Hi.<P> I have been in Plan A for 10 months. After a conversation with my w last week (where I asked her to either commit one way or another), she claimed that she DID love the om (this is a first) but that she was no longer in contact with him. I don't know whether to believe her or not. She has lied about everything else for the last year...so who knows. She has been looking at apartment ads and stocking away supplies "to make her escape". Now that I have asked her to do one or the other, she hasn't made any indications that she wants to move OR work on us. (I had to force the issue...10 months in Plan A was getting to be draining) She is emotionally withdrawn from me (no affection, ect.), but she is still pleasant to me as long as we do not discuss "us". She also looks very miserable and seems to have little drive to do anything like looking for a job (she got one and quit after a week). She also always seems tired.<BR> Does anyone have any idea what she may be thinking/going through? I felt that I cannot do this much longer, but if it is withdrawal, then I feel that I need to rethink that. As I said before, she will not talk about "us" or her plans. She has done things to indicate she wants to move out, but she doesn't seem to be taking active steps. (BTW...living with OM is NOT an option for her) On the other side, she doesn't seem to have any love for me and shows no desire to try with me. She has stated in the past that she wants to "find herself" and be independent. She also left for Om for a couple months but came back wanting to reconcile. After 2-3 weeks, things backslid to the way they were when she was "sky high" into the OM. Any ideas?<P>Arrow

I think that sounds like withdrawal. I think it takes awhile for the WS to start to remember their original feeling for spouse. I think plan A is to help them. <P>Why did she leave OM and why is it not an option now??? If that is really the case, I would assume she is in withdrawal and really do a great plan A. It may be very draining. Have you gone to the recovery board and looked at some of SAMH's posts. His W seemed to vacillate quite a bit. He really seemed to be very aggressive in his plan A. He is in recovery now. He has given his w a lot of time and attention, that he has only been able to do by having her at home. <P>You may want to read his posts. THey are very encouraging. I go to the recovery board when I want to be encouraged!!!! Some people in recovery can better tell you how long w/d lasts. I personally know of one woman here that told me it took her H 2 years from D to tell her he loved her. He had only moved out 7 months. But the entirety of his feelings took 2 years.<P>good luck......

Tootrusting<BR> The Om lives in a different country..you know an internet affair. She went but while she liked the guy (love, she says), I think she realised it would never work.<BR> I am really hanging on Plan A by a thread. Steve Harley says that seperation may be the only option here..seeing that she wants to be "independent". I'm not sure she really does..she may just want away from me. As everyone here knows, it is hard to keep giving without anything in return (at least short term). Also, the LB's from me are starting to be harder to control in the face of 10 months of rejection.<P>Arrow

Arrow:<P>It sounds like your W might be suffering from depression. I am not a doctor, but I have been going through withdrawl for two months and a lot of what you are describing sounds fimiliar. There are days, I barely have the strength or desire to do anything. I drag myself to work and go through the motions, but I get no pleasure out of the work I use to love. I put things off, I don't call family and friends like I use to...I just don't want to do anything but wallow. I still feel resentment towards my H and find it difficult to be nice to him. If he is overly nice to me, it makes me angry. Of course for me, I believe he is just trying another tactic in being controlling. It is hard to concentrate and make decisions. I feel nothing but an overwhelming sense of sadness. I know I am depressed over the entire situation. I did not want to take medication, but after two months of this, I'm about to ask about it. I have been in counseling for two months...and though it has helped some, I still think of myself as in love with the OM. I have had no contact, but the pain still hasn't lessened. I question my own sanity since I never even saw this person face to face. <P>Has your wife done counseling by herself...maybe she needs an objective party to hear her out about what she is feeling. She most likely doesn't understand what is happening and is quite confused. There is a lot of stuff written in this forum about the H or W not being in love with the OP, but that they are merely addicted. I think that is most likely true, but not in all cases. Sometimes I think it is love. There are exceptions to every rule; this included. Anyway, you may suggest, or want to get someone else to suggest, that your W get a physical and see if you needs anti-depressant. I know this is very hard on you, but believe it or not, this is not easy on the betrayer either. Good luck with this...I hope the sun shines on you and your W soon.<P>LS<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Arrow:<BR><B>Hi.<P> I have been in Plan A for 10 months. After a conversation with my w last week (where I asked her to either commit one way or another), she claimed that she DID love the om (this is a first) but that she was no longer in contact with him. I don't know whether to believe her or not. She has lied about everything else for the last year...so who knows. She has been looking at apartment ads and stocking away supplies "to make her escape". Now that I have asked her to do one or the other, she hasn't made any indications that she wants to move OR work on us. (I had to force the issue...10 months in Plan A was getting to be draining) She is emotionally withdrawn from me (no affection, ect.), but she is still pleasant to me as long as we do not discuss "us". She also looks very miserable and seems to have little drive to do anything like looking for a job (she got one and quit after a week). She also always seems tired.<BR> Does anyone have any idea what she may be thinking/going through? I felt that I cannot do this much longer, but if it is withdrawal, then I feel that I need to rethink that. As I said before, she will not talk about "us" or her plans. She has done things to indicate she wants to move out, but she doesn't seem to be taking active steps. (BTW...living with OM is NOT an option for her) On the other side, she doesn't seem to have any love for me and shows no desire to try with me. She has stated in the past that she wants to "find herself" and be independent. She also left for Om for a couple months but came back wanting to reconcile. After 2-3 weeks, things backslid to the way they were when she was "sky high" into the OM. Any ideas?<P>Arrow</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

LonelySoul,<BR> Thanks for your insight. She will not go to counseling (makes her feel defective). I agree that she may be depressed and I know she is confused. She does seem angry when I try to be nice. I truly am not trying to be controlling...I only am trying to reach out to her. You know, I used to be the person she turned to, but it's tough when you have been replaced. I truly believe our marriage wasn't that bad, BUT I did do a lot wrong which I am trying to change. She doesn't want to see these changes in me...my guess is it makes it harder to justify things. She said that she worked on this for years...she very well may have, but she never honestly sat down and talked with me. I think she was lonely (I was gone too much) and BOOM things happened.<BR> As for the addiction/love. I agree that these things are addictions but they very often include love. I believe she is in love with the om, but since their relationship has never seen the real world, it has become a fantasy and, yes, an addiction. I do not believe that we are only capable of loving one person. She loves this guy, yet I know she still loves me in some way and I'm sure she is scared to commit to me for fear of things going back to the way they were. I don't blame her, yet I wish she would give me a chance. If it keeps on like this, I'm afraid I will start to lose my love for her. Love is like a flower...if you don't water it, it will wither and die. I didn't water hers enough...I just wish she would let me now, even though she doesn't owe me that. Anyway, I ramble.<P>Arrow

I don't know your whole story...I mean why she feels she has given up on your marriage. I know when my H first discovered my EA, I told him the same thing. I will not go back to the way things were. I told my H what I wanted him to do, but in our case, he wouldn't do anything. It was my fault. My H has a control problem and we have issues beyond the OM. My feelings for the OM complicate the issue, but it's not the entire issue. I was so confused about my actions that at the time of discovery, I was willing to try and work things out. My H's behavior was completely irrational...I don't want to bore you with the details, but after agonizing over my marriage and the OM, I filed for divorce. I have no OM, but my H still acts like all is well and we are one happy family. I find that annoying and more confusing. I think your wife probably is very confused at this point. She doesn't want you to be nice to her because she wants to love the OM right now. As nuts as this sounds...I can relate. The fantasy of him is much better than the past memories with you. She is focusing on the negative right now of how she got caught up with this OP. I take it she had an internet romance like me. Believe me, I think this kind of affair is harder to shake for women because it touches on your emotions unlike anyother relationship. I believed it was true love because the relationship was so odd and so unlike me that I convinced myself it was meant to be. Not so...I understand why I did it and I know I loved this person too. Logically, I am sure it was an addiction, but it sure feels like love and I haven't been able to shake it yet. <P>Does your wife have a pastor/priest, etc that she would be comfortable talking to. It feels weird talking about that kind of thing with your pastor, but it has helped me see things a little bit more clearly. As hard as this is for you, you may want to ask your wife about the relationship with the OM. To my H's credit he has probed me with questions about my relationship and it has helped that he wants to talk about it. I have told him why I was attracted to the OM and how he made me feel. You mentioned your wife was lonely...the OM filled the void that was created. He made her feel special and beautiful and that she was the most marvelous person in the world. She is addicted to that feeling...that wonderful feeling of being in love. We are all vuneralble to that feeling; especially if you have been married a long time and indifference has taken passion's place. I am not saying it is right, but it happens; obviously. Anyway, Arrow....I am here if you need me. I know this is so hard for you and for your Wife. I can relate so much because I am feeling so much of what your wife is going through. Before she can be receptive to your love, she's got to come to terms with her feelings.<P>LS<P> <BR>

First, doesn't sound like she could move even if she would actually act upon it. It does sound like she's either in withdrawals, or still in contact with the OM. Sorry, but if she's stockpiling and talking about moving after 10 months of Plan A then I might lean towards contact with OM.<P>Now all that means is that you still have work to do. And just because you are tired is no excuse to give up on your marriage. Believe it or not your wife has not given up on you no matter what she says right now. If she had given up on you she'd be gone regardless of her job situation. <P>Just so you know, my wife was worse than evil in the things she said and did - down right cruel and vicious. And my wife makes nearly $100K per year. She didn't go anywhere, I kept Plan A'ng even when I wanted to quit - especially when I wanted to quit, I kept my mouth shut and my love and actions turned up really high,.......and now, now she's for the most part my wife again in every possible way. She is in withdrawals, and has just begun to talk about the pain she's experiencing - but she's made a decision to stay and she shows tons of love and affection now.<P>Do you get it Arrow - this woman made Satin look like a wimp during the affair - really. And now she's working towards getting her angle wings. They don't know or mean what they say or do. The affair will die most likely, but you have to hang around and keep her around until that happens.<P>SamH

LonelySoul,<BR> She has never told me what she needs me to do except give her space...oh and the old standby "can't we be like roommates". Even upon discovery, I have always told her that I want to correct the mistakes of the past and rebuild our marriage.<P>SamH,<BR> I agree with what you are saying and I do suspect that she is still talking to the om. However, after 10 months and absolutely NO progress (in fact it almost seems worse than before), I am seriously contemplating Plan B for my own well being. I want to hang in like you suggest, but I don't know how much more I can do.<P>Arrow

Hi Arrow -<P>I might consider some depression going on here also.....definitely signs of that possibility.<P>I am also concerned about you though!!<P>Why are you so dependent on her reactions for your plan A? Have you done all the changes you needed to do for your part in the breakdown of the marriage? Have you reached the apex with how much better a person you want to be? Have you shown a consistant new behavior? Have you done your best to provide a safe and loving environment for her so she feels comfortable in starting to open up?<P>Is your love waning because of her (the person) or her actions/inactions?<P>What did Harley say about your plan A. Is it that you are focusing too much on how much time this is taking and not enough about how much is really changing on your part?<P>I hope you don't mind the questions, I just want you to look at your heart. Starting to lovebust after supposedly Plan A'ing is not a good example that you have truly changed to her....could be perceived as just temporary actions till you get what you want. I wouldn't want that to be what she sees.....<P>I can't remember, did you say she is seeing a counselor or anyone? Perhaps they could help if depression is playing a factor in her life. <P>Hugs,<P>Sheba<BR>

Sheba,<BR> I agree that LB's now are not what I need to do...I think I might have reached the point of needing a break..for me! As for the changes, yes I have made many and she has even commented on them. So I just keep trying...<P>Arrow

Arrow...I take it you and your wife are still living together. I, too, wanted space. I didn't want it because I wanted to carry on with the OM, but because I was so confused and not sure about how I felt. I was married 16 years and to even have the EA was traumatic for me. My H would not leave. He insisted I was still talking to the OM when I was not. If I came home from work not in tears, he would insist I had talked to him. That only made me more angry. I know this is hard, but you need to talk to her about her feelings. It really does sound like she is very depressed. I don't think she would be that depressed if she were talking to the OM. If she were, she most likely would be looking for a job, and making plans to be with him. It sounds like she is just despondent over the whole thing and is having trouble coping. You most likely are being blamed for all of this unhappiness. Logical? Of course not, but right now she is not being logical. Was the OM married? Did he break it off? Did the affair ever turn into a PA? It is really important to know what she is feeling to get a handle on how to fix this. Tell her how you feel. The sad part is if she is truly depressed, she can't help acting like this. Has she lost weight, gained weight, drink too much, have trouble sleeping? One or all of these are signs of depression. I have lost 17lbs in two months and never sleep past 5 am no matter how late I stay up. I know I wake up every morning hoping I'll feel like my old self, and when I don't, it makes it all the more worse. I was unhappy in my marriage before the EA, but not as unhappy as I am now since I had it and am now trying to get over it. Its lousy and I know I have no one to blame but me. <P>How are you doing? I hope you are taking care of yourself. You need to be strong right now. I know easier said then done. <P>LS

Hi Arrow -<P>I am glad that you have done so well so far that she has noticed....<P>Sorry that you need a "break" but won't that show that these changes are not "for good"? Could be very counter productive!! You need a faith boost!!<P>C'mon you can keep this up....it's all in your perspective. What is so difficult that you need a break from being nice? That is all Plan A is.....<P>What do you think of depression being involved at this point with your wife? What are your thoughts on counseling/medical help?<P>Hugs,<P>Sheba

LonelySoul,<BR> Yes it turned into a PA. She went to stay with him and missed being home, I think. How do I get her to talk about it to me? I try and she doesn't want to. She has also said that I am her friend as long as it is what I want to hear. There is probably some truth in that statement, but I have really worked hard to just ACCEPT her feelings, but she will not open up! Any ideas.<P>Sheba,<BR> Thanks for the boost...I need that sometimes. I can always do better!!!<P>Arrow

Lonely,<BR> Yes, she is showing most all of those "depression" signs.<BR>

Arrow...<P>Is there someone your Wife trusts right now that she would listen to? Does anyone else know what is going on? It is important that your wife get to a doctor if the depression doesn't lift. She can't possibly make logical decisions right now. She most likely doesn't know herself what she wants. <P>I really don't think the OM is in the picture right now...not if she is experiencing all of that. I do think you should try to get her to talk. Approach her in a neutral way and tell her you understand her pain (even if you are not sure you do) and try your darnest to get her talk about it. If she is like me she needs to get it out there. I truly understand what she is feeling...and I think I can imagine your pain as well. Feel free to email me if you want....sapgar@excite.com.<P>Take care.