Good evening! I apologize in advance b/c I know this will be long. Been reading for a few weeks but just now decided to post.

My husband and I have been together for 16 years (married for 12)- we married young, we are now 34 & 35 and have two girls (8&9). I caught my husband corresponding with an escort in early April (we have had many issues over the years regarding porn- chat rooms- EA's, inappropriate relationships etc). When I confronted him about it I was angry and asked him to leave the house. He readily agreed. He went to stay with his mom and returned 2 days later after agreeing to attend marriage counseling. His attitude at this point was not one of sorrow or remorse- he was actually pretty defiant and told me that he had not been happy for many years (and that the porn and escort were his way of acting out) and that he wasn't sure he wanted to be married any more and that in fact he knew I would find the escort info and had purposely left it there so I would find it and end the marriage because he didn't know how to. He said he would enter the MC with no promises (maybe we would stay married, maybe not).

The first two times were really helpful. The MC said that she felt there was a lot of hope for us - and that we were moving quicker than she normally saw. We quickly uncovered many hurts from our past (both from our marriage as well as from our childhood). I found out that my H stepfather had been very emotionally and at times physically abusive to him in his early years. He would be punished over the smallest of things. Needless to say it came out that a lot of my behavior (controlling nature) and the way I handle conflict reminded him of his SD. One of the ways he learned to deal with his SD was to lie and escape to his fantasy world. That same coping mechanism continued to our marriage. He found himself not expressing his true emotions or being honest with me for fear of making me unhappy or causing an argument. Over time he realized how unhappy this made him and how much he resented me and began withdrawing from me, engaging in activities that he knew would hurt me and overall just not communicating his true feelings. According to him he has not been happy for the last 6 years of our marriage.

Problem is , I never saw any of this. He put up a great facade. We never had any true arguments (now I know why), the only time he would tell me that he was unhappy or that I was controlling is when I would catch him in one of his acts (EA, online porn chats etc). Because that was the only time he brought it up I just assumed that it was his excuse - his way of deflecting blame on me. Sadly I lost all sense of trust and respect in him. Unfortunately we never went to counseling back then.

On a day to day basis we seemed fine. We laughed, talked , spent time together and considered ourselves best friends. But the intimacy was gone- and while we had sex it was not very often (I wanted, he didn't, I blamed it on his porn habit).

I was always the one to throw around the D word when I caught him in one of his acts- no matter what I did (and I will admit and can see now where I had bad emotional behavior) he never once threatened me with a D. So when all this went down in April I knew he was serious.

First 2 weeks of MC - great- great conversations, interactions & sex in the days after the sessions. By the 3rd week out of the blue I could sense him withdrawing again- when I pushed for answers we ended up in an argument. That weekend he left home again (stayed with his mom) and came back on Monday. We missed our MC that week. That same week (May 5th - the day before my birthday) he seemed fine but said he was going out with a long lost friend that night (not like him)- told him good have a great time. At 10:00 that night got a text saying he was spending the night with friend too drunk to drive (def not like him)- I was pissed. I texted him , he didn't respond until 2AM to let me know he was safe and OK and would talk to me in the AM. I knew in my heart he had been with some woman that night but he denied it. However he was very emotionally distraught (he didn't want to be alone, didn't know what was wrong with him, even briefly threatened suicide). He stayed the next two nights (missing my birthday) at his moms and came home to me on Mothers Day. Told him I couldn't take the constant coming and going (he's never done this before). Said he wouldn't do it again and if he did it was because he was ready to ask for a Divorce.

That week went great- laughing, talking (no sex though) etc. Weekend went well. By Monday he left and has been gone ever since (almost a month). Now during that week I had found out that yes on that night before my birthday he had been with an escort and I confronted him in a very nice , calm manner. Told him I knew, that I forgave him and that if he would agree to go back to marriage counseling then I still wanted us to work it out (he was confused by my kind approach - very different than the past). Said the experience made him feel very empty and alone and he knew then that he had reached rock bottom. After that initial conversation I never brought it up to him again that week. Sadly at the end of the week I started thinking about it more and on Sunday evening I created a profile on an adult dating site where she advertised strictly so I could see what she looked like (why? I don't know). Well H checked my email the next day (he has access to mine, I do not have access to his)- said that while he was away working hard I was out looking at dating sites - I told him why I did it. He just said Oh. That afternoon he came home and said he realized that he didn't have the right feelings for me when he saw I went on that site and didn't feel the least bit jealous or upset. And then he left.

I went to IC that week (the same MC) and she encouraged me to confront him about several other lies I knew about as well as push for disclosure. That week he admitted to me that he had slept with the same escort twice in May (close together), another escort when we lived in Florida (around the time our problems started), another one when we returned to TN and that he had engaged in 2 emotional affairs (one that led to kissing but nothing else).

To give full disclosure- I engaged in my own EA almost 7 years ago online with an old HS BF that lived half way across the country before we moved to Florida - and while I admitted this (he didn't know I just came out and confessed and cut it off), I have traced the real beginning to the downfall of our marriage to this time. I was going through a very selfish , post partum induced depression/ time period where I made a lot of bad decisions for our family and basically forced him along (moving to FL, buying an overpriced house, filing bankruptcy, making him leave a job he loved, having my own EA etc)- he never stood up to me and said no to any of these choices because he didn't want to upset me and cause conflict. At the time I didn't know he wasn't onboard with what was happening.

So present day:
-MC brought out a lot of past hurts , at first we were dealing with it OK but then it hit us both like a ton of bricks
-My husband is and has been living in a hotel for the last month
-He comes by the house every night - when he does we have good conversations- he eats dinner with us- and we have started doing activities together with the kids on Saturday
-We both realize we have inflicted a lot of pain on one another over the years
-I am optimistic that now that we recognize this (I never understood how controlling I was until all this happened nor did I realize how unhappy he was), that it can be fixed if we both want it to
-I have said I want to change and am willing to do whatever it takes, I have been reading all the books, websites and have started implementing change - working on making me a better person, being a nicer and accomodating person, giving him his space, trying to show him that I can make this a safe and secure relationship for him where he can openly communicate with me
-He says he has noticed the change and is watching me but that he will not come home right now and still is not 100% sure the marriage will work
-He tells me that he has the dream that we need to divorce - the old marriage is dead and that it needs closure and that maybe once that happens we could start over (I don't feel we need to go thru a D just to start over- I will agree the old marriage was toxic and a new relationship needs to be built).
-I am trying to be strong- but him not being here is very hard on me (my big emotional need is honesty and security)- how do I know where he is and what he is doing? Every once in a while I break though and I tell him calmly that if a D is what he wants then I will comply and not fight it , but then he gets emotional and says hes not sure what he wants
-I have been told the old lines of "I love you, I'm just not in love with you". "I checked out years ago", "It is not about anyone else . I just need my space, I just need to feel like being with you can be a safe place for me and I just don't feel strong enough yet".
-Based on our history, I have pictured him shacked up with escorts, random hook-ups etc, he has sworn over and over again that is not the case- that he realizes what he was doing was not getting him anywhere and was unhealthy. He swears he is working all the time or crashing by himself at his hotel. He did start a new high stress management job the month before all the stuff started.
-In the beginning when I cried, begged and pleaded it did nothing. But since I have stopped begging he has been more receptive. He has slipped up lately and said "I love you" , he has started giving me hugs (although he asks for permission), he calls or texts me about his day thru out the day - at night though after he leaves our house around 7:30 or so he doesn't call or text me like he does during the day. When I asked him about this he said he wasn't sure why that was- other than he either was working or that was his wind down time for his thoughts.
-He has been opening up more (sometimes it is hard for me to handle his newfound honesty)
-He says that right now is about him, and learning who he is and becoming stronger. Says he is not interested in anyone else right now and said that he promised when he was ready to "date" again I would be the first person he asked out
-Said he wants things to work out with me but is scared of the past repeating itself
-Told me yesterday morning that he felt the strong urge to come home the night before but didn't because he felt like he just needed more time- we werent ready
-One minute he tells me not to give up hope, hang in there, etc but then the next he says he doesn't want to lead me on, that he still can not make any promises.
-I was telling him about marriage builders last night and he actually asked if he could do the questionnaires (LB's & EN's) and if I would send him my responses as well (this was a BIG step for him as he has been resistant to look at any of the programs)

***I actually tend to believe him that there is not someone else - I do think that we BOTH caused tremendous damage to each other over the years and that we needed this separation to work on ourselves a bit. I sense that it is important for him to feel like now that I know all of his past secrets that I won't use them against him or as a way to control him. I have let go of what happened bc I view those as just bad events that were just symptoms of a bad marriage not the cause of the break up.

But I am afraid I messed up big time today. He came by this morning to visit briefly, nice short chat, he hugged me and then he actually said I love you (first time in weeks)- he caught himself and looked shocked and I think the fact that he said it and the overall positive information he has been giving me these last few days kind of freaked him out. He didn't call or text as much today, then this evening he said he could only stay a bit bc he had a ton of work he had to get back to the office. He seemed a tad bit withdrawn or stressed (hard to tell right now). Either way, it put my magical thinking into play and my old insecurities came into play. I used my moms car and went on a recon mission this evening. Hes been telling me that we works til 10 or later most nights and then goes back to his hotel. Up until yesterday I did not know what hotel hes been staying at but he used my GPS this weekend and forgot and put the address in. So he left here at 7:30, I went by his office at 9 (he's not there), went by his hotel (not there), scoured the Applebee's and other close by bars (not there), corner strip club (not there)- back to office (not there), back to hotel (not there) for 3 hours I did this. Finally came home and texted "So, what did you do this evening?", knew it came across wrong and called him. He was borderline angry and defiant. Said he wasn't doing anything wrong but that this is why we were seperated bc he knew I would never change - and even though he wasn't doing anything wrong he didn't want to be made to feel like he was. Said that he had gone to the office, then grocery store, Red Box, then stopped at Applebee's then hotel (across the street from AB's)- the problem I have is that when I talked to him I had just been at the applebees and hotel not 10 minutes before and never saw his car at either place. When I mentioned this he got angrier- said I could believe what I want and if I was so concerned why didn't I get my daddy to stroke me a check to hire a PI- said I should bc they would just prove there was nothing to find. I talked him down from his anger and tried to explain my POV. That I have always been an insecure person with trust issues - that it has been hard for me to go a month and using blind faith to trust him, and while he could gauge whether or not I was changing what measures did I have in place to prove that he was telling me the truth, that he was asking me to believe him just because he said it was the truth (when honesty is one of the major issues we have had in the R). He seemed better by the end of the convo, but said that he was sad bc he felt like this was a set back and that it just made him doubt even more that I would ever really truly change.

I am trying my best- I must have been doing something right these past couple weeks bc I was noticing a big change in him coming around to the idea of reconciliation. I just can't get over my hurt and insecurity that he won't come home. And it seems like when we're on the brink of a break thru I do something to sabotage it. I don't mean to, I want this to work and I want to be a better and trusting wife. But I also don't want to feel like I am a doormat. That I am just standing back choosing to believe everything he says while in reality giving him one last summer to sow his wild oats.

He says he needs to see consistency in me (do I want to work on it, do I not, do I trust, do I not). That he needs to see that the changes I have implemented (and am still working on) are real and not an act. Said he doesn't want any mind games, manipulation or ultimatums, just wants to see the genuine me and me see the genuine him and us determine if those two can indeed love each other.

I guess I just feel like I am working so hard to fill his LB and make him feel safe and secure but that I am not necessarily getting the same in return - and maybe that comes in time.

Sorry for the long read- any thoughts or suggestions or feedback is greatly appreciated. really I just needed to rant rather than send him some long emotional email tonight. I am hoping the little spy act I pulled tonight has not pushed him away completly. But why can't he see that I need reassurances too?

Thanks for reading.

It seems that much trust has been broken over the years. It sounds as though you both want to get it back but given all you describe, this will necessarily be a longterm process, and you probably shouldn't worry about day to day progress and try more to look at the long term. I wonder about your personality styles - is he quieter, more acquiescent than you? Could this be an issue in terms of why has sought distance? Just a thought. Hang in there.

Hi and sorry you're here.

Please click the notify button and ask the moderators to move your thread to the 'surviving an affair' forum. That's the better place for you to get help.

Also, please find a way to summarize your initial post into 3-4 short paragraphs. Most folks around here aren't going to sift through a long post looking for relevant facts. Things like:

- married 12 years, together 16
- ages 34 & 35
- 2 daughters ages 8 & 9
- you had an EA 7 years ago that was never recovered from
- he has confessed to being with 3 escorts and 2 EA's
- he has a porn habit and profiles on dating sites
- he is in and out of the house

Does that about sum it up? Again, sorry you're here, but you're in the right place.

I agree about moving the thread over to Surviving an Affair, but not so much on shortening the post, you have a LOT of information in there that the veterans on that forum can use to help.

I truly believe that if you BOTH are wanting to save the marriage, and you are BOTH willing to jump 100% and more into MB and do exactly what is required, that you can indeed, save your marriage.

But....(isn't there always one?)

Coming from a marriage that is in the process of divorce now, with a serial cheater, my question to you is this. Is your husband (and you as well) 150% willing to go totally, fully, without a hesitation with creating transparency and honesty and openness in his life, where you know every move he makes, every account, password, open phone for checking, gps, you name it, (my husband referred to it as a ball and chain around his (BEEP) and I wasn't even pushing it to be honest, he was far more creative in finding ways to sneak than I was in knowing how to catch it).

Without that, I don't see where you have a chance, once that trust is broken, especially repeatedly, it's an amazing feat to get it back for most of us. One slip up can set us back to day one.

Your story sounds alot like mine, in many ways, and it took me a long time to realize that the main reason I stayed, over and above the fear of living life with a disability, was that I really did not like the person I was, and how I was accepting the garbage in my life and did not know if I would ever find ME again....not to mention the depression I was in was horrendous. I have only recently (2 months or so) have become that person I always knew I could be, that I wanted to be, and there is no way in this world I would EVER go back to that kind of life, even though odds are good I'll never be in another relationship again, it's the price I am willing to pay to be able to say I love who I am today.

Again, if you are both in this with full committment, then it is possible to save your marriage. Without that, I don't see it happening. It takes two.

Hi SL
I am so sorry you find yourself in this situation, I am not a vet here but I would suggest that you do take him up on the suggestion he made and hire a PI, as most people will tell you on here when you get the ILBNILWY speech there is a 90% chance there is an ongoing affair.

The other thing I would suggest that you consider a plan b, this plan consists of having no contact with your WH until he is ready to work on your marriage and commit to the marrige, this plan is also good for you as it gives you the space to work on yourself like you want to and at the same time protects you an him from furtherr love busting. The vets can tell you more about plan B but if I was in your shoes thts the way I would go.

Bump. Is anyone going to help here?

SlowlyLosingIt, welcome to Marriage Builders. You will probably get more help if you cut that back to about 3 paragraphs and take the (sorry long) out of the title - that is a sure fire way to make sure people don't read it. We don't need that much information to get it. Check out this thread

Slow, Wow long read. I suggest you cut down the post some. But let me tell you first his childhood is the past. It has no bearing on the choices he makes as an adult. Firstly drop all that as it doesn't justify anything.
Secondly lets get to the meat. Trust unfortunately is something we can never afford our spouse. Given the right circumstances we all will have an affair. If he is upset that you are snooping there is usually something to uncover. Also remember if a way-wards lips are moving they are lying.
I suspect an Affair here. Not being transparent and him leaving, along with most of your description screams A to me. Most Men dont walk out on there family without something under there wings. Women too so not just men.
But by large there are so many Red Flags of typical Wayward babble. "its about me" "i need to find myself" "im not sure if I want to reconcile"."new Job = new contacts"
First you need to find the real deal out. SNOOP or hire a PI. Because IF,and I suspect there is an A you are on the road to a D.
Once you know for sure there is or isn't an Affair going on then and only then can you move forward.
In the mean time proceed as Plan A. Quit love busting. Read everything on this site. Order Harley's books.
Oh and Im sorry you have found us BUT you are in the right place