Ummm, do you have any statistics to back up your statement?

I'd suggest that you read the following.

Living together before marriage, Part 1

Living together before marriage, Part 2

What is it like to be married after living together, Part 1

What is it like to be married after living together, Part 2

What is it like to be married after living together, Part 3

I personally don't know a single married couple who didn't live together prior to being married. Again, what constitutes living together? If you routinely stay at the other person's place until midnight but go home to sleep, I guess you're ok.

Its not a "myth" at all. Those marriages have an 80% higher rate of divorce so it has nothing to do with "personal beliefs" but has everything to do with bad habits developed while shacking up.

Living Together Before Marriage: Compatibility Test or Curse?

Additionally, most domestic violence occurs in shack up situations or marriages that started that way:

For the record, I am not planning on cohabitating with this women or any woman until I am divorced which may be as soon as 2 or 3 months from now.

I have done alot of self examination on the rebound thing. I still feel strongly that due to the lengthy deterioration of my marriage, and the spiritual awakening that I have experienced that my heart is free to love. I was feeling free and whole and happy before this thing began.

I was not looking for this and frankly would not have allowed it were it with a local person. This began through a friend's introduction with the only intention of having a possible friendship. From that, an amazing connection of intellect, spirit and heart began.

I will not walk away from this person without seeing where it may lead. I did not go into this a desparate, lovesick puppy.

All conventional wisdom would say this is a rebound. I have utmost respect for you Pepperband and you too MelodyLane (ya Beatles freaks). I cannot say that there are absolutely no threads of a rebound woven into this, but by and large she and I are two healthy people having a serious look at each other.

-pdc

Just be careful, my friend!!!

Premarital sex, if you ask me. I'm not sure if Dr. Harley defines it that way or not.


Wow. Sounds like a great opportunity to define a new, better normal for the next generation.

Thank you Mel, I will. Worst case and this turns out a heartbreak, after what I've been through and where I am spiritually, I can handle it. My completeness comes from within, not from a relationship.

....and Pep, my kids are all for this.

DITTO

Thank you Pep.

You people on this site helped me cope and find my way through the hardest thing I have ever experienced, in a big way.

Like I stated in the title of this thread, I am amazed that something so beautiful could come into my life so soon. I am clearly in an emotional affair, but I am also clearly separated from my stbxw in my heart.

I respect those who find the establishment of a new relaionship while still legally married wrong. I thought I had barriers in place for this not to happen yet.

My situation is a bit different than most. I don't say that to justify. I am where I am now, and my heart is full. The woman I am involved with used the term regarding someone else, "an adventure of the heart" and that is what this is. A wonderful adventure.

-pdc

pdc, yes, your situation is a bit different. But, you know what? It's not different enough.

It didn't bother me very much until I saw where you said that you are clearly separated from your stbxw in your "heart." That's EXACTLY what my WXH thought during our divorce.

As far as he was concerned we were done so he felt no compunction about introducing the OW to some of our children. They were horrified, and it damaged his relationship with them even further.

For the sake of your children, and in respect of THEM and what they've been through, you need to cool it with your emotional affair until after your divorce is final.

Put your attention on them. I hope some/all of them are in counseling. I hope YOU are in counseling.

Thank you Kirby,

Every one of my children including my 14 year old son knows I have a "friend", and each has enthusiastically encouraged me in this. Just last night my son with a mature beyond his years smile said, Dad I want you to be happy. This was in regards to my telling him I was going to have a video chat with my friend. I asked him how he felt about it.

I and they have appropriate support. Thank you so much for your concern.

-pdc

Well, I think that tells us all how easy it is to fall into this affair trap doesn't it?

Ahhh pdc, I wish you had slowed this down from the start. Please be careful.

To be totally honest, as I read thru these posts of yours, there was one thing that kept coming to mind. One question I found myself asking, each time I read thru these.

"What drugs is he on? I want some".

Then it hit me, are you on anti depressants? Those could well give you the feeling that you have your WW out of your heart when she in fact, is not. And the feeling that all is golden in this relationship. Just an idea. I worry about you, what can I say.

NSZ,

Thank you also for your concern. You have been a kind voice on this board.

The only drug I am on is discovering "presence", that is to say finding the place inside myself that is aware of "now". This involves an awareness of life as it occurs, paying attention to what is truly before you at this moment. In doing this escaping the incessant internal commentary that goes on inside our heads, see and hearing what is before us as it truly is, not the "stories" we tell ourselves about it. This is a dicovery of who I really am, and who others are at the core.

There is so much more to say on that subject, but not here. Suffice it to say, I have found peace, and am able to face life as it occurs, and to see it for what it is, to find the beauty in what comes.

Just to temper the above statement, it is a process and one that I am growing in.

I don't think this is the same mindset that allows one to enter into an affair although I can see how from the outside it could look like that. (were my marriage not conclusively over, my barriers would have allowed none of this)

All in all, I am quite happy, and not because I have found a love. That just adds to what was and is already there.

-pdc

I will say one more thing on the subject. Keep in mind that relatinships that begin as affairs have a slim chance of survival.

I see someone who is admitting that they are wayward and then saying they are different. Hmmmm, I think I have heard that somewhere before.

Take care and take care of those children. I hope they don't get confused about marriage and affairs.

Really? Truly? Or is this wishful thinking?

[edit]

Your family has been through a major trauma.

Healing takes time, and you have not had enough time to heal.

My good friend tried to create an account and post here. He had some difficulty and asked that I publish his post for him.

Here it is:

"Well this post serves as my first to the MB site, and it is posted from a very unique perspective regarding PDC.

I first met the now incarcerated wife before her affair with the boy. Out of the blue I called PDC one evening. Since that time we have walked through fire together, providing mutual support and creating what I believe will be a friendship that will last a lifetime.

In the last six months this man has become more of himself, come back to himself, allowed himself to emerge from a cave into the day. His visage has changed from burdened to relief. I have been amazed by his resilience.

While I do not have a "before" reference point with the children, I do have a "during" reference, and see them frequently. The youngest is now engaging me in conversation and does not have the dark cloud over his head. He, like the other children are grieving the loss of their mother, but they all seem relieved. PDC invests time with them, and is a loving parent.

As to his new friend, I found myself saying some of the same things to him that have been posted here. I care for this man as a brother. It seems soon. The ego can use feelings to mask grief. Wait for the divorce. But when riding a big wave in to shore, once it curls you got to go with it. He is happy. I enjoy seeing him happy. I support him in the decision to continue to "chat" with her.

Our friendship continues to strengthen as we work on some mutual projects. His new friend has not created distance in our communication. We talk just about every day and from what I can tell this new relationship seems healthy. Is she the "one?" Who knows. That he brought this change in his life to this forum speaks well of his character. Got your back good buddy."

I haven't read through the entire thread, just the beginning but it seems you're getting the cart before the horse...get divorced and THEN date.

I only say this because I've basically been where you are, and I'm hoping I can make a small dent in your myopia:

A 50 year old man should know better. You are in a rebound. What do you not understand about that? It doesn't matter what you think, how you feel, or what your friends say. It is what it is, and nothing is going to change that.

I honestly wish you the best, but I know where you are headed. This relationship will crash and burn. You are headed for a couple years' worth of ups and downs AFTER your divorce AT LEAST, and it's a ride you haven't even started yet. In 2 years you'll hardly remember this woman, and if you learn anything from the experience you will consider her a rebound.

I know you don't want to believe it. What you have is "special". It transcends labels. You were meant to be with her all along. Blah blah blah. Been there, done that. So have the vast majority of all people who re-enter the dating world after getting out of a bad marriage.

Time to stop farting rainbows and realize that when you've eaten crap for so long, a Saltine cracker seems delicious...is that what you're going to settle for, or do you think maybe there's something a little better on the menu if you'd TURN THE PAGE AND CHECK IT OUT?

Krazy71,

You seem to be so certain. I don't deny that some rebound threads must be woven through this.

Just because many or even most take the given path called rebound does not mean all are cetain to as you seem to expouse.

I don't mean to insult you but you speak as though you are a prophet and that valid exceptions cannot occur because you have been there and you know. Do you think there has never been a "rebound" that has gone on to flourish into a beautiful future? Do you forget I am armed with Marriage Builders tools to employ?

At the risk of sounding arrogant, I and my friend are both exceptional people with our eyes wide open (yes they're also a bit blinded by love). We may or may not be the life partners that we are looking for, but we can surely find out.

There will no doubt be "rebound" characteristics employed especially by me, there already has been. I see where that will cause hurdles to overcome, but it doesn't make the hurdles insurmountable.

We also have the luxury/curse of time. Our distance relationship will by necessity due to our individual responsibilities continue for a good while. We have both commented to each other how this internet/phone relationship in it's own way is beneficially unique as it is based on communication and the physical is not there to muddy the waters.

Sometimes the best and most well suited entree happens to be on page 1. She is by no means a saltine cracker, she is the caviar.

Time will tell. I will continue on this "adventure of the heart".

Thank you K1 for taking your time and showing your care. This whole thread has been helpful for me. It has caused me to look more deeply into the wounds I am bringing to the table.

Trying to keep my eyes wide open.

-pdc

I'm not one to state so emphatically that there are never exceptions. A person can learn to read the handwriting on the wall and statistics do tell a story and it's good to learn from the vast majority and their experiences. However, just once in a while there ARE exceptions and I don't see how one can speak so surely for themselves of something they know little about? It helps to stick to addressing explicit things rather that speaking in a generalized summation. JMHO