Need some help from anyone out there who has been through this before I make a mistake.

Married 10 years, 2 young children and me and my wife have become disconnected through career, responsibility etc. We dont ever fight.

3 months ago I got hit with "I think I want a divorce" out of the blue and my wife tells me she loves me but is not in-love with me. Went to counseling and we worked on re-connecting. Things got GREAT! Now 2 weeks ago I get told "I want a divorce, I'm done" and my wife suddenly has alot of resentment for me (6 months or so). Shell take a seperation but feels divorce is imminent and wishes to put no effort into it. On top of that I got layed off from my job.

Issue- Shes a bartender working nights and weekends. I'm layed off. I don't even think it's possible to facilitate a divorce or seperation right now. I can stave off the divorce or seperation for now due to finances and work on getting her to get further help with me. Ultimately, she wants the house and the kids but she can't afford the house and has no idea how she can take care of the kids working nights and weekends yet is actually willing to divorce anyway and sort it out after (remember, we have 2 kids)

Advice? Me give her space and bounce from friends house to house? Take the seperation and move back to mom and pop (******)? Cohabitate and try to get her to get further help with me? Got to think about the kids here.

Shes dead set on considering us "done" but I have got her to start reading "Marriage Fitness" by Mort Fertell. She needs a major wake up call but I don't know how to give it. HELP

5/30/07-Well, I spent the night at a friends house last night and came home mid morning. My wife said that in her time alone she felt relieved at first, the pressure had somewhat been lifted off her, then she began to feel lonely and began to miss me and think there might be something worth saving.

She then told me she thought she would prefer a seperation instead of divorce, maybe this could be saved. I had a phone call scheduled with a consulor I've been talking with and I asked him that question, "could a seperation (time to be day by day) be a positive thing, could it help?" He answered "No", you need to avoid that at all costs and you need to try and work through this slowly together.

Anyone out there had lasting success after a short seperation period? Or gone through Mort Fertell's marriage fitness program? Shes at-least reading the book now.

5-31-07 Things are changing a bit rapidly but heres the latest. She calls last night from work and only has a few minutes to talk but tells me that maybe she just needs a major life change, getting out of her job and a move. She then asks me to go ahead and apply to a couple of jobs near her family, 2 hours away which is where we had discussed moving to previously. If we sell our home, cash in investments and build there, she won't have to work any longer and can stay home with the kids not to mention free family baby sitting. But, before we hang up she states that "if we did get a dvorce, she would at least have family near by and be able to take care of the kids on her own".

Now she was on a time limit to get her thoughts out and things seem very nice today but she still isnt wearing her wedding ring. If we sell, cash in investments and start a new life it would relieve tons of pressure off us and her. Maybe we would have a new start and a second chance. On the other hand, if I get her out there and do this, then she leaves me, I'm financially hosed while shes sitting pretty.

My wife is a kind and loving woman, not vindictive or hateful but I have my reserves about this. comments? Weve been also question if she is going through a mid-life crisis? 2 counselors suggested this also. It's all so sudden and extreme

6-1-07 Today as she left for work I saw a ring on her finger, looked down at it and she noticed. It wasn't the wedding ring however which she ackowledged but she turned to me and said "I'm thinking about it". She's still reading "Marriage Fitness" also, so I guess I've had a few good signs now but I don't want to ask and push her further away. I just wish I knew what to do.

UHG- long read I know. Anyone got some thoughts?

Are you sure she does not have a new male friend?

I'm sure as I can be. I have asked her, checked her cell logs and our cell phones have GPS that you can track on the net, havent turned up anything. Also, betweem her work schedule, kids schedules and her time at home with me, it leaves even little time for sleep.

don't leave the house
don't pay one dime for a legal sep or divorce,she wants it so bad let HER pursue and pay for it with her own money.

sounds like that "7 year itch" thing. she is questioning stuff, etc., going through many emotions. you marriage sounds to me like it can definitely be saved. will she see a counselor? will she read here?

read up on Plan A and Plan A your butt off. I feel from what you have posted that she will respond very well to that.

just my thoughts.
mlhb

JAG,

I think you should keep the idea of an affair in your sights.Why? Because of two important things you mentioned that are classic:

The ILYBINILWY ( I love you but I'm not in love with you) speech and the wedding rings are off.

Not only that but the resentment, the divorce sentiment that comes out of the blue and the desire to be on her own suddenly, to "think" things through.Also,the rapid fire changes in her actions and thought processes.Many times when a person is in the affair,they have some very serious decisions to make and quick or else they lose the other person involved or the potential for that other relationship so the emotions/excitement they are feeling toward the other person and a possible new beginning start to become more important,they rewrite history in their minds to make it sound like they were not happy with the marriage,you, the family,their lives so they need a "change".

I have been here years and cannot think of anyone that did not have this happen to them when their spouse was in an affair.Keep in mind that affairs don't have to be physical,they can be emotional too.I hope I am wrong but do keep it on the back burner and keep your ears and eyes wide open for any clues.

Incidentally,did you ask about the ring that she had on? Was it hers or a new one? My ex wayard husband had a new ring as do many cheaters: wearing items given to them by the other person.My ex actually wore a silver band the other woman gave him before we were even divorced.And on the wedding finger too.sick

If you get a chance go over to the general questions board and do some reading and see if there are any similarities to her behavior and what is going on.Also read up on the concepts here.

Keep posting.

The ring she had on in the above post was a ring she bought a while back while I was with her. Tomorrow is my daughters birthday and were having a party for her in the afternoon, family over etc. It will be intresting to see how she acts towards me after everyone leaves or if she'll just wan't to get out of the house. Tuesday, she is flying out of town to see one of her girlfriends and get away for a couple of days. I know she's going there as I've seen the e-mails back and forth for the past week. This is all so confusing.

If she stays at home tomorrow night, I'm not sure what we can do as I can imagine there will probably be a bit of tension between us. I'll post tomorrow night on the results.

So,how did things go JAG? Inquiring minds want to know <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Well, things went extremely well yesterday and last night. She was wearing her ring again yesterday and continued to this morning. We were both fairly busy with our seperate duties yesterday but we had a little time to relax last night before we crashed. We thought about getting a movie but just had some good conversation instead until we both fell asleep somewhat early. Not the affection or great sex we had until this came up the 2nd time, just a few weeks ago but it was good.While her mother was over, all of us were discussing plans to relocate etc as I wrote above.

Still, when she left for the gym this morning I got my usual quick hug with a turned cheeck for a peck but no good kiss, which I haven't got since this all started. I just wish I could read her mind.

Tomorrow, she flies out to NYC for 3 days to help take care of her girlfriend and get away for a bit. Were also home around each other almost all day today which could be good or bad. I really wan't to move to the next step towards getting through this and putting it behind us but I'm trying to be careful not to push her away again and take it slow. I'll post again tomorrow.

Thanks for all your comments.

Update-

Well, our family vacation went really well at first. We had fun with the kids, we laughed, relaxed together and we were having a great time. Until our last night there. At dinner I noticed she wasn't wearing her ring again (shes been wearing it again recently) and with a smile on my face (I didn't think it was intentional) I pointed and asked "did you forget it?". She said "I don't know, maybe". Long story short; this later evolved into a deeper and more heated discussion where she again stated she was done, she didn't think we were meant to be together and thought divorce was inevitable although would consider a seperation first. Great lead in to a fathers day I was supposed to spend at the in-laws (whom I love).

I'm afraid that I, myself am starting to feel "done". Working through the roller coaster of this is killing me and she won't participate in getting constructive help with me to save our marriage. Yet, she won't/hasn't taken any steps to file for divorce or seperation and has no real plan for how she is going to keep the house and take care of the kids working nights and weekends even with child support. She just wants the marriage over and plans to sort out the consequences after.

No obvious marital problems leading up to this, one would think we were very happy. I just don't know what to do. Stick it out and continue to get hurt in the hopes she will come around while things deteriorate or end this myself. This is seriously starting to affect me emotionally and physically

Jag,

If you look or go through counseling you may find that there are some marital problems, or it could just be a mid-life crisis. If there are some marital problems some work could give birth to a new relationship.

On the note of what your wife is saying and not saying is SOOO eerily familiar to me. My wife is saying the same to me about relocating but to 4+ hours away from where we are at. Her approach to this was to divorce me and then move. When she found it would be difficult she said lets move or I will divorce you. I had a hard time moving by being threatened. I worked very hard at improving myself and listening to her needs. All efforts were dismissed as I did nothing about her demand to move to her family. It has been a rough 2 years.

We are in the process of being divorced. Me blaming her for divorcing me. Her blaming me for causing the divorce and not stopping it by not moving (again I am unsure of her motives). She just recently put in an order for removal from State with the courts and I am fighting it (We have two little ones too, DD3 DD5). It is VERY costly and I don't know what the out come will be. Sometimes I think I just want to try to move with her. I do love her. Things have changes so much through this.

Bottom line you will have to make your own choices. I wish someone could tell you (and me) which the right path is. Just be careful she does not secretly try to take your kids away from you. For that you need your involvement with the kids to keep them from being moved too far away from you (depending on state law)

Jag, I would bet large sums of money I don't even have that she's having an affair, if not physical then at least emotional. If that's the case the last thing you want to do is separate (well, unless you also want a divorce.)

I would suspect either someone at the gym, or someone who lives near her friend in New York City.

You might want to go over to the Infidelity boards.

I think I have come to a few conclusions with our situation after a brief but needed discussion with my wife today (we had plans on going out tomorrow night). For months now I have tried to be reconnect with her and fill her love bank while keeping LBs almost non-exsistant (anything can set her off right now though). She has alot of animosity built up towards me and she says virtualy anything I do irritates her, good or bad. Now remember, we have always got along perfectly well, no fights and have fun together. Still, at this point she does not wish to put any effort in keeping our marriage together. She feels done and quite suddenly I might add.

I don't believe she is letting my love bank deposits get through, at all. She is simply fixated on our marriage being over. She has agreed however to discuss what LBs I have commited over time with me tomorrow night but thats it. My question: I saw this topic in another thread but I can't find it now. What can one do in this type of situation where our partner has put up a wall and your deposits just wont get accepted? I start a new job next week and I feel once I hit the first big pay check, I will get served with divorce papers or at the very least a seperation agreement (money isnt an issue with us at the moment, were financially ok under one roof that is). However, divorce or even seperation means she has to struggle to get by working nights and weekends as a bartender with no end in site. Our children, 8/10 yrs will have a very hard time with this. A divorce will cost us more than getting marriage help/couseling etc. I will be emotionally devestated and possibly financially too.

Considering the above, wouldnt the best option for anyone in her situation be to give something constructive a try?

Even 6 weeks before I get hit with this, she cried one night thinking about herself aging and worried I may one day leave her?? I just don't understand whats happening.

My situation is becomming dire. Anyone have some suggestions?

jag,

Is there possibly more to it than this? When you become disconnected, you stop meeting each others emotional needs. Resentment builds. Arguments occur. Has there been any abuse? Emotional, physical, substance, alcohol?

I would be highly suspect of her job as a bartender. Bartenders have a tendency to become connected with their patrons, especially the regulars. Alcohol is flowing, flirting is rampant. An emotional affair with a patron is plausible.

The grass may seem greener after a tipping a couple of shots with a patron at the bar.

Have you read the emotional needs portion of this website and shared it with your wife? Even though she is blocking your attempts at making love deposits, it helps to know that you are at least attempting to make the right kind of deposits at the right times.

Understanding what her needs are and when she needs them met is key to making the right deposits at the right times.

It doesn't completely make sense to me but I have come to some realities after our date night.
No abuse of any kind in our relationship. It's actually been very nice and we both agree we are each others best friend and trust each other fully. Her job has had an impact and it is both our faults for not removing her from that environment earlier. She has admitted it makes things easier on her and doesn't enable to see our situation from the proper perspective as she does get hit on nightly and always has by druken patrons. Also, all her co-workers are young and single so she has a very odd environment for a 37 year old, married mother of two. Now, it's too late to make a change in that regard as she will need the employment being single.

Over dinner last night we discussed some things. She cannot force herself to allow my efforts to get through. She cannot get past the feeling things are done. She is out of love and has no affection towards me left.

Given this, we are going to seperate. I start a new job next week (commission only) so we will have to stay under the same roof for a minimum of 2-3 months (possibly longer) so I can afford to move out and furnish another home which I will rent so the kids will have a place to come see me. Now, I am going to be fixing the house up during my time left here so that it can be placed on the market when I leave. She cannot afford it on her own in the long run and it's quite large and more than she really needs with just her and the kids. The kids will be told of the seperation when we have a date of action set.

I have asked her to let me know my love busters that she says I have still been commiting, I have asked her to address her emotional needs with me, which she did not and may never. She states that her emotional needs that she wants and the needs that I am not fullfilling are seperate needs which I don't understand but I guess it may not really matter anymore.

Although, I try to still remain hopeful and maybe the impending seperation may give her the kick in the butt she says she needs to want to try again. I feel I have done all I can and we both agree there is nothing I can do to make her wan't to try to keep our marriage together. She does want to see if the grass is greener on the other side even though she thinks we could go on for the rest of our lives as we are and we could be "happy" together. She wonders if theres a higher level of happiness out there for her.

In 2-3 months we will be seperated but the final action of divorce will be on her and soon to follow I'm sure. In the meantime I will still try plan A etc, no need not to but I believe she is in-fact "done". Thanks to all for your comments and support as I get through this rough time and I will update the thread periodically.

Jag- I feel for you. I am in the same situation, but no children, married 27 years. Wife is bound for sep/div. All I can is take care of myself. Sad, but where there is life there is hope.

JAG,

This must be awful for you. Something just doesn't make sense here. If its not an affair (which it does seem like) or deep seated resentment, it's puzzling. Any big changes in your or her life? A past affair of yours, an old boyfriend of hers back in her life, a death of one of her parents, previous mental instability in her background?

Has she ever had reservations about her job. Have you ever asked her to consider switching jobs? If so, what was her reaction?

In any event, I don't see why you would support a separation. I really don't see the benefit for you, her, or the marriage. Why not let her be the one to move out? Do you think you might be an 'appeaser'?

Does she see the consequences of divorce on the children?
Have you read the 'carrot and stick' post on GQII? You can't keep her in the marriage, but she should experience the consequences of breaking it up if she is set on doing it.

Best of luck,

- WG

I agree, it doesn't make sense at all. I really don't think there is anyone else as I just don't see where she would find the time honestly. She has stated she just wan't to feel free and not answer to anyone or feel guilt.We have tried getting her out of her job for years but I've been shutting down banks and mortgage companies for 3 years now. Shes also become close friends with girls/women nearly half her age she hangs out with alot from work lately. Possibly a mid-life crisis?

Anyway, I think I just really came to a point yesterday where I no longer felt like being treated as a doormat or live-in baby sitter. All she has been able to tell me is "I feel done" or "I no longer wan't to try and theres nothing you can do to change that". And again, even though we don't fight and never really have, my son (10) knows something is up and just not right. I shouldn't have to live like this. She says she knows shes just being selfish and only thinking of her.Even last night, she got off work at 1am but stayed and drank till 5am, drove home drunk and slept in her clothes.

So in-light of the above; I woke up early this moring. I called a painter, stucco repair co., had new windows installed (home warranty in progress), installed new vent fans and more. When she woke up at noon I was standing in our foyer talking to a realtor I had called. When she asked what the ****** was going on, I told her I was moving out as soon as it was feasable.

She asked why the change of heart and sudden urgency and I had to tell her that I believed what she has been telling me repeatedly all this time. If she can't move to make some progress with me; we are in-fact "done". I also firmly told her, unless she can put our marriage and our kids as the priorty in her life and either quit her job or make a plan to quickly leave it there is nothing left for me to hold onto anyway. Thats not the woman I married. I did ask if she was "sure" this is what she wants and she said she didn't know.

Later in the day, she said she thought it would be good if I could find a rental in the same school district so if the house sold her and the kids could move in or if I did make the move near her parents 2hrs away with my new job we could arrange the same there. I had to tell her "no". The kids could come obviously but not her, unless she was fully committed to working on our marriage. I'm not going to do that to myself or the kids otherwise.

Maybe this is the tough love she needs to get her to re-adjust her priorities in life or maybe she is just "done". Either way, I've got to think about me and my kids now. I can't keep living like this. I pray my decisions are going to be for the best as above all, I want our marriage to make it but if it continues as it has, it only seems to grow worse.

jag,

I do not recommend moving out. At least not without a legal custody agreement in hand. Moving out can be viewed by the courts as abandonment.

Get your ducks in a row first. Consult an attorney, get a separation agreement which includes custody and then you can move out.

Don't accommodate her. If she wants a divorce, she should be the one moving out. Let her find herself an apartment and see what it is like to support two households. Why should you bear the burden?

A separation is basically a business deal. Be ALL business.

JAG,


You surely must see that with behavior like this, she has the time and opportunity for an affair. What external confirmation do you have that she did what she said she did? Perhaps you should re-read the 'Spying 101' post on GQII. Have you tried a keylogger? Have you checked mileage on the car to see if she is making any trips she is lying about?

My wife suffers from low self-esteem, and approaching 40, she felt she missed out on a hip, carefree single life in her twenties. Hanging out with GFs half her age is not a good sign. My situation is different, but my wife and I worked off shifts, which sounds like something you and I have in common. In hindsight, I wished I had worked to change this.

If there is an affair, your spouse won't be thinking straight and will not likely be able to choose the marriage. Its a hard thing to believe about your partner, and I was completely taken by surprise. If you find out that there is an affair, you may be able to take steps to end it.

I fought for my marriage for close to a year, then I moved out. (My WS couldn't be honest and break off contact with affair partners.) I couldn't tolerate it, and I eventually moved out. Its now been about eight months, but there are a lot of downsides:

• 
  * My WS has alienated me from our teenage child. Visitation is rare (not by my choice).
  * I have lost untold thousands of dollars of personal property that I may never be able to recover. I am not able to return to the home at will.
  * I opened myself up to charges of abandonment (which I can counter)
  * It gave my WS opportunity to recharge an affair, shamelessly and frequently bringing an OP into our home and our bed while I am away.
  * Being alone is harder than I thought. While in my case separation and divorce is proving to be the best course, it wouldn't say that moving out made me a happier person. I still have to deal with the bitterness/unfairness of my wife's poor choices.

You can make some decisions (i.e., boundaries) to protect yourself and still live in the home.

Wishing you the best,

- WG

Thanks for the feedback. Today we continued on with getting the house ready for sale. The reality of it all has set in a bit and things between us got ugly for a few minutes here and there. After a breather, we discussed this and we both saw how quickly things can turn bad quite easily and this is just the begining.

For now, we are going to continue getting the house ready to sell but we both do want our kids to remain in the same school system so were faced with 3 options.
1) Her keep the house, me move out and she can try to refi the home into her name-cashing out half the equity to me.
2) Sell the home, split the equity and figure it out from there.
3) Stick together and work hard as we can on our marriage, sell or stay in the home-doesn't matter.

I told her I firmly believed the right thing to do for our own potential happiness and the kid's was to work on reconnecting and strengthening our marriage but she has to firmly commit and get in a totally positive frame of mind to make that possible. She told me she agreed that would be the best thing to do but shes not at that point yet but mulling it over-whatever that means (still feels she wants a divorce). So for now I guess we will continue getting the home ready and I'll have to adapt to changes as they come.

We have both agreed that we need to continue our new date night as we go through this, if anything we need to remain civil for the kids and who knows, maybe it will help us get a little closer. I have thought about what some have stated in their replys- if she wants the divorce, let her move out and get it etc but I do worry that approach will end us up in court and make matters worse.

If things do get ugly though, I will not hesitate to empty my 401k and get a hardcore attourney and fight for custody and the home if she doesn't have a solid plan to how she will manage without me, given her night and weekend schedule, lack of benefits and lower earning potential. I worry if that is even winnable though if it comes down to it.

Thank you all soo much for your feedback and I'll keep updating.