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#384172 06/07/00 06:51 PM
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I just push and push and don't seem to be able to know how to stop. My Plan A is driving my H crazy, so there is no way I am doing this right. Today he told me that it makes him feel ridiculous and embarresed that I am doing all the work on this marriage when he is the betrayer.<P>I called him today and asked him to go to a Retrouvaille weekend with me. (oh, update...he had 2 year affair, moved out two days after discovery, has been gone a month now...we see each other every few days as we have 3 kids involved in stuff. Our relationship is kind, but strained)<P>Anyway, he said he didn't want to go to Retrouvaille (sp?) but would do it for me...gag. Should I set it up? He is afraid it will be like our trip to Hawaii, which was before discovery and was a complete disaster. We know why it was a disaster (his guilt and I believe withdrawl during that time) but he is scared to death of another negative experience like that with me.<P>He has refused to get any help, and thinks the answers will come to him in a "lightning bolt" fashion...that someday he'll just wake up and know what will make him happy. I feel like this marriage will take a lot of work, and a decision has to be made to work on it or get out. <P>So...jeez I am so long winded...should I leave him alone to figure it out, or push him like I'm doing and risk driving him completley nuts?<P>

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Allison,<P>We can only hope when those lightning bolts hit, they hit all of them at once!LOL<P>Maybe you can talk to some of the people who have been to Retrouville and get some advice. Seems like people have good things to say about it. If he agreed to go I would certainly be tempted to take him up on it. Maybe the lightning will strike there.<BR>Lora

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Hi az allison -<P>The toughest part of this is figuring out how much is "too much" isn't it?<P>If you feel that you are pushing, then stop it!!! If he says he is uncomfortable - then change the way you are approaching things - else it's a lovebuster!!!!<P>I think that Retrovaille is a great idea, it's just the timing that may be off. Has he had enough time to see that life can be better with you? Have you exhibited behavior that would make him feel safe enough to be open minded about what they will say and teach?<P>You know your situation best, so it's hard to advise.....<P>You want to go when you think it would be the most beneficial. Not too soon, when he still is afraid of you because of his guilt.<P>If he said he would go, then I would check out the dates and pick one that will allow you time enough to "stop pushing" and just be caring and understanding..... not a date when you both dive in when you are so petrified of each other.<P>Hope this helps some.....<P>Big Hugs,<P>Sheba<P>

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Retrouvaille has a web site that has comments from spouses who didn't want to go and went anyway... basically it still had an impact on them... they only schedule them 4 times a year I think.. so the timing could be just right... why not try it.. if he is willing to go than go ahead and schedule it.. but then back off and give him plenty of space between now and when the session is... he does need time to sort through his thoughts and to face his guilt....In the meantime, it is really tough on you, if you are not into counseling yet.. you might want to think about it.. and do somethings for yourself so that you feel good about yourself and strong. Good luck!

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Thank you all..so much. You have help my muddled mind start to clear a bit. <P>Lora...Loved the lightning comment. Is is wrong to pray for that possiblilty? LOL I am tempted to push for this weekend now, but am leaving the final descision up to him. He told me he'd let me know tomorrow.<P>Sheba...you're so right. Isn't it funny that I'm starting to learn what a lovebuster is after all this time. It is different things to each and every one of us. My H is pretty blown away with how our seperation is going. He says he expected to be picking up our kids at the end of the block, not welcomed in with open arms. I think my behaviour is escalating his guilt! He says he does not "feel" seperated, but like he has built on an extra bedroom and moved into it. Yep, sounds like he needs some breating room.<P>I think, considering your advice, that I will shoot for the September Retro instead of the one in two weeks, and back off for a while. Thank you.<P>Nikki...Thank you for the info on the Retro web site. I went there when I read your reply and it helped so much. Another bookmark for me. Timing is important, and as much as I'm tempted to "go for it" right away, I may need to sit on this one for a bit.<BR>

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Run don't walk to Retrouvaille! If he's agreeing to go, then ease up on him until the date of your weekend.<P>My H too, was hestitant to go to a couple's retreat.It was religiously based.I know Retrouvaille,although run by Catholics, stays away from religion in their weekend.My H said the same thing,"I'll go for you.What have we got to lose?" Our previous vacation,shortly before discovery,was a distaster,like your Hawaii trip.My H left our retreat a changed man.It had a HUGE impact on our recovery and on him spiritually. It was amazing,and better yet, has lasted.<P>On the ride home from the weekend he talked about when he would be moving home. It still took him a month before he was ready,but I believe I have him 100% now. In recovery 9 months now.Go for it!

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mthrrhbrd,<P>hope i spelled your name right. May I ask you a few questions?<P>Just how hesitant was your husband?<BR>Did you feel like he was really working on the marriage before that weekend?<BR>Did either of you feel like it was a "last ditch effort?"<BR>Did you push him to go? How was his attitude when you first got there..vs..when you left?<P>LOL..now I'm probably driving you crazy in addition to my H, but I'm so scared to make another mistake. Thanks<BR>

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Hi,<BR> My H was reluctant to the point of almost saying "no". When I first approached him about it he said "I don't think so,but I'll think about it and let you know tomorrow." Appeasingly said. Keep in mind the retreat was a gift from my best friend,the matron of honor at our wedding(she and her H let us go in their place).This was a true blessing,as with H moving out we were low on cash and probably wouldn't have been able to go otherwise.A clear example of how God works in this mess.<BR>I had to have an answer from H in 24 hours. He felt pressured for sure,I could feel it.I was skeptical of a positive response.He told me later the same night that he would go(he was here ALL the time when we were separated)but only because it was a gift from my friend and her H. I think he felt like he had to prove to her that he had "tried".H was in counseling at this time also.<P>As the time drew near(I think we had a 2 week wait)for the weekend,H seemed to be a bit more positive about it,but I think it was because I really let him have his space and plan a'd him to death.His counselor was helpful also.On our way there, things were a bit tense.However,we ended up enjoying our time there.<P>Was he working on the marriage before the weekend? Well yes and no.Yes,because after d-day he almost immediately had no contact w/OW and because he sought counseling,stating he had to find out if he wanted to be married "forever".No, because he moved out,and was content to just come and go,the self centeredness was amazing.Our relationship was strained on a couples level but we were able to still enjoy parenting. It was like it was two seperate relationships.That was good for the kids.<P>Since our relationship was already strained I did have to encourage him to go,but I kept that at a bare minimum,as one of his complaints about me was that I was "trying to control him".I did not feel it was a last ditch effort,he did,and has said so.<P>Like I said it was tense on the way there but he loosened up. As I mentioned the retreat was a church sponsered retreat.I was worried that this would be a turn off to H,who had lost himself spiritually.He softened to it and the weekend was a huge success.It was like the speakers were hand picked for our situation and we (not belonging to this particular church)were very warmly welcomed and made to feel comfortable.I know God worked a powerful miracle in my H's heart that weekend.I am so blessed.My H has continued to go to church from the weekend of the retreat,7 months ago.We just started a couple's bible study.He's working very hard,personally to be a better H.I think God hit us over the head with a 2x4 with this mess. I am truly thankful.<P>So, I say go. I wouldn't wait until September.This mess is too painful to wait all summer.Can you endure this that long? You also risk H becoming even more entanged w/OW.If he's willing,no matter on what pretense,I say you have to go. He might not be willing in three months.Seize the day!

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When my H and I signed up for Retrouvaille, one member of the hosting (for lack of a better term) couple called us up individually and queried us as to our motivation for going. Reluctance to go was fine, but they wanted to make sure there was no coercion. They also wanted to confirm that there was no active substance abuse or OP involved. According to their guidelines, these issues (active substance abuse and an "active" affair) are beyond their scope.<P>Don't know all your particulars, but this is just food for thought.<P>------------------<BR>RobinAnn<P>*********<P>Miracles occur naturally as expressions of love. The real miracle is the love that inspires them. In this sense everything that comes from love is a miracle.<P>Marianne Williamson


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