Ha ha, oops! Well, good for you! And good thing he posted it here so I could see it too!!


Hmmm...thanks Pep, I think. I realize that as it's typed, that part of my post seems a little backwards. I DO know what I'm doing is right, FOR ME and MY KIDS and our future, and I'm NOT worried about whether or not H is mad at me. He's actually not, even though I really expected he'd be. He does NOT deny he has a problem, but he DOES deny his inability to control it. "I can stop at 4 beers and I will...I won't ever do another shot again..." Yea that's crap, you know it & I know it, he doesn't (didn't last night) know it, he may never know it.

The other day I do think I was owning his feelings. Today, I'd have to disagree & say I'm really not. I'm surely in a better, healthier, on-my-way-to-happier place.

I'm home now, and he's in the basement fixing the door he mangled. I was upset to see the truck out front, as I was convincing myself on the way home from work that our M is dead...was a long time ago. I'm not sure I want it! He might come up here & say OK, he's willing to cut alcohol out of his/our life, and I won't believe him!

Your e-mail account is not listed on the site so it's safe. Again, I think outside help could be the best approach, but if a successful alcoholic that quits is his friend, then maybe it's worth a shot.

If he isn't angry at you then he's definately angry with himself, as I was. He's at the point where he will pull the trigger one way or another.

Did his friend who quit go through a program or did he just stop?

AA focuses not just on stopping. It's heart is about living life differently and looking inside to right the wrongs. When the drinking stops there will still be the problems of life. This is where we must cope.

If you decide to offer it up, it has to be on HIS terms, and let him know this. He has not hit his bottom yet. It may be your duty to take him to that spot. If you try and reconsile now while he's drinking you stand for the same cycle happening again because he will get validation that it's OK.

It's NOT ok and he needs to understand that. How you do this is up to you. You cannot force him, he must start the path himself.

Julie

Our MC told me that he would not take us on if my H "just stopped drinking" ... because the dry drunk has no coping skills & that makes them harder to work with than a drinking drunk !!!!!!

MC told me that if my H did not agree to AA and follow up by going to AA I ought not allow him back in my life

this worked out very well for us

my husband is not only sober ... my husband is HAPPY and enjoys life fully!

big difference

a dry drunk will resent you for every minute he goes without booze ... YUK!

but, this is what worked for us ... if you do not insist on AA .... then make peace with the life you currently have, because that is what will come

blessing for you Julie

Pep

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have a want now to help others who are where I've been, please consider this just to smooth the waters before going to a meeting.

Exactly as stated above we can stop, but the issues after that require guidance and support.

Post deleted by Swanner

Remember AA is not for lowlife scum. Most people in it are quite successful and are professionals. It's pre-concieved notions are mostly wrong.

This is a good strategy for bringing his bottom of the barrel to him. We all have to hit a bottom, and everyone's is different. Some won't be phased by the potential of loosing the family, but most are, especially when children are involved.

It will be a tough nut to crack, but you must do this. Let him know you love him and are in support of him, but only if he has a PLAN and TAKES ACTION. His words mean nothing now, but actions will. Help him with that plan.

I gotta hand it to DF. I was looking to see if someone would suggest Alanon. Pepper, your post is great too. As an alcoholic, sex addict and being addicted to other things to boot, I can only agree with what they have said. When I went through treatment 22 years ago, I was told that I was an alcoholic if I kept drinking even after I saw it causing problems in my life. Best you can do Julie is go to Alanon. They won't tell you how to fix your husband, just how to take care of yourself and your family. That's really all you are responsible for. Hopefully, if he hits bottom finally, he will want to come along with you on the recovery road. If not, I am very sorry about that, but you have to walk that road regardless of what he wants to do.

You seem to have the right attitude...that is...you seem to know that you have to take care of yourself. May God bless you in everything.

Swanner, I think that your lack of experience and education has severely limited your own viewpoint in this arena. Far from having an "objective" view, yours reveals an ignorance of addiction in general, and alcoholism specfically. I would take experience over ignorance any day, wouldn't you? It is very hard for a person who has no experience or exposure to addiction recovery to understand what they are dealing with. In the area of alcoholism, one is not a "little" alcoholic, there are no "gray areas;" they either are or they aren't. It's sort of like being pregnant. You either are or you aren't. Very "black and white," as is most of life to clear thinkers.




And this is where your lack of experience about addiction really shows. With an alcoholic, one is never enough. They don't drink a "few", they drink ALOT. They are alcoholics, after all. If they could have "a few and enjoy them whenever possible" they would not be alcoholics, would they? They would be social drinkers.

Even so, if 5 bananas make me violently ill, wouldn't it be so silly to have 3 or 4? That doesn't sound too dang smart to me. Any sane person would just quit eating bananas instead of taking that risk. And if they couldn't, wouldn't that be very telling?


"Balance" is a cute word, but is nothing more than meaningless rhetoric. If you want to educate yourself on the disease of alcoholism, I would refer you to the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous. It is still one of the most comprehensive books about alcoholism out there. Please educate yourself, "long time lurker..." I sense that you really do want to help, but it is not helpful to anyone to offer advice about something which you know nothing about.


Julie, please understand that this lady hasn't the slightest notion about alcoholism. His drinking is what is damaging your marriage. It would be silly to suggest that asking him to go to AA "can be equally as damaging to your marriage" AA is full of people who got there the same way. Far from being "resentful," they are grateful that someone loved them enough to give them a much needed push over the fence. They didn't just wake up one morning and magically see the error of their ways. That ain't how it works. "Balance" is a meaningless word in this arena. A person in recovery does not feel "resentment" anyway.

ML

Since I can't PM you, I just wanted to say you are spot on. But she did come back and refute her earlier post.

p.s. Julie, I just wanted to say that I am DAMN PROUD of you for stepping up to the plate here. I hope you do follow through and check out Alanon. They will RUIN his drinking and change your life! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thanks again DF & Jimm too. For the record though, my attitude sucks!

Well he fixed the door & then asked if I had time to talk. I said I wasn't really ready, but that if he had something to say I'd listen. I probably should have been more honest & told him no. Anyway, it wasn't long before I asked him to leave.

He said, "I figured I'd be back home tonight" I said, "Did I say that?" He said, "well if I agree to stop drinking you said that's what it'd take for me to come back home" I said yes, that was one of the commitments I'd need from him.

He then said he's going to quit drinking. Then he went on rationalizing how if someday we're at a wedding or somebody's party & he's offered a beer, he doesn't want to feel he'll be kicked out of the house if he takes it.

I said people always offer people drinks, and that if somebody has agreed to never take another one of those offers, they simply don't. Nor do they put themselves in these situations. He kept trying to negotiate. He started getting angry, saying he didn't want to be watched over, etc. and I agreed...I don't want to have another person to watch over. He said we've got other problems & for 10 years he's offered and tried and been willing to help me thru mine, when it's only recently that I actually decided to tell him "my big secret" and now he's got a problem and if he doesn't change it we're thru. Double-standard? I agreed, said it's not right that I waited so long, and that I/we do still have issues. Eventually I said "this is all about me, we're not ready to live together yet. I think you need to go."

He then texted "I will quit drinking but i dont want 2 live under the shadow of my past mistakes" I said neither do I! And counting doesn't work - people lose count but when people are dedicated to quitting they QUIT!

I think you're all right (again) - he needs AA. He said I'm not much of a support to him since I don't really believe he can do it. He's right.

Julie, I would strongly suggest that you push AA. He is running a con on you already. The things that he is telling you tell me that he is telling you he will stop only in order to get you off his back. He is already negotiating for exceptions and I assure you, the exceptions will grow each and every day. You will become a jailor who has to dictate his each and every drinking experience, as in: "is it ok if I accept a drink at this wake?" Yes, he will resent you for that very much.

This is exactly how an alcholic will PLAY his spouse. He asks for an inch and as the heat dies down he asks for more and more. Then when he successfully gets you off his back, he goes back to his normal routine and he is off and running again.

Please understand that you are being PLAYED right now.

He is so ripe for AA right now. He's justifying the drinks still. He is trying to set a standard that when out socially he can still drink. I thought the same things too. But guess what, he'll likely get SMASHED at these events.

When we try and "control" the drinking we don't enjoy it. When we enjoy it, it ends up being too much.

Stop avoiding it and get his [censored] there or at least offer up someone to talk to like me. The last thing he wants is to fully believe the drinking is the ACTUAL issue here....but I'm sure he's thought of it.

Thanks Mel, I needed that. REALLY needed it. From you. Thanks.

Please now, share with me how you figure they will RUIN his drinking.

I'm pretty confident that we can RUIN affairs, both emotional and physical, in fact I've even offered some advice on other posters' threads, were you watching? But alcohol has been in my life for as long as I can remember, always one-upping me...how can these people ruin it? A brief synopsis, if you will?

How about something like this: "you are a big boy, you can drink all you want anytime you want. I am not your momma and am not going to police your behavior.

However, if you want to stay married to me, you must stop drinking and get help for your problem." SMILE <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I think I'll just let you take over on this one as we keep saying the same stuff...but in a different way!

How you guys, how? Please help. I didn't come this far to let him back-track again. I started second-guessing myself. Thinking there may be wiggle room here. There's no wiggle room! Why does he want to choose beer over me? Just like my father...the comparisons which he resents. NO he's not 'as bad' but DANG it, I don't like it! I don't deserve it! Perhaps we shall divorce.

::

The ol' ultimatum trick. Even *I* resent me giving ultimatums!

It's too much. Too much! I love him too much to be as strong as I need to be. I miss him too much to continue to stand up for myself. I've already been defeated. Again.

We need to divorce. I'm not strong anymore. I was until about 2.5 hours ago. He can be the one with regret a year from now...I don't want to be.