Again or just a huge trigger?

I�ve been here before, cant remember username and even my MB bookmarks are
all gone, change computers since then.

Dday in January 2006 revealed previous two years of several Affairs. EA, ONS
and PAs. With at least 5 diff. women.
I am BW 39 WH 36, 17 years marriage, two sons 10 and 12.

We are supposed to be recovered but recovering still from all the damage on
our lives left by it. The past year was really bad in terms of problems with
school and kids with special needs, financially, sickness, jobs, etc. Both
very depressed. Actually things are not quite right in terms of intimacy
since October 2010. I�ve been snooping now and then and never found
anything. (mail and messages)

Two months ago OW n3 tried to establish contact by email, he immediately
showed me and we both replied with an NC again.

Yesterday morning there was �a suspicious message on his iphone. The number
was not on his contacts, not signed just a �Even though I am here in this
�country� I am thinking of you� kind of message, coming from someone on
holidays on another country.
I woke my husband immediately and asked what was this about. He said he had
no idea. He told me to call to the number and check it out. I replied to the
sms saying �Don�t contact me again�
I left for work.

Mid afternoon he sends me an email regretting this kind of triggers that he
loves me and the boys and that he had already arranged to change his phone
number.

I was very upset and shooked. It just felt like d-day. I was just wandering
how to get to this, all day thinking are we there again? who could this OW
be?, and how to check on his work long list of contacts who might have gone
on holidays to that country.

When we talked about it in the evening he just said he had no idea but that
he checked the country code on the number and that it was probably from OW
n5. He had deleted the message because we had always done so after sending
NC requests while replying to similar incidents for the past 5 years.

I was surprised to hear this explanation, specially because if I consider
that possiblility (OW n5) this would not be the kind of words of a first
re-contact. After 5 years.

When I told him this, he said what else could it be then? For him, after
checking country name, he could only think of that person. When I said that
in the msn she mentioned she was on another country and not her won. (if she
was using her mobile phone the code would be from the country she was
staying right? (help on this please)

Also, this OW was a ONS while she was here for a night and left and they
continued through email and chat until I found out a days after. (D-Day)

Also he changed his phone number 2 years ago and he just said it�s quite
easy to get his number but I just checked his office webpage and it doesn�t
show his number.
He even changed companies a year later and his name doesn�t even show up on
the website. I find it really hard for her to get his contact except thrugh
his e-mail. She leaves in another continent and has nothing to do with our
place. She came here for one night.

I am really confused here. Something doesn�t feel right.

Please help me I don�t know what to think of it.

What can I do? Confront him yet again? Saying Im not buying his
explanations?
Try to having him admit so we can move forward? Treatening that if he keeps
this now it will just make things worse and that soon or later I will find
out?

Also, his fast decision to change his phone number is not like any reaction
he ever had before to this kind of situation.

Is this another OW and he�s diverting mentioning that one?

My experience tells me to keep quite and continuing checking but, after this
if there�s something really going on, he�ll make sure to cover up and delete
everything I am sure of it. I cant access his office computer.


Please help I am really really in a bad place right now

Will it ever end,

I'm sorry that you find yourself here.

I know that feeling of "am I over sensitive or is something going on." A few months back, I was here with the same question you have and here is the post I got from Sugarcane. It was a tremendous help to me.



Originally Posted By: pokerface
I'm not sure why I thought I needed to discuss it. I think I am doubting my own judgement because they fooled me before ( and were very good at it).

This is a very important issue and you are correct to wonder about it. I too have been through this and I would now never underestimate the devious, callous depths to which a craven WH will go to keep having a fulfilling marriage with his loving wife and family and also illicit sex with OW.

I would not tell you to trust him. That would be entire wrong and foolish. The problem is, you will not find out about whether this was planned between them and whether he is still in touch with her by asking him. You already know how capable he is of lying with a straight face. There will never be any point in discussing this to find out the truth.

The only way that you will gain knowledge and (I hope) reassurance will be for you to spy on him and say NOTHING about the fact that you are doing this. If you find something, you must act on it. If you do not find anything, you spy intermittently for some time but do not reveal that you are doing this.

Being angry and questioning him, though, is neither arming yourself nor protecting yourself. It is merely tipping him off to hide his behaviour more carefully if there is anything to hide, and alienating him if there is nothing to hide.

I hope this helps.

Does your husband travel for a living?

The basic issue I see is that he has the same phone # as he had before so these women are free to contact him. I would get his number changed.

Also, you can buy what a Spy stick that works on some phones and retreive some deleted texts. There is a thread about it over on Operation Investigate.

I would also ask him to take a polygraph. Make an appointment and tell him 2 days before hand. Hand him a list of questions and give him 2 days to come clean before the poly.

Thank you pokerface.
I am just so drained I dont know if I heve energy left to go through with this anymore. I just dont see an ending to anything anymore.

Nothing makes sense in my life. I canr judge anything.

My husband does not travel anymore. He changed job one year after big d day.

He has to attend lots of business dinners and coktails.

We have no polyghraphs where we live. No couseling Nor enen a decent psycologist.

I might pressure him teling him that he better come clean now since he knows that sooner or later i will find out. If hes clean or still denies i can propose to start a more efficient investigation with his knowledge. Like install stuff on his office computer.
Hes comming have to go

I would assume he IS having an affair (again) and act on that.

I say that since.....well.......he is a skilled liar from practise in the past. If he isn't cheating, doing plan A won't hurt anything. It will help you get stronger for you too which is a plus.

You can plan A, snoop to your best ability and make no decisions or proclamations about your marriage until you feel stronger to do so.

You can always pull the plug on a marriage tomorrow. Do nothing today that shoots yourself in the foot and puts you in a corner.

You act as though you want to save the marriage until you know that you are at the juncture where you do not want to. That is something you need to sleep on even when you think you have reached the point. YK?

Trust your own strength to handle whatever is going on. Do not view him as your source of strength since that will make you feel weak if it isn't there to hold you up. Develop your own inner strength more for now and make decisions based on what is best for you vs emotions.

Keep posting and re-directing your love and support to yourself as you work the plan.....A.....then maybe B.......than perhaps D. Only you can choose the length of time to spend in each part of the plan for your own financial security and strength of desire to do so.

Sounds to me like you've never officially worked the MB Program or Counseled with the Harley's.

Is that right??

But if he has knowledge then it will be ineffective. In order for snooping to be effective, it has to be without his knowledge. Did you see my comment about the spy stick?

Hi MelodyLane
You help me a lot back then thank you. I am going to look for the stick on the internet right after.

We did follow MB, read everything on website together did the questionaries. No counseling. We are europeans living in asia.

The big problem is that many bad things happenned to us since 2003.
His two years of affairs and lies only made it worst.
then d-day on 2006. followed by 7 months of denials and small d-days everytime he disclosed new information.

Add to it that our relatioship was based on honesty and transparency and what i admired most in my H was his honesty and sincerity. Then mix in that trust is a very big issue for me.

Right now to be honest my main concern is that more than anykind of affair is that he is going to make me feel crazy and tottally lost by denying.

Last night ha told me his new number is effective and that I didnt seem very happy or entusiastic about his decision. hr said he did it so we can protect ourselves from this kind of messages.

I said that what I was not happy was the fact that this OW n5 would have a hard time to find his new number. If she would want to reach him again he either gave it to her or would contact him by email.
He says if not her theres no other person he can think of. this the only one from greece. The message was something like this "even though i am here in burdum i miss you and i am thinking of you." thats in Turkey.

My concerns?
This does not sound like a first recontact msm after 5 years.
She could not had his number on the web
The only person they both know does not have his number

Then his reaction to this is also suspicious and different
He says he just wants to end this triggers or reduce them once and for all.

We have had a lot and they always makw a huge impact on our lives.

I managed to sleep a couple of hour tonight and i am feeling a little better.

Reading,
I guess you are right plan A until i find something or not.
Going to try to recover deleted messages.

I just hate it because I am really tired of thiss all, and I am really bad at hiding my emotions and Plan A and be sweet when I just dont even want to look at him is tiring. Specially when I have the boys to attend to. And stressfull work and manage to pay the bills.

I just feel like i should pick up the boys and disappear.

I just feel like i should pick up the boys and disappear.

That would be plan B.

You can prep and go to that later if you have to.

Hang in there and rebuild your own strength to handle whatever it is.

Fact is, none of us want to deal with this stuff. None of us are not tired of having to.

It sucks. Pure and simple....it does.

Williteverend, I would strongly advise you NOT to go into Plan A. EVER. The time for Plan A is done and gone because this has nothing to do with unmet needs, but evrything with his poor boundaries with women.

It should be Plan B or a real recovery. With his numerous affairs, you should both be working on changing his life so dramatically that he couldnt possibly carry on a secret second life.

You can find the link to the spy stick over on Operation Investigate forum.

A serial cheater who continues to cheat is dangerous. Your instincts to pick up the boys and disappear seem well founded.

What was your previous posting name?

Had willow on in but forgot the rest, I know it was not just willow

Everything is just so messed up
I guess I just been doing everything wrong.

Still cant find anything.

The last year had many red flags but in a way or another and because stress has been a lot me or him always found a way of just keep going.

Like, there's no explanation I find nothing so yeah it's me overreacting.

Or yeah he had a life threatnening situation and he is changing some of his habits.

I just look back and see 7 out of 17 very bad years due to his Affairs.

We never really got into the why he did it. last conclusion was he did it because he had the chance and it felt good to have this desperate single poor lonely girls after him.


Then during the past 5 years there's always stuff that goes unexplained. and I either believe him or not.

So full trust like we had is still far.

He agreed he would never drink again at the events he has to attend. We never really drunk so a beer is enough to get us drunk.
Drinking played a big role on his PAs.
He does not drink but is upset he does not have that option when at those events. I believe this creates some resentment.

We were always home people. Actually I gave up on many friends and an active social live because he never felt like going out with friends.

Now he's always willing and for the past few months have attended events when he could have sent someone else. And even told me that he felt like going to the parties after these dinners.

E even called me a few weeks ago asking if he could go with people I dont know to the party.

What upsets me most is that for friends event he always complains and never wants to go. And when this parties come he doesnt even comntemplate asking me to go.

I find myself in a very dark place right now.

I feel like I failed everything. I almost lost my job, and lost the respect of my superiors.

My kids are struggling with "special needs".

We are totally broken.

Whatever we once wanted to achieve as a family is lost.
Kids will be teens soon.

I been sick because of the only psychologist we have her that gave me sote medicine that messed up my health and body.

I was overweith (8 kg) on d-day, now I am OBESE (20kg)

We hate the place we live in. We are not giving the kids the education we wanted.

And I look back and see that I have been too depressed for too long.
My mother is aging and sick in Europe and I cant even visit her.
No friends I can talk about anything.

We never had family near but we could always count on each other but since this all happened that I dont feel we are the friends we were to each other.

sorry about the ramblings. it's being a bad evening.

I know your last post lists your woes.

It also lists things you can mostly change to build yourself a great life.

You can work on your health, directing your children to a pretty good life as they become teens, communicate with your mom more (skype her if you don't already), create friendships which will support you (via socializing somehow....meetup groups or local groups that appeal to you), finding joy even though your husband is letting you down as a partner (at least right now).

Feel hopeful that you can find joy.