I feel like my parents should address some of the issues she has raised as this is the first time she's even talked to them since I found out about the affair

There's no restraining order...i'm assuming I would be notified as well

Arguing with her would be pointless.

BTW: I loved my crazy ex fiance too. I'm eternally grateful I never married her.

I also loved my wayward ex. Glad she's out of my life as well.

Love isn't enough. The question for you is this:

Where do you stand on issues that truly matter? (Such as religion, kids, parenting philosophy, ideas on marriage, roles of men and women in marriage, etc.)

Those are the things that are the glue that keep a marriage strong and together.

Being married to a woman who feels it's ok to have lots of male friends (my ex W) or who wishes to experiment sexually with women (my ex fiance), or who wants bad boys (ex fiance), are not good marriage material or are issues that require massive changes in ways of thinking.

Just giving you food for thought. Love is not enough. Love is a feeling, but more importantly it is a choice.

Feelings come and go. There will be moments you love your W more than she loves you and vice versa, but staying married and preserving principles in that marriage are a choice.

Hence you have the principles outlined by MB, such as radical honesty, ENs, etc.

Nothing in that note that can't be overcome. She is obviously mad, but you knew that was coming. Work on yourself and give her a couple of weeks.

That's one of the things that bothers me a lot. Our values and opinions on those things are pretty much the same. No problems with religion, both wanted kids, hadn't really discussed parenting philosophy, ideas on marriage and thoughts on roles of men and women in marriage were the same.

I truly believe if the affair never happened (although she states otherwise), we would still be living together working through our problems.

I'm assuming you mean the complaints about me. That's what I and my family tried tell her a month ago (before we knew about the affair), but she kept saying to my parents "you have no idea how I feel"...we all agree this can be worked through

You're right! Its her way of rationalizing this horrible thing she did. And because you aren't a total pr*ck all the time she has to sling whatever you did do out of scale to make it look bigger.

You aren't perfect, neither am I - but dudes don't spend 500 hours talking to strangers on some website working on their marriages if they don't love the girl that screwed around on them.

Make this work any way you can, be smart about it and you might just pull it off.

ABC,

Please understand that I say things to challenge you. You really must challenge your views on your own marriage. You may not see the problems because you are too emotionally involved and close to the situation to see the reality.

I recommend you ask a friend or family member to give you an honest to God look at your own marriage. People often see dynamics you may be oblivious to. For example, they may not like the way she talks to you. Or they may not like the way she talks to other men. Or they might have issues with the way you addressed her and the fact that you may have been oblivious to her discomfort in how you treated her.

For example, you may have thought you were simply kidding about something and that it would be taken that way, but your wife may have silently been hurt badly by what you considered �joking�.

I say this because I see it all the time in guys. We have a problem with seeing what we wish to see and get caught off guard when the wife walks away. We act surprised that she did so, but the reality is that the problems were there in front of us the whole time and we simply didn�t see them or we dismissed them.

How often have we heard a complaint from our wives and simply said, �It�s a phase she�s going through� or �That�s nonsense. That�s not reality� or �It must be that time of the month. She�s being hormonal.�

Guys are often dismissive of things while women often internalize the problems or stew over the issues that were brought up and were subsequently dismissed.

It�s a Mars/Venus thing. Men think, �She�s not complaining, so things must be ok� while women are thinking, �Why can�t he see how unhappy I am about this situation?!�

I�m generalizing, but I think there is a lot of truth to this which is why soooooo many men come here and are �surprised� by problems that existed right in front of their faces the whole time and they didn�t take action on.

The issues which led to the affair are going to have to be tackled if you are going to have any chance at all at saving your marriage. They�re going to have to be tackled regardless, even if you don�t save your marriage, or you will be doomed to repeat them in a future marriage.

Love is not enough and you need to take a good hard look at the big issues in your marriage. I was compatible with my ex W on many thing, but the big ones are the ones that I feel contributed to our downfall. She had no belief in God, which I didn�t think was a big deal at the time, yet it was critical in her value of our vows.

She liked having guy friends. I didn�t think it was good to have female friends while married.

I had very strict boundaries on my interactions with women. She didn�t.

I had strong beliefs about bearing the burden of parenting and not relying on nannies. My ex was the opposite and left the bulk of the childcare on our nanny or parents.

These were all things I felt we could work through, but they were all in one way or another cancers that ate away at the foundations of our marriage and led to her straying.

So these were BIG things I kept in mind when dating again. If you rebuild your marriage, you will have to tackle these issues. If you date again, you have to tackle these things.

Think about it.

ABC,

1. sending threatening emails
2. airmailing them worried for his life
3. contacting my work .... my colleagues new and old .... the
4. and this lawsuit

Sounds like you are teaching her what to do when OM goes on to cheat on her. Bullies don't like it when their marks fight back either!

God Bless
Gamma

LostDads: I appreciate you challenging me. What you say in your last post all applies to me. There were many times I was kidding about stuff that now I can see my wife took personally. I was definitely caught off guard. There were many times she would get angry and I would ask her if it's her time of the month. In the end I do believe our values and beliefs are similar enough that if we get through this we would work out. She is a very very sensitive person (should have known that before this but maybe just ignored it), so I would definitely watch what I say and do.

The only thing that my parents used to say is that she isn't open about her feelings, her likes and dislikes, so they were always very careful around her.

wife sent me following email tonight...made me really sad..please advise:

stop emailing me, my family, my friends, OM's family. this relationship is over. i will never get back with you ever. you are doing so many crazy things like contacting work, contacting my family, hiring a PI against me. My parents will NEVER EVER allow me to get back with you. my family and friends now are telling me they never even liked that we were together and are happy that i am not longer with you. your actions are proving what kind of person you really are and it is the kind of person i should have never been with in the first place, a controlling crazy person who still has to get his own way. if you do not stop i will make sure i get another restraining order to stop you from contacting my family and friends. Even if I am alone for the rest of my life I would never get back together with you. I'm sure that is what you are trying to do by ruining my life. and religiously our marriage is already over! don't ever contact me or my family/friends again. and stop using other email addresses to people who have blocked you. there is a reason why they are blocking your emails. OUR MARRIAGE IS OVER FOREVER! i suggest you move on. and actually get advice from real people instead of these so called "experts" from these stupid internet forums

Sounds like something i heard once....

oh yeah ... my ww said that stuff to me once... it was a bunch of crap.

I'd say that if exposure is complete... your next letter is probably a plan B letter.

Just think about something ok? You seem like a stand up guy, imagine how hard its going to be for the POSOM when he has to deal with your WW's emotions and needs?

Think about how her fantasy image of this guy is going to unravel the first time he doesn't live up to her built up image of him? You think you step on toes then? wait til he completely blows it because he just jumped into someone elses marriage with no concern but his own.

I'd say be quiet, write your plan B letter and make sure you have your lawyer be the pitbull your paying him/her to be.

If im wrong here, someone feel free to correct me.

It means that exposure is working. The affair is in danger and she is very angry about that. She's probably lying about her parents.

All these "crazy" things she mentioned are nothing compared to her cheating, remember that.

abc098, do you have a plan? I hope your WWs babble didn't scare you away?;-)

Fog-babble.
I wouldn't respond back to this because you'll just get into a back-and-forth that will accomplish little with a wayward. The only thing I would say if I were you is that you will do whatever it takes to save your marriage.

(She can't get a RO against you on behalf of all her family and buddies. Ignore that.)

No, your M isn't over, 'reliously' (whatever that means) or otherwise.

Our marriage is over "religiously"?

Really?

I didn't know that God had the standard of, "I do, until I feel like being with someone else."

Sorry, religiously she's committed adultery, which is a mortal sin punishable by an eternity in he11 for no repentance for it.

Everything you've just been fed is fog babble. Let her rant. If anything, the rant is showing effectiveness of your actions.

Don't believe what she says about her family, either. The reality is probably different.

Regardless, time to go to Plan B/D.

That means write your letter, and then sic your lawyer on her.

Her babble reminds me of things I heard. My WXW justified her actions by telling herself that she was already divorced in her head, so she could be with other men and date around. No one told me, but that was enough justification for her.

Waywards tell themselves anything they want to justify what they are doing.

Personally, I think you should be grateful this immoral cheat is out of your life. I know you don't feel that way right now, but you will eventually.

Ask your friends and family for an honest to God observation about your marriage and about your WW.

Standard WW anger at letting the world know that she is cheating.

Don't respond to these emails. Fight the urge to debate these things.

I haven't really even done plan A yet though...there haven't been any carrots..just stick of exposure

The chance for the carrot will come.

she actually did file a restraining order against me because i sent the email to her workplace....

What I posted was that she can't file a restraining order against you on behalf of anyone but herself. If her parents or other relatives want to file an RO against you they'll have to do so themselves.

Tell me about the RO she filed against you. Did you have to appear in court regarding this? What happened there?