If we as parents do not teach our children morals, someone else will (good or bad). We are biblically instructed to "teach our children in the ways they should go" so they will have a LONG LIFE. I would say that dad's adultery -- and now fornication -- is a perfect teaching opportunity about morals.

Furthermore, I believe that tolerance has been grossly overrated. Who says we have to be tolerant? Who says we have to accept what society has accepted as the "norm"? Who says we can't be judgmental? Call a spade a spade? We do our children a HUGE disservice by teaching them to "wink" at blantant sin.

My husband often says, "we blew it in the 60s with 'free love' and America is paying for it now." I agree.

Rant over.

I didnt get through this whole thread yet, but it is a very good topic...I told my DS the truth about OW and WH. I tell DS all the time how much I love WH and I hate what he is doing right now. My DS saw me cry and go through a horrible time when WH left...Me and DS cried together....My WH tell me that this screwed up DS. I didnt cry in front of my DS on purpose...I told DS that I was hurt by what his father did, but I still love him and that is why it hurts so much.

Well DS is not screwed up...WH thinks he is screwed up because DS wants nothing to do with OW....and WH has been put in the position that DS wont see him with OW....Not my decision. Luckily for now WH does see DS without OW. WH thinks I should have accepted A and told DS that we love each other but just cannot live together anymore (NOT).

Me and DS got through this tragedy together...we missed WH, we cried about WH's selfish decision. This is not my fault, WH affair and leaving did this, not me. If my son is hurt or is mad at his dad, it is WH fault, not mine.

The other day my DS said if you could be anywhere right now where would you want to be....I said (from our trip to disney world, my DS favorite ride) on the rafts floating with you around and around all day long. DS said him too. Then I added that it would be nice if WH was there too....DS said "no I dont want him there, he is a jerk".

Now I know that my son loves WH and spends a lot of time with him, so I was shocked when he responded this way...but it just proves that all the fun places and cool toys that WH buys DS, that DS still knows that he left home to be with OW...and I dont want my DS to grow up thinking that it is acceptable to dump your family when you find someone you like better. And cheat and lie in the process.

To me its like OW helped murder my family...I can tell DS that God wants you to forgive, its good when you can, but you dont have to be polite or friendly when you are face to face with the murderer.....Maybe I am a little overdramatic, but that is how I feel.

I think I would just tell DS that if he is angry at OW or wants to kick her (ahh I would love that) to just ignore her, you dont have to be her best buddy, I dont even think he would have to talk to her if he doesnt want to. Just pretend she is invisible if DS wants to.

I think the above poster handled things beautifully. No need to badmouth the cheater. Just explain the facts and the effect it has had on you. The kids will figure it out. Mine did.

I never hesitated to correct their mom's lies about her relationship with the OM and the timing of when it was formed. My kids love their mom. Thye hate that she cheated and they hate the OM.

So totally close to my situation with my WH and DDs. I totally agree with you and imanotherone!

One time Cat. ONE time in 8 months of separation and divorce. One incident does not a pattern make.

SW, your doin the best you can, so dont worry about it....no one is perfect. Your WH did this, not you, and you were blinsided. I made some mistakes with DS also. But I was blinded by pain. Just learn from it and be the best mom you can be, thats all you can do.

I agree with most of this. But, there are many people in this country who are not "biblically instructed" to do anything. They have different beliefs and are fine, good, people.

Wow. Ds is going to his dad's right now (I should be in the car driving!) and I just said the above almost word for word. No anger, no venom...just told him. He came and crawled on my lap. He again reiterated that he didn't want me to feel bad. I told him I DO feel bad, but not over ANYTHING ds has done. That he is totally innocent. That I feel bad that the OW and his dad broke up 2 families and now want to bring ds into the mix and act like it is all ok. I reminded him to be polite. I reminded him that I am not asking him to FEEL any certain way...that I just want him to remember the facts of this situation. It was probably less than a 5 minute conversation...Ijust wanted to clarify it before I drop him off. And I won't bring it up again....will be ready to answer questions. Now that I have Melody's words in my head I have a clear idea of my goal.

I am not hurting and angry and ranting. I don't know where people get that stuff. And Cat thinks I have an unhealthy relationship with my son...she doesn't agree with anything in my lifestyle, AT ALL, so I'm not sure how I can think her advice is objective.

I do appreciate all the help though.

I recently had a talk with my eldest daughter, age 11, along these lines. She was inquiring what it was I objected to about her mom's decision to cheat and go live with the OM.
I told her it was selfish of her mom. I asked her if her mom ever consulted her or the other children about the decision she was making that would cause them to see their Dad about 500% less of the time than normal.
Did she ever ask me or the kids if it was okay that they would live in a run down home with a moronic, beer guzzling, backward baseball cap wearing dork, whose [censored] I could kick on my worst day(Well, I thought about this question, anyway).

I think the question about depriving the kids of as great an opportunity to see me made an impression. My daughter has been having anxiety attacks since the cheating and tyhe breakup of our family. We are going to a child counselor together tomorrow.

You laid this out this perfectly to your son. {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{SmilingWoman}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

I think this was perfect SW. I was trying to caution you before to avoid telling your son how to feel. He needs to figure that one out on his own and he also needs to figure out his own relationship with his Dad.

From one of your earlier posts, I got the impression you had tasked him with ratting his Dad out when OW came over and I was not on board with that. Others here might feel differently. It's not that I ever thought you should just sweep the entire sordid mess under the rug...I was concerned that he was being asked to do something that was not appropriate for a child to do.

I totally agree with the posters who advise you to continue to teach him what is right and what is wrong.

At the end of the day, WxH is still his father. And how that relationship develops will have to be between them.

((SW)) Good job. I think you handled it well. I hope I can conduct myself as well.

OH, I meant to clear this up with you earlier, but there was a lot being thrown at me in this thread. I did not task ds with telling me ANYTHING. I never asked him to spy on his dad or tell me stuff....I have told him he is always free to tell me anything and he tells me A LOT. Most of it I do not tell WXH I even know about....I just listen to ds and guide him. But no, no tasking from me to ds.

SW, hopefully he does tell you everything that happens there. He should be told that he is free to tell you anything and if he sees something that seems WRONG, he is to call you.

I have experienced a CORRUPT father and they can be dangerous to kids. I was taken to bars, strip joints, the bookies, given booze, drugs, etc. I NEVER told my mother either, because I had never been taught right from wrong so I didn't KNOW it was wrong. I was a stupid child who had been taught that my instincts about right and wrong were WRONG. And in my warped little world the only thing WRONG was being "judgmental" [except against Christians] and being an a*shole Christian.

I knew how to baseball a trifecta at the horsetrack by the time I was 10.

Considered a basic skill requirement in Texas, I imagine. Skoal or Coopenhagen considered vegetables servings at school lunch.

shaddup, you yankee dawg!!

My littlest sister, who was closest to my dad, is completely ignorant about basic history. I asked her what she was doing in school and she replied she spent all her time "handicapping horses" when she was in high school!

FWIW, we yankee kids thought every dad rode around puking out the car door while driving with one hand. Any of my brothers and I were welcome in any tavern in town from age 5. We could just go in and ask for free chips or popcorn. A simple trip to buy a newspaper with my dad involved at least 4 or 5 stops at taverns where he would be visiting "clients".