What's progressed to date:

Married 9 years, together 11, 2 kids
DDay 12/3 - 3 month EA, one physical encounter
She left for one week 12/5, NC with OM starting 12/12
We took a family vacation 12/13 to 12/20 to determine course of recovery
Started MC 12/21
Broke NC inadvertently 12/31 when he showed up at mutual friend's home for NYE that she was at.
Broke NC again 1/5 because she needed closure because he was so distraught that she wouldn't talk to him on NYE.
Went NC again 1/5, but broke for 15 minutes on 1/18 to 'end it' in public place at recommendation of MC, no physical NC since, one phone call and one text of the 'are you ok' variety.

Plan A during this entire time, with a modified Plan B starting 1/6. We agreed to LC and to temp separate as I no longer wanted her contacting OM while living in marital home.

I've been home (except for brief business trip) w/ 2 kids, while she's staying away to get head straight.

That's a brief synopsis of our journey to date. All along she's maintained that she still loves me and sees no one else in her future, but that she's confused by the 'feelings' she felt with OM. I've owned up to my part in the disintegration of our marriage and not meeting her ENs. I've successfully implemented plan A for myself and filled her LB by meeting her ENs and I believe that this has had a very good effect on our M. Whether the modified plan B was necessary is debatable. We didn't have complete NC as we have kids, and on occasion we met for lunch or dinner just to 'date' and reconnect. We are both committed (or at least seem to be) to rebuilding our marriage, but I'm troubled by her nagging feelings of whether she can ever lower her wall again to me. She claims that because I wasn't meeting her ENs, she has forced herself not to be 'in love' (such a cliche) with me. I'm sure part of this is rewriting history and justification.

She claims that she no longer has much emotional attachment to the OM and that now realizes that she was addicted more to the 'feeling' that he gave her vs to the person himself. I know that she is rationalizing the text and phone call as not breaking NC because she doesn't want to have guilt (anymore than she already has) over ruining his life as much as ours.

So, my question is, the lease on the secondary residence expires in 2 weeks. Given the progress or maybe lack of progress (here's where I need some objectivity), what should we do? Originally, we were supposed to split time in this residence so that we could both continue to be a presence at home with the children. It so happened, that I was out of town on business, so my time has been limited there. From what I've read, it is never good to leave the marital home, so I will probably insist on not going there the last week (her week is now and I'm home).

The time apart has done us some good as she says she has missed me alot. I'm concerned about whether the NC with OM will stick, although, in my heart of hearts I believe (yes, I'm a sucker), even tho she has broken NC before, it wasn't to perpetuate the A, but to 'end it' which unfortunately didn't stick because of her need of guiltless closure (I know, no such thing). Other than the 1/5 break of NC, she's been above board in notifying me of the phone call and text. Of course, there could be many more and again I'm being fooled.

So, in summary, questions are:

Continue NC/LC with WW or start to taper it off so that we can enter rebuilding?
Trust that NC with OM is occurring (I am being vigilant)?
How bad is the not 'in love' worry and her protective wall?

I'm at the mercy of you experts

Have you considered trying Marriage Builders? They have what is called Plan A and Plan B that should be used in order to a) bust up the affair and b) protect the BS frm the harmful abuse of the affair.


Thats great fogbabble! Can we use that for the famous fogbabble thread?

Be prepared to learn there was more than one physical encounter.

You guys spent NYE apart? Why? Special occasions and fun times should always be spent with each other, not with outsiders. That's because fun times = LB$ deposits and you want those to come from you, not outsiders.

Ditch this MC. Work with the Harleys instead.

I agree you should not leave the marital home. NO WAY should you ever stay at the "second residence". You didn't abandon the marriage, she did.

What do you want?
What does she say she wants?

No biggie. You guys are about six weeks post D-day but only one week of NC. Of course she has feelings for OM. She will until she's been in NC for weeks if not months.

If I were in your shoes, and if WW said she wanted to R the marriage, I would set the bar VERY high. You are in a strong position to set some high standards for her to earn her way home. You want a committed, remorseful wife. You don't want to let her home easily and always be looking over your shoulder waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Some suggestions for her to come home:
1) Have her take a polygraph. Ask her about the "one" physical encounter.
2) Have her sign a post-nup saying if she contacts OM or if he contacts her and she fails to tell you about it, she's out, no custody, no child support, no alimony, no half of the house.
3) She agrees to counseling with a counselor of YOUR choice, for as long as YOU deem necessary. And she must actively participate, doing all assignments and truly working on things.
4) She agrees to answer all your questions fully and honestly, as many times as you need to ask them.

That's where I'd start, anyway.

Honestly I wouldn't worry right now about her feelings for OM. I'd worry more about the repeated breaks in NC and her level of openness and honesty. Her feelings will follow her actions so it's her actions I'd be watching.

Oops.. make that one week since they SAW each other. I forgot about the text and phone call since. The way I see it, ongoing contact is your biggest problem. I wouldn't let her home yet unless I had a post-nup in place like I mentioned before. I don't think she's serious yet.

I agree with the fogbabble comment. There's definitely been alot of rationalization on her part and the MC bluntly called her on it.

As for implementing plan A and plan B are you suggesting that I've not done that? I've been reading MB since early December (only choosing to post recently) and thought I'd been following plan A to the T. Plan B probably not so much and hence my questions.

ok, I apologize for giggling, WCOM, but yours is about the foggiest post I have EVER read from a betrayed spouse in the 10 years I have been here. Do you seriously not understand that the reason your wife wants to stay in another domicile is so she can carry on her affair unimpeded?

Did you hear that? She is not clearing her head. She is getting laid. With your blessing. You are not in Plan A or Plan B and never have been. You are in Plan G for gullible.

Your wife is having a full boat, physical affair and you are calling this "progress." The times you have caught her contacting the OM, you allowed her to spin the story as "getting closure."

Surely you can see that when someone wants to "close" something, they CLOSE it, they don't open it.

No, the biggest problem here is not your wife, Sir, it is YOU. You are aiding and abetting your wife's affair. You are an enabler.

Do you want some help out of this mess?

WCOM, this is Plan A [and the "A" does not stand for appeasement or enabling]:

The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A by Pepperband


The carrot of Plan A

Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.

Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.

Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.

Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.

Stop lovebusting behaviors.

Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.

Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.

Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.

Offering forgiveness and understanding.


The stick of Plan A

Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Plan A is both a *carrot* and a *stick*.

Just to be clear, the phone call and text were initiated by him and she told me about them.

But I get your drift, and if I understand you, take advantage of the situation to outline the course of recovery that I want.

Dr. Willard Harley, clinical psychologist and founder of Marriage Builders:

Adulterers lie. About everything.

Can you elaborate the reason for the separation? Was this idea from the MC?

In reality you all need to spend a minimum 15 hrs togehter.

I second Turtle's question - you all went to different NYE parties? or she went and you babysat?

Just trying to peel a layer of the onion to understand the dynamics of your marriage.

Melody,

I have no doubt that that's a possibility, but let me elaborate. The first week I was there and she was home with the kids. She had no more opportunity to be with him than if we were home together. I talked to the kids every night and she was home.

2nd week, she was there for 2 days and then I went out of town so again she was home. When I returned, she went to her birth home 4 states away to stay with relatives. So, again, no opportunity beyond what she would normally have.

As of now, she is still out of town returning tonight.

Prior to this separation, I did plan A for 6 weeks, so I don't think it can be completely discounted.

I'm all for learning and don't want to appear enabling and maybe I didn't explain the situation thoroughly as far as the separation was concerned. But it is not like she's been living alone for a month and had day to day opportunity to 'get laid' as you suggested.

Yes, but phone records and text records don't which I can collaborate. At least for those two instances. Does that mean she doesn't have a secret sim card or pre-paid. Of course not, and I'm not gullible not to think so. So is it the position to go into this believing nothing, and distrusting everything. What do you start to build on then?

We went to different parties. The separation was my idea initially as I wanted to hasten NC with the OM. Isn't that what plan B entails? Judging from everyone's response, it appears that I erred. If so, how do I right the ship and progress responsibly?

WCOM, there is no reason to separate other than to carry on the affair. Not only does it allow her to carry on her affair umimpeded but it increases the risk of divorce.

Every night you spend apart is an opportunity to conduct her affair in some way, whether it be in person or on the phone, IM, etc. There is no other reason to separate. Dr Harley is right.

My suggestion would be to try Plan A. That means no more separation. That means exposing her affair and no more "closure" nonsense. That means causing as much conflict in the affair as possible.


And please find a qualified counselor. This one is worthless.

Who is this OM? Is he married and does his wife know?

Melody,

Thanks for the advice....As noted, the separation was initiated by me thinking that I should be instituting plan B. My mistake evidently, so now I guess I should end this period of NC?

The OM is a recent friend of a friend. Yes the W knows but unfortunately that's of no help as she was complicit to the A. She's a lesbian and they remain married out of convenience. In effect, it was a way of dumping her own H without the guilt, by hoping he 'found' someone else.

And how do you know she knows and was complicit in the affair? How do you know all this?