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Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by Dajavude


The freeloaders analogy is blurry though as she is expecting a complete commitment (emotional and financial) from me to support her, the household and kids etc. I initially tried to keep an initial financial separation but every attempt by me to clarify financial costs and who pays what etc, has been construed as a nit picky money hungry attempt to have my cake and eat it.

This is partly cultural as she is from Philippines where the male is expected to be the provider but I feel like she is expecting a "husband/father" behaviour from me but freeloader freedom from her.



Dr Harley uses the term freeloader to mean uncommitted which is somewhat different from its conventional use. He advises everyone to be uncommitted in the early (the first six months) of a relationship. That means no effort, each of you should be exactly who you are. She has this right; she continues to have contact with her ex as her backup plan and at the same time asks for your emotional and financial support. All these things are healthy ways for her to show you who she is.

You, on the other hand are not being a freeloader; you are far too committed. So the relationship is an effort for you which it should not be. That is why the people here suggested you move out and date her casually. Had you done that in the first place, you would have saved yourself (and her children) a lot of trauma and heartache.

The relationship does not need to end, it just needs to be casual and fun. You must move out.



I expected to move out in the beginning when living together first came up. I explained it would be best thing for everyone to move slowly.

Every time it came up she was adamant she needed someone with her.

I felt if I insisted it might jeapodise the relationship.

In fact I have offered this option many times since, even just this morning but she wants us together.

Not withstanding the inherent dangers, I want us together now as well we are all bonding and building connections.

I am not interested in continuing relationship with her while she maintains a connection with her ex. It's not worth the stress for me. Irrespective of whether we live together or not.

If I had choice to go back in time now I would stick to my original gut reaction and end relationship when I found out her situation.

Now I am in love and emotionally attached.

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Originally Posted by Dajavude

Not withstanding the inherent dangers, I want us together now as well we are all bonding and building connections.


Well yes of course, Dr Harley warns against jumping into bed during the freeloader stage because it creates a very intense bond with someone who might simply be wrong for you.

Originally Posted by Dajavude

I am not interested in continuing relationship with her while she maintains a connection with her ex. It's not worth the stress for me. Irrespective of whether we live together or not.


That makes sense. Don't demand, just observe. If you demand, she will take her communications underground which you need like a hole in the head.

Originally Posted by Dajavude

If I had choice to go back in time now I would stick to my original gut reaction and end relationship when I found out her situation.

Now I am in love and emotionally attached.


Yes and therein lies your problem. When will you be moving out?


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Originally Posted by living_well
[quote=Dajavude]]

Yes and therein lies your problem. When will you be moving out?


If I move out it will be the end of the relationship.

We discussed this again yesterday. She said she has no time to invest now that she has to work and care for the kids; that the relationship would just fade.

The other end is if there is not a way for us to manage the love busting contact with the ex.

I should not have agreed to her blocking him because it just created an impossible and unacceptable restriction to her.

When she did it SMS were still coming through which she couldn't understand.

I asked her last night if she had still been getting msgs and how has she responded. She disclosed she had sent a thankyou msg regarding some helpful thing he had done for her son.

I said that was a breach of the commitment she had made to not contact without me being present.

She tried to make light of it but I pointed out she had decided on the no contact rules and she had broken the agreement.

She basically spat the dummy and made out I was being ridiculous blowing it out of proportion.

Went to bed angry with her giving me silent treatment and I tried to engage with her this morning.

I eventually managed to explain I should not have accepted her offer to block because it was done in the spur of the moment to placate me.

I said I would not have asked for that.

She was still angry and defiant insisting the problem is me and my insecurities.

I know that is partly true but I also feel I have legitimate reasons to be uncomfortable.

I said it felt like she wanted to keep her connection with him and didn't want to share with me. I offered to let her keep that and I would move out so she could do what she wants.

She tried to gas light by saying I should be happy she moved in with me and that should prove her feelings and stop creating stories in my head to ruin our relationship.

So I asked her how would she feel about an arrangement where she is free to call and SMS ex as she pleases and to periodically show me so that over time I can see a history of her conducting things in a way that is respectful of me and us and that in time I would not feel worried?

She said she still felt it was a demand from me. I asked her why she felt that was worse than the arrangement she offered to block and not contact him?

She said she hasnt said no but needs time to think as she was going to work.

I guess now she has option to say yes, counter with another solution idea to provide reassurance to me or say no.

In which case I can say I cannot stay and be relaxed and happy in that environment and leave permanently.





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Originally Posted by Dajavude

If I move out it will be the end of the relationship.

We discussed this again yesterday. She said she has no time to invest now that she has to work and care for the kids; that the relationship would just fade.


So that tells you everything you need to know, You rank below her children and even below her job. She does not love you and does not plan to fall in love with you, you are just a meal ticket for her.

When are you moving out?


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Originally Posted by living_well
Originally Posted by Dajavude

If I move out it will be the end of the relationship.

We discussed this again yesterday. She said she has no time to invest now that she has to work and care for the kids; that the relationship would just fade.


So that tells you everything you need to know, You rank below her children and even below her job. She does not love you and does not plan to fall in love with you, you are just a meal ticket for her.

When are you moving out?


That's not how I see it.

Yes I am a support for her. That's what a partner does in a relationship.

I am just trying to navigate things within the reality of the situation and not over react or create unecessary drama.

I have just resigned to accepting and trusting her. Both our stress levels have gone down, more relaxed and she is being more open and affectionate.

I guess I will see in time if our relationship grows.

She wants to spend time with me doing things together, asks my opinion, does things for me, buys gifts, etc etc . I have been focused on the one thing and building a story around it.

I need to appreciate her perspective; her husband was very jealous and controlling. They were together 15years and during that time she was not even allowed to leave the house without him. Her baulking at my sensitivity to the ex boyfriend reminds her of that.

She also doesn't have any other friends or relatives in our country, Australia. So it makes sense that she would not want to burn bridges with someone that has been a friend and supported her., Especially in case things don't work with us.

I can't blame her for that.

I can really only try to accept each day as it comes and judge on our time together.

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Made it through another day with no drama.

I have kept focussing on being happy / helpful, affectionate, household support etc etc. She has been becoming more open and affectionate back in return and we have spent all of her two days off together.

I still find myself having my mind go to thinking about messages on phone but I just try to distract myself and not dwell.

She has been happy to leave phone lying around, use it in plain view of me, even putting phone in my pocket while we were shopping and unlocking the phone where I could see - but I have purposely turned away and not tried to watch. I want her to decide to be transparent without any more effort from me.

I don't feel like I can actually bring this up again without causing unecessary drama.

The pay off has been a very happy few days together.

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Do you have a question for us?


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Originally Posted by living_well
Do you have a question for us?



For me I am looking for some support and guidance with some of the challenges I am facing and also to help me find a balanced perspective in attempting to navigate out interactions and my own thinking and emotions.

I get that living together is a big no no for some people, and that might be the only insight and advice that can be offered by some given their own experiences etc.


So my posting is partly cathartic and inferring questions that probably don't have black and white answers. 🤔

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FWW/BW (me)
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Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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So we have have had just over a week with no major upset or drama.

This has come in the back of my decision to try to accept and trust her.

We had a early Valentine's celebration as she works on the weekend so I took Friday off to spend together.

It was a nice day overall but I found myself struggling with anxiety each time I heard an alert on her phone. Spending the whole day together made me realise how much energy I am using to manage that.

I have not brought this topic up again but I am feeling worried and resentful about it still because I think she should want to alleviate my concerns and not want to keep that contact hidden.

I am worried that boundaries are not being respected and that when I find out I am going to be put in a tougher situation of needing to leave.

I wish I could just let it go because other than that things have been great between us and the kids.

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How about sharing child care with another family instead of this guy?


Me 40, OD 18 and YD 13
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Originally Posted by NewEveryDay
How about sharing child care with another family instead of this guy?



If only it was that simple. The arrangements are primarily to maintain a connection for the kids to him and his family. He has adult / teenager sons that live with him and they all hang out. It also provides a convenient location for the kids to go after school as he lives near the schools.

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I am finding the mind activity on this really frustrating. I just want the resentment to go away but its like each event just adds fuel to it.



Part of me is saying to just wait and let the thoughts go and they will disappear over time. The other part is just bubbling away and agitating to stand up and insist on transparency. Talking to her previously asking just results in her not listening, not demonstrating any attempt to have empathy for my feelings. She straight away blames me for for being insecure.



Even though I wish we could discuss everything I don't see any point in trying to have a discussion about it.

Just a circular mind story.

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Your feelings would go away if she was interacting with someone else, perhaps one of the teens. Or found another place for the kids to hang after school. But that’s not where your relationship is right now where she’s trying to win you over the way you are trying to win her over. So it feels awful all the time.

If you were open to other women meeting your needs right now as well it wouldn’t feel so unequal. I think that’s what the other posters are saying, not to go to a one sided exclusivity until you both get there.


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Originally Posted by NewEveryDay
Your feelings would go away if she was interacting with someone else, perhaps one of the teens. Or found another place for the kids to hang after school. But that’s not where your relationship is right now where she’s trying to win you over the way you are trying to win her over. So it feels awful all the time.

If you were open to other women meeting your needs right now as well it wouldn’t feel so unequal. I think that’s what the other posters are saying, not to go to a one sided exclusivity until you both get there.


Yes, but, It makes me feel really sad because in my situation that option only leads to end of our relationship.

Seems I only have sad choices in that regard....

To stay and keep trying to manage my resentment in the hope it goes away over time or something changes.
To bring it up again although I feel this is pointless. If I ask respectfully and try to leave the option of her saying no open and she says no I am left in the same boat.
To leave.

Some years ago after my second marriage ended I found solace with listening to Eckart Tolle. In particular "Transmuting Suffering into Peace" on Audible. It helped me become more compassionate of myself and others, more mindful and helped to bring my awareness out of my thoughts. This helped me to get to sleep most nights for the first 12 months after we separated. I have started to listen to him again as I am having trouble sleeping again.

He explains how the external, other people. relationships, etc will change when there is a change inside ourselves. I have witnessed that this week with her behaviour becoming more relaxed and carefree with me. But it seems like I am only treating the symptoms.

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As you can see I am feeling very emotional today. I am 50 years old and I feel like crying. Makes me feel silly because it's not like its a life and death issue.

My painbody is agitating inside to confront her. I usually just write all of my verbal negativity into my diary to let it out. I have also come here and used posting as a cathartic exercise. I have written a letter to her about how I am feeling. I have done this before but I don't send them or give to her but it's all kind of bubbling out since friday.

The saddest thing is feeling I can't tell you how my love for you erodes everytime I hear a message alert on your phone. It feels like a stab in the guts because I want to be able to tell you everything and to trust that you will try to understand me and have my back. 
Instead I have the horrible feeling of knowing you will blame me and not want to help. 

This is something I cannot understand. I have tried to talk to you about it and everytime it turns in to you blaming me and making out I am trying to control you. 

I am only asking you to show me what you say you are doing that is supposed be ok and respectful of us. 

Instead all I have is your word. The word you said you wanted me to accept after you told me about living with Michael still.  I did that for you when you asked. You don't seem to understand that your actions destroyed that trust. You continuing to share a disrespectful bond with Michael even after you moved. You should not have even been talking to him before that, let alone making fun me and joking with him.


As much as that hurt me I didn't want to lose you over that and I asked you to show me the communication so that I can have peace about it. Instead you blame me. My feelings don't count, it is all my insecurities and I have no right to feel like you betrayed me. 

I have made myself sick by trying to accept you hiding your communication with him for over a week and I have noticed how happy you have become.  Have you seen how i have died a little bit inside every day that you have not offered to help me?  

The worst day was friday. The day when we were supposed to be spending time together and focusing on each other.  You spent the so much time on your phone, then talking about  how how your late husband courted you and other things you remember, being ungrateful about roses I bought you, there was only 10!!! and musing outloud about how you can't think of any reason why you love me, that it is a mystery. 

This is my recollection of friday.

Yours was a litany of selfies and you still can't put a photo of us on your FB profile. 

All the while you would not have noticed how I winced inside, and tried to hide my feelings , everytime the phone had an alert or you responded to something with me worrying it was him. 

All you would have to do is recognise the hurt your actions caused and let me see the messages until I felt comfortable and trust that there was no more disloyalty to me and us. I honestly don't know how long I can keep smiling and make believe it's worth suffering everyday. 
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Hi @Dajavude,

Sorry you are having this struggle.

Have you thought further about trying to continue the relationship, but living separately? I realize this may not be what you want, but over time it could lead to a more intelligence-driven perspective on this relationship versus an emotional-driven perspective (for both of you). I know this was suggested earlier also, and she gave reasons why this would lead to the relationship fading away and you also gave reasons why it was not possible, but just because she says that it will lead to drifting apart does not mean that is what will happen. It may or may not. Why not try to be transparent with her about all of this emotional turmoil and ask to live separately for now, but date and see where this goes over time?

I do not see the current situation as sustainable from your messages and the emotional imbalance right now. But the choice is not either or. The choice could be something in-between from a continuum of choices. Sometimes those choices and options only become clearer over time.

I wish you well.


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Originally Posted by Blackhawk
Hi @Dajavude,

Sorry you are having this struggle.

Have you thought further about trying to continue the relationship, but living separately? I realize this may not be what you want, but over time it could lead to a more intelligence-driven perspective on this relationship versus an emotional-driven perspective (for both of you). I know this was suggested earlier also, and she gave reasons why this would lead to the relationship fading away and you also gave reasons why it was not possible, but just because she says that it will lead to drifting apart does not mean that is what will happen. It may or may not. Why not try to be transparent with her about all of this emotional turmoil and ask to live separately for now, but date and see where this goes over time?

I do not see the current situation as sustainable from your messages and the emotional imbalance right now. But the choice is not either or. The choice could be something in-between from a continuum of choices. Sometimes those choices and options only become clearer over time.

I wish you well.



Thankyou 😊

Due to the nature of the relationship it would be viewed) construed as abandoning her.

I see now that I let things move too fast. I had purposely not dated and stayed single for 5,years since end of last marriage. I decided to try again last October and she was the first lady I met.

We really clicked and she was super enthusiastic so it was very easy for me. She always wanted to talk and make dates so I never really had any issues until she told me about her living arrangements with her ex.

At that point I had to decide to end relationship or trust her. In hindsight maybe I should have gone with gut feeling to withdraw.

Everything is obvious in hindsight.

If everything was negative and bad it would be easy choice now but she does so many nice things for me my love bank is still being replenised and I am doing things for her happily as well, albeit with an underlying sensitivity.

Hence my hesitation to upset things while they are going well.


Last edited by Dajavude; 02/14/21 05:17 PM.
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I have a new conundrum today.

Last night she asked me to help her with a problem on her iPad. It needed to be signed in and when I tried to pass to her she told me the pin.

I think it might be the same on her phone. I have been purposely avoiding watching her put in her phone pin to respect her privacy and also hoping she will offer to share the communication as I had previously asked.

Now I am potentially able to check I realise I may be confronted with information that will confirm my fears OR validate I can trust her.

If I find inappropriate communication I am going to have to leave. There will be no point bringing it up again.

I would be able to pack my things and move within one day myself while they are all at work / school.


Or do I not look and let things go?

Do I raise the issue again?




Last edited by Dajavude; 02/15/21 03:35 PM.
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Originally Posted by Dajavude


Now I am potentially able to check I realise I may be confronted with information that will confirm my fears OR validate I can trust her.

If I find inappropriate communication I am going to have to leave. There will be no point bringing it up again.

I would be able to pack my things and move within one day myself while they are all at work / school.



Your problem is that finding nothing proves nothing. She may have deleted everything or they may have decided not to use text messaging for private conversations. Your problem is that she has already told you that she has no interest in going exclusive (becoming a renter) at this time. She is being honest.

You are going to need to put on your brave boots and move out. Then date her and date others too. You need to freeload. You will feel so much better when you have done this.


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