Others, I'd like to comment on something re Zach. We are not being easy on him. He's not playing with children anymore - he's amongst grizzled veterans who give no quarter.

He's immature - [of course! Some of us have marriages older than him!] He puts it all out there, exposing his lack of insight and youth and immaturity and selfishness. And we bop him over the head, kick him in the knees, force him to look at his words and his actions.

And he stays here. No "Poor Zach, cry on my shoulder" from MB vets. He's admitted to selfish actions and views and DJs. And he re-reads carefully thought posts. And keeps coming back for more.

For my part, I will continue to post what I see, and I know the rest of you will also. For my part, I hope his wife makes him work for it, I hope she takes care of herself and takes time to build a support network, to discover who she is, and to get strength. I don't know whether it is the right thing for the two of them to reunite or not.

My point is, this Zach isn't running away from our Boot Camp. I think that's why we aren't running away from him. He takes our criticisms, processes them, and hopefully internalizes them.

Zach, if you got what you wanted the first week or the first month, the learning would not have been deep or final. If you get together with your wife again by Christmas, probably not good enough either. Valentine's day would be perfect and romantic. But don't count on it. don't set deadlines for your marriage recovery.

If you recover, there IS no end. No Happily Ever After. It's 99% work with blips of ecstasy, jolts of loss, weeks of routine and boredom, and unexpected moments of pleasure. If you feel like you're doing all the work, you have to do more.

We live in different time dimensions. You live in the Young Guy Time Dimension. Time moves differently for you than for a 30 year old, a 40 year old, and so on. A month to you seems like "forever." That's the way life is, it's normal. I get calls from my son away at college, time races too fast for me, and I miss when we were together every day.

You say you experience "anxiety attacks". Please try to find a counselor to help you deal with them. Do everything to be responsible and take care of yourself. And don't give up, okay? Don't give up on yourself or on God.

Thanks noodle for smacking me back into freaking reality.



Your right and I understand

Agree Belle...

Zach..I hope that you know that this IS boot camp style redirection.

We WANT to hold a mirror up to your face so that you CAN MAYBE have that happily ever after.

I understand, thank you for waking me up there.


Dunno why I all of a sudden started acting like that.

Ill continue on being on a good path to recovery!

Everyone backslides. Use the insight from your postings to focus yourself. Talk to yourself the way we have talked to you. Don't play "I'm no good" tapes or "What's the use" tapes. Play the ones you have heard about taking accountability for your actions. Play the ones that have you behaving like a responsible, adult male.

The man you will become is pecking his way out of the boy shell. He looks just like you, sounds like you too. But he has goals. He practices delayed gratification. He prays on his knees for God's will to be done. He is humble.

The man in you puts his wife's needs ahead of his own. He won't snap back to childhood and hanging out with single women and asking for their advice and sympathy and insight to win his wife back. He won't snap back to childhood even if his wife says "It's over." and means it.

He will work on himself. He will hurt, but he will do the right things regardless.

He will work on himself. He will hurt, but he will do the right things regardless.



I like that. Thanks for the support, I need it at times. She hasnt spoke to me today, so i guess shes not wanting to go out tonight.


I guess ill get ready and head out to my friends and stay the night there, I will do the right things out with him. Few friends from work and I are going go to out to eat, and then hang out probably at his house. Ive done told them im not going to be put in a bad situation where I could mess my marriage up anymore, and they said thats understandable, they want the best for us.

I told them that me and my W may go do something tonight, and they told me they would rather me spend time with my W than go out with them. But I guess I havent heard anything from her so I will get ready and go. Its like 40 mins away though so I dont know how she will take it, esp. with me staying at his house.

Guess we'll see.

Last night I went out with them, they were drinking so we went out to eat at this place that has awesome food and has a bar.

Had a decent time but all I could think about is my W, so its hard for me to have fun. I txted and called her and spoke with her. At one point I was sitting there talking with my friends, 2 attractive girls came up behind me and one put her arm on my shoulder and asked if I would come sit with her! I smiled and told her "Sorry, but im married", then they just looked at me then walked away. It felt good to finally be a man and say something like that and not be like "Ok", like I use to.


But im off to church!

Have a good day!

"...but I'm married"

Yeah! Way to go! Not the fat lady singing, but a step along the way. (((((((Zach)))))))

Zach,

Have you ever written an apology letter to your wife for all the pain you have caused her?? This is a letter that would have not one single excuse for your behavior.... And DON'T expect anything from her in return...

Have you changed your cell phone number and offered up an online account exclusivly for her with passwords that she can verify who you are talking with? It may not help, but it's simple to do......

The people you are willing to be around and the places you are willing to go will speak more toward your sincerity and your willingness to become a different man. More than any of the words you can say....

Going to a dinner club/bar where single women are tells me you are not doing whatever it takes to protect your wife or protect yourself.... again its actions not words.......

An affair is the worst form of independent behavior that a spouse can exhibit, and the way to change is by radically eliminating all the independent decisions you make. This includes friends and associates, places you may hang out, and activities you participate in....Study the book "Love Busters".....

Have you confessed your actions and your own sins to your Minister?? This was another step necessary for my own recovery....

Zack....IMO you have changed little or nothing that would allow you to be used by God to become a new man. I hear much self pity and see little actions on your end to clean up the wreckage and carnage you have created.

I don't feel qualified to give you a lot of advice, but I can sure see some of myself in you while I was still justifying all my actions....it was a sick place filled with denial and self distruction....loathing.....and self pity....

Start following through with some of the great advice you have already been given by so many on your post and stop giving lip service to their desires to help you...

tst,

I think your advice is spot on, actually.

Talking to her on the phone now...



She just told me shes getting a Divorce <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Zach, has she retained an attorney? Or was she announcing her intention to you?

No she left me just now, seeing a laywer tomorrow


IM so hurt im crying my eyes out i dont want to be here

Help me please!!!!!

Hey.

You're gonna be okay, Zach.

What's going on with you?

I would rather die, I really would, I cant go to sleep tonight I dont know what to do with my life right now, I dont want to be here, god please help me, Ive begged and begged and she says 100% we're done, shes calling a lawyer tomorrow.


I dont know what to do, im so hopeless, I dont want to live without her

This is the worst pain you ever felt in your life, I know. Lots of us here have experienced it. You don't think you can live without her.

You can. You will. Even with your heart torn out of your chest, you will be okay. Concentrate on the next minute. Just get through that minute.

Talk to God. Tell him to help you get through this.

"Thy will; NOT my will, be done."

Zach, I have to go out right now, people are waiting for my potato latkes. Keep praying. God will comfort you.

Just get through the next hour, and the 20 minutes after the next hour, and the day after today, we have all gone through this, we have all gotten through it.

You will get through it too. ((((((((Zach))))))))))

You will.

Pray. Listen to God. Be very still and listen. He loves you.

Your right only god can help me......


Ive done so much to change for myself and she doesnt beleive I can do it.


It hurts so bad I cant live without her, and she acts like it doesnt bother her. He got mad when I cried, she didnt cry, her emotions are just plain. She says she will always love me but not be in love with me. This is the worst day ill ever have in my life.

I wish I could go back 4 years but I cant. I wish she would just try and see if I have truly changed before making this decision.

Zach,

Ready for another redirect?

I think you need one but I don't want to give you the impression that I am kicking you while you are down...you can't see my face or hear my voice so you can't "hear" the gentleness behind the words.

You are being consumed once more with self pity and a lot of that grief has more to do with being DENIED than with the actual loss of the relationship.

The fact is that you treated the relationship with the UTMOST contempt for the majority of the time you were in it.

You treated it like a cheap and indestructable tool.

You tossed it in the garbage and rolled over it with your car and used it to unclog the toilette because it was convenient.

The relationship was dying when you were sleeping around, it was dying when you were clubbing, it was dying when you were lying, it was dying when she left you.

Now it is "mostly dead" to coin a phrase from the princess bride which is indeed different from "all dead" and here you stand at the turn of the tide about to recieve the very thing you need the most and not prepared to receive it because you are lost in self pity.

The war is upon you and you have laid down your weapon to cry in your beer without having fired a single shot.

This is where it gets REAL. This is where the rubber meets the road. This is where you grow up or fail to.

She has let go of you, no longer loves you, is no longer moved by your tears.

In order to regain her affections you will have to *actually* become a man she can admire and fall in love with and that goes much deeper than cards and balloons and txt messages.

She can't love you for the sake of boy she knew any longer...you have used up all of your credit and the account has been closed.

Open a new one.

Ready?

Hi noodle.
Hi Zach. I'm home.
How's it going?