Hi all I desperately need your advice. It's still early days for me as I have only just found out about H's relationship with OW.I also discovered he had got her pregnant nad stood by her through a miscarriage. I have no children and H does not want any with me so this has been truly hurtful.

I'm dealing with my feelings and trying my best to give our relationship another chance.Things have moved fast this last few days, NC email sent to OW and H has removed her numbers and closed down email account. I know he could still contact her but I believe he hasn't.I'm trying to stick with the reconcilliation but have been very weak in the beginning and after advice form several ofthe people at MB I am now showing signs of being stronger and using plan A techniques. But I blew it last night. Went out to a pre-arranged dinner with H's colleagues. Had a lovely evening meeting these guys for the 1st time (H works and lives abroad and it is first opportunity for me to stay long term with him and socialise). I could fel anger and resentment building up in me when I was talking to htese people. Anger at my H for this OW, I sat there smiling and being friendly talking about our wedding and playing the dutiful wife when inside was screaming "He was with her, its all a lie". I ried to contorl what was building up and drinking alcohol was not a good move. I kept it together in front of his work colleagues but snapped when we got home. I just went crazy shouting and screaming. I was like a banshee with tears sobbing out of me like no tomorrow. The look on his face was sheer distate which made me worse, I felt so degraded and low. I started saying I'm sorry and thatI was sorry I was not like her and he replied "Don't I now it!" with much venom and sarcasm. I was broken. I did something really stupid and took a knife and cut my arm.Not a deep cut just scratches. Why did I do this? I felt desperate at the time. Did I want a reaction from him. all night I kept hoping he would give me some loving attention but he did not and i can remember thinking he does not want ot be here with me he wants her.Why I am I feling so desperate and where is this anger coming from????

Scratching at my arm with the knife was the only thing I could do to take away the dreadful feeling I had inside me that was just getting out of control. I think I'm losing my mind, I am ashamed today as to my behaviour. I have called H and apologised and explained that the past 2 week tension and shock has just built up inside me and manifested into something I could not control.

Please help me. I am on my own apart from H, in a foreign country. I don't know anyone here and I look to MB for guidance. I am going home in 4 weeks time.

I want to control this. I want to plan A him and make him realise he has made the right choice but I keep blowing it. How can I keep on track?

lyndam - Infidelity hurts at a magnitude that is almost indescribable to anyone who has not been a Betrayed Spouse and experienced it for themselves. I don't want to cruel, but a question MUST be asked, so if it adds to your pain I am sorry.

WHY do you want to recover what appears to have not been a marriage to begin with?

His affair predated your marriage and continued through the ceremony and into you first months together.

He was NOT interested in "keeping myself only unto you" and his vulgar comment of "Don't I now it!" indicates strongly that he has no intention of fidelity in marriage to you.

Why are you so desperate to have THIS man as your husband?

What does your husband "get" out of being married to you and why did he agree to marriage after you had been available to him without being married for so long previously?

When did he agree to the marriage and wedding plans were begun in relation to his affair with this OW (Other Woman)?

I respect your honesty foreverhers. We made plans for the wedding 12 months previous. I am not sure why I love or want this man. Maybe I will snap out of this crazy nightmare and find the strength to walk away.

What do you suggest I do. Ask him to tell me what he gets from the marriage? Make a list of pros and cons? He is going to see a counsellor in a few weeks time and I wil go along with him. I really don't know what to do and I guess you are saying just walk away

To all you reading this post I must sound weak and pathetic wanting to stick with this man after what he has done. Maybe I am but I love him and he is saying he has made a huge mistake and will not hurt me again. He says he is ashamed and is going to see MC to help him understand why he has done it. I'd appreciate honest advice and thoughts as I am on my own out here. I have followed advice given in my first posting to try and save this relationship. Please give me your opinions. Thank you for helping me.

Your reaction to your H's betrayal is normal. I think most of us BS's felt weak and pathetic at the early points of discovery. Why??? Because we believe in fidelity and the betrayal knocks us for a loop. I believe(d) that marriage should protect us from intruders; it's a shock to find out that it doesn't.

Don't be hard on yourself. Read all on this site and work on yourself to build confidence.

Whether you choose to continue in this marriage is up to you. It's going to be hard work either way. I don't know whether you're wanting children eventually or not; you did state that he doesn't want kids. If your views are different on this, that's a big deal...either way one of you "loses."

lyndam - You misunderstand the questions. Those who know me around here know that I am strong believer in saving all marriages that CAN be saved. Not all marriages should be saved, as in the case of a severely abusive spouse, but the reality is that even in the cases where one spouse (usually the Betrayed Spouse) wants to save their marriage, not all marriages ARE saved because it takes both spouses actually wanting to save it and trying hard to save it.

I asked the questions to "get a feel" for WHY you want to remain married to this man. His "Don't I know it" retort to you seemed to be a glimpse into what is really going on in his mind.

Now you state that he is "sorry" and that he has agreed to counseling, and those are both positive things.





Yes, that's exactly what I am suggesting. You need to know WHY he wants to recover a marriage that his adultery said he didn't really want. So you need to know if you are just someone to keep house or if you are indeed going to be a WIFE. A "housekeeper" he can hire. A wife is lifetime commitment that has NO room for anyone else in it no matter what he might be feeling or what "needs" he thinks you are, more importantly are not, meeting the "way he'd like them to be met."

His adultery was a pure act of selfishness, and that level of "me first" is not conducive to a good marriage.

You state your reason for wanting to save your marriage is that you love him. That's obviously a good, and necessary, starting point. But there are underlying issues that need to be addressed because recovery from adultery is NOT an easy task to accomplish.

If he is truly repentant and wants to "change his ways," then you will have to be ready to forgive him, totally. That's a lot easier to say than it is to actually do. So you need a firm understanding of what YOU are promising to him if you do choose to forgive him. Forgiveness IS a requirement for a successful recovery, but again, the trauma of adultery is huge and the wounds are usually very deep. One casualty of adultery is the immediate and permanent loss of "blind trust." So add trust to the "bin" of required items needed to have a successful recovery.

Trust takes much longer to rebuild than it does to grant forgiveness. Trust after betrayal can only be EARNED. That's not to say that you can't simply grant trust in some areas, you can and you will. But you will find those areas to be relatively easy and NOT related to his exclusive fidelity to YOU as his one and only wife.

The trust I am talking about is the kind that will allow you to allow yourself the possibility of being hurt again. That's usually the last "wall of protection" that a BS takes down, and it usually takes years to get to that point.

That's why his being open, transparent, and accountable to you are so important. He has to surrender his "right to privacy" to you so that he can earn your trust again. You have to get to the point where you are comfortable that you "can predict his behavior in a given situation even when you are not around."

With respect to the counseling. What your MARRIAGE needs is Joint Marital Counseling. Individual Counseling is rarely focused on what someone needs to do for the "good of the marriage and spouse." You both need to be present during counseling so that you both can hear and see what is said and the responses. This is a Joint effort in rebuilding, and initial counseling sessions can get quite stressful. But that IS the point of the counseling. It is to get the festering stuff out in the open so that it CAN be addressed and dealt with. Neither of you are "mind readers," so you need this openness to stop the "guessing games" and find out what is really going on and what may need to be changed in both of you, for the good of the marriage.

If faith in God plays a part in your marriage, or individual lives, you need to address that part also. So if it is, spiritual advice is also recommended.

God bless.

Thank you Forever Hers.I appreciate your advice and will take what you have said (as he will no longer talk about the A). I do want to work at this relationship as we have had 6 1/2 happy years. Obviously ups and downs but he was faithful to me right up to moving away and as this site predicts he is pointing the finger at me and when angry saying he was pushed into an A because I am unreasonable and "angry" with him and have been for the duration of the relationship. I do feel hurt by this. If I question him or bring up issues that are concerning me he would say I was nagging. He would not talk to me about relationship issues so things have always built up and come out when we have been out. I really did pick up the vibes that the affection he once had for me was getting less and less and could feel that he only visited or spoke to me out of guilt and a feeling that he owed it to me as he still felt I was a nice person but was no longer in love with me physically and mentally. He "loved" me but was not "in love me". I can see this now and I was right to question his change in personality. He seemed more arrogant than usual and extremely critical. He did not show me affection at all during an evening out and I would be left watching other couples looking happy and being tactile with each other and feel hurt and frustrated. I would then bring it up at the only time I could get him to talk to me and that was always after a night out where alcohol was involved. This in turn always turned into a row filled with resentment and frustration. The same is happening now. I am left with all these unanswered questions about the A and feeling vulnerable and unloved so I tiptoe around and when I think he has relaxed enough after a few drinks I ask him to please talk to me and explain his feelings. He goes mad and then starts the blame for his indiscretion saying it is exactly this reason why he went off with OW. I think this is extremely unfair. I called her a name last night and he immediately turned on me saying she was a professional person and I had no right to name call her. This hurt me deeply as I took it that he is defending her and protecting her. I went to bed crying and he scolded me and said it was pathetic and I needed to grow up and stop being a child. He said he had heard it for 3 weeks and was sick of me being a victim. He said I had to be stronger and to be able to face lifes ups and downs. I was scolded like a child, afraid to cry, afraid I was going to anger him further. He said when my brother dies in October last year I had taken it badly and that I needed to toughen up. I was alone at home when my brother died and he had just left to move to another country. I was devastated and dealt with the death on my own with his support by email and phone. I think he is being extremely cruel to me saying these things as they are not the words of someone who is trying to build up a relationship. I feel I am annoying him. He wants me to shut up and get over it or we will not move on. Is he right?

I will go to the MC with him and I hope it will be good for us. I think I am starting to see a very heartless man who I can't help loving but I am also realising that his lack of emotion and support is a deep rooted problem from his childhood. He has 2 children from a previous marriage and his son is extremely vulnerable at the moment and my H cannot give that emotional support to his son. He loves him very much but he cannot relate to showing affection. He can with his daughter but it still looks uncomfortable for him.My H thinks that partying or having fun makes everything alright and applies this to both his relationship with me and his children. Its like he cannot face the real world and real issues. It unnerves him. I now that I will find strength and if I cannot see a way forward in one month's time I know deep down I have to walk away. If there are no positive signs of him improving I now he will never be able to give that emotional support and affection required for a good relationship and I do not want to be the brunt of his cruel words for the rest of my life as I now he will have many A's as he will not have changed and if he does not get the "perfect" partner in me he will sulk and go looking for it as if its his god given right to be happy regardless of the affects it will have on me his wife and his family.

lyndam - first things first. You need to move your posting to the General Questions II forum where there is a much higher rate of posting from others so that you can get as much support and advice as possible.

Second, having read your post I have to agree, sort of, with one thing that your husband has said, you are appearing to be weak and whiney. That is very understandable to me, because having been a Betrayed Spouse I know the emotional shock you are going through.

Here is what I see.

You have had 6.5 years of a "wonderful relationship."
He has had 6.5 years of "free sex" and no commitment.

You have been married 4 months.
He has never been married to you.

He was married before.
Why did he divorce the first time?

He has children.
He is NOT a father.

You want children.
He does not want children.

Question: Are you so weak and insecure that you will take the "garbage" as your filet mignon?

I understand that for whatever reason YOU want to save your marriage. So try Marriage Counseling and see if it helps. Keep a close eye on what is said to him, his responses, and what he begins to make changes in.

I am NOT convinced, personally, that this marriage is worth saving because you've never HAD a marriage. YOU have, but he has not. The BASIS doesn't seem to be there.

Certainly NOT the basis that can withstand an extended separtation (overseas work environment) because your husband is NOT "into" denying his own wants for sex and honoring his wedding commitment to "forsake all others."

I am convinced from what you wrote that his "I'm sorry" is nothing more than he's sorry he got caught cheating. He is NOT sorry in a repentant way.

So let's get practical for just a minute. This is going to require you to stiffen your spine, accept that the marriage already ended when he chose adultery BEFORE, DURING, and AFTER your marriage.


"saying he was pushed into an A because I am unreasonable and "angry" with him and have been for the duration of the relationship. "

This is typical Wayward Spouse attempting to "gaslight" you and make YOU the problem. Lyndam, here is the absolute truth that YOU must know and understand. There is NO excuse for Adultery. The FAULT for Adultery is completely and 100% on the Adulterer. They own it 100%.

IF there were relationship "troubles" two things should have happened.

1. He should never have married you.

2. He should have talked with about the perceived problems, and with a PRE-marital counselor, before CHOOSING to engage in adultery with another woman.


"He goes mad and then starts the blame for his indiscretion saying it is exactly this reason why he went off with OW."

NO, this is his "excuse" for cheating. He doesn't want to accept responsibility for HIS choices and HIS actions. He wants to make you the "bad guy" in this so he can either "justify" the unjustifiable or CONTROL you so that he can continue doing whatever he wants to do regardless of its impact on you.



"I went to bed crying and he scolded me and said it was pathetic and I needed to grow up and stop being a child. He said he had heard it for 3 weeks and was sick of me being a victim. He said I had to be stronger and to be able to face lifes ups and downs.."

"3 weeks?" He was nailing his bimbo for 7 months, and THAT's not pathetic?

I'm sorry lyndam, but he has NO concept of love, much less care for you. OF COURSE he doesn't "like" to see the emotional devastation HE has caused, because it makes him have to see that HE is the cause and his choices DO have consequences on others. He wants to deny that and wants to believe that he can do anything he wants and it's "just the ups and downs of life, so get over it."



"He wants me to shut up and get over it or we will not move on. Is he right?"

Yes and no. He is right that he wants you to "move on," BUT only on HIS terms. Marriage is 100/100% deal, not a 50/50 deal like so many like to think.

He is right that HE wants you to "shut up" and forget about the single biggest betrayal one spouse can do to another spouse because he thinks HE has the right to do anything he wants and you only have the right to "sit there and take it."

He is right that for 6.5 he has been able to mainpulate you and control you and fool you into thinking he was a "nice guy" and "marriage material." NOW you know the hard truth, he is a USER of people, not a lover of people.

HE is intensely selfish and only concerned about himself.

It hurts to know that you could have been so naive and "blinded" by YOUR love for him that you wouldn't let yourself "see" the ugly side of him.

I am equally certain that during the previous 6.5 years before your marriage that all was NOT always "peaches and cream." I am certain that with his selfishness there were many time when you "saw" the real him, and then chose to ignore it, excuse it, forget it.

So he is expecting more of the same now.

Is THAT how you want to spend your married life?

Make it CLEAR to him that you will go to counseling with him because you love him, BUT he is on notice that unless you see him facing and dealing with HIS problems, you will give him his wish to be "free of you" and "free of the restraints of marriage" on his selfish pursuits.

It IS time you "got over" the "weak-kneed spineless clingy I'll do ANYTHING to remain married to you, you wonderful hunk that I MUST have in my life!" sort of wimpy behavior and STOOD UP TO this poor excuse for a man and disaster of a marital partner. Make it CLEAR that he VOLUNTEERED for marriage, with all of what it entails, and that his choice for Adultery was his and his alone.

Personally, I hope your counseling has good results, but I am very pessimistic. As such, I would also suggest you contact an attorney as soon as possible to draw up divorce papers. It is TIME that he understood marriage is a "two-way street" and that it is Exclusive of all others, so if he doesn't come around, be ready to cut yourself loose from this person.

By the way, SAVE all documentation you have of his affair. You need to divorce for CAUSE if you choose to go that route.

God bless.