I want their feedback and their help on this so badly... If, I made a mistake, I want to know what I've done... Or why they aren't responding...

Inside, myself I know that both have lives and are very busy but I suddenly feel very despondent...

Which is EXACTLY what waywards do. My WxH didn't consider his affair an affair either.

It's called justification and denial.

Following the script - just like all the other waywards.

They ALL think they are special and different and not a cheater. They are WRONG.

Huh? This is by any measure a "standard" affair, any way you slice it.

No wayward thinks they are having an affair. They couch it in all kinds of fuzzy language and twisted logic. My WW actually told me that I gave her permission to "date" OM! I had to remind her (uselessly, I add) that what I had said was that my attorney said I could not do what she was doing. There is a big difference there, don't you think?

In the small amount of human brain that might remain within a wayward, there is a little voice that's telling them it's wrong. But they can't own up to it, so they lie, justify, rewrite history, and manipulate facts any way they can to make themselves feel good about what they're doing.

WH is wayward, and is saying and doing all the typical wayward things, that I agree.

But Steve Harley has actually discovered that WH has a character flaw, and has told Plexle to not do exposure because it would do no good.

So WH does not feel guilty because he feels he has no reason to feel guilty. He does not think he has crossed over a line.

If WH was a normal wayward, Harley wouldn't give Plexle this advice, don't you think?

This is true Gals.

The only thing holding off total exposure in my opinion is Dr Harleys presence and Plexle waiting for a car.

IMO WH has one chance to get it together before the bombs fly and that chance is with Dr. H.

I wouldn't apoligize to OW you will be lowering yourself to be manipulative and Steve hasn't said to do anything like that yet.

As far as plan A stuff do it. It's how you would like to live right?

I don't like it that he is acting like you are the bad guy with all his little girlfriends and wonder how stable he is but that doesn't mean you should have to take it. Wait for Dr. H on this.

This suggests WH has a personality disorder. If WH cannot discern right from wrong, has no conscience or is incapable of feeling empathy or understanding the hurt that he can/is causing, then the question arises: Should Plexle stay with him? Personality disorders are extremely difficult to treat, and most disordered people don't believe they have a problem and thus do not want to be treated.

Doc H told me that without a belief systems change, the behavior will not change. It's a genuine inability to have intimate empathy. That's why we've been told to enjoy each other again as a TEAM.

I suspect I'm in the wrong thread....

Like I said above Dr. Harley is his only hope. Then Plex should do whatever she needs to for herself.

Finally caught up with your thread. I think you are exactly on track. Whether he contacts OW or not is completely out of your control. Great that you forwarded the emails to Doc H, but if he finds out you have them, he will probably go another route contacting her...like your friend's computers. BTW, think about contacting those friends he has a computer with, he has probably told them a whole pack of lies.

I agree, keep up the carrot part of Plan A which what Doc H has you doing. You may even want to put those emails away and not read them...no need, you know what is going on. Just work on being a team.

I think there will come a time he will be convinced he will be a better teammate, or you will cut him from the team. But that will come later. Right now, it's time to start working as a team. They can complain about you all they want, but there will come a time when you both are really bonding that OW will cross the line in her complaining and he will back you up...then she (and he) will know, whose team he is on...

I understand the belief system thing. Maybe what I am missing is the details about what Dr. Harley says you guys can have together. Maybe I am to slow to understand it so I will trust that you know plex.

We all have belief systems. Athiests too. So What belief system problem causes him to reach out to a bunch of different women for obvious emotional support?
Possibly he has emotional areas that he can't handle and so the Belief system hasn't matured?

So the Team thing was like when we work at McDonalds with someone right? Like when we play sports then? Is Dr H talkin about fairness? Thats a start anyways.

Hope Im not sounding rude Plex

She isn't doing so good now. I'll be meeting with her soon.

I just wanted to thank you all for your responses and support. I think maybe she'll need to go to Plan B soon.

Any further feedback/support would be appreciated!

Plan B is almost always required, as Plan A is usually not enough to end the A and reconcile the M. Plan A is designed to build the foundation for Plan B.

Plan B is both a protective measure for the BS, since they have been suffering unimaginable abuse by being a complete giver in Plan A, and is designed to make the WS realize the absence of the EN met by the BS are not being met by the OP.

Plan B is also designed to prepare the BS for life without the WS. The hope is that the combination of plans will serve to end the A and begin the recovery process. But if it does not, it helps the BS heal and adjust to life with the WS.

I am sure you see also that because change is enevitable <sp> that whether WH complies to what BS asks or not Plan B is part of a Plan to achieve a place of emotional security beyond what was viewed as nessesary before. Its not a time where we patiently wait for life to go back to what was comfortable but a place to reflect on what we need all by ourselves first. Then what we want in our relationships now.
Its all part of growth that we should be able to do without a separation or an affair but thats where the way out is paved with the Bcrap of denial and lies that we blame on the spouse.
Plan B is also a place that we can protect ourselves from all that crap and build our self image back to a healthy place.

Tahts where the forum can help because as we understand to a degree what you are going through, Most of the vets here understand a lot of what happens to ppl at these times. They understand the enemy that attacks the individual and the marriage and know its tactics. They are in the trenchs with you.


Hey Plex we are gonna be here so hang in there.

WH just sent the last email to oW: 42 messages since 5pm

'Good night and hope u have good sleep tonite.. Love u hugs xoxo'

Lost,
Plexle

OW reply: "good nite! hugs love u!"

OK so you have all the convos from them now. Did you get the "pager" service straightened out yet?

It will get better Plex, hang in there

Pleasant dreams

WHAT THE HELL FOR?@!!#!#!@#!#

Plan A does NOT mean ACCEPTING the affair.

Just because the two affair partners refuse to acknowledge they are in an affair doesn't mean there ISN'T one.

If it wasn't an affair, her H would be SHARING his texts to OW with Plexie.

Plan A means being wonderful - but ALSO FIGHTING the affair.

Plexie's H has had NO consequences ALL THIS TIME. It's time he starts to understand his fallout.

BullChit. He can LEARN any consequence he is handed.

He can NOT think it is till the cows come home. But Plexie LEAVING the marriage because of what SHE perceives as an affair is all the proof he needs.

This is true gals,
She can stay and baby him or stand up for herself and let him make his own decision. If he chooses to go and keep getting babied by the other women in his life then at least when he thinks of Plexle he will allways know she respected him for who he could be.

Dr H saw his personality disorder and I am sure it will take time but WH should be given the chance for something better in his life.

Expect more Plex.