I am so mad. I am furious. I want to kick his @$$!!!!!!<P>We normally eat breakfast at Cafe Woman's place, and I haven't objected to that because: 1. Cafe Woman usually isn't there. and 2. My H does enjoy trading gossip with the men who eat breakfast there.<P>After our blowup, if Cafe Woman was at the restaurant, we ate at another cafe.<P>This morning, I drive up. Cafe Woman is there (apparently the cook didn't show up), and H is also there.<P>AAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!<P>I kept my cool. I went in, but I did not sit beside my H. I sat across the table from him; there is no way that I wanted him anywhere near me. I have not said diddly-squat to him about it yet--waiting 'til I cool down. We got to work, and he wanted to give me a little pecky kiss. That was the last thing I wanted to do, but I complied.<P>He is testing me! If I let this slide, the next thing that will happen is that he will go back to his old routine of going up there all the time.<P>I have to go out of town just before lunchtime tomorrow to see my counselor, and I would not be surprised if he doesn't take advantage of my absence to go up there. As soon as he leaves here, I'm going to see if I can reschedule my appointment for later in the afternoon.<P>Well, he just came in and all hell broke loose. He asked me what I was POd about. I simply said that we should have eaten at another cafe this morning. He said, "Well, what was I supposed to do? Get up and leave? I didn't know she was there until she came walking out of the kitchen." He said that he didn't see her car when he got there.<P>Anyway, he said that I'm POd all the time and that I have nothing to be POd about. He said that he's tired of my s***. That I don't care about him. That he can't treat me like everybody else treats their wives--(excuse me? Everybody else treats their wives with disrespect and anger?)--that I expect him to kiss my @$$. He said a whole lot more. He's mad because I don't believe him. I asked him how he can expect me to believe him after 13 years of lies. I told him that I don't believe that he only cheated one time.<P>Still the whole defensive attitude. It's a mess.<P>So now, what should I do?

Sweetpea<P>I don't know!!! I don't know what you should do! <P>It's pretty certain he had an inappropriate emotional attachment! But he doesn't see anything wrong with it! <P>You've got to use your head! Don't do anything crazy! <P>Uggh and yuck twice

I don't know your whole story, but I think there will come a time when even if you don't trust him, you should try to believe him. Calming explaining why you are so po'd and that you felt it showed a lack of appreciation. No you don't want your butt kissed...well...only if it feels good ;-). But you do want affection and you do want him to be not so defensive. I think by showing up at Cafe and her seeing the two of you together would send a message that you are working on your marriage. Maybe say something like "Hon, I just need you to acknowledge that seeing cafe woman really makes me mad and I have a right to be mad. Therefore I need reassurance from you, not the defensive crap you give me" Like I said, I don't know your whole story. Try and calm down, don't miss your appointment and if possible maybe H can go with you. Take care.

Sweetpea,<P>If H is living with you and both of you have committed to each other to build your marriage... I think you should be following "The Policy of Joint Agreement" (POJA).<P>Here is a quick link to the MB page on <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3500_policy.html" TARGET=_blank>The Policy of Joint Agreement</A>.<P>If you are not in agreement on rebuilding... Plan A... is maybe? where you should be...<P>Plan B... if the hurt you're having is too much.<P>Prayers in any case... <P>Jim

Well, we've had a pretty good little skirmish.<P>After our fight this morning, he found out that some of the woods at his hunting camp were burning, so he asked me if I wanted to ride out with him to check it out---no serious damage, thank goodness....about 40 acres of brush burned. He figures that some guys burned it out in an effort to reduce the cover for deer so that the deer on the camp property would move on to another area for easier hunting on other property. Sort of stealing the deer off the camp property, you might say.<P>Anyway, he said that he was tired of feeling like he was "on trial"--that he has felt like he's been on trial since he admitted to his fling because he thought I was POd all the time. I told him that sometimes I might be angry, but that I was trying to deal with it on my own because I <B>don't</B> want to put him "on trial." I told him that other times, I was just sad, but that I was also trying to deal with that on my own because he didn't seem to want to ever talk about the situation. I know that when I don't feel that I can express my emotions, I do tend to withdraw because at such times, I feel like I could blow sky high at the slightest thing.<P> He still swears up and down that he never had an affair with Cafe Woman, but I did tell him that I felt that he had some sort of feelings for her...that given the right place and right circumstances, he could have entered into a full-blown affair with her.<P> I asked him if he could understand why I had trouble believing him. He said, "No, not really." ??????????????? I explained to him that it was really hard for me to believe that he had only had that one fling, because of his behavior over the years and the constant lies over the previous 13 years. I told him that it was so painful for me to <B>know</B> that he had been with someone else and still have him lie to me. He said, "Well, I hoped you didn't really know." I asked him why he kept lying to me, even when I directly asked him, and he said that he just hoped it would all blow over. I did ask him the two questions I had about the STD Tramp. He said that he never told her she gave us the "trich" because he didn't know that she had given us anything--that he just thought I had a yeast infection. I told him that I found that hard to believe, because of his insistence on going to the doctor with me when he virtually <B>never</B> went to the doctor with me, except for when I was pregnant and was having an ultrasound or problems (last pregnancies were high risk). Anyway, he said that he didn't want to believe that he had actually contracted a disease and passed it on to me. He also said that he did not go to the funeral home when the STD Tramp died. He said, "She meant nothing to me. She was just there."<BR> I told him that I was pretty much over that, but that the lies were what hurt so much. That being told I was crazy and that I must have been screwing around to get trich was absolutely awful for me.<BR> I told him that I needed to be able to talk to him about how I feel, but that I felt like he expected me to just deal with everything all by myself. He said, "Well, don't you think I've been having to deal with this stuff, too?" I told him that I was sure he was, but that I think we need to deal with the situation together, and not by ourselves. Then, he told me that he was having to deal with my "putting him through hell." (Plan A is hell for him?) I told him that I was sorry--that I wasn't trying to punish him, but was trying to show my love for him. He said that he wants everything to go back to the way it was before all this stuff blew up.<P> I also told him that if he was holding anything back, to please not do it...that we could work through it all, but that I'd rather deal with it all at one time.<P> Oh, gosh! I've got to sort through all the things he said. He really didn't talk about his feelings much, other than to blame me for all this cr**.<P> Anyway, he held me and told me that he loves me, so we're sort of OK again. He knows now that I do need to be able to talk to him about how I feel, and that I want him to tell me how he feels--that we <B>both</B> need to be able to do this with respect and without fighting.<P> We'll see. Thanks for all your support.

Jim,<BR> I've been Plan A'ing for almost two years, with only a few lovebusting blowups. There are things I still need to improve upon, but I'm having a hard time doing that with all this garbage going on.<BR> I finally got the admission of infidelity (a 1-night stand over 13 years ago that I <B>knew</B> he had) at the end of August, when I packed my stuff and disappeared for a couple of days. I was really ready to go to Plan B when I did that. I have been in major Plan A ever since he admitted cheating. The problem is that we still haven't been able to communicate like we should. He doesn't want to hear about it, and I need to talk about it, but couldn't because he didn't want to hear about it....and so it goes. I'm supposed to "just get over it; it happened a long time ago." He's tired of my pain. I did tell him that a large part of my pain was because I have never and will never have what I really want--a husband who loves me so much that he could never even think about being with another woman.<p>[This message has been edited by Sweetpea (edited November 16, 1999).]

I am glad things are sorta okay for you two now. That is the start of the climb up hill. <P>The communication thing is hard...scary, especially for some people I think. It means going deep down inside and taking inventory. Admitting and realizing feelings and things sometimes we didn't know we had.<P>I have a friend who says and it is so true...we aren't afraid of the dark...we are afraid of the light. <P>I will pray that this goes as easily as possible for you and your husband. <P>Right now I feel good for you two as this is a step in the right direction. Yeah! <P>------------------<BR>God bless you and all of us.<P>Samantha<BR>

Sweatpea,<P>I went surfing this morning, and I found something that might help you and me.<P>I think the main part of our problem with our husband's is conflict management/avoidance.... bottom line: communication.<P>I am going to post a topic to Chris, and hope he includes it in his resource page. Let me know what you think about it.<P>TNT<BR> <A HREF="http://pacskills.com/free_stop_arguing_tips.html#anchor7056078" TARGET=_blank>http://pacskills.com/free_stop_arguing_tips.html#anchor7056078</A>

Thanks, TNT, I already took a look at that site. It's kinda hard, though, to try to change our communication by myself. He's not into taking any advice on how to communicate. He says that he has no problem communicating; that I'm the one with all the problems. Yes, I do have a problem with deciding the right moment to bring things up; so much depends on his "mood." But, I think I'm better at communicating my thoughts if I feel like somebody's listening. During our one joint counseling session, my counselor asked H if he would consider seeing a counselor (a male one, if he would prefer) about his own issues and to help him learn to communicate better with me, "since Sweetpea is already so <B>open</B> with her feelings."<P>Anyway, I'm thinking about doing something that is really risky, and I'm fixing to post a new thread to ask for opinions. Take a look and tell me what you think.