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You are right! I know he sees her as someone else. And he has been acting like an "alien".
I dont want my relationship to be the same again. I want it to be stonger and the two of us to be able to talk and communicate better. I want him to feel like he can approach me and tell when something is wrong. I want me to be able to do that as well.
Last edited by lostandfound_101; 12/04/09 11:54 AM.
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Yes her parents know. I dont know the reaction but it has happened twice before so I dont think they were shocked. I dont know that she has any siblings. Then how do you know they know, if YOU didn't tell them? You are being foolish if you do not call them yourself. You are throwing away your marriage if YOU don't take the steps we recommend and call them YOURSELF. Her friends help her ger around so I dont recognize her car. She is not what you would call a girl with values. Nor are her friends. This is so totally not who I ever thought would interest my husband. Why are you not trying to get information on her siblings and friends so you can talk to them? I cant bear to hurt his parents like that. I havent told them. I am hoping I wont have to. But, I will if he decides to move out again. So his parents' temporary happiness (read: ignorance) is more important to you than being married to their son? What kind of happiness do you think they will have when they find out you're divorcing because their precious son cheated on you? You are not making sense. We went to his families tis past week and had a very nice time. I just dont want to hurt anyone else. So you are saying that YOUR happiness is worth LESS than anyone else's? That, as long as his parents or siblings or cousins or best friends don't have to have bad feelings about their wonderful son/brother/cousin/friend, it's ok with you if you just walk away from your husband? Or is the truth that you are just AFRAID to tell anyone? Or ashamed? Or are afraid of him being mad at you and then saying it's YOUR fault he is leaving because you exposed? If that is the real truth, please know that what you are feeling is VERY common for betrayed spouses. It's why we have to fight so hard to get you to see the importance of exposure. But you know what? EVERY person who has come here, been afraid to expose, and finally agreed to do it - every one - said they were SO GLAD they finally did. In fact, most of them who were afraid and waited, kicked themselves for waiting so long. Please listen to the advice here. You are not using it. And you are going to lose your husband because you are ignoring it. Read some other threads; you'll see that exposure works. Please stop being afraid.
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I just want to jump in to say that when you expose, you are just revealing a truth vs covering things up and making them so very secret and exciting.
You need to know what you are going to say and to let them know that you want the marriage to survive and thrive. That you would like any advice they have about working towards that.
One of the toughest exposures I made was to my own elderly parents since I realized that this is a looooong haul I am in and they may not live to see the end result. That sucked big time but they surprised me with amazing support and input and strength. I can see where my character came from. A couple of amazing people who raised me.
Last edited by reading; 12/04/09 02:54 PM.
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I just want to jump in to say that when you expose, you are just revealing a truth vs covering things up and making them so very secret and exciting. Just today my WW, through my attorney, requested/demanded that I write letters of retraction to those I had exposed the A to. Can you imagine? Since I'm in Plan B, I will not even respond. I gave my attorney a statement to read to WW about the conditions I had set for her to communicate with me (in other words, shut up).
Preach the Gospel every day. When necessary, use words.
St. Francis of Assissi
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I am sure you are right. I am afraid of what the reaction would be from him if I tell his family. I dont think he can do that. If he leaves he will have to tell them. If I do it for him he wont have to anymore. It will make it easier to leave.
As I mentioned earlier she has already gotten with another married man. I dont know how long it has been going on but I was told for a while. So that means she was with my H and this other man at the same time. He must not know. He thinks she loves him. I dont think she is capable.
I am not ashamed so much as scared to do the wrong thing. I thought at one time I should go talk to her myself. But, since I heard this today I think maybe I shouldnt. Surely, he will not want to be with her now. He will certainly hear about it if he hasnt already.
I know her parents know bacause she was living with her parents when this was going on. My oldest son went to their house and told them he was looking for his dad who was with their daughter. They were keeping the kids for her while she moved in with my H.
When it all came down my kids who all college age went to confront him and told him he was a coward. He had left with only text to tell me he want coming home. I fell apart. They just kinda took over and made him come talk to me.
As soon as he got home he told me he wasnt leaving. We talked more than we have ever talked about what was wrong and how we could improve it.
All my co-workers already knew. But, no one told me. How do tell someone something like that they said. The rumors were going around and his co-workers knew. He was openly seeing her from what I was told. I had not been told anything about her before he left that day.
I try not to listen to gossip and I just trusted him.
Without a doubt I know she is not what will make him happy. I know I cant "make" him happy but I can give him comfort and be strong for him when he needs it.
Ok. If he isnt seeing her anymore would it still be necessary to tell his family?
I will get a GPS and figure out a way to monitor his cell phone messages. The keylogger thing will be difficult. I dont want to get into any trouble if I put one on his office computer. Can I? I may even know a PI that I can hire for a while.
My home computer I can install one.
If I do this for a while and he is not seeing her would it still be necessary. I will if I find he is. The kind of woman she is I dont think anyone would agree he is doing the right thing. And, if he gets upset with me I am no worse off than I was before. AS long as he is still seeing her.
What do you think?
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I am sure you are right. I am afraid of what the reaction would be from him if I tell his family. The following quote was written by Star*fish. It's saved on my "notable posts" thread. Here is is. Read this several times a day. It is the fear that paralyzes you, sends blood rushing through your veins, sours your stomach, and interupts your sleep. It is the fear that gives away your power, your hope, and your forgiveness. It is fear that robs you of the active self and traps you in the role of patronizing enabler who will take them back at ANY cost...even if the price is too high. It is fear that keeps you from confronting and exposing. And fear that prevents you from enforcing your boundaries and having compassion for yourself.
Fear of abandonment.
Fear of rejection.
Fear of reaction....yours, theirs.
Fear of future...the unknown.
Fear of destitution and want.
Fear of failure.
Fear of losing.
Fear of loss.
Fear of solitude.
Fear of settling.
Fear of change.
Fear of lack of change.
Fear
Fear
Infidelity creates FEAR....and fear is crippling. Research shows us what we already know in our hearts....when we are fearful....we are unable to fire up the parts of our brains that "process" information on a logical, rational, spirtual level and create solutions that increase the odds for success in crises. When we are fearful....we don't use our neocortex....but instead, it is our limpic system which lights up our MRIs....our animal brains wired for "fight or flight".
There is no HOPE in our animal brains....because our indentity, our souls, our compassion....don't reside there. You are only capable of conflict or escape when you are there....so you must find a quiet place to deal with your fears so that you can confront, expose, do all the things that overcoming infidelity entails....all the things that happiness entails. You must value yourself as well as protect yourself, without fear of losing your WS or enforcing boundaries.....because if you don't....all your fears will be realized anyway.
MB is not designed to trap you in a marriage where your feelings are crushed and disrespected or the vows of marriage are meaningless. It's designed to help you overcome fear and give you hope that marriages CAN recover from infidelity....but you must be brave and be willing to risk losing your WS in order to regain trust, fidelity, security.
You must be willing to see beyond your pain and take logical and systematic steps to undermine the affair and increase the stability and security of your marriage. That takes courage above pain. It takes the peacefulness of knowing you are strong enough to lose a self indulgent and unrepentant spouse or recover with a flawed, but motivated one.
Don't let your fear take back a spouse who isn't ready to do the hard work recovery after infidelity entails. It is an invitation for misery.
If you don't believe you CAN survive without your WS....you cannot do what you must do to ensure success.
Stop being fearful of their threats...they are just excuses to leave or be selfish.
Stop being fearful of their reactions....their reactions arise from their guilt...not your boundaries.
Stop being fearful of taking a stand....it's the only way to gain respect or trust.
Stop being fearful of being alone.....until you can stand on your own and risk losing them, you will NEVER know if they remain with you by choice. And you will never know if you want them or you NEED them.
And if you need them....even if they return....you are in trouble chere.
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I am afraid of what the reaction would be from him if I tell his family. Let me spare you this fear. His reaction will be - ANGER!  Unjustified anger. His anger is based on his OWN fear and his OWN shame. His anger will NOT be the demise of your marriage. His adulterous affair MIGHT cause the end of your marriage. You should tolerate his anger but not tolerate his adultery.
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I did call and talk to my father who is always very supportive. He believes I should let him go and he will see he has made a mistake. He believes my H is suffering from some sort of pyschosis that he has to address before he can truly be happy. That I cannot make him happy. Psychosis being something to do with not feeling adequate.
He is very smart and successful but he doesnt have confidence when it comes to "just being a person"
Whether it is a psychosis or just that he is disappointed with his accomplishments I can only try to support him and be there for him.
I would like to call her parents and ask them if they will help me get her to understand what she is doing and that she will not find happiness with a man that was truly dedicated to his family by tearing him away from his family.
Maybe they can get her to realize no matter what she does for him she cannot replace 20+ years of marriage and 5 kids.
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I would like to call her parents and ask them if they will help me get her to understand what she is doing and that she will not find happiness with a man that was truly dedicated to his family by tearing him away from his family.
Maybe they can get her to realize no matter what she does for him she cannot replace 20+ years of marriage and 5 kids. OW is NOT going to help you. This is a fantasy in your head and will NOT work. Follow the MB plans.
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I am sure you are right. I am afraid of what the reaction would be from him if I tell his family. I dont think he can do that. If he leaves he will have to tell them. If I do it for him he wont have to anymore. It will make it easier to leave. Have you read all the articles here about affairs? I don't think you have, or you would understand that you're not getting the point. The point is that exposing KILLS the affair - at least it is the ONE best chance you have. If you tell his parents now, they (hopefully) will call him and cuss him out and tell him how disappointed they are in him, and look at the wonderful wife he is hurting, and how could he have done something so despicable. The shame which he rightfully will feel might be the ONLY thing that would bring him home to you. It does NO GOOD to tell them AFTER HE IS GONE! Look. Your marriage can survive his being mad at you for a few days. It CANNOT SURVIVE him screwing another woman. You've already lost him. What else do you have to lose? PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE call his family and her family today. Or just give up and file for divorce. Him hearing about her with another guy will most likely NOT make him give her up. He is too addicted. He will justify it; make it the other guy's fault, she just got confused... You have to expose so that he starts to see HIS affair for the slime it really is. Through everyone else's eyes.
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lost, read pepperband's quote about fear. Then read it again. Memorizing it wouldn't be a bad thing. All of your posts are confirming that you don't want the A to continue, but you're afraid to do anything so you're going to let it continue. Stop acting in fear!
Also, don't let any presumed notions about the OWs morals or character paralyze you. It is not important if she is the town tramp or Mother Teresa. It doesn't matter if she's true to your H or is screwing every guy in town. The ONLY thing you need to acknowledge is that she is involved in an adulterous affair with YOUR H. I've seen too many posts by BSs who say things like "she's broken up marriages before...she's a tramp...she goes from man to man..." and they strike me almost as wishful thinking "If I think hard enough about negative aspects of the OW, my WH will pick those thoughts up by osmosis and suddenly decide to do the right thing, and we can get back to normal."
That's probably not going to happen. You will need to take some action, here. If not for your M, at least for your sanity.
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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I am sure you are right. I am afraid of what the reaction would be from him if I tell his family. He will be angry, of course. I dont think he can do that. If he leaves he will have to tell them. If I do it for him he wont have to anymore. It will make it easier to leave. Easier for him, you mean. If he tells his family, then he gets to put the spin on it, and then he's won. If you expose the truth, he can't lie his way out of it. As I mentioned earlier she has already gotten with another married man. I dont know how long it has been going on but I was told for a while. So that means she was with my H and this other man at the same time. He must not know. He thinks she loves him. I dont think she is capable. Your focus should not be on her. It should be on your H. And your M, if you want it. I am not ashamed so much as scared to do the wrong thing. I thought at one time I should go talk to her myself. But, since I heard this today I think maybe I shouldnt. Listen to the others here. They will guide you. If you choose to confront the OW, they'll tell you how and what to say. Surely, he will not want to be with her now. He will certainly hear about it if he hasnt already. Don't bet on it. Affairs are awful, ugly things. They are surreal, and it turns spouses into unthinking aliens. I know her parents know bacause she was living with her parents when this was going on. My oldest son went to their house and told them he was looking for his dad who was with their daughter. They were keeping the kids for her while she moved in with my H. Guilt and shame do not belong to the wayward couple. At least not until their A is known to everyone around them. When it all came down my kids who all college age went to confront him and told him he was a coward. He had left with only text to tell me he want coming home. I fell apart. They just kinda took over and made him come talk to me. Because he wants to manipulate the situation. Don't believe anything he says. As soon as he got home he told me he wasnt leaving. We talked more than we have ever talked about what was wrong and how we could improve it. This is called cake-eating. As in, "having one's cake and eating it, too." All my co-workers already knew. But, no one told me. How do tell someone something like that they said. The rumors were going around and his co-workers knew. He was openly seeing her from what I was told. I had not been told anything about her before he left that day. Unfortunately, many do not want to "get involved." This is why exposure works to your benefit. If you know and tell others, then others will not feel ashamed or guilty, and tell still others. I try not to listen to gossip and I just trusted him. It's time to determine what is gossip and what is truth. Why would there be gossip if there wasn't some reason for it? Without a doubt I know she is not what will make him happy. I know I cant "make" him happy but I can give him comfort and be strong for him when he needs it. She is fulfilling some of his EN. Dr. Harley maintains that all A's die of their own accord, because they aren't grounded in reality. But the swath of damage they cause is wide and deep. Ok. If he isnt seeing her anymore would it still be necessary to tell his family? In my opinion, unless you have verifiable proof that he isn't seeing her any more, expose, expose, expose. I will get a GPS and figure out a way to monitor his cell phone messages. The keylogger thing will be difficult. I dont want to get into any trouble if I put one on his office computer. Can I? I may even know a PI that I can hire for a while. Good for you. My home computer I can install one. Yes. Without fail. If I do this for a while and he is not seeing her would it still be necessary. I will if I find he is. The kind of woman she is I dont think anyone would agree he is doing the right thing. And, if he gets upset with me I am no worse off than I was before. AS long as he is still seeing her. It is necessary up until you have verifiable proof that the A is over and you two are in recovery. Otherwise he will sandbag you and find ways around your efforts. Adulterers are NOT simple-minded. They are entirely focused on continuing their A. Be warned. What do you think?
Preach the Gospel every day. When necessary, use words.
St. Francis of Assissi
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I read this and it made me cry! Being afraid is a terrible way to feel. It comes and goes. I try to be strong and I am getting there little by little. THanks for posting this.
And thanks to all of you. I know you are right that I cannot accept a H that is not committed just so I can have him here.
I have to go for now but I will be back.
Thanks again.
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You will need to take some action, here. If not for your M, at least for your sanity. Absolutely! This is no joke. Having a spouse cheat on you is the most devastating thing a person can go through. And to have your spouse blatantly cheat on you for any extended time period has led to mental breakdowns. You just cannot sit there and HOPE it will end. Your mental health is at stake here. You have to push past your fears and do something to help your sitch.
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I will think about it. I understand what you are saying. Mymarriage means more to me than anything.
I know I can live iwthout him I just dont want to give up all that we have worked for. I know that I am being a coward by not telling his family.
If exposing kills the affair then maybe that is the right thing to do. I will read some more articles and decide. I may lose him by waiting, I dont know.
I have been through something similar about 10 years ago. I guess you would say he had an emotional affair. It took about a year to get past it. Maybe if I had done things different back then this would not be happening now.
Maybe there is no hope for us. I think there is one minute and the next I have no idea how to live with this. I dont want to give up but I dont think I can do what you ask. I want it to be between myself and my H but from what you are tellimg me that is not possible,
I guess you may be right that he wont mind her sleeping with other men as long as he is not living with her. I really thought that may show him where he is wrong about her. I suppose it doesnt matter what she is. She is something special to him
Thats the part that hurts the most.
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Read some more articles here and threads. You will find that waywards almost always affair 'down.' That's what makes it so hard to comprehend. I think it's psychological - gives them a sense of superiority over something.
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Read some more articles here and threads. You will find that waywards almost always affair 'down.' That's what makes it so hard to comprehend. I think it's psychological - gives them a sense of superiority over something. Hmm, I wonder. "Down" as compared to what? To the BS? In my opinion, my WW went "down," but only because OM doesn't measure up in my opinion. But compared to WW, he's still a step "up." (I don't mean that in a harsh sense; WW is a bit of a "plain ol' country girl," and both OM and I are educated and gainfully employed).
Preach the Gospel every day. When necessary, use words.
St. Francis of Assissi
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I will think about it. I understand what you are saying. Mymarriage means more to me than anything.
I know I can live iwthout him I just dont want to give up all that we have worked for. I know that I am being a coward by not telling his family.
If exposing kills the affair then maybe that is the right thing to do. I will read some more articles and decide. I may lose him by waiting, I dont know.
I have been through something similar about 10 years ago. I guess you would say he had an emotional affair. It took about a year to get past it. Maybe if I had done things different back then this would not be happening now.
Maybe there is no hope for us. I think there is one minute and the next I have no idea how to live with this. I dont want to give up but I dont think I can do what you ask. I want it to be between myself and my H but from what you are tellimg me that is not possible,
I guess you may be right that he wont mind her sleeping with other men as long as he is not living with her. I really thought that may show him where he is wrong about her. I suppose it doesnt matter what she is. She is something special to him
Thats the part that hurts the most. Your WH has dumped on everything you've worked for together. You're not giving anything up. There's no "maybe" about it. Exposure kills As. Sitting on your hands could end your M. It's as simple as that. Your WH is an alien right now. Don't expect for him to 'man up' and do the right thing. Someone is currently meeting needs of his that he will give up a lot for so that those needs can be met. DON'T spend any more time on the morals of the OW. She's seeing a MM - ergo, her morals are in the "alley cat" range. Your H doesn't care/doesn't know/will consider that kind of info as incorrect, false gossip or a flat-out lie in order to continue having his needs met. Listen to the people who have been there. Read my info below this post.
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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I dont think I will say anything to anyone.
THanks for the advice but I just cannot hurt anyone else by telling the people who love him about this. I am going to continue to do the things I should be doing in our marraige. I am going to do make him feel special and try to provide his ENs.
He may not accept what I have to give all the time but right now that is okay. I think I have to be understanding and not give up. It is not difficult to love him because I just do. It is easy to be patient because I know he is trying to. He may be just hanging on to me and using me as I have been told but... I have to believe in our love.
I believe in what we had and I know we are strong. If it was not what I thought I dont want it back. We are not perfect but we were great! I know he thought so too. We had a lot happen to us over the past 2 years and we fell apart.
I know now what matters and I think he will realize that. I can be the GIVER and provide for him as long as I believe that he loves me. The OW cannot give him what he needs. He may be confused irght now but he will realize she is not what he thinks she is.
I read the thread that Pepperband (I think it was) posted for everyone to read. That is my plan. To give all I can for as long as it takes. If I lose him then I will have a great loss. I just dont believe hurting someone else is the way to hold on to my family. I pray about it everyday and I believe that lookig for support from folks like you and doing everything I can to bring him back is what I need to be doing.
I pray for strength and I pray that God will help my H open his heart and let listen.
I have this different attitude about what I need now. I dont want to just save our marraige and keep it in tact. I want to do it right. I want to put his needs first for a change. My turn will come one day! You could argue that while the A is going on nothing will change.
I agree to but I think it has to be his choice. He has to choose between me and her on his own or it will NOT be his choice. His family may influence him but he will never know it was his choice if he is pushed to make that decision.
I need him to be here because he wants to be. That is the only way he will be HAPPY and content. Otherwise, he will feel cheated and lonely for a long time. I refuse to fight with him and I will not give him an ultimatum. Sometimes I feel cheated myself and want to give up but then I think about what I would want someone to do if I were on the other side.
If i was the one who was unhappy and thought I found something outside the marriage what would I hope my husband would do? If I didnt want to be with him and I wanted to really leave I would want him to tell me he didnt love me. I would want him to be angry and want a divorce. I owuld probably provoke him and use that excuse.
If I was still in love W/my H I would want him to hang on. If I did it because I was looking for someone to satisfy my EN I would love it if he tried to satisfy them for me. That would make me question what i was doing and what I was giving up. That is what would make me fall in love with him again.
Coming from a crazy person I guess but that is who I am. I can only be me.
Last edited by lostandfound_101; 12/07/09 02:27 PM.
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Don't wait till he moves out to expose. Do it now.
I waited a whole year...I did not know he was having A with downstairs neighbor but I could have snooped, but didn't.
So he moved out and I exposed to everybody...fortunately I did it just in time before he could spin his own story...which was going to be this:
Atena and I were not happy for a long while. I had told her a year ago I wanted to separate and was just waiting for son to graduate. Now after we separated I met up with the neighbor and we are not so happy...
OK, my exposure did nothing to the A as it came too late (I have been in plan B now for over 2 months so I am sticking to MB). On top of that we live in Europe and H's whole family is in the States so he feels no pressure from them, but I know for sure his mom and dad talked to him and they are devastated...however they are not close by to be able to put pressure.All his siblins are on my side. H rented a studio in a very remote area and sees nobody but OW. We work together and he knows that people at work know, nevertheless nobody has confronted him and he seems fine talking to people as if nothing happened. Imagine..he did not even tell his direct superior about the separation...
So, do not wait to be in my situation where exposure came too late and was to no avail.
Do it now.
Maritalbliss, you said you are in recovery but i see that you were in NC since 2/16/09...did H move out?
blessing
atena
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