Ok then, lets say I stop talking to my ex. He's been in and out of my life so much that wouldn't be a problem. He respects me and simply wants me to be happy. That is why he left the last time, because I didn't want him around. I have realized however that we keep getting pulled together for a reason, whether it is to balance each others lives or just to get an ego boost off of one another every now and then or what I don't really know. He was my first love and will in a way always be a part of my life, whether he is physically in it or not. But I have broken ties with him before and can easily do it again.

But then what? I can make sure that dinner is ready, the apt is clean, the baby is in bed and greet my husband wearing nothing but a pair of stilettos and I doubt it would make a bit of difference. I can completely forget about how I feel and immerse myself in my H and his needs, that's all I've done lately. But I think its about time he starts giving back. How can I explain to you people that I love my H and would do anything for him, as long as I don't lose myself in the process. I was raised to have a mind of my own and to be strong and independent. And I have lost a lot of that since I have been with my H. I am not cheating with the OM, simply taking his compliments and allowing myself to feel like a woman again. Between the OM and myself it is kind of like a game. We help each other build up the confidence that we need. Ok I would like to let my H have that job, believe me I would want nothing more than for my H to tell me he thinks I'm sexy or beautiful or even semi-pretty. But he doesn't, I have told him that I would like him too, he still has neglected to say anything. For our 2 year anniversary I was wearing a sexy dress when he came home from work, I felt foolish, because I don't like dresses. He was more concerned with the fact that his new laptop arrived the same day. He is very much into himself and everything that is important to him. I used to be one of those things, now I'm not even in the top 20. He is my no 2, because my son is #1 of course. But I do everything I can to take care of my H.

No I don't think he would like if he found out I was talking to my ex. But sometimes I wonder if he would even care, just because that's less he has to talk to me.

Don't talk about it, do it.

For the rest of your life!!
Commit yourself to the fact that you must never have any form of contact with this human for the rest of your life!!

Then you have a chance at fixing your marriage. Get yourself right, then we can work on your husband.

Then tell him, he deserves to know what you have been doing anyway.

Work on your marriage.

If your answer is that you've already done that, then (after you have ended contact with your ex for 3-6 months) tell your husband that your marriage is in trouble and if things continue the way they are, you are planning to get a legal separation and then a divorce. Set a time frame for that decision and then go about being the best wife you can be. If he doesn't come around then get a divorce.

I don't think anybody here is telling you to be miserable.

What they are saying is that while you are indulging in fanciful daydream fantasy with your ex, you have no credibility about the effort you are putting into your M or about the lack of effort your husband is making. And you are indulging in a fantasy. "Allowing yourself to feel like a woman again." You were raised to be strong and independent, yet need compliments from your ex to build your confidence?

People can post and post and go through all the details, but common sense tells you that you can't be flirting with your ex and fixing your M at the same time. Marriages don't get better with a third party around, they get worse. You knew that when you posted, you just don't want to deal with it. So would you rather us lie to you (more indulging in fantasy) or tell you the truth?

Its a shame. If what you are posting is the truth, you could so easily come out of this. But I fear that you would rather argue that we "don't understand", so you can indulge in a fantasy.

Well here's what I did with my H.
First I got rid of OM.

I sat DH down and told him exactly how I felt. How I felt neglected, alone. Gave specific examples of when I felt that way - like when you dressed to the nines and he was more excited about the laptop.

Then I told him I was developing feelings for someone else, and that I didn't want that person to be filling up my heart, I wanted DH to be the one I turned to and counted on. I told him I didn't like telling him that news, because it is painful, but that it was too important to ignore.

My H came around.

I suggest you try the open and *completely* honest approach with your H. If he wakes up, good. If not, you continue refrain from any sort of contact or communication with your ex-boyfriend. Get counseling with the Harleys via telephone if you can possibly afford it. Heck, when your H wants to know what you want for your birthday, anniversary, etc. tell him a session with the Harleys. Tell your parents (and your inlaws) that you're having a rough time and see if they'll help pay for the counseling.

Then, with ex-boyfriend still out of the picture, if counseling with the Harleys does not help, you get a job and move out. Tell your H you'll be interested in reconciliation when he's ready to put you first in his life.

Don't ever speak to ex-boyfriend as long as you are married.
It is emotional suicide.

If you think you can handle it, that it's not that big a deal,that we're over-reacting, just pause and ask yourself:
Why is it that EVERYONE who has experienced infidelity is telling you to avoid ex-boyfriend?
What possible reason could they have for telling you this?

I guarantee that every single one of us thought "I'm different. I can handle it. It's not that big a deal."

The girl that "used to be your best friend?" What happened there?

A lot of overtime? I don't like the sound of that. Do his paychecks reflect the overtime?

Charlotte

Bumpity-bumpity-bump

I decided to stop talking to my ex just because it was starting to confuse me about what I wanted.

Well again I talked to my H. I even made a video of what I was thinking so I didn't forget before he got home. He watched it and it upset him, but not for the reason you might think. I didn't say anything about my ex. I am not sure its the right time to indulge that information. But after he watched it he was very upset. I decided to wait to talk to him after I put our son to bed.
He asked me what I wanted him to say.

I told him anything, we used to talk all the time.

He said yeah and then I wasn't working 11 hr days.

I said I know you work long hours and that you work very hard and I love you for that. But I spend all day long with Jack and when you get home I'm tired too. I know that doesn't mean much to you, but it means something to me.

He asked me what I wanted from him.

I told him I just wanted a little appreciation, a little bit of conversation, a little adult interaction, a little romance.

He didn't have anything to say to that.

I told him that I'll give him some space to figure out what he wants. And that I'll wait for him as long as I can.

Then we ate dinner and after I put everything away I came into the bedroom and turned the tv on in here. Is this what you people thought would happen? To make me feel even worse? To make my marriage even scarier for me? To give me more reasons to cry?

Glad to hear that you stopped talking to OM. I hope you stick with it. If H wants to ignore your problems at some point you may have to discuss D with him. Maybe that conversation alone with be a wake up call for him. And use the word "divorce" not just figure out what you want...that's too vague. He needs to understand the gravity of how you are feeling and how that would impact his life and your son.

Whatever happens in your M don't seek comfort or ego boosts from other men. You're only looking for trouble there.

bump

thats a good thing you stopped talking to your ex coz agreed he was a getway a somebody who was there listening to you and sympathising but don't you think your husband should be the one doing that and understood he is not doing that at the moment but he has been everythign to you thats why u dumped ex and married him didn't you...

you know gap between husband and wife is created easily and it widens dangerously pretty quickly don't let that happen because both of youw ill drift away from each other..remember all teh good reasons you married hima nd don't look at the negative side all the time...first of all commit to yourself that you want to save this marriage...you might be feeling everybody here is only pushing you to do somethign and he is left alone but the thing is we have only you as the contact person in all this...

i would suggest you both set a time on a weekend leave the baby if you can somewhere and go at some quite place fopr a coupleof hours...don't talk about what you are feelign and wanting but ask him to say what he wants and ho he is feeling just listen to his side of story and don't talk in between stay calm ...once he has spoken it out you both can go about things one by one and then you can justifyu yourself and tell him all teh efforts you are putting up to save the day...this will give you a better view of the whole situationa s you will have his problems infront of you as well then it would be easy to work things out between you two...

All the best.

Lacey,

I'm not sure where to begin. I'll just go w/ a list, and apologize in advance if any of this seems overly harsh or "misunderstanding" of your situation.

*I'm a former wayward wife. I COMPLETELY fed myself the BS about "Am I really happy? What do I need to do to make myself happy?" to justify my affair. And believe me, it is BS when it's in the context of an OM.

*You DO have an OM, whether you admit it or not. You think you can handle it, that it won't get out of control? Look where you are now, look how you feel about your ex, and look how you feel about your husband. I know, I know, you're not planning on it, it will never happen, blah blah blah - do you know how many of us waywards here planned on committing adultery? Yeah, I'd say zero or very nearly so.

*You sound foggy already. Please realize that people here are trying to help you - because we have all been through it, on one side of the affair or the other, and IT SUCKS. It is the single WORST thing you could do to yourself, your husband, your son. Since I suspect you're foggy, you won't realize the complete disregard and disrespect you're displaying to those trying to help you, and you won't realize how dangerous the game you're playing is.

*Nothing is going to work unless you want it to. You have to decide, you have to make the change. You can't post here and say you tried, you can't speak to your ex and compile a litany of things wrong w/ your marriage, the countless times you've spoken w/ your H, etc., etc., etc. Until you are ready to stand up and be a person of character, of MORAL BACKBONE, someone who "gets it," this is all a waste. If you love your H and M the way you say you do (and you're sending very mixed messages on that), you need to know you've honestly tried everything, 110%, to make it work. Are you doing that now?

*If nothing else, think of your son. What kind of mother are you? What kind of mother lets other men into her marriage, what kind of mother plays w/ fire -- plays w/ not only her life, but her husband's and son's lives?? Do you realize how horribly you will destroy that little boy's life if you come anywhere near an affair??

There are a lot of other things to say, and I'm sorry if this all seems to be directed at you and the OM issue. However, please, consider the source (me, a former wayward): you don't just need to fix your marriage, you need to fix yourself. Know who you are, what you stand for, and put the commitment to that and your M above all else.

You are not alone in needing to uphold the M, certainly. And do whatever it takes to make your H "get it" -- keep talking until you're blue in the face, snoop to see if there is an A, BOTH of you read HNHN, SAA, anything by Dr. Harley.

If your H IS having an A, it will be difficult to get him to come around. If YOU have an A, (and I'm scared you're already too foggy to take any advice on prevention and "get it" right now), your situation will be a thousand times worse than it is now.

Too much to go into. Lacey, keep posting - people want to help you, but you need to GENUINELY want to help yourself and your M first.

Lacey it is very good that the ex boyfriend contact is dropped.. now don't contact him again or all the good work this will allow is down the drain.

Now 11 hr days is hard but a lot of men and women do that these days and still give a bit of affection and respond to needs. I don't see that as a good excuse at all.

OK what can you two do to address that. Ask him to set aside an hour after little Jack is asleep each night to talk or laugh or play (come on your allowed to you know ) together.

It may even be rubbing each others back or feet or whatever.. a bit of intimacy and showing care to each other.

Now your comment
That could work against you because you are assuming he feels that way. Perhaps it could be expressed in later discussions that "it appears you don't seem to care ............ etc." rather than a statement of fact because you don't know if he cares about this or not but it appears to you he doesn't. See the difference? You are expressing your feelings not making a disrespectful judgement.

I don't think you should give him as much time as you can wait at all. Let this sink in for a day or so and talk to him again. And then a few days later again .. not nagging every day but to let him know ITS SERIOUS!!!

Repeat that you want to love him and want him to show his love in return.... express again that you are not looking for a gold train but appreciation... affection ... time for the two of you only ... conversation - even about how hard a day he had - sharing in other words....

Take his hands in your when you talk to him ... don't put distance between you after all its about being together isn't it?

Don't retreat into the bedroom or wherever and turn the TV on .. what good does that do when you just said he did not spend time WITH you and YOU run off????? It far better for him to see how upset this is making you rather than hide it from him!!!!!

Time alone = time withdrawing from each other in these circumstances. Don't do it!!

If after you have tried all this and he is distant... well I would begin to snoop big time...but lets look at that bridge when or if it happens. He might surprise you and its just work pressure and stress. Lets not think the worst case yet.

Good luck Lacey

Bumping!

Where are you, Goddess? What's happening? We are worried about you!

Charlotte

I'm giving my husband another chance. I'm letting him try and make things better. We have had so many conversations about our relationship in just the last month alone, we've both grown tired of it. But I think he finally heard me. He's been very sweet this weekend, cooking for me, taking Jack outside to play so I could take a longer nap. He is trying and I am giving him every encouragement that I can. I want my marriage to last forever. Now that things are getting better I am wondering what happened. I'm wondering how long its gonna last, but I don't really care. I am just enjoying it and I'm working on it keep it this way.

You are taking the right first steps. Good for you! I would like to point out a couple areas where I think the Marriage Builders could help really help you & your H create the marriage you both want. I am not an expert (hence the post count) but I have been lurking here awhile and workin' the MB program IRL.

First, the Giver & the Taker. It concerns me that you talk about your self-sacrifice like it's a good thing. It's really not a good idea to give-give-give to the neglect of your own needs; doing so leads to feelings of resentment, and resentment breeds all sorts of nasty things like Love Busters and a sense of entitlement. (I hear that four out of five WW's recommend entitlement as the best justification for adultery.)

Emotional Needs have been discussed by others in this thread .... I would only add that top EN's differ from person to person, and our assumptions about what is important to our spouses can be very inaccurate. Consider that if Domestic Support does not rank high on your H's list of EN's, then your efforts in that area won't automatically get the "payoff" you'd like or expect. Likewise, he may just be deaf to your need for Affection, all the while stewing over the fact that you don't recognize the Financial Support he provides in the way that he would like. The ENQ on this site helps couples identify key needs, and the Harley books mentioned by other posters will help you two go about meeting these needs. Simply telling him "I need [fill in the blank]" may not be sufficient direction ... the MB materials can give a great road map to learning to meet EN's.

EN's tie into the core MB concept of the Love Bank, which represents the "net" balance of feelings of love within marriage. Meeting EN's makes deposits into the bank while committing Love Busters makes withdrawals; a high positive balance => feeling of being in love with depositor. Based on your posts I suspect that you're prone to the love buster Disrespectful Judgments, which can include things like making negative assumptions about the spouse's thoughts or intentions (he does thoughtless thing "x" because he takes me for granted, or worse), and presuming the worst about what s/he will do in a given situation (I can try all I want to fix this marriage but he can't change, he'll just blow it off). The more LB's you can eliminate, the stronger your marriage will be.

Also, I do "get" that you put your child first priority-wise and I doubt anyone here is going to convince you otherwise. I would ask you to consider how much good it will do your child to de-prioritize the marriage all the way into unhappiness or divorce. Pepperband's sig line sums that up wonderfully & Kiwi makes very good points about this too. It sounds like you two are in a critical stage to start rebuilding your M, so please don't shortchange those efforts.

Lastly ... it may well be that more of the blame rests with your H in the M getting to this state, but please consider your responsibility to turn things around. Your previous efforts, no matter how sincere, obviously didn't work 100% so could do with some fixin' too. That you tried very hard doesn't (IMO) entitle you to sit around and let your H do all the heavy lifting ... that thought makes me especially uncomfortable given that you've spent some weeks secretly stoking the embers of a past relationship. Most here would consider that an EA. It is at the least detrimental to the M, good on you for breaking that off but I suspect you'll come to realize it was more damaging than you knew.

Anyway ... it's time to get a plan & get movin'! I think you'll find this site to be a great resource for you. Just watch for the swinging 2x4's!!

I don't think that any one person should do the heavy lifting in a marriage. I think it should be equal on all parts. I am still providing my husband with as much comfort and affection as I can. I still get rejected, but its not as bad as it was before. I know that he's trying and I am trying as well. He had a 3 day weekend from work and he spent the majority of the time cooking for me. I am so glad that he finally heard me. We are getting to a better place. Thank you all for your kind words.

I know we are not through yet, but right now we are taking some time to figure out what we want. I realized that maybe part of the problem is that I wasn't sure what I wanted.

I have taken all of your advice and put most of it to use. I have tried to pamper my husband and be the best wife I can be. And when he needed it I gave him his space. Well now we are living together but are on a trial separation or something like that. He said he doesn't know how he feels. He doesn't know what he wants. And just like that my world crumbled. I've been the only one in this marriage for a year or so, and now I'm the only one left. As usual I'm the one left cleaning up the mess.

Goddess, you say "as usual I'm the one left cleaning up the mess".

Honestly, you are both so young, you have a very small child. This is SO salvagable. Do you really think that you are the only young couple who has realised that this is it. This is "maturity". Yes, it's tough being young and being young parents. You BOTH need to realise that this will pass (lol, my MIL used to say that to me when I was up to my eyes in babies and I thought "what do you know").

I would like to shake your H. This should be a happy, wonderful time for you both. It still can be. I understand so well what you both feel. I was 23 when I had my first child. It seemed like everyone else was doing their "20s" thing. They were travelling, they were going out. That is so transient. Now I have adult children and a happy marriage (after my A) and it is all worth it.

You need to see past what is happening now. Babies are hard work, but being parents to them is worth it. Children NEED their parents, they need BOTH parents.

Yes I know we are young and that we married young. I know that parenting is hard and especially on young people. Yes our friends are going out and partying and doing "stupid things", but most of them have kids too. I don't miss partying, cause I can barely handle alcohol any more. Besides, I feel like I did enough partying in high school to last till my 30's. I don't regret not doing what my friends are doing. I can't do anything to change my husband and the way he thinks. We've been going through this over and over again. And frankly I'm tired of it. He's put me through enough of this I love you, I love you not thing. I've tried to get him to change, and I've changed hoping it would help. Nothing really has changed since the first time that turned himself off like this. Well, I guess somethings have, now we're married with a kid. But this doesn't have anything to do with being parents. This has to do with my husband that is currently in an emotional coma. And I'm the devastated wife that sits by his side every day. But I think its time to pull the plug.

I talked to my mom about maybe going back home for a little bit. Just for a week or two, give him some time to figure out what he wants. And after I told him that he called his mom. They talked for a while and after they were done he came out and played with Jack. We were all having fun together, we felt like a real family. Saturday evening was nice while our son was awake, and even after he went to bed my H stayed out here in the living room with me. Although he was listening to music on his laptop, which did kind of bother me. But then his battery started to die and he took it and went into the bedroom. But still he slept in the bed and I slept on the couch. Today he spent most of the day in bed and our son woke up early so I was up with him. And when he was ready for a nap so was I, and since H was still in bed I went to sleep on the couch. While I was asleep he decided to go for a bike ride and I slept a little longer then got up and took a shower. But he over exerted himself on his bike ride, so he didn't really want to play with our son. I decided that I should talk to his mom, maybe she will help me understand what is going on.

That she did. First she told me that he told her he was afraid that if I left I was going to keep Jack from him. I tried to talk to him about it telling him that I would not do that. He said that he knows what kind of influence my family has over me. And I told him that they know how much I hated being kept from my father. He said that there is no way to tell what would happen. I asked if he had so little faith in me that I can't make my own decisions. And I told him that I would not try to take our son away from him. And he looked at me and with a very harsh tone he said he never said I would, and then he went to bed.

I plan on trying to talk to him tomorrow, but for tonight I'm still sleeping on the couch. My MIL told me that we both need some time apart, but at the same time we need some time alone together. I agree, but I won't force him until he's ready to spend that time with me. And frankly I don't think he's ready for that. But I will do my best to wait for him. As long as he wants this to work then I will do what I can to make it work. But if he doesn't then its over. And that's pretty much all there is to it.