This is something that seems to be prevalent in marriages that leads to affairs and general unhappiness.

People expect to have thier minds read when thier ENs are not met as they strugle to please thier mates assuming they know what to do for them.

Of course this could be avoided if the just sat down and spent some time communicating and finding out how each other feels. Many times I believe we start out on the same page but then communication stagnates and we go along,"giving them everything they could have possibly wanted" according to what we think is right, without really knowing, or experiencing together, how we change.


Many times after an affair or a problem comes to a head, we try to do a plan A and the other party has not come to the table or been realistic about what they need. If one gives up and continues to reject the betrayed or seeking to reconcile, many times they just live with the idea that its no use, and feel they are being furthur manipulated by the seeker.MB seems to be part of it. Its really difficult to reach them and find out what they need, or even if anyone can realistically meet those needs anyway.

But what I really find sad is when two people don't spend the time and communicate and go on for years doing what they think,(mindread,assume,knowbetter), is the right thing, and then one day give up and do something dumb like an affair or just continue in what has become a loveless marriage for lack of the proper actions.

I started this thread and have more to add but I have some projects to do so I will add more later. Please give your opinions and insights on this if you have them.

Ok back,

What I am really talking about is how two people can eliminate the sometimes ridiculous expectations they put upon each other in thier marriage by simple communication. How if they sit down and put what they expect from their partner on paper, and hold it up to the light of reality and the real world, they can not only have a healthier marraige, but a healthier life.

That is one of the reasons they get married right? To have someone they can count on to keep them real as you reach for the stars together.

Many romantic relationships which show promise of great benifets and dreams strain when obstacles get in thier way. Sometimes the dreams have realistic expectations, sometimes they don't. If even the most immature of couples can communicate during all the pitfalls of growing up together they can support and love each other as they learn. Sometimes it learning how to achieve realistic and positive goals, sometimes its learning those goals are unrealistic in their nature, but its all about working together and staying together in love when it comes to marriage. Its NOT about changing and growing separately, or even doing everything right all of the time.

Even couples who go through odd phases and certain "kicks" can stay together while they go thru them and be happy as they go. Who cares if they are politically correct or make bad judgements? As long as they can learn together and stay together, they can grow together too.

Too many times we don't share everything with our spouse, or feel we are the lone ranger and must save them from the error of thier ways because we are too stubborn to admit or afraid to discuss how we feel about lifes challanges. Even take stands about what we don't like. Many times the things we don't like are even really issues we should deal with realistically with outside influences of counsellors to sort out whats going on.


Why don't we take it to our mates, then bring in clarification and truth in whatever way works for us before it festers into resentment?

Its probably cuz we thought our partner was going to agree with us and that was what we expected when we got together, that the search for our other half was over, that we didn't have to grow anymore.

I feel bad for the BS who has to do plan A when things got so far out of hand that they have to deal with a wayward. They can only show them how good it could be and tell them thier is a way back from the world they ran away to in fear.

Yup, they ran away, and its a cowards way out, or is it the unimformed and enticed by escapism and the hopelessness they feel person who goes wayward? I know that anyone who thinks running away from thier problems is a solution is foolish, or that lieing or cheating with someone who reenforces that its ok is not freedom like they feel it is, its self-destruction. But to call it anything else but a cowards way out enables the excuse. Excuse=Reason stuffed with a lie.


So what is a plan A without knowing the ENs of the wayward? Do they even know what they want? Besides to run? I can feel sorry for them, but I don't start to respect them till they pony-up and deal with integrity, guts and fairness with their lives or BSs.


Don't they know the vows were for them to have the honor of loving someone and learning how? Marriage is'nt for wussys

CP,

We're here learning about Dr Harley's method for achieving an happy marriage. Many of us have had marital problems, and we have found that the Harley tools deal effectively with those, and create fulfilling marriages.

I'm not sure what kind of response you are looking for. I think everyone here will agree that communicating ENs is essential.

I guess I was re-stating the obviuos and emphasizing that when the communication starts to break down and continues for a great amount of time, it may be difficult to understand what ENs a WS who is being difficult and is also very confused may really want. Especially if they are giving up and/or involved with an affair partner. I think fear plays a large part of that.


I wasn't looking for a specific response, just thoughts on that.