could happen -- that he had completely cracked under the pressure and could be unstable.

I sometimes feel really uncomfortable with all of us dispensing advice. What if exposure ends up costing someone their lives? I think that MB principals are guidelines, but need to be adjusted in different cases.

What do you all think the best next step is for AmI -- besides the obvious one, which is staying calm and nonreactive? Does Plan B make sense in this situation?

I'm venting right now. What a JERK.

Tonight he isn't working. DD has an awards thing at church. I made dinner, he came right in and ate with us, like we're a family ... but then when it's time to go to the awards thing, he loads the kids up in his vehicle and takes off with them. Locks the extra door so that I wouldn't even consider getting in the vehicle with them ...

His truck gets 8 miles to the gallon. When we were all walking out, the kids started getting in my car, and he told them NO, get in the truck.

Like I wouldn't be going.

Maybe this is best, he will probably get struck by lightning walking in to the church! I wouldn't mind being several steps behind him when that happens.

What a turkey.

-AmI.

Does he gobble when he walks? Poor AmI. Stay strong. Your kids need you.

DC

as vents go

this was very mild

Pep

I would have waved them "bye" as they drove off in big old truck

then rushed into the house

grabbed my purse

and jumped into my car

and beat them to the event and wave "hi" with a smile as they pulled into the parking lot

they don't lock the doors at church events , do they <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

JUST GO ... the kids won't mind you take separate transportation

Pep

do they have cell phones?

if not

buy each of them a cell phone

and they probably have email ?

keep in touch the way the kids do

text msg
email
IM
chat
and ~~~> MY SPACE

I started a My Space recently ... and all my "friends" requests were from my kids' friends ... I closed it down because it was just not my thing ... but, you could do this as a way to let the kids know you are thinking about them all the time

Pep

I haven't read all of your thread....

But it sounds to me that...he's still mad and wants to show he's in control? Do him a favour, allow this to backfire on him...and do not 'interfere'....

Stay cool, AmI.....don't 'react'......don't give your power away....let him 'spin the wheels'.....it will get him nowhere!

....he may have 'legal' rights over the kids.... but you are raising and loving them.... the kids know this.... and he does, too... but he can't see this until he 'cools off'!

Noodle said it best....he's 'cornering himself'.....don't SAVE him...... probably looking for someone to 'blame' for his troubles..... because he can't believe he could have gotten himself in such a mess...all by himself!

LOL Pep.

This guy is being a jerk. Personally, it sounds like a needs a foot in his a$$! Hey, wait, I take a size thirteen... I could do that ! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I would avoid the cell phone thing. All that will do is anger him at this point. You cannot do anything that will put the kids into a position where they have to willfully go against their dad. Just wait this out so that you do not give him another "excuse" to act like an even bigger jerk.

He has the ability to make this worse. You have the opportunity to make it better by waiting it out.

I know that a lot of WS are not open to reason. However, I think it might be time for you to write a letter to him letting him know that his actions are not only harming you, but the kids as well. Tell him that if he was trying to make a point that you understand that you have no legal right to the kids... but that they must surely be hurting from being pulled from the only mom they really know. Let him know that you realize he is upset over your exposure but that your family means so much to you that you feel as though you have been backed into a corner and don't know what else to do to fight this insanity.

You can put this letter together and leave it sit for a few more days. See what happens and if there is no change, I would give it to him.

Good luck.

I did go ... I was backing out in my own car and called my mom to vent and yell some ... she and her husband were on their way to the awards ceremony, anyway, so they just came and picked me up.

The church is across the street from my MIL's house, so we went to MIL's house first, where my SIL and niece were going to be ... they weren't there, but WH and the kids were.

He was ticked when we walked in. MIL gave us all big hugs and sat us down and chatted with us, WH sat on the couch and stewed. He'd get up to walk to the back of the house every once in a while. Finally, he and DD left since she had to be at the church a little bit early. DS and MIL rode to the church with us.

He's just being a jerk. Flexing his muscle because he thinks he can. Showing his whole family, and his kids, what a jerk he really is.

Afterwards, he wouldn't let the kids go to the cake-and-ice-cream thing that they were having at the church. But then they got home much later than I did, and he'd taken them to ice-cream. DD told me "it was good, but I don't know why we couldn't have ice cream at church with my friends."

::::::

Sound like a real scum bag. wish I could say it another way.

LM (frowning)

Thanks, MEDC. I agree, he does need a foot strategically placed. Maybe several ... I'll add you to the list of volunteers. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


I really am trying to wait this out, but could use some basic strategy help ... like what to do about dinner and silly petty things like that? I make dinner ... when he's home, do I not include him? Or sit there and pretend like everything's ok and we're a family?

That seems silly, but it really bothered me tonight. I'm good enough to cook his dinner, but not go to DD's awards ceremony with them? Should I have even thought that we'd be going to the ceremony together? Maybe it was better not to think that, anyway.

Also ... he showers and keeps his clothes and all his things in our room. That's driving me nuts, too, because he feels so entitled to come and go in there. He'll come in at whatever time he drags himself home from wherever he is and take a shower ... regardless of whether I'm sleeping or what. He's sleeping downstairs, but driving me nuts with coming and going in my room whenever he pleases.

These all seem so petty and silly when I write it down, but some practical pointers for the petty, silly stuff would be appreciated. I have no idea how to do a decent Plan B with him still in the house and refusing to leave.


And here's a fun kicker on that ... he announced to me on his way out the door just now that he probably won't be moving out on the 1st, as he'd agreed before. He hasn't decided yet. I own a separate rental house (bought before we were married) and he went and told the renters that they had to be out by November 1, so he could move in.

I told them they aren't going anywhere and not to worry about him. But he's got to be out of here before then.

I wish he was dumb enough for me to be able to get a restraining order against him ... that would get him out. But he's way too smart for that. Too bad they don't give out restraining orders for being a big dumb jerk.

-AmI.

He left a little bit ago ... kind of funny since the kids are here, now, in bed.

But he left. He was in workout clothes, but also made a point of coming in and getting his "date hat" and some nicer clothes to take with him. Kept putting them down right next to me, or walking past me with them so I'd know.

Whatever. I hope he stays there.

It is funny that he left me here with the kids so he could go off and do his play.

Jerk.

He didn't always use to be such a scumbag. Where did my real H go?????? I miss him. I want this idiot out of my house, though!

Hi, AmI, I just wanted to let you knwo that I'm still around...wishing you the best...knowing you are capable...

Do you know if he could be on suspension for his behavior at work? Is that a possiblility? Is there a way that you can find out what's going on with him and work?

Also, in regards to the renters...is there anyway that he can force them out...I'm not familiar with things like that...

See I'm wondering if his work and Nov. 1st have something in common. As far as coming into your room at night and getting his clothes...you could always pack his tings and move them into the basement, put a lock on your door if you don't have one...it's an option...just a thought...

But here's what I'm thinking...when H was being a jerk...I made certain that I tried my hardest to be extra nice...not let him bother me...no matter the attitude...if WH won't move out you can continue to Plan A until he does...I'm not saying kiss his @ss...I'm saying be nice, perhaps cook his favorite meal...don't act like things are perfect...but be detached and loving at the same time...

I see hope in your future...he's still not going anywhere...he sees that your family and his are on your side...his world is crumbling...remember there a certain way an A must end...WH's not spending his nights with OW...not moving in with her...

What I'm asking is for you to step back and look at the new reality, accept it, and form a plan for it with the new information that you have...

Should you Plan B, Plan A, 180, or plan D? I don't think Plan D is an option right now...he's sticking to close to you for whatever reason...let's not try to figure that reason out...but the new reality is...he's still at home, you can't talk R with him...he's alien...Wh's not going anywhere, according to him until Nov...that give you alot of time...

If you feel that Plan B is what you want to do...then move his clothes...if I understood LA correctly her H lived in another room for a while...your WH seems to be keeping up the appears that everyting is fine for the kids...don't seem like he wants to change that reality...still seems like he wants you close by...again for whatever reason...

Try to do some objective thinking...put yourself on the outside of your M and take a look in...What do YOU see?

I'm sure the answer will come to you...I know this because everything you ahve done thus far has been in your favor...it's remarkable...this new reality...Does the higher rung give you a better view?

Take his things out of YOUR room. Let him know his things BOTHER you. That's what I told my WS. I told him if he could get naked in another person's bed (OW doesn't even deserve a name - so I often called her 'other people' or Mrs. ________), then his things didn't need to be here. Because seeing them hurt me.

Remember how they say they don't tell you things because it could hurt you? Well play the sanme babble back to them and see if he likes it.

He wants to get you to enable the A. In your case it is evident he got bitten by the A bug because he is acting sooo cooky. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

I would soon use the line about him making sure he shows you he is happy because in this mess SOMEBODY you know (NOT the OW) had better be happy with all the misery he IS causing.

That's the same line I gave my then WS and you should have seen his face get all distorted. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Then after the clothes get taken (you don't need to care where), tell him it hurts you to see him in your home on your couch and btw, he seems to be having a 'strange ordor' since he has been hanging around the OW. Ha! ha!!! I used that line also.

It kept him focused on other things (like washing more often so he wouldn't have that 'imaginary smell'). LOL!!! In turn it reduced the amount of hurtful babble he would send my way. I learned to hang up when he called or not even answer and when he came in person and started babbling, I'd start sniffing the air like I could tell he was getting stinky. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

L.

Have you sat down with the kids and told them what their father is doing? If not, I would do so immediately. Let them know, if they want to talk to him about the disruption they are causing in their family to do so.

Personally, I think this clown needs a wake up call. I know this is contrary to MB advice... but I would not wait much longer before hitting this clown with divorce papers. You are being ripped to shreds here and he is trying to find a way to push YOU out of the house.

Call Dr. Harley and get advice.. but every time he enters the room with you in there... I would make a point to leave the room. Do not give him the satisfaction of flaunting this in front of you....

And please be honest with yourself... after everything this man has done... and he has broken what should be some prety sacred rules... do you really want him around anymore... could you really ever forgive him? If the answer is "no" divorce the chump.

I am so sorry for what you are going through.

I would suggest that one more day waiting him out... and then contact the people at his job that we discussed earlier.

Oh, and do not put a lock on a door... he can just kick it down if he chooses to do so... nothing illegal about breaking your own door. Aslo, I would ask him to move his stuff out of the room... don't do it without his consent. Again, he is a jerk... but these things will just provoke a strong reaction.

MEDC -- If I had a lock on the bedroom door and he broke it down at night while I'm in there sleeping -- would that be good enough grounds for an RO?

Last night, I was in bed asleep, and the dog was curled up in my stomach. WH came in at about 1am, and was reaching over me to pet the dog. It woke me up and scared me half to death. I jumped and gasped ... and he said "Yeah, I live here, too."

Then he turned on the lights and was taking a shower (there is no wall between the master bath and bedroom, so lights on in the bathroom are on in the bedroom, too).


Would it be reasonable to at least lock him out of there at night? The bedroom door doesn't have a working lock on it right now. If he had to overpower a lock to pull stunts like that in the middle of the night ... would that be grounds for a restraining order? (there are other bathrooms in the house that he can use)

A restraining order would get him out of the house, right? But it would also tick him off even more and put my chances with the kids in even more jeopardy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Hi, Rin! Thanks for checking in. I'm pretty self-absorbed the last few days and haven't been keeping up with your thread -- I'm sorry.

I don't think he's going to get a suspension at work, but I'm not sure. None of them have talked to me except the one from last week, and he said he didn't think they'd do anything about it because they have a standard that they "aren't the moral police". WH repeated that same phrase to his cousin (our renters) the other day.

I think he picked Nov. 1 because he wanted to give his cousin more notice about time to move out. I own the house, it was bought before we were married, only my name is on the title and the loan ... so he would have no power at all to evict the renters. And they have told me several times that they aren't going anywhere unless I ask them to. They said that if *I* needed that house, they'd be out in a second. But they aren't leaving to give him a place to continue his affair. I really need them in there -- they take great care of the place, I never have to worry about anything -- and they really need the place, so we're on the same page about them not leaving.

I don't really know what plan to be in right now, I just want him away from me. I want to be in a super dark Plan B right now, but it's hard to do with him right there in my face.

I have an apointment with Steve Harley tomorrow morning. Maybe he can give me some strategy tips. I don't get in to meet with the lawyer until Thursday, so I'm trying to hang in there and wait on that. I definitely need some good legal advice now ....

Thanks for sticking it out with me even when I haven't been so great at keeping up with your sitch recently -- you're a great friend!

-AmI.

No, that would not be grounds for a restraining order... unless he kicked the door in and then came at you physically.
In fact, the only issue I can see with your putting a lock on the door to bar him from a room in his own home would be against you. There really is no legal reason to bar him from the room. He's a jerk... not a threat.
A restraining order would get him out of the house... but the kids would most likely leave too. But again, he's way too smart to do anything to necessitate an order.
The children are in a bad place right now having to live in this atmosphere.
I have some tough questions to ask here and they go against what I would normally even consider.... but here goes?
Do you work and financially contribute to the house and bills?
Do you have a mortgage?
Can he afford mortgage on his own?
Is there a lot of equity in the property?
What my thoughts are right now is that if this doesn't get any better soon, then one of you is going to need to leave. I would talk to an attorney about this before doing anything though. You cannot continue to live in this enviroment and since the kids are legally his and he seems to have no intention of changing, it might be better (and only if an attorney says your assets are protected) for you to find temporary shelter and plan B or divorce this jerk.
I know that the thought of this is tough and it is not fair to you in anyway.... but neither is living in that house.
The impact on him coming home one day and finding you gone might wake this jerk up.