It is when used in that manner

Don't really expect anything notable to happen for a while. Not yet 20 days in. Maybe things will start to change sometime in the future.

Yesterday (Sunday) was about par. I didn't go to church. I was up and she came downstairs. D14 was not home, she went to church with a friend and stayed the afternoon with her. Did not talk much, it was raining outside all day. After a while she went back upstairs, making a comment about not having anything to talk about. She stayed there the rest of the afternoon. I went up a few times. Talked a little. Not too deep, not too contentious.

The thing I try to impress on her is that I realize that in the past that I looked at things differently, wrongly. I said to myself, "I shouldn't have to do this or that for her to love me." But now I see that I should have been saying "If I do this or that, I can really show her how much I love her."

That is the biggest difference in me. Once I started giving, or wanting to give, I felt things inside of me that I had buried, good things that made me just want to do more.

My biggest realization, however, is the thing that worries me the most. By withdrawing into my world of protection because I thought I was being unappreciated, sleeping on the couch and feeling mistreated, I made her feel that I cared nothing about being with her, in every way. Looking back, I don't see how she could have felt differently. She told me this in ways, and with words, but I could not see outside my comfort shell, until it was shattered last fall. So now the thing I most want to do, to hold her, to love her in every way so that she knows how much it means to me, the thing that I failed at so miserably, that really hurt her, is the thing that I am most unable to do.

I told her that, but didn't spend a lot of time talking. I went to pick up D late in the afternoon, while I was gone, W came downstairs. D watched TV in her room most of the rest of the night. W and I watched TV together,W was also playing Bingo, Yahtzee, whatever on her computer. She does that all the time, it started a while ago, part of the depression and isolation that contributed to where we are now.

I did good, even watched a Lifetime movie that I have yet to figure out the point it was trying to make, a lot of drama, tragedy, but no point that I could determine. Watched The Apprentice, she likes that, I can tolerate it, starting to enjoy it some. But she did stay downstairs until it was over. Told her I was glad she came down, she said don't read anything in to it.

In a nutshell, this is the state of the nation:

She is angry still that I told the kids and her family.
She says she thinks I am out to teach her a lesson.
She sees no future.

I am hanging in.

Like I said before,less than 20 days in. This is more of a status report than anything. I don't expect much else.

I don't see that there will be a lot of reasons to post a lot for a while. I always check to see what words of wisdom or words of jerkism I can get. Will probably just say hey everyday, if nothing else to bump the thread.

Thanks for all the time and help. It is amazing how much the people on here care about complete strangers.

Hang in there herb. Like you said, it's only been 20 days. I have tried to call some people my husband works with, but no one has called me back. They have talked to him first to find out what I'm calling about. It seems like a sick place to work - people supporting the affair between 2 employees. I am trying to work plan A - my H was over this weekend to pick up some more of his things, started to talk about visitation with kids, I just sat there and told him what he was wanting (3 nights a week) just didn't work for me. He got mad, said lawyers and a judge would decide then. I told him "if that's how these things are figured out, I guess that'll be what happens". He was standing up, getting agitated, but I just (tried) to keep a calm voice and was knitting (I don't even really do that,just learned) while he was talking. It was actually kind of fun. When he left, our oldest D said, "he was mad", I just agreed with her. She texted him, and he came back to say bye to her and our youngest. Like I said, it was almost fun.

That is what I am waiting for. I think I have a good perspective on that, based on all the good advice here.

Herb, please tell me she did not go to the OM's church? Has she been in contact with the OM?



Awesome realization! I am very glad you were able to express this to her. Even though she may not hear you today, your words will come back to her when she is not so foggy.



Do you enjoy chick shows? Because my H does not. Doing things you don't like, Herb, is sacrifice, and sacrifice leads to RESENTMENT. The goal in marital recovery is to find recreations that you BOTH ENJOY. Its good that you are with her, but please exercise caution in doing things you don't like, because it WILL NOT help your marriage, I promise you. It will add to your resentment.

Check out this article: The Giver and the Taker


This is just a sign of withdrawal. AS long as contact HAS ENDED, that is. If she is seeing the OM at church, then she is not in withdrawal, she is still in her affair.

Did she go to the OM's church?

No, I don't like them, but I didn't have anything else to do. Felt like being in the same vicinity was important. No big deal.

No. As far as I can determine, NC is still going on.

Herb,

Do you have Yahtzee or other board games at home that you can pull out and ask WW if she wants to play with you instead of by herself on the computer? Can you suggest taking a walk together? You don't need to talk - just be there together.

Try not to talk about your relationship all time. Is there anything she's interested in that she wanted you to do with her at one point? Can you explore that and see if it's something the two of you can share NOW? For example: my FWH always wanted me to play one of his computer game with him, but it never appealed to me. During Plan A, I stopped wasting my time watching TV and played that game with him like he always wanted. I love it! We still play just about every night.

Don't listen to her babble. We've all heard these things. She doesn't believe it can work. It's too late. How can YOU possibly make her happy? Divorce is the only way. The kids will be fine with divorce. blah, blah, blah... It's all babble and doesn't mean ANYTHING. This will pass. You can have an amazing marriage that doesn't even compare to the old one. You've finally joined the fight of your life - don't give up!

No, she went to a different one. I talked to her today about her and I going together next week.

One thing that complicates things is that the old church (with OM) broadcasts services locally on cable, so I kind of want to be at home during that time, but I also need to be in church with D14.

Right now, she doesn't want to do anything at all with me. Every suggestion gets basically the same response, "When are you going to face reality?"

But this is not anything I don't expect.

Herb, have you exposed this affair to a higher authority than the church board? This is a fox in the henhouse who is an unfit pastor. He should be removed from his position according to biblical principle.

Can you take this further up the line to get him removed?

This is a great time to discuss REALITY with her. What is her vision of reality and what does she want? This would be a great opportunity to discuss that you would be willing to work on your marriage together, but you will not cooperate in any potential divorce proceedings.

For example, if she does file for divorce, she needs to understand that you will not move out, will not cooperate, will file for full custody and will countersue on the grounds of adultery. You will not pay her a cent to get an apartment unless court ordered to do so. You will have the OM hauled into court to give sworn testimony about their adutlerous affair on the stand.

Have this discussion, Herb. She needs to know what reality will bring. She needs to know you will NOT COOPERATE and you will not go down without a HUGE FIGHT that will not be pretty. If you have a reality check with her, she will start looking to your marriage instead of fantasizing about easily moving you out.

We are baptist, each church is autonomous. There is a local association, I will see what I can do

We are a no fault state, I don't know what leverage I will have, other than not moving out.

Melody is spot on. You need to give her exactly what she doesn't want. Get back in your bedroom now!

PLEASE DO, Herb. I betcha this is not the first marriage he has attacked and if he is not stopped, it won't be the last. Can you imagine how emboldened he will be if he GETS AWAY WITH THIS? If he can lie his way out of this and manage to retain his position, he will know he can do it again. You would be doing other families a favor by campaigning to get this unfit pastor removed so some other man doesn't have to endure what you have endured.

Herb, just tell her that you will bring in her adultery into any divorce action and make sure it gets on record. The point here is to scare the hell out of her and make sure she knows you won't go down easy. She needs to know you will fight with all you have and if anyone will be moving it will be HER.

Are you in an alienation of affection state? What state are you in?

KY

There is really no authority outside the local church. I just met with a respected retired pastor that filled in at out church before OM came. He is very well thought of by all the deacons that know. I filled him in. He said he would talk to the deacons I am aware of what is happening and one other that I don't know what he knows.

I think the people that should be doing something about it having the light shined on them may have an effect as well.

Grounds for Filing: The Petition for Dissolution of Marriage must declare the appropriate Kentucky grounds upon which the dissolution of marriage is being sought. The appropriate lawful ground will be that which the parties agree upon and can substantiate, or that which the filing spouse desires to prove to the court. The dissolution of marriage grounds are as follows:

Irretrievable breakdown.

(1) If both of the parties by petition or otherwise have stated under oath or affirmation that the marriage is irretrievably broken, or one of the parties has so stated and the other has not denied it, the court, after hearing, shall make a finding whether the marriage is irretrievably broken. No decree shall be entered until the parties have lived apart for 60 days. Living apart shall include living under the same roof without sexual cohabitation. The court may order a conciliation conference as a part of the hearing. (Kentucky Statutes - Title 35 - Chapters: 403.140)

Counseling or Mediation Requirements: If one of the parties has denied under oath or affirmation that the marriage is irretrievably broken, the court shall consider all relevant factors, including the circumstances that gave rise to filing the petition and the prospect of reconciliation, and shall: (a) Make a finding whether the marriage is irretrievably broken; or (b) Continue the matter for further hearing not fewer than 30 nor more than 60 days later, or as soon thereafter as the matter may be reached on the court's calendar, and may suggest to the parties that they seek counseling.

The court, at the request of either party shall, or on its own motion may, order a conciliation conference. At the adjourned hearing the court shall make a finding whether the marriage is irretrievably broken. (Kentucky Statutes - Title 35 - Chapters: 403.170)

Another deacon knows now, and he is a person that is very straightforward, I don't think he will mince words or back away.

I am really trying to increase he exposure pressure on him without destroying the church. It has had many troubles in the last few years, but there are a lot of really good people there. I have exposed to all the people on my side. I just need him out of the picture as completely as possible.

Thanks everybody for the whacks to make me not wait around for things to happen.