Uh, I am not a veteran and not an expert but I feel strongly about this, so I am going to go ahead...

You need to get out of this situation that had you BORED and also APART from you wife. You need a new job pronto.

Have an open, honest and intimate conversation with your wife. It isn't okay for you to look at porn or look up old girlfriends just because your are bored. It's not "not a big deal" just because you screwed up way worse the last time. Uh, you have to even BETTER boundaries and behavior because you screwed up so badly last time...You aren't getting it and you really need to work on that. This is a separate issue. Are you by chance drinking at all? I know that being alone and bored it's common to have at least one drink...I would abstain completely from even one drink while you are away from your wife. Ignore me if you are already a teetotaler.

POJA with your wife about you getting a new job. Luckily, you getting a non-traveling job is right in line with MB principals. Tell your wife that in order to regain her trust you will be in her sights at all times for as long as takes or forever. Plenty of couples go most of their lives without spending the night apart...

POJA living on less money if you get a different job.

Just make sure that if she balks at living on considerable less, you don't LB. Just work something out. Work two jobs at home if you need to. Does she work? Do you have kids at home? Can she come with you each and every time you travel?

I dealt with trust issues in my marriage as well as travel. Even without trust issues, traveling can destroy a marriage. I don't think you can go out of town for work considering what you are dealing with. At all. End of story.

wanntatry, you are exactly right about the traveling job. Traveling jobs are an invitation an affair. Anything that takes a spouse away overnight is an invitation. Marriage Builders strongly recommends AGAINST traveling jobs. It is not a matter of negotiation, but a matter of extraordinary precautions.

Yep, point is that if you wait till it "feels right" it will be to late. Then you will be one of those "I wish I had listened to.." people.

Be stronger and smarter than most, have faith and really fear what your doing to yourself and your wife, and discipline yourself with the MB principles.

Don't straddle the fence, your not in as safe as you think you are place to not take action. Now is the time.

"At the time, I am missing the connection to it's a lie, it's violating an agreement, it's hurting my wife. Also, I am blaming my wife by saying it's no big deal. Kind of shifting the responsibility of the act from me to her."


The fact is it is NOT an agreement.

You intrinsically know this.

That twinge of guilt that you feel when you go to the porn site, or to look at the OW's facebook page?????

THAT has nothing to do with an "agreement". That has to do with your own self-betrayal. It is your INNER VOICE telling you of the wrongness of your action. That voice has nothing to do with any agreement with anyone but YOURSELF - it is your moral self talking then.

This idea that you have an agreement with an outside entity to do the right thing

is ludicrous.

Doing the right thing BECAUSE it is the right thing is what you have the problem with.


Your justifications and blame-shifting come AFTER you have already decided to do the WRONG thing. After you have made this "justification" that you need to be policed, that there is some sort of "agreement" you are breaking.

In reality, the simple fact is that you know it is wrong - morally - to see the other woman in ANY MANNER, and to be searching for porn because you lack control in this area.


There is no need for external nannies.


Stop the cycle and face the fact that your problem lies within your own desires to have what you want, when you want it, and you want some way to blame SOMEONE ELSE when you are bad.


Now, go read a book that talks about this issue. It is actually written for business people, but quite applicable to your thinking right now: "Leadership and Self-deception: Getting out of the Box" by the Arbinger Institute.


Get yourself out of this box.


SB

In speaking with my wife this weekend, one of her comments/analogies about what I am doing was: I have never hit my wife (never threatened to hit her) nor has she ever felt that I would hit her no matter how heated an arguement could get - why is that, because I would be afraid to hurt her, so.... at some point I made a decision never to do that. The next time I think about looking at porn or the OWs facebook page - it would be like I am hitting her. That thought is easier than everything that has been written and will be the thought that I keep with me when I turn on that computer. Not to say that I don't appreciate everything that is written, but I guess that I am struggling with all of the different comments posted. I will keep posting as my wife feels that I still don't get it, but appreciates that I am trying.

Cant, a big source of your problem is your traveling job. As long as you continue spending the nights apart, you will be vulnerable to an affair. Did you read our comments about that?

If your wife was there every time you turned on that computer in the evening, I betcha you would feel even less inclined to look up the skankyho's facebook page or to look at porn. With someone there to watch you, it is much less likely that you will do these things, including having an affair.

As long as you have a traveling job, this will continue to be a problem for you. The solution is to change jobs VERSUS relying upon will power.

I was out of work for almost 1 1/2 years until I found this job - I wish I could have found something that kept me at home (looking since I got this job, no luck). When I was home, I continued the emotional affair and had times where I had set backs, so while my most recent set back was while away on my job - there have been instances with me around.

Schoolbus made a comment about me desiring to have what I want, when I want it - and I think that sums me up. I know that I need to think before I act - my comment about me about to do something bad is like hitting her - and I think this mental picture puts it in perspective. I'm not saying that this will forever stop me from doing something as I know that I have problems that I have to address, but I think that it will help stop looking at the porn or facebook.

I plan to continue looking for advice within this forum as I feel there are a number of people that could help and I plan to review the material that is available.

The fact still remains that traveling is an invitation an affair. Saying that your EA continued at home does not mean that traveling is less risky, it means that it is MORE risky. Do you know that this is how many affairs start? And since you are already on thin ice and have very poor boundaries, why take such a foolish risk with your marriage?

I am not suggesting you quit tomorrow, but that you start taking your wife with you until you can get another job. Whatever you do, I would be seriously looking for a non traveling job NOW.

I am concerned that you dont have a serious approach at all about your marriage and are still taking very foolish risks.

I hope that your wife is able to see the same red flags the rest of us see. She should feel very unsafe.

Spending time with my wife this weekend, she agrees that I stay with the job that I currently have, but continue to look for something that would allow me to stay home. Her job (2 actually) is not one that would allow her to pick up and follow me to my new location as she has worked hard to build her career.

We both agree that we both have to be more open and honest with our feelings to build an intimate relationship. For me, it means not just to let her know if I made a mistake but to let her know that I considered/thought about doing something that I should not. For her (really this applies to both) it means to share good and bad thoughts about each other. In the past I would share my good thoughts about her but not bad and for her it means that she should share bad thoughts about me, not good. Since I have been in the wrong, I tend to share good thoughts and she tends to share bad thoughts.

We both know that this has to change. I know that for her it will not be easy --> why share a good thought about someone that has lied to you and made you feel worthless through their actions.

The real big red flag to me is the porn and fooling around. It speaks about how you have stepped outside of boundaries of self-respect. Have you dealt with this enough to realize how self-abusive this has become?

I will assume you have rationalized for years as you started to justify those things. Thats how it ussually happens as the relationship degrades. I am not putting you down but I am gonna tell you the truth. It is gonna take some real soul searching and changes even in how you think to turn this around. Believe it or not the porn degrades you and is destructive to you.

Ok, so all I really wanted to say was deal with respecting yourself so you will do the same with your wife. It should be a package deal. You wouldn't hurt your wife because she is a part of you. I know you get that, and you probablly searching for a way fix it.


Hang in there and keep reading and posting, you'll get it but expect some 2X4s leveled at you to correct some shaky thinking on your part. Just look at it as boot camp. I doesn't pay to screw around with your life or your wifes and waste time.

ConstantProcess - By me choosing to go into the "In Private" tab on my PC to view the porn, I made a decision to decive me wife. I knew that by using the "In Private" screen, what I was doing was wrong. The viewing of the porn was not important to me, it was a waste of time. The main thing that I am trying to solve is for myself is - if it was not important to me/a waste of time - then why do it and why go into "In Private" to do it.
Because of this, I have once again shown my wife that I can't be trusted, that lying/concealing/getting my own way is more important to me than having an open/honest relationship and ultimately (if I keep it up) more important than my marriage.
I think that your comment of respecting myself goes a long way towards working towards rebuilding trust and it shouldn't be hard but based off of my past (do good for months, then screw up) it is. Hope I got your point - will keep on working.
Thanks.

Its definately challenging, doing all the heavy lifting while always being the bad person, quilty person, never getting praise, admiration or ANY EN's met etc... Makes it harder coming from such a lonely place. This is why I can understand plan A as it creates an environment where a couple can blossom.

Distancing yourselves to opposite ends of the spectrum makes everything tough but again I guess thats what happens when we dont think about the consequences of our actons.

Keep us updated with your progress

CGIR;

Keep posting. Your circumstance is so very similar to mine, I would give anything to have my husband show insight and humility to face the real problem.

I get blamed, too.
He goes to internet dating sites "just to look"
and the porn.
He gets "religion" and says he will stop.
Until another "boo boo" shows up.
Then he is sorry,
He apologises, and tells me "I am not to ever talk about it again."
Because, he says it is over, it is in the past.
Of course, he says he does the action, but the REASON he does is is because I A, B, C or D'd.
Tells me "why can't I see that he is trustworthy and "a good guy".

Well Barbie sounds like my late wife also with her drinking, esspecially the admition out of guilt and then the not wanting to talk about it.

Its bullcrap isn't it? If She was important, and a part of me and my life, then the behavior and all that goes with it are important. It needs to be dealt with and the behavior needs to be gone IMO.

Why it was there to begin with is really an irrelevant detail, but thier is hope that it can be eliminated thru MB practices. The problem is it IS a BIG DEAL. It makes it hard to trust when people are treating you like your stupid and don't matter.


"Well leave then", I would say at times, when she would get stubborn and argue and I would stand my ground, but what would have worked better is if she went to AA, along with other reality therapy, crap if any therapy.


Sorry a little bit of a T/J but thought if you saw that you can help it, and what your doin with the pron is just escapism, you would see it is your choice.

How does your wife feel about MB? Are you guys working the program? Let us know the details of what you are accually doing with the books or counselling with Dr. H.

Last night I was talking to my wife and I mentioned that by reading this forum and the advice given in my post as well as others (such as yllan) that it is helpful. I said to her that I plan to visit every day and use it as my support group. She mentions that it will probably be like the past, do it for a while, say it is under control and that I don't need to continue and then some time later - slip up again. It gets frustrating to hear that, but in the past that is what I would do. I know that this time has to be different than prior times and I know that to build back trust, I have to show her over time (a long time), but that is my plan.
She also mentioned that it is hard for her to share her feelings/concerns with me, but she has no one else (we are each others best friends, don't really have other close friends). I told her that she should post her thoughts/concerns on this site as I feel that she should use it as her support group as well. Also, I'm thinking that if she has a tough time saying them to me, maybe writing them down and having me view her post might be somewhat effective.
If someone is/has been in a similar situation as us, did you do this or how did you go about addressing this issue - appreciate any all input.

Oh boy... do I understand your wifes position.

Do not have her read your post. You stay off hers. At least at first.

Oh, man. Do you understand what you have done? Seriously? This is not a joke.

The man I know now as "husband" is a 10% shadow of the guy I used to know. Internet dating sites (and his weird beliefs that it is somhow my fault) has ruined my M. He thinks he is a "good guy". I bet you think you are, too.

He is good.. to everyone except me. I can not describe the pain to you.

You need to wise up.

Dere is a similar situation... from your wifes POV.

For 20 years, I trusted him w/o question. The last 4.5 years has been nasty discovery after nasty discovery.


Now I only wish I could get away from him and the pain he causes me daily.

I have tried everything to save this marriage to the man I thought I would love forever. Even the positive stories I read on this site offer me any hope anymore.

I feel trapped. We have a family and a huge house, we would be financially devastated if we divorce. My children would suffer. Candy coat it every why you want-- but financials and responsibilties ARE some reasons some stay married.


He thinks I should not talk about these "issues" and only talk about "good things for the relationship." This is great if you can over look the elephant sitting in the room. Sitting and pooping in your closet.

The absolute worst is that part where it is explained away because of something I DID.

He leaves the house or hangs up if I get angry or agitatied or the conversation is not to his liking. He told me Firday that if I had nothing "nice" to say to him... that I was not to talk to him.

He talks a good story. He believes he is a different person (BETTER MAN) -- and That "all he does is try things to improve his marriage"....

I should mention I found out 2 weeks ago I found the Match.com searches. Again. He has told me he has done this for years....

years.

He does not think it is such a big deal. (because he does not sign up... he just trolls.) He has also told me that I can never speak to him about it again.

I would like to know how.

Your wifes pain is real. The issues can destroy a person. I am sorry if my posts distract from the information you seek. You should know what you are doing to your wife.

You should care about her feelings. Stop being so selfish.

Cant, I hold out absolutely no hope for your marriage unless and until your traveling job is changed and you are home every night. I agree that even a serial cheater can change, but that ain't gonna happen if the environment that led to your cheating is changed.

A serial cheater - ESPECIALLY - should never spend the night apart from his wife. In order to change your habits, you need someone watching you like a hawk every night. Like Dr Harley has stated, traveling jobs are invitation to an affair.

Things will not change unless............things change.

barbiecat,

After a slip up I used to say that I used to be bad, but I know that I am a good guy/getting better. Not after this most recent mistake though.

I know that I have a tendency to not give it my all at work. I know that I don't reach out to my family/friends as often as I should. I know that I don't always meet my wife's need of affection or admiration.

I think I thought about these things and said to myself that a good guy doesn't do these things. I also said that because I am not a good guy, and probably don't respect myself - how am I going to respect my wife.

I know that I have to put in the effort to improve myself as well as my marriage - no more "I am a good guy, I just slipped up"

I know that if I don't come to that realization soon, I'll wake up one day truely alone.

Have your wife start her own thread and you both stay off each others and don't interupt her reality and healing process.

Get a job that you can be home every night, even if you have to flip burgers, sell your house and live in an apt.


Your right, you might end up alone if you can't be better than a best friend to her that goes back on your commitments that marriage vows involve.


Have you looked into the bible and what they are? I would be honest with myself if I were you and stop thinking the way you do and start doing what you should be, no excuses, you know what I mean.

As mel has said before and many people who have found themselves in trouble have learned, your best thinking got you where you are. When you take responsibility you realize actions will be nessesary for others to SEE that you have changed how you respect them, and love them, appreciate them, cherish them, forsake all others for them. See where I am going?

If you have the guts to look beyond what you think is love, and will learn what it is, by faith and trust, you can grow beyond this.

Dont think about it, DO it.

Prayin for ya