This is my first post, I apologize for it being so long but I am really torn over the situation. I appreciate everyone that takes the time to read it, even if you don't respond.

My wife and I have been married for 24 years and have three children, two in college, one in high school.

She is VERY passionate about kayaking and I've had no problem with it as it has been local paddling or camping out with a large group in the kayak club she belongs to. Many members of the club are married and kayak together.

Most of the time when she went camping out son went with her. I have little to no interest in kayaking.

She has a 6 day all girl camping trip scheduled for March which I was a little uncomfortable with but met a few of the girls and said what the heck, don't let me get in the way of what you love.

She has talked in the past about kayaking the green river with a single female, them camping on sandbars for a week. The other girl is VERY experienced at this and though I wasn't thrilled with her going away for 11 days I had reluctantly again given my ok to go.

NOW (Friday), I find out that there are two other couples going, neither of whom are married and there is the significant potential that two single men will be on the trip.

She has been very open and honest with me about the whole situation and even agreed to bow out if I was uncomfortable about the unmarried men going. She let me know last night that the whole trip was planned around her schedule and if she bowed out, she would look awfully bad since the trip had originally been set up to accomodate her time frame for going. Basically, she was laying a guilt trip on me if I said no due to them scheduling around her free time, which is essentially all the time because she hasn't worked in 20 years (I know raising the kids IS work, I mean she just hasn't had a job to report to) I give her a 4 figure allowance to run the house and pay ALL the other bills including all her kayaking activities.

I am finding now that I have VERY significant reservations about her going since the trip went from two single women to 6 people going (2 men allegedly in committed relationships but unmarried) and potentially two single guys. This just does not mesh well with me.

Am I being selfish? How would you feel about your spouse going on a trip where there will definately be two unmarried men (both in relationships) and potentially two single men NOT in any relationships.

We have been having trouble in our relationship in that I enjoy doing things she doesn't and vice versa. She told me about 6 months ago that she loved me but was not "in love with me". We had a big blow up the other day and I told her the same thing, I loved her, but was no longer "in love with her" but the truth is I am. I sincerely believe she is not in love with me anymore.

Should I trust her as she has always been faithful in the past, or should I put my foot down and tell her not to go? She would be very agitated but this is causing me a lot of grief.

I would truly appreciate any advice the board would give.


Regards to all

RHM

Read "His Needs, Her Needs." The answers you're looking for are in there.

In my experience, when someone says, I love you but I'm not in love with you, it's highly likely that they're already having an affair or at least looking elsewhere.

Think about it, your wife and her friend are going on a trip with 4 single men. Yeah, I think you have good reason to question that. I think you should ask yourself (and her) why is it so important to her to save face with her friends over considering your needs.

If you were both satisfied and happily married each of you would put each other first and this wouldn't be an issue.

There is a way to get that back and it's in the book above and on the pages of this site. I was a veteran of marriage counseling but I've learned so much more from Dr. Harley's site, books, and workshop.

Best of luck.

One of the key tenets here is called POJA, which basically means everything you do has to be enthusiastically agreed to by both of you, or else it will cause stress to the marriage. You absolutely have the right to have reservations about the trip. And you have the right to negotiate something that both of you can be comfortable with. Don't let your concern over her leaving you keep you from having strong boundaries on what's acceptable to you; don't cave.

You can rekindle your marriage by following the stuff here. It's a lot to learn, but worth it. Unless she's having an affair already (and that includes emotional affairs, where she gets some non-physical needs met by someone else), you can get back to where you were 20 years ago. One of the first steps is to spend at least 15 hours together each week doing nothing but stuff for just the two of you. It naturally makes you closer and makes you like each other again.

For the immediate future, however, I recommend complete honesty. Print this out and read it to her. Tell her you're so scared of losing her that you felt compelled to go seek advice on how not to. That you WANT her to be able to do stuff like the trip, but now that things are rocky, you're scared stiff she's going to pull away and this trip is a perfect opportunity, so now you're terrified of the trip. Just be honest, and see what happens.

If she's already having an EA or PA, none of this will matter, and she'll just lie her way out of everything. (sorry, but true) If she's not, the honesty is the first step back to love.

Suggestion. If you kayak, take the time off and go with her, even if you don't like it. It may surprise you and you'll have fun together and rekindle your M. If she adamantly doesn't want you to go, be very afraid of an affair. Yes, it's time off, but this is your M we're talking about.

If you don't kayak, tell her you just can't handle her going, and take the time off anyway and schedule a romantic vacation for the two of you for that same week. Rekindle your M on a second honeymoon. Again, this is your M we're talking about. And if she balks, be very worried. And start snooping; check her phone/text/email records for signs of an affair.

Ky/Cat:

Thanks for replying. I am sure this has been said a thousand times over, but I don't think she is having an affair, emotionally or physically.

However, I DO see this trip as the potential for EA and/or PA. She again offered not to go yesterday but I told her to go ahead. I am in a no win situation. If I tell her not to go, she will guilt me big time. If she goes, I will NOT be a happy camper (no pun intended). I told her to change the names, run the scenario by her brothers and see what THEIR reactions would be. Her response was, I don't want to drag my brothers into it and they will know what is going on. She and I both know what her brothers reaction would be.

Being in a marriage where you love each other but are not "in love" is one of the strangest situations I've ever found myself in.

I "love" my dad, but I am not "in love" with him. I equate our marriage to being on about same emotional level as this. I have mentioned the "D" word in arguments in the past and she said this really bothers her and never wants the threat mentioned again so I've said I wouldn't and I haven't.

One other thing really bothers me about this trip. Besides the potential of an EA or PA, is the fact that if (when) word gets out, I will be seen as a chump. I can hear people now, yeah xxx's wife went on a wilderness camping trip and there was 4 single guys there but "nothing" went on.

Yeah right, I know what I would think and know what others will think of me "when" word of this trip gets out. I'll be the dumb... of the area.

I think the Dr. said one of the hardest times in a relationship is when the kids leave. Well, that is pretty much where we are at now. Our daughters are in college, son graduates high school in a couple of months (and can stay with his grandparents if we leave on trips which we have).

I am pretty much retired at 48 and can surely see where our interest have diverged over the years. Sometimes I am tempted to tell her to get a job then she could find out what having a weekend to do things is worth. Now she comes and goes as she pleases and has been for the last 2-3 years, since the kids started driving themselves to school. As I originally posted, I have given her 4 figures to run the house and I have paid EVERY other bill. I sometimes think I have spoiled my wife but that ain't the topic of this post, I am just rambling.

She is calling me now wanting to go do something now after giving me the cold shoulder last night and this am. We took a motorcycle ride (my passion) and I drove too fast for her. She never once told me on the trip to slow down (I don't do crazy but ride at a spirited pace), so I didn't know I was doing anything wrong...just riding as I normally do. That resulted in the could shoulder last night and first thing this am.

Well, gotta go. My wife is calling, apparently things are back to normal or about as "normal" as they will be. We are going to spend the afternoon together.

Again, thanks for the replies.

Kind regards,

RM