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I've been seeing a lot of folks coming to this forum, distraught and devastated over their spouse's infidelity, much as I did not so long ago. I, and the rest of the BS's here, want to give them a hug because we know their pain.

Another thing I keep seeing is a strong desire for these broken people to 'help' their spouse keep cheating on them! Yes, I said HELP. And I mean that because of the BS's refusal to expose the A. I wish I had a nickel for every poster who has come on here, begging for help. And when the vets offer that help by explaining the importance of exposure, the BS responds with all the reasons for why they SHOULDN'T expose the A. For example:

"WS will lose his job." Oh, yeah. That's a good reason to let your spouse and his lover keep humping! NOT.
"My father will kill him!" Doubtful, don't you think?
"The OW's H is mentally unstable and will beat her up!" One, do you care? Two, her H has more than likely never laid a hand on her in anger.
"It will scar my children." Nothing like a divorce will.
"He'll get mad at me and leave me!" Okay. Then let the A continue so he can get the OW pregnant and THEN leave you. Or maybe just read some of the posts on here from FWS who are thankful they were exposed.
"It will destroy my in-laws if they know!" Um. Okay. But you might not want to keep calling them your 'in-laws'. Because they probably won't be that to you much longer.
"He'll lose the respect of his colleagues!" You think they don't already know?
"We can't afford for him to quit his job." Jobs are like buses. He can get another job. What you DON'T want him in is another MARRIAGE, right?

NOTHING is as important as your M! There is NO excuse to keep your spouse's affair confidential! There is every reason to let your spouse know that you will do whatever it takes to keep your marriage intact. If you listen to NO other piece of advice on this forum, listen to the vets who tell you when and how to expose the A! Exposure was what ended my FWH's A.

His timeline before exposure:

October: he thought the EA with his co-worker was just dandy, that as long as it was 'just' inappropriate comments and flirting it wasn't wrong. His AP's H knew something was up ("gut feeling") but didn't act on the feeling and resisted snooping in the beginning.
November: The EA goes PA. Too bad her BH didn't act on his 'gut feeling', huh?
December: WH is now addicted to the OP, but guilt has settled in and he has a hard time looking at himself in the morning and an even harder time looking at me, and he realizes that he's in a bad situation. Can't talk to anyone about it. His best friend is ME, so who's he going to confide in? He is now on a merry-go-round and doesn't know how to get off.
January: OW's spouse confronts my WH, which was a real wake-up call. He gives OW a NC letter. NC lasts all of one day. Why? Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER! LISTEN UP, newly betrayeds! Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER!
February: OW's spouse FINALLY sends certified letter to employer. A ends THAT DAY. OW's H makes her quit her job. They move away. My H confesses to me. Our rebuilding begins.

Look back at the timeline. Do you see where the A could have ended? Back in October, when the OW's H should have acted on his 'gut feeling'!

Don't expect your WS to be a standup person and do the right thing, because often they don't know HOW - my FWH told me he was GLAD the A was exposed, that he felt relief when his employer confronted him, because he didn't know how to end it!

Please, newly betrayed, please listen to the vets on this board if you truly want to save your marriage.

:::stepping down off soapbox:::


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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From the wrong-side-of-the-tracks perspective of a wayward, I want to give MBliss' post a big endorsement.

I replied yesterday to a newbie who found out some stuff about his wife having secret phone relationships with some OMs, yet he's wanting to give his W the benefit of the doubt, and doesn't want to snoop, & hasn't exposed to the wife of one of the other guys. (I dunno if the 2nd OM is married). Anyway, point is, by the time a wayward is this deep in, their internal compass is no longer functioning, and BSs who're counting on that compass & who want to give their WSs the benefit of the doubt are probably fooling themselves. The only way to get things back on-course is if an outside force (external to the WS) acts upon the wayward. That's what exposure is about.

I can SO relate to the story MBliss recounts above re: her FWH. At the time when I was in my A., I had gotten emotionally attached to my OW big-time, and I felt myself to be on that same "merry-go-round." My wife had an inkling, but that was all; and when she brought it up with me one evening (this was before I'd gone all the way with PA), I reassured her with a statement that was 2 parts lie [that nothing untoward was going on between me & my OW, and that I'd stop being alone with her anyway] and 1 part unspoken, wishful thinking [that I possessed the emotional capacity to stop myself or in any way control my addiction to this OW at that point in time, before going all the way to the bottom with her].

Looking back, my wife & I often think, what if she'd expressed her concerns to my OW's husband right then? As it turned out, the OW's husband was already suspecting her of messing around with someone else (not me), but if he'd heard from my wife then & there, I wonder whether that wouldn't have made a huge difference & maybe kept me & OW from going completely off the deep end. Her H would certainly have dialed up his monitoring of her, and he also probably could've told my wife a thing or two that might've made my wife less inclined to swallow my falsely-reassuring "nothing improper's going on" line.

To be very clear: This isn't blaming my wife one bit for not acting on her gut feeling; after all, it was I who lied to her & deceived her. Rather, the point is that exposure is huge, key, crucial. If you're a BS or think you might be, and you're reading this & wondering what to do next, for God's sake, please DON'T err on the side of giving your spouse some unmerited benefit of a doubt. You need allies, external forces, who can help get your WS back on-course, by making the imminent costs [to the adulterous persons] of continuing the affair so high as to outweigh the drug-like rush that will normally keep them in it.

I too, felt (among a whole spaghetti-bowl of other, mostly horrible feelings) a definite sense of relief when my OW finally got found out by her H. It gave me no choice but to make a choice, finally, as to whether I wanted to lose or save my marriage. Not all WSs will choose to try to save it, but from what I've experienced & read, even those who DO so choose, will still need the big, clarifying kick in the butt that exposure provides.


Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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I was conducting a survey which died in the recent crash but I still have the data. When I get a chance, I'll condense it again and repost it. I should also repost the survey so we can get more responses. Anyway, the data clearly shows that exposure gives you the best chance to end the affair. Especially nuclear exposure. Failure to expose, or exposing a little bit at a time giving the WS a chance to spin their version first had disasterous results.

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
I've been seeing a lot of folks coming to this forum, distraught and devastated over their spouse's infidelity, much as I did not so long ago. I, and the rest of the BS's here, want to give them a hug because we know their pain.

Another thing I keep seeing is a strong desire for these broken people to 'help' their spouse keep cheating on them! Yes, I said HELP. And I mean that because of the BS's refusal to expose the A. I wish I had a nickel for every poster who has come on here, begging for help. And when the vets offer that help by explaining the importance of exposure, the BS responds with all the reasons for why they SHOULDN'T expose the A. For example:

"WS will lose his job." Oh, yeah. That's a good reason to let your spouse and his lover keep humping! NOT.
"My father will kill him!" Doubtful, don't you think?
"The OW's H is mentally unstable and will beat her up!" One, do you care? Two, her H has more than likely never laid a hand on her in anger.
"It will scar my children." Nothing like a divorce will.
"He'll get mad at me and leave me!" Okay. Then let the A continue so he can get the OW pregnant and THEN leave you. Or maybe just read some of the posts on here from FWS who are thankful they were exposed.
"It will destroy my in-laws if they know!" Um. Okay. But you might not want to keep calling them your 'in-laws'. Because they probably won't be that to you much longer.
"He'll lose the respect of his colleagues!" You think they don't already know?
"We can't afford for him to quit his job." Jobs are like buses. He can get another job. What you DON'T want him in is another MARRIAGE, right?

NOTHING is as important as your M! There is NO excuse to keep your spouse's affair confidential! There is every reason to let your spouse know that you will do whatever it takes to keep your marriage intact. If you listen to NO other piece of advice on this forum, listen to the vets who tell you when and how to expose the A! Exposure was what ended my FWH's A.

His timeline before exposure:

October: he thought the EA with his co-worker was just dandy, that as long as it was 'just' inappropriate comments and flirting it wasn't wrong. His AP's H knew something was up ("gut feeling") but didn't act on the feeling and resisted snooping in the beginning.
November: The EA goes PA. Too bad her BH didn't act on his 'gut feeling', huh?
December: WH is now addicted to the OP, but guilt has settled in and he has a hard time looking at himself in the morning and an even harder time looking at me, and he realizes that he's in a bad situation. Can't talk to anyone about it. His best friend is ME, so who's he going to confide in? He is now on a merry-go-round and doesn't know how to get off.
January: OW's spouse confronts my WH, which was a real wake-up call. He gives OW a NC letter. NC lasts all of one day. Why? Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER! LISTEN UP, newly betrayeds! Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER!
February: OW's spouse FINALLY sends certified letter to employer. A ends THAT DAY. OW's H makes her quit her job. They move away. My H confesses to me. Our rebuilding begins.

Look back at the timeline. Do you see where the A could have ended? Back in October, when the OW's H should have acted on his 'gut feeling'!

Don't expect your WS to be a standup person and do the right thing, because often they don't know HOW - my FWH told me he was GLAD the A was exposed, that he felt relief when his employer confronted him, because he didn't know how to end it!

Please, newly betrayed, please listen to the vets on this board if you truly want to save your marriage.

:::stepping down off soapbox:::

I EXPOSED TO ANYONE AND EVERYONE FOR NUMEROUS REASONS. Some I'm not so proud of..Accountability, Vindictiveness, Understandability, HELP, Etc...DUDE

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I also want to say that if anyone is afraid to expose because "people will talk", widespread exposure will actually shut down gossip completely. Gossip happens when people only have part of the story, or hear something from a 3rd party. When you tell them yourself, they know the straight truth and the whole truth and there's nothing to spread around.

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Originally Posted by Tabby1
I also want to say that if anyone is afraid to expose because "people will talk", widespread exposure will actually shut down gossip completely. Gossip happens when people only have part of the story, or hear something from a 3rd party. When you tell them yourself, they know the straight truth and the whole truth and there's nothing to spread around.

AMEN SISTER...Everyone knows the most minute details of her A and my RA. Its out there for the world to see except our two little ones. DUDE

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Great posts, MaritalBliss and Gloveoil! I can attest to the fact that exposure is the single most potent weapon a BS has against the affair. We have had so many affairs here that were killed when they were exposed. Others died quickly after exposure. The worst thing a BS can do is keep the affair secret. Everyone should know, family, children, OP's spouse. Exposure is ruinous to affairs when everyone is looking.

My H's affair ended the DAY it was exposed and there are many other such cases.

A marriage can recover from the temporary anger of an exposed WS, but it cannot recover from an ongoing affair. Like MaritalBliss pointed out, we even cases where the WW ended up PREGNANT because her poor, scared BH did nothing to stop the affair.

While there are no guarantees, this remains the single most potent weapon in the BS arsenal.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Quick summary of results:

46 people responded to the survey. Of these, 31 affairs ended while 15 did not.

Of the 31 affairs that ended:
- 16 exposed immediately (within the first day)
- 11 exposed within the first 2 weeks of d-day
- 3 exposed over a period of time
- 1 didn't expose

Of the 15 affairs that did not end:
- 8 took longer than 2 weeks to expose
- 7 exposed little by little

I should repost the survey to get some more responses. It won't ever be a truly scientific study as this board itself generates some bias, but for people who need to know the statistics, it's something.

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Originally Posted by Tabby1
Quick summary of results:

46 people responded to the survey. Of these, 31 affairs ended while 15 did not.

Of the 31 affairs that ended:
- 16 exposed immediately (within the first day)
- 11 exposed within the first 2 weeks of d-day
- 3 exposed over a period of time
- 1 didn't expose

Of the 15 affairs that did not end:
- 8 took longer than 2 weeks to expose
- 7 exposed little by little

I should repost the survey to get some more responses. It won't ever be a truly scientific study as this board itself generates some bias, but for people who need to know the statistics, it's something.


AND...Just to add, the more MORAL(OXYMORON) the WS WAS, the more potent the EXPOSURE is generally.

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I still have doubts of the effectiveness of exposing to OWs friends in a bid to find her parents.

I think that WS and OW have already told her friends that WS is "married but separated". Would the knowledge that I am trying to save my marriage actually make any difference? Most people, including one of my sisters, seem to think that verbally saying the words "we are separated", even if adultery was being committed prior to those words, somehow makes it ok to cheat on ones spouse.

I don't want to come across as a neurotic, vindictive BS if this exposure doesn't actually achieve anything.

Thoughts?


Me:41
WS:42
Together 22 yrs, No kids
ILYBNILWY: April 09
WS & OW: Oct 08 - present
http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/u...388#Post2282388
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maritalbliss,
This sitch could have been written about me.

Unfortunately I did not find this MB site till 12-08, and A began in 6-08.

My timeline
6-08 sometime during end of month drunken PA began (I had no clue)
7-18-08 - Im not happy speech and want to move
8-08 confused and dazed and starting to ask questions as XH starts looking for apartments
9-08 - Confirm A with direct report. I fall apart and guess what - DO NOTHING except confront him (big deal)
10-08 - XH moves out
10-18 - I confront PP (big deal)
10-08 - 12-08 - I also work there and I keep quiet. Embarrassed, shamed (WHY), Don't want XH to get fired, think A will die a quiet death. my own fog babble.
12-08 - I find this site and get hit full force with 2x4s...expose.
1-1-09 XH takes PP to Vegas
1-09 FINALLY I expose to mgmt. and co-workers

No surprise 75% of coworkers know.
1-09 - No surprise - XH gives me D papers (they had much time to formulate their own agenda)

3-09 - XH gets slapped on the wrist at work.

LISTEN to the VETS here. I thought they were crazy. I thought they were militant. I almost stopped coming to MB.

Would it have saved my M? I don't know.

But I will tell you D hurts, D destroys the family. In comparison to losing a paycheck, being embarrassed and shamed -- I will take that any day instead of being in this empty space after 22 years of M. If I had a choice again, I would be at XH and PP's desk with a Banner saying "Office Affair".

Just my 2 cents or more.


Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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Originally Posted by TravelMonkey
I still have doubts of the effectiveness of exposing to OWs friends in a bid to find her parents.

I think that WS and OW have already told her friends that WS is "married but separated". Would the knowledge that I am trying to save my marriage actually make any difference? Most people, including one of my sisters, seem to think that verbally saying the words "we are separated", even if adultery was being committed prior to those words, somehow makes it ok to cheat on ones spouse.

I don't want to come across as a neurotic, vindictive BS if this exposure doesn't actually achieve anything.

Thoughts?

Exposure could ensure they don't do it to the next spouse, even if its not you...Vindictive? I think one of the main reasons spouses have As is cuz they are pissed at their spouses. My fwxw said when her A was confessed "I was so mad at you!" Ok, that was vindictive, then I was vindictive back?!(RA/EXPOSURE) DUDE

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Originally Posted by TravelMonkey
I still have doubts of the effectiveness of exposing to OWs friends in a bid to find her parents.

I think that WS and OW have already told her friends that WS is "married but separated". Would the knowledge that I am trying to save my marriage actually make any difference? Most people, including one of my sisters, seem to think that verbally saying the words "we are separated", even if adultery was being committed prior to those words, somehow makes it ok to cheat on ones spouse.

I don't want to come across as a neurotic, vindictive BS if this exposure doesn't actually achieve anything.

Thoughts?
This is an example of the WS spinning their own version. Yes, some people might overlook it some if the WS says you are separated. But most won't be comfortable with it. Even if they don't immediately or outwardly respond to the knowledge that adultery is the reason for the separation, they will also not support the affair-relationship when it starts to break down.

The longer you wait and the more you draw it out, the more vindictive and neurotic you will seem. Immediate action suggests confidence, even when there is none.

Again, your marriage can survive anger. It cannot survive an active affair.

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Dude and Tabby.

Thank you so much. I am going to do it! Watch my space.


Me:41
WS:42
Together 22 yrs, No kids
ILYBNILWY: April 09
WS & OW: Oct 08 - present
http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/u...388#Post2282388
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TM

It is 3:44 pm, well were are watching!

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MaritalBliss is TOTALLY RIGHT!

My then-WW did everything she could to keep me in-the-dark and passive...i.e., to not "find out the truth and expose it".

To you newly-BSs, don't fall for the threats ("violation of trust", "I'll leave you if you talk", etc.). Find out however you need to and EXPOSE and do it NUCLEAR.

If you do what I did, you will end up sorry and divorced and portrayed as at fault for everything.


xWW:
Secret LTA w/ thrice married OM at her workplace; EA/PA starts ~ 2005-6
Files & completes D - 2007, OM/OMW#3 D - 2007, Affairage - immediately thereafter
Disappears in 2006 w/o even a goodbye to anyone, Never a paragraph of real truth ever spoken
Me/xBH:
M "for life", Suspicions (denied) & desperate Plan A latter-half '06
1st D-day 1/07, full truth D-day 7/08 (all via 3rd parties)
NC w/ xWW 8/08-date, better off w/o unrepentant vileness, betrayal, & rampant deceit in my life anymore
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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
I've been seeing a lot of folks coming to this forum, distraught and devastated over their spouse's infidelity, much as I did not so long ago. I, and the rest of the BS's here, want to give them a hug because we know their pain.

Another thing I keep seeing is a strong desire for these broken people to 'help' their spouse keep cheating on them! Yes, I said HELP. And I mean that because of the BS's refusal to expose the A. I wish I had a nickel for every poster who has come on here, begging for help. And when the vets offer that help by explaining the importance of exposure, the BS responds with all the reasons for why they SHOULDN'T expose the A. For example:

"WS will lose his job." Oh, yeah. That's a good reason to let your spouse and his lover keep humping! NOT.
"My father will kill him!" Doubtful, don't you think?
"The OW's H is mentally unstable and will beat her up!" One, do you care? Two, her H has more than likely never laid a hand on her in anger.
"It will scar my children." Nothing like a divorce will.
"He'll get mad at me and leave me!" Okay. Then let the A continue so he can get the OW pregnant and THEN leave you. Or maybe just read some of the posts on here from FWS who are thankful they were exposed.
"It will destroy my in-laws if they know!" Um. Okay. But you might not want to keep calling them your 'in-laws'. Because they probably won't be that to you much longer.
"He'll lose the respect of his colleagues!" You think they don't already know?
"We can't afford for him to quit his job." Jobs are like buses. He can get another job. What you DON'T want him in is another MARRIAGE, right?

NOTHING is as important as your M! There is NO excuse to keep your spouse's affair confidential! There is every reason to let your spouse know that you will do whatever it takes to keep your marriage intact. If you listen to NO other piece of advice on this forum, listen to the vets who tell you when and how to expose the A! Exposure was what ended my FWH's A.

His timeline before exposure:

October: he thought the EA with his co-worker was just dandy, that as long as it was 'just' inappropriate comments and flirting it wasn't wrong. His AP's H knew something was up ("gut feeling") but didn't act on the feeling and resisted snooping in the beginning.
November: The EA goes PA. Too bad her BH didn't act on his 'gut feeling', huh?
December: WH is now addicted to the OP, but guilt has settled in and he has a hard time looking at himself in the morning and an even harder time looking at me, and he realizes that he's in a bad situation. Can't talk to anyone about it. His best friend is ME, so who's he going to confide in? He is now on a merry-go-round and doesn't know how to get off.
January: OW's spouse confronts my WH, which was a real wake-up call. He gives OW a NC letter. NC lasts all of one day. Why? Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER! LISTEN UP, newly betrayeds! Because they continued to WORK TOGETHER!
February: OW's spouse FINALLY sends certified letter to employer. A ends THAT DAY. OW's H makes her quit her job. They move away. My H confesses to me. Our rebuilding begins.

Look back at the timeline. Do you see where the A could have ended? Back in October, when the OW's H should have acted on his 'gut feeling'!

Don't expect your WS to be a standup person and do the right thing, because often they don't know HOW - my FWH told me he was GLAD the A was exposed, that he felt relief when his employer confronted him, because he didn't know how to end it!

Please, newly betrayed, please listen to the vets on this board if you truly want to save your marriage.

:::stepping down off soapbox:::


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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So what if your spouse swears it is over? My husband's affair happened in 2008. I have looked at phone records and emails...seems they haven't had contact since 2009.

But...when I did call the OW (yes i did very recently since I have just found out), he immediately texted her "don't worry about anything" which struck me as strange. Why would he care if she's worried???!!!

Last edited by lostandscorned; 03/14/10 10:58 AM.
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Originally Posted by lostandscorned
So what if your spouse swears it is over? My husband's affair happened in 2008. I have looked at phone records and emails...seems they haven't had contact since 2009.

But...when I did call the OW (yes i did very recently since I have just found out), he immediately texted her "don't worry about anything" which struck me as strange. Why would he care if she's worried???!!!

Because he is still having an A with her.


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
Originally Posted by lostandscorned
So what if your spouse swears it is over? My husband's affair happened in 2008. I have looked at phone records and emails...seems they haven't had contact since 2009.

But...when I did call the OW (yes i did very recently since I have just found out), he immediately texted her "don't worry about anything" which struck me as strange. Why would he care if she's worried???!!!

Because he is still having an A with her.

How could he be if I check his phone and call records...I also check his email. She lives 11 hours from us. Do you really think it's still going on?

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