Yet another pet peeve. When I am rinsing dishes, no matter how quickly I rinse or no matter how much counter space is available, WW absolutely insists on piling dishes on the dirty dishes that haven't yet been rinsed. I hate this. That means I now have to rinse BOTH sides of the plate. I tell her and tell her but to no avail. Why can't she sets the plates down on the counter without stacking? I eat even faster now to give me a head start on rinsing but she simply adjusts. I'm at my wit's end! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

[and don't bother asking why I rinse before they go in the dishwasher. This has been thoroughly discussed in another thread and new opinions on the subject are NOT welcome]

So how long has she been washing dishes this way? Since the A? As long as you've known her? How long has this been getting your goat?

It's a whole lot more than just washing dishes, isn't it? I used to love it when my H would call me at work when he had nothing to say, just wanted to check in. Now, I cringe every time he calls.

It's our problem, Piojitos. Not theirs. So what are we going to do about it? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

She has always done the dishes that way. I HATE it. I hate it more that I tell her it bothers me and she still does it. I don't think she does it to intentionally bother me but she can't break the habit.

What am I going to do about it?

Stop rinsing dishes, leave the kitchen and let someone else worry about it.

I don't know why I rinse dishes anyway. I HAVE A FRIGGIN MAID!!!!

Yes I guess it is my problem.

WW is taking the DD's to Mexico for the summer. They are leaving in two weeks. I decided to leave the DDs with Amazon Woman for the weekend and take WW to Bahrain to just get away. Oh yes. She did get her hair colored. But beyond that, it was just for us. The A seemed like an ancient memory. I had a great time doing very little.

Maybe my issues do not come from the infidelity in my marriage. Maybe I would still feel this way even if he was faithful. I don't know anymore. I just know I'm irritated and tired.

I cringe when he calls. I become tense when he pulls into the driveway. I look forward to the Saturdays that he works.

It's a lot deeper than I want to believe. Maybe even a little sick.

I'm stressed at work. I'm frustrated with my cluttered home. I am worried sick that we are sending my 15-year-old to Europe this summer.

I take it all out on my H.

Oh! I got a glimpse of The Mosquito. That's my H's fault, too. That nasty, buzzing insect is living behind my home.

Piojitos-the dishes thing? No big deal. Not an issue.

I am way beyond what you are going through. I am 5 years out and angrier than ever. I waited too long. It has festered.

But I will suffer. My kids are the most important thing in my life. I will smile and keep it all inside. I desperately need IC. No MC at this point.

I have a compelling urge to change my screen name. I already registered it so it's in the database but I haven't decided yet - mainly because I don't want Lemonman bustin on me yet again. But I really really want to.

I don't even know what piojitos means. I plugged it into one of those Spanish dictionary websites and it came up with nil. Maybe if I understood what that meant, I'd better understand why you want to change your screen name.

Actually that sums me up pretty well. Maybe I'll keep it.

It's not what I want to change my name FROM. It's what I want to change it TO.

piojitos are head lice if you want to get nit-picky.

That is hilarious!!!!

Okay, I give. What do you want to change it TO?

We are now going on six years. The Mosquito is still living behind my house.

I still feel the same. I have not stepped forward or back.

Ghostrider (Piojitos), you still around?

tater
I hope your buddies show up..
btw..great handle
just a thought from the jerseyboy
but arent the tatooes a trigger..??? what do the oldtimeers say about triggers??.this isnt retorical.. i really dont know..but If you really want to stay married to him..how about..getting into a meditation course.. and practcing..just leting it go
jerseyboy

If we're talking about meditation, Buddhism, etc.

Then,

this is your "shenpa", tater.

Your "hook", as it were.

Because you are hooked into this same problem, it has kept you from moving forward, or backward, or anywhere, for that matter.

Your shenpa.

It takes you into itself, and keeps you locked where you do not want to be, and keeps your thought process right

there


So, in meditation, you find yourself

hooked

and trying to escape this shenpa.


We all have one.


The question becomes, how to escape it?


Age-old.


Jerseyboy asks it, as do I.


If you have made the decision to stay where you are - in the marriage - then you must, then, make the next logical decision.

Which is to make yourself happy there.

It is not up to anyone else to do that, tater.

You are the force driving your own happiness. If in fact you choose to remain where you are - then you must choose to be happy. And to do the things which make you so.

Here's the Buddhist take on this topic, FWIW. (Since we are talking meditation, after all...)

Happiness is a state of being - actually, it can be chosen. It exists in and of itself.

An example of this "reality" is that there are days in which you wake up happy. There is no reason for it - you just wake up that way. Nothing has happened, you open your eyes, and the feeling of "I'm happy, the day feels good, I feel good, it's going to be a great and wonderful day!" is right there. (Yes, by the same token, the opposite feeling occurs, too!)

"Things" or "events" do not necessarily make us happy or sad. They contribute to our feelings, yes, but there is proof of this concept as well.

Many people who have had terrible events in their lives describe themselves as "happy". Many people who have absolutely nothing - live in desperate poverty - describe themselves as "happy". So happiness is independent of things and events. Sometimes related to, and interrelated at times, but independent, still.

So, at some point, there is a "choice" if you will. Outside the Buddhist thought it is considered perhaps a neurological choice, made unconsciously; others maintain that it is conscious.

I digress, sorry.


What I'm asking you is this:

Since you have decided to remain,

why have you not decided to make yourself happier there?

SB

It's been awhile since I've posted here. I'm wondering if I just couldn't answer Schoolbus. I know I read that post over and over. I even googled "shenpa". I'm still at a loss.

A year later...

I feel like it still hurts as much but not as often. Make sense? When I think of the A, it stabs just as much as before, but I think of it less often. I have taken a step towards something. Maybe a bit of peace. Maybe hope.

Dr. Phil says,"The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior."

I can honestly say that my H has been faithful the past 7 years. I think his brain has changed. He still has a low self-esteem. Instead of thinking, "I need to have someone else want me to feel good about myself", he now thinks, "No one else could possibly want me." He's gained some weight and is losing his hair. He is very self-conscience. I wish I could believe that he wants to be faithful because he loves me and doesn't want to hurt me again.

Obviously, I'm not over this. Probably because I know there are so many unanswered questions that he refuses to discuss. There's no negotiation when it comes to resolving my issues from the past.

We are still living in the same house. The basement is gutted as we remodel. I haven't seen the mosquito lately but I haven't been looking. It's spring, though. She may be lurking in the bushes. I'd still like to wallop her.

This has always been the next step. Unfortunately it is a bit like Dorothy understanding that she always had the power to go back to Kansas. She had to learn it for herself - otherwise she wouldn't have believed it.

I always liked this thread. It came along at a time I really needed it. I was rereading my posts and I have forgotten so much of that. I highlighted what schoolbus said because I think it is the key even though it is so simple. I was struggling along about the same pace as last year until very recently. I still love gemela but still am not “in love” with her. I still feel the pain of the A most days for a little bit. Some days it is better – some it is worse. Some days it is stronger – some days not. I may be like this the rest of my life. I hope not but I don’t know. Even if I do, the pain is not as bad as the good I have in the M. And we do have a lot of good in the M. I discovered what I was doing was mixing the pain of the A with the fear of a new A without being aware of it so I never completely trusted gemela and if she wasn’t where I thought she was (which didn’t happen very often), I always assumed the worst.

This was causing friction. Gemela wants me to trust her. I think she needs it. I was making myself unhappy worrying about a repeat offense. There is no doubt in my mind she could have another A in the right circumstances but I do think she has better boundaries now than before. I came to the point where I either needed to get a D or change my way of thinking. I did not want to continue to be unhappy. So the decision I made (and what I actually told gemela) one day when she accused me of checking up on her was that she was wrong. I told her (in all sincerity) that I didn’t care if she was having an A or not. She had already proven she was capable and therefore could do it again. It wasn’t my job to prevent her from doing it – that was her responsibility. I told her that if she did have an A, that sooner or later I would find out about it because there is no way she could keep it a secret forever and if I did discover she was having one, that we would immediately get divorced because I’ll never go through this again. So the choice is and always will be hers. Such a weight was lifted off me.

Now I still have the pain but I no longer have the worry. The difference between then and now is not how I feel about gemela but rather how I feel about myself. If I were to get a D, it would not devastate me. Now since I no longer need the M, I can choose to want it. I also know that if we D, gemela will be the loser (and I’m not talking about finances). I feel like the balance of power has shifted in my favor. And all this has occurred with no change in gemela. It has all occurred as a result of how I feel about myself.

We have many similar emotions. I, too, feel that I love my H but I'm not in love with him. I'm sure he feels the same way about me. We enjoyed a night together last night with all the kids gone. He BBQ'd steaks and we watched "The Curious Case of Benjamin Button". (awesome!!) We enjoyed each other's company and I felt safe. We have great moments in our M.

I am comfortable with my decision for staying in the marriage. It is better than what I imagined it would be 7 years ago when I let him back in the house but it will never be what I had hoped as I walked down that aisle 17+ years ago. That's gone. I will never have the "perfect" marriage. It's gone and that saddens me.

I'm not afraid that he will have another A though I do know it's a possibility. I'm more afraid of him going back to the alcohol and drugs.

For myself, I know that I have taken a stand for this M and am stronger because of it with my day-to-day decisions. I still fear that I am seen as a doormat. I still cannot forgive him. If I did, the severity of his actions would be lessened. He has not asked for forgiveness either. I believe that he has deliberately not asked for it because then it would reflect how devastating his A was. I don't feel I have ever really received a heart-felt apology from him. Those are the issues that beat me up. The flowers and gifts and little things he does around the house do not make up for his lack of remorse for what he caused me and our sons many years ago. He says he is sorry, but I don't know how deep.

I guess I have chosen to "not be unhappy".

I believe our situations are very different.

We don't have access to Benjamin Button.

Tatertot,

Your description of your H at this point in time raises a red flag for me. My FWH was feeling exactly this way prior to his A. He became so depressed over aging (and many other things during his nuclear midlife crisis), that he desperately looked for anything to ease the pain and relive the glory of his younger days. He started with a few pathetic attempts to pick up women in bars. He progressed to an extremely long-distance EA with a high school classmate. He then started losing weight and working on his appearance. The A became a PA when he went home for his 30th reunion.

Please don't assume that your H will remain faithful because he has low self-esteem and is feeling bad about the way he looks. That could very well be what drives him to infidelity in an attempt to feel better.

Your other comments about so many unanswered questions and your ongoing anger really struck a chord with me too. After D-Day, H told me the worst of the things about the A, but because it was so painful for him to discuss, he would not talk about the minor details. This kept me stalled in my recovery because I couldn't see the big picture and I continued to worry that there was more I didn't know (as in other incidents of infidelity).

Once H's work schedule lightened up a month ago, we spent about a week talking and e-mailing and sorting through the details of all his infidelity. It turns out there were two more instances of attempted infidelity, but they didn't change anything because they were just a part of the larger story, which I already knew.

I did have to work to convince H that answering all my questions would be the best thing for both of us. Then the floodgates opened and all kinds of details came out. H even would initiate some of these conversations! Ironically, a lot of what he told me actually made him look better (as much as that could be possible in this situation). Right after d-day, and for the next 7 months, H depicted OW as totally blameless. He insisted he had done all the pursuing and he took 100% responsibility. It turns out OW was a conniving, lying, drug-using POS who was manipulating H like crazy. She was so good at manipulating him that H didn't realize he'd been played until we started connecting the dots together. While nothing H revealed excuses his behavior, it does explain a lot.

The end result of all this free-flowing discussion was to free me from the anger that had been building. That alone was worth the effort, but much to H's surprise, it brought him peace too.

I should add that whenever we've talked about the A, I've been very low-key (which is a real achievement for me!) and non-judgmental (also tough for me). I wanted him to feel safe to bare his soul.

If you've lived for 5-6 years with so many unanswered questions, no wonder you're angry. I don't see how you can move past this state without complete honesty. You shouldn't have to settle for anthing less.

Thank you, Bea.

I do realize that there is always the risk of him having another A. I do trust him more and more each day but I will never be able to trust him 100%. I'm still on guard. I still check his cell phone and his whereabouts. I always know where he is. He always answers his phone. There are no questions concerning finances. I'm more comfortable than I have been for many years.

I do have issues of moving ahead. I'm sure there are others out there that believe 7 years is a long time for me to continue with this grudge. To me, it seems like yesterday. I still have vivid memories. My IC once suggested some kind of eye-movement therapy that is suppose to help one forget pain-provoking memories. Not sure if that is for me. I don't want to forget, I just want to know everything.

I'm not sure where I'm suppose to be. I guess I'm a little happier, a little more content than I was a year ago. That is one more year of no A. I have something really deep inside me that soaks up my energy, though. It leaves me feeling sick, guilty. I question my emotional stability at times. Why do I still feel this way after 7 years? How long is thing going to take? I feel neurotic...a bit manic at times because I can't shake it. It comes and goes but when it's here, it gnaws.

My dad was bi-polar and my mom is the biggest worry-wart. Maybe I have some of those tendancies. I'm very dedicated to my family and my career but I'm so dang tired! I just want a break.