I don't know if I should give any background info about our problem so I will give a brief overview for now. My wife started a new job and met a guy. We were having problems in our marraige with communication etc. at the time and she ending up leaving me for the other guy. I tried for a year to get her to come back and work on things and she refused. We would see each other about once a week during this entire year and of course, I was hoping that she would come back. We tried to go to counseling in the beginning, but she was lying to the counselor so that went nowhere. I told her that she needed to move out of his apartment, get her own cell phone (not on his plan) and get another job and then we could start working on our problems. She refused to do this so after a year of waiting, I finally filed for divorce. Surprisingly, it ended up being an uncontested divorce with us dividing everything ourselves. After she was served the papers, she started making some changes. She wrote letters to all of our friends that had turned their back on her apologizing for what she had done. She started selling off a lot of her things to raise money so that she could move out of the apartment (what she tells me). She asked her boyfriend to move out the apartment that they were sharing and he did. We are presently divorced (for about a week now) and I am having a hard time understanding why she is doing this all now. Was it that she thought that I wouldn't go through with the divorce in the first place? Does she finally realize the mistake that she made and is trying to make things right? I have told her that I am not going to go into anything with her while she is still living in his apartment, working with him, having a private cell phone with him. Am I making a mistake thinking that there might be a chance to get back what we had?

Move slowly. Don't project into the future. See if she really makes the changes b4 you invest any of your heart into her.

Don't include her in your life plans based on these current promises.

I think as long as the divorce was in a pending situation, she might have felt like there was an attachment and/or a safety net of sorts.

You cut ties with the divorce, but unfortunately I think that might have been the only thing that would wake her up. Now she is admitting to herself that what she did was a lark and nothing substantial, but you have no guarantee that she wouldn't turn and do this again.

I agree with the previous poster.

Sooly

I'm in a very similar sitch. D-Day 12-24-05, was already in Plan A since 3/05. Continued Plan A until she moved out 6/06. D was final 8/06. Now, she wants back. She realizes that her family and church, her friends and children would never really accept OM. She realizes that I am the only one that ever brought her peace and stability. I'm afraid she has realized this too late.

Yet, we still try.

My advice is the same as the others, with the addition of this: exercise and work on your diet. Feeling healthy and strong has done absolute WONDERS for me and my self-esteem (not to be confused with ego). Don't give in - let her prove herself. You are doing the right thing - she needs to be on her own for awhile and demonstrate a level of maturity that would never accept betrayal as any course of action.

Can you post how long you were married and whether there are children? What are your ages?

blue

Has she actually said that she is making these changes because she wants you back? Maybe she is just making them because she wants to do what is right, but is relieved and feels the pressure is off because now there is no chance it can be interpreted that it is for your marriage?

The fact that she refused to work on the marriage for a whole year, then didn't contest the divorce looks like it's over for her. Maybe she figures that the boyfriend is completely unrelated to your (former) marriage, so the changes she's making with him might have nothing to do with you at all.

Sometimes when it's finally really over, an ex is willing to have peace with you but it doesn't necessarily mean she wants to go back in to a relationship with you.

"Am I making a mistake thinking that there might be a chance to get back what we had?"

Possibly, but I think it's usually better than not taking a chance and missing out on something.

She can't work on your relationship until she works on herself first. Let her make the first move, and don't back down on anything just because you see a few hopeful signs.

In the meantime, work on yourself, have fun, enjoy life. Just don't get involved in another relationship as long as you are holding onto hope for this one.

Thanks for all of the answers. A little more info. for you. I am 35 and she is 33 and we were married for about 8 years and didn't have any children. We were together for a total of 14 years when all of this happened. She has told me that she is doing all of this because she wants me back and that she cannot see herself growing old with anyone else. I have asked her to do these things and she has told me that she will. I am still waiting for her to move out into her own apartment but she has only had the money that was from the divorce for less than a week. I will wait to see what happens. She has sent me emails from companies that she has applied for jobs for and for her new cell phone that she just purchased. I know that these are not huge steps, but I guess they are a start if she is serious. I am going to continue on for now like she isn't coming back. When all of this happened, and for the year following, I ended up losing about 70 lbs and feel really good about it. I have more money right now and I can enjoy the 2 hobbies that I have more than ever. Please keep posting with ideas and insight. I really appreciate it.

IMHO, maybe you should be asking yourself if all of this is really worth it. Maybe this is the time you need to take to yourself and ask yourself the hypothetical question "If we do get back together, can I honestly trust her?" I would think being with a woman who has chosen another man over you, would always intruduce a bit of doubt in your relationship, and that just cannot be good. My X chose another married man over me, the man she had 2 kids with. There is no erasing what she did, no forgiving that, and no way of walking back in my life. Perhaps you should be weighing whether or not, in a years time, you would be able to see past her own past, you know... how long if you do get together, until she does it to you again?

As my X said when I found out... "oops" just doesn't undo decisions they have made.

That is just me. Tread lightly, and know your own limits first.

I think there is a good chance that you guys could repair your relationship - but give yourself some time just for yourself, first.

As others have said, you ex needs time to work on herself, too.

This is a marriage building site - Dr Harley has saved thousands of relationships and his plan really works - especially when both parties are genuinely willing to do what it takes.

Yes, your ex wife has a lot to make up for, but with the Harley plan, she can do that and show you (through radical honest and POJA) that she can be the spouse you want. You can learn to trust her again.

But the Harley plan is for the future. Now is the time just for you and enjoying life for yourself.

Peace to you.

Alph.

DDog, how are things?

We continue to communicate through email, but she is still living in their old apartment and still works with him. She tells me that "their" cell phone is being shut off at the end of January and that she has a trac phone that she will be using as her own. She told me that he will not have the new number but I have no way of telling. I am going to wait and see what she does about the job and the moving out before I invest anymore into this. She still sees our dog once a week and takes him every other weekend. I am just at a wait and see point in the relationship. I think that is the best thing that I can do right now.

I just wanted to post an update on what is going on. I am not sure if anyone is following this or not. I spoke with my ex yesterday when she was dropping off our dog and she has her new phone. She told me that it cost her $300 to get out of the contract and that the other guy didn't help her pay for it. She also told me that he owes her $1,800 and that he was going to pay her back out of his $2,300 tax refund. The only problem with that was that he owed the IRS $1,800 from last year so he only received $500 back. Maybe she is seeing this guy for what he really was all along like everyone was telling her.

DD,

My feeling is that her seeing the OM for what he is does not solve your problems or issues. Even if she leaves him completely, you are NOT assured that a relationship with her would work. You surely don't want to be just "second" choice, or the convenient choice.

Your marriage had problems before her A. How have you changed so that your role in those problems will be removed? How have you changed your perspective on marriage and commitment?

How has her views and actions changed? How has she changed to avoid her role in the problems that were in this marriage? How has her problem solving skills changed so that having an affair is NOT a problem solving solution as it was before? What has she DONE to indicate that her view of you has changed? What has she DONE to convince you that she has a much better understanding of marriage, vows, and her role in the marriage?

Until you can answer these things not with just words but examples from both of your actions, getting back together with her would be a very poor decision.

Her moving out, getting a new phone, and a new job, just reduces the likelihood of her resuming her affair with THIS man. It does not indicate a change in her coping skills or her views of marriage and it vows.

Sorry to sound so blunt, but if there is to be a reconnection it needs to be done in light of what has been learned and changed on the part of both of you.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

DD: It's a good feeling - somewhat of a vindicating experience - so give yourself a minute to say, "Finally, she's starting to get it!"

But, JL is dead on. I know this because I'm in the exact same place -- with one difference: my X and I are "seeing" each other and just hanging out with the kids and each other. During this time, I'm watching and paying attention. We're conversing in ways and about subjects we haven't (mutually) discussed in the past couple of years.

BUT: There are still red flags!

JL has some excellent questions:


This is a big one - one that I'm still struggling with -- after all, "I" didn't have the A... THAT thinking isn't constructive (for me).


When appropriate, this should be answered and written down by both parties. I'm going to request this one myself...


YES! What can and will happen to ensure that this NEVER happens again?

My X is a chronic "liar" even though she doesn't think so. In her words, she "avoids the whole truth" to avoid confrontation. The problem there is that the lines get too blurry after awhile. It's the alcoholic, right? One drink is too many, and a hundred isn't enough.

Keep posting, DD...

B

JL, I know that her seeing the OM for what he is does not solve our problems but with him in the picture, we will never be able to work on the problems. Like MB says above, maybe she is finally starting to get it. I know what some of the problems were before the A but that is not something that I am willing to work on with someone else in the picture. I have been there and done that and it doesn't work. I will not enter into a "relationship" with her until I am comfortable that our issues have been discussed and resolved. I am sure that a lot of counseling is in our future if it were to work out. I have been told many things that I have done in the marriage that she didn't like, but I am not sure if those are really things that are true or if they were just things that she told me to justify what she was doing. This is something that we will have to discuss when she can get "out of his control" (as I put it). I have been to a counselor for an anger issue that she said that I had. The counselor told me that she likes to keep "pushing me" even after the argument is over and that I should just get away from the situation which I do now. I think that we also had a problem with financial issues. We were more interested in the trips and acquiring things in the beginning of our marriage and when I wanted to change things and pay down the bills, she was not interested in that. Another problem we had in the end was with communication. It got to the point where she couldn't talk to me about important things and would just write them down. It bugged me that she couldn't even talk to me about things.

As for the ways that she is changing, that is something that I can't comment on right now. I think that she needs to get out on her own and decide what it is that she really wants. If it is not me, that is fine, but she needs to make that decision with a clear head and not be under the influence of someone else in my opinion.

DD,

The changes you make in how you handled your marriage before the A are really for you. Examine her complaints, take them seriously and see if they are things you can in fact change. Some complaints are no doubt self-serving, and don't carry much merit.

But, the goal here is to prepare you for your next relationship whether it be with her or someone new. You are newly divorced so there is no need to rush into another relationship. However, learning from this last one is a very important thing.

Most second marriages don't make it and the reason it seems is that people drag the same baggage into it that they had with the first. This implies that if you work on yourself,for yourself, that your chances of a successful relationship in the future go way up.

It is clear that she has to change a variety of things before she would be a suitable mate, that includes her views on finances and her views on how she treated you. The issue of the OM will go away. Very few affairs lead to marriages and of those most fail. You are correct that while he is in the picture you two will NOT get together.

So work on yourself. Understand your boundaries. Learn how to express your boundaries in non-lovebusting ways. And give yourself time to heal.

That is my advice. Hang in there and keep learning.

God Bless,

JL

My wife gave me a letter the other day with a list of things on it that she is interested in now that the divorce is final. Here is the list in a shortened version. I am looking for any input you might have on it...

1. Wants to be with someone that can always communicate with me anyway they feel most comfortable.

2. Wants to be with someone that will accept the same from her.

3. Have meals together with no TV or phone interruptions.

4. Forget about the past mistakes.

5. Someone that wants to get up every now and then and just go somewhere. Not plan everything.

6. Put her first over everyone including our families.

7. Defend her to other people and discuss with her in private anything I don't agree with.

8. Be with someone that doesn't have plans to live in our city forever.

9. Be with someone that thinks she is beautiful inside and outside and will love her enough to never make her want someone else.

10. Be married again this year if possible. She loved being married and didn't realize it until she let it slip away. She misses being a wife and having to look forward to look forward to a future with someone she loves.

Any comments???

Seems like she wants a lot, but what does she offer?

Look at this from a whole different perspective Dex.

You are a single man. Is this woman marriage material?
Does she meet YOUR needs?

I don't see her taking much ownership for past problems...in fact I see her hinting around at it being your fault.

And I also see hints that she wants the past "forgotten" instead of owning her responsibility and making it up to you.

Lexxxy, that is the way that I feel about things right now. I am not sure what she is offering me and I don't see her meeting any of my needs right now. I feel like the past problems are all of my fault as she sees it and doesn't want to take responsibility for what SHE did. I have told her that she needs to own up to what she did and we would need a lot of counseling to even have a chance making it. She still comes up with excuses as to why she can't do things and I don't even try to convince her otherwise anymore.

DD,

Let's see she is trying to romance you with "what I want..."

If you recall what i posted to you before, well the same applies to her. She needs to learn and grow or you will have the same results. I agree with Lexxxy whole heartedly, it is all about blaming you.

If she is missing being married so much why did she drive you away??? Why did she have an affair? What has she learned? What has changed?

You see if she is not changed by this experience, then you will be in the same marriage you had before, and from the sounds of it you weren't that thrilled even before her affair. Perhaps you should of been but you weren't or you would have done a few things differently.

I am not advocating sending this to her, but it would probably do you some good to sit down and write out what you are looking for in a marriage, but go a step further. List what you need from a future W, what you want from a future W. And then list what you want to give to a future W and marriage. What do YOU look forward to giving to a woman that you love and how would you do it?

Something to think about, now that you have her list of "demands". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

She has not gotten it yet.

God Bless,

JL