This is in response to the post below about "I'm not a whore". It brings up an interesting question. What exactly is a whore and what is a bad person ? The OW in my case was a whore IMO. She admittedly pursued a married man, informed me she could care less about the pain she caused me or our families. She actually said she was GLAD that I hurt!Claimed I couldn't have been hurt more than her. LOL the stupid cow was involved with him for less than 6 months! If I behaved like her I would fully expect to be called a whore and wear that badge proudly because I had earned and deserved it. Yes, my H did a totally sleazebag thing too but he admits it, is ashamed of it, has repented over and over. He also said over and over "I am a bad person". I of course don't think he is a bad person, but at the time he was having the afffair he sure was. I don't think all OP or WS are whores or bad people. Only the ones who aren't sorry for what they did. And I mean really sorry, not just sorry for themselves that hey didn't get what they wanted. One funny thing though _ I've mentioned my high school frioend who was constantly screwing other girl's BFs. It was so tedious every month to hear "I think I might be pregnant and I don't know who's it is" "I think I might have an STD and I don't know who from" This girl was a bona fide slut. She thought it was funny when the hurting GFs would push her up against lockers. She felt like she was somehow better than the the GFs because that girl's BF had sex with her.If there was a party there was a 100% chance that she'd be boinking someone in a car. The whole school thought she was a whore and she got really mad and didn't get it at all. She was constantly saying "I am not a whore and I refuse to be called one" But she was! To me a whore or bad person is someone who sees no wrongdoing in the things they have done, especially when those things have caused so much pain to others.

Fairydust,<P>Didn't get to read the post you were referring to, but I can say I've had the same thoughts you do.<P>THe OW in our case had no remorse either-- or so she said. As far as I know, she's never been married and probably doesn't understand the bond that is created between H and W. THerefore, she doesn't understand the immense pain caused by the affair.<P>YOu and I would label people such as these as whores, where they may see themselves merely as "sexually open" or perhaps just very desirable.<P>Why don't they feel guilt about what they do? Perhaps they just weren't raised with the understanding that adultery is wrong. Maybe they were in families where adultery occured. Some people are brought up to be deceitful and selfish. They're taught that's the way to get ahead-- to get yours.<P>But as we see over time, they usually end up with very little. Selfish people- and I think these type of OW who have no problems with breaking up marriages- often end up alone. When real relationships develop, they can't continue in a healthy way when one person is so selfish.<P>I also think these people, like the girl in HS you describe-actually have a low self-esteem. They feed off the affection and attention of others to feel good. They simply can't feel good without it. These are the people who focus on seeing others down-- as opposed to doing their best in life for them. They must do things at others expense, because they simply don't believe their efforts are worthwhile on their own.<P>There is a tiny bit of me that feels sorry for the OW in my case, because I think she'll never find real happiness.<P>She mocked the institution of marriage and all that goes with it. She made it out to be so hokey and glorified living dangerously and for the moment. When all the while, she most likely wishes to meet a man to marry and to trust.<P>Will these "whores" ever change? Probably not. But they see the world in an entirely different way. We can only approach our lives the way we were taught to. If our WSs wish to stay on that road with us great. We've all had periods in our lives, where we've been influenced by some "different" people. The important thing is to learn from it and get back on the right track.

fairydust,<P>This struck a nerve in me too. The OW in my case was a whore from the word go. If anyone who is offended by that would like to go and meet her and then tell me she ISN'T, I would like to know about it. Yeah, yeah it's a mean word. Frankly, it's the nicest one I can think of to describe her.<P>No, it's not fun to be filled with so much anger toward another person. Yes, one day I will need to come to some place of forgiveness for her, for my own sake. Not today. <P>So what is a whore? I call her that first of all because she barely wears clothes. I know of three married men she has pursued, including my own, and one man she pursued as soon as he got engaged.<P>I have heard her with my own ears making trashy sex talk with married men in the workplace. And she talked this way to every man in the workplace, whether she was bagging him yet or not. She chose to start working on my H when I was pregnant. She knew me and my small son.<P>She would pick up my H near our home and go have sex with him before work. She would meet him for lunch and have sex during the lunch break. During the nine month affair, he spent the night a handful of times with her, otherwise she was content to perform her services during lunch. <P>She decided she hated me (I was nothing but kind to her ever) and would call me a b***h. She tried to destroy my children and my family. Because of this my three year old son developed stomach problems that were emotional in origin. I became practically suicidal and definitely non-functional. <P>Somehow she tried to convince my H that it was MY fault they were sleazing around. <P>After the affair ended I confronted her and was very civil. She then proceeded to bad mouth me and tell everyone at the workplace how she was victimized. One last attempt to harm me and my family.<P>That night we heard she was publically hanging all over some other guy... The cycle begins again... You tell me, she's NOT a WHORE???<P>As for my H, I make no excuse for him. And believe me, I have called him every name in the book as well. For his part, he has repented. Goes to counseling every week. He has gotten on much needed anti-depressants. He tells me daily how sorry he is and for the past three months has been 100% devoted to making things right. If that can be done... <P>If she changes her life, and I hope for every family in America that she does, then I will cease to call her a whore. But how she was during this time is whorish and that is THAT. <BR> <p>[This message has been edited by Dead Inside (edited July 19, 2000).]

OUCH! AND, OH MY!<P>My H's OW is a beautiful, loving, caring individual that simply made a "wrong turn". I wish her peace and happiness....WITH ALL MY HEART.<P><BR>-------------------------------------------<BR>Some inspiration for us all:<P>If we practice an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, soon the whole world will be blind and toothless. ~Gandhi<P>To forgive is to set a prisoner free and discover the prisoner was YOU. ~unknown<P>I will permit no man to narrow and degrade my soul by making me hate him. ~Booker T. Washington<P>Peace to us all, ~Marie<P><BR>

On the whore issue....<P>If my W only had an affair with a "whore" man, it would be so much easier to win her back. Instead she's having it with a good bloke. Makes one think....

To Van,<BR> You have a valid point. I guess in a way I'm glad my H had an affair with a person like this and not a "good" person. Of course OW didn't present her true self when the affair started. He would have run away quite quickly. It took awhile for the snake to shed it's skin. Her behavior made coming home look infinitely more appealing to him.

I don't like labels. I'm also a stickler about semantics. When I refer to my H's OW, I simply refer to her as an adultress, because that is the most semantically appropriate label I can think of without name calling or flowering her up with romantic names like "mistress" or "lover" or, even worse, ambiguous descriptors like "my h's friend" (sorry ... I don't sleep with my "friends!). I also tend to refer to my H as an adulterer. To me, these words are laden with meaning, as per my beliefs that cheating is morally wrong, and yet it's not casting someone down in an entirely negative light. <P>I think that my H's adultress was actually pretty nice to him, and in any other circumstances, I think that we could have been friends. Mutual friends who describe her say that she was like a lesser version of myself, but I think they only think this because she was the adultress in the situation, and that prevented them from viewing her in an entirely positive light. If she hadn't been an adultress, maybe we would on an equal level. But simply the fact that she did what she did made her and him, in our mutual friends' eyes and in my own eyes, people who weren't really morally astute at the time the EMR was going on.<P>This is my feeling on the subject: you only wear the label as long as you're committing the crime, IMHO. Once I know for a fact that my H has severed contact, he will no longer be an adulterer, and she will no longer be an adultress.<P>belld

For what it's worth, a "whore" generally refers to a woman who performs sexual favors for personal, financial gain. The word is generally synonymous with prostitute. <P>During the course of time, the term has evolved in common usage to refer more generally to a woman of loose moral values, not just a prostitute. (I agree that there are plenty of men who have the same characteristics, but the fact remains that the term generally refers to women. Not really fair, but, then, I didn't make up the word.)<P>I think the points that have been made here are important: Using the term here to refer to any member or user of the site is inappropriate. If it makes you feel better to refer to the OP in your situation as a "whore," then by all means, go ahead. <P>Let's all remember not to personalize someone ELSE's situation with our own.<P>------------------<BR>/// Lone Star * ///<P>