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Lora Offline OP
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I was talking to my counseler and something she said has been nagging at me. We were talking about letting go, and love and she said if I loved my H and wanted him to be happy, maybe he would be happy with OW....<P>I thought about it and went back and told her NEVER. I do love him and want him to be happy. If we were divorced I think I could want him to be happy with another woman one day.. but never OW. If they get together I will be hopping they are not the affair couple that beats the statistics.<P>Does anyone else feel this way or am I being unforgiving and petty? Do you think I should try and get to that point? I tell you it makes me angry just thinking about it. <BR>I don't think I can do it. What about the rest of you?<BR>Lora

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I hear ya! I felt that way too.<BR>I guess "time" has changed how I feel.<BR>I've told my H if she is so wonderful by all means, go to her. Then the truth came out.<BR>She doesn't want him. She wants her independance, doesn't want to put forth what a marriage entails. <BR>I started working on ME how I could become a better person. If that is the life he wanted . By all means go for it...<BR>Well he is now realizing the grass isn't greener on the other side. I guess he realized if you don't "water" the grass at the second home too, it still dies...<BR>Could I have TOLD him that , no remember he just thought I wanted to deny him happiness.<BR>Sometime have have to see it for themselves...<BR>So you too can focus on Yourself, and when you do that, (without LB) he will see the true colors of his new lawn....<BR>When you change, people around you change...<BR>So change for the better. <BR>Let him make his own mistakes...just be there when he's ready to reTHINK what he's done and who he's left, and what he really had with you.<BR>Good Luck<BR>This will in time make YOU a stronger and better person....

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My H and I worked things out and are very much a success story. However, if we hadn't and he had wanted to be with OW I wouldn't have just "wished them well". I would have made sure that OW's life was just as disrupted as mine, only fair isn't it? Everyone she knew, was related to, worked wiht etc. would know what kind of person she was and how she "got her man"lol. As far as H, well he would not only have had the punishment of having to live with a nutcase, he would have been paying out the nose to me in child support and alimony. OW would have been very disappointed that teh lavish lifestyle she was expecting him to provide would have been eaten up with legal bills and support. I never voiced any of this to H by the way and thankfully we nevr got anywhere close to that point. My own little evil fantasy I guess, but I would have done it.

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We all realize that counselors are in the business of helpinbg people to become emotionally healthy, but don't you want to GAG sometimes at phrases such as "Don't lower yourself to that level" or "No one can make unhappy if you don't allow them to" or (my personal favorite) "Seeking evenge will not make you feel better andyou wil only end up hurting yourself." Oh, really???? I know it isn't a very noble, loving thought on my part, but if I could force some serious REVENGE on the OW, I would feel WONDERFUL!<P>It is a sad but true fact of life that usually people do NOT get what they deserve..either the bad OR the good. One thing that has hampered my recovery (nearing 2 years so far) is the injustice of all of this. The OW has been a suburban princess all her life, first living off her father, then her father's big bucks inheritance, then her husband, then his big bucks inheritance after he killed himself over her, and now my husband through a large child support figure for the baby she conceived in hopes of holding on to him.<P>Revenge? You bet. She lounges by her pool and "does lunch" with friends, etc. while I get myself to work every day, as I have had to do all my life and will continue to do until well beyond my eligible retirement age because we have to pay such large support. Meanwhile, she's enjoying the lap of luxury while we have to go out to borrow money to send the last of our kids through college.<P>My counselor says I should feel very proud that I am doing the "right" "honorable" thing, and that should be very comforting. Wellllllll, in my "other life" before the afair, I was able to act more honorably. But now that all of this has happened, and I no longer view the world through "rose-colored glasses" I understand that honor and nobility get you what it gets all martyrs....burned!!<BR>The worst part of all of this is that I really miss the person I used to be just as I miss the man I thought I married.<P>So, to make a long story longer in response to your post, Lora, don't feel guilty about not wanting your H and OW to "live happily ever after." (You would be shocked at what I would wish for my H and the OW if they were ever to reunite.) They don't deserve it.

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Heck No! If my H left me for OW, no one could ever convince me to wish them well. Why should I wish them well while my kids & I are treated like crap???<P>Don't feel guilty about how you are feeling about this. They aren't the victims, you are!

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Your counselor has somehow managed to take SEVERAL issues, and throw them in the same pot and called them stew....<P>not is right!<P>1st of all, Wanting happiness for someone does not include endorsing sin. <P>If your kids are happy smoking pot, are you going to embrace the pot for your kids happiness and call it forgiveness? not.<P>adultery is adultery, and it is wrong, and its conseqence is not good. Sin is by definition in the Bible as "short lived pleasure". <P>Your husbands affair will not bring him Lasting Happiness, no matter how happy he starts the affair out with. Happiness cannot last, because sin is short lived pleasure.<P>I'm sure you want happiness for your husband, but you want what is good for him also. We want happiness for our kids, but we don't hand our kids a joint, do we? Same thing in my book.<P>Get a new counselor. She's mixing apples and oranges.

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Lora Offline OP
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Thanks for the responses. Sometimes I don't trust myself and my feelings anymore. I feel like it would take a saint to get to the place where I can wish them to be happy. And I know I'm not a saint. LOL<P>So I will keep working on me, but my prayers for OW run more along the lines of her finding a single guy to lavish all of her attention on, or for her to take a good long look at what she is doing and for her to be aware that she needs to make some changes in her life.<BR>Lora

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trustntruth...<P>I may have to wonder why I'm here...<P>...you say all the things I want to say... [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>...thanks! ... I agree!<P> [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>Jim

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I'm now divorced.....Do I wish him well....hell no! I hope he falls flat on his face. I don't think I am any different than anyone else. How can I wish him well after everything he did to our children, our family and me.<P>Of course that doesn't mean that I still don't have feelings, good feelings for him. I do, but only if he apologizes and starts doing things that are right will I entertain the "good" thoughts and wishful thinking for him.

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>If we were divorced I think I could want him to be happy with another woman one day.. but never OW...am I being unforgiving and petty? </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>OW is who you feel in direct competition with. She'd be the "Winner", you the "Loser". <P>But if you divorced and he married a woman totally unfamiliar to you, she wouldn't be the one chosen over you in "the game" so to speak. Not hard to understand at all, Hon. <P>The only point you need to "get to" is one where you feel good about yourself and which is mentally healthy for you. Forgiveness won't come to all of us. But I think it's sweet and a sign of the goodness in your heart that you would even worry for a nanosecond about feeling that way.<P>I wish OW ecstasy with someone else as well. Not a popular sentiment, I know.<P>But if they ended up together, I think I'd have some satisfaction in knowing their fantasy about how perfect the other person is will come crashing down to earth after they've had a chance to live in Realityland for a while. They've devised total myths about eachother that no one could possibly live up to 24/7. I'd give up any alimony for front row seats of that!<P>Then I could wish them well out of sheer pity. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<p>[This message has been edited by Leilana (edited August 01, 2000).]

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When my sweetie tells me that his girl "didn't make him crazy like I do," I keep telling my H that he is so very welcome to go back to his lady. It would prove my point that the fussing and fighting didn't originate with me. I am not the one with anger problems. The day that I stopped crying and kissing his butt and started ignoring his outbursts, that's the day he began his search for another girl.<P>When you sh** in your own bed for so long, I guess the next thing to do is to look for another to sleep in.<P>She laid it on so thick about how wonderful he is, and he thought the sun rose at her command because she worshipped him.<P>I would love to see them move in together (as she had begged) and to see what life is really like: jobs, bills, step-children, (boy, she would just love my ADD kid!)not to mention the temper tantrums that I mentioned before hand. And her ability to cry at the drop of a hat--he HATED it when I cried, but it seemed to be an endearing trait in HER. He was right there to "comfort" her in her little troubles.<P>I sound bitter, but I am not in the least. But I DO know that I am right, without a shadow of a doubt. This could be a match made in "heaven," (yeah, right) and maybe it could be what the doctor ordered to show him that he really has been a jerk for all these years.

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This post rally strikes a cord with me...that is why I posted elsewhere that I am not a nice person.<P>H is with a bimbo (and I am being kind)<BR>33 months into affair, 18 months since d-day and 15 months separated, 12 months since any contact really with H (other than the few times that I have iniated this)<P>The devestation he has wrought is huge for our 4 kids....he will not discuss anything about them with me..."they are all fine" NOT<P>So I wish them a stinking future (they have just moved into the home he has bought them...while I am legally fighting him for financial support etc...which he thinks he does not have to give as I can afford to live without him and pay for kids.....<P>I hope he walks into HIS bedroom and finds ow in bed with a young stud...(I fantasize about hiring one and to set this up!!!!)<P>I hope this relationship fails and she walks out on him and then fights him for his money........<P>I do not wish them well.<P>For MY sake she is good for my ego...healthy men do not leave their wives and families for this......but this is so wrong for my kids to have to accept and live with to see the parody of their father the @sshole.....<P>In reality I hope it fails...so that the next ow I can speak to about my daughter's needs so that she will be able to "better" educate H about the children's issues.<P>I also fantasize that H (who is consumed by his "financial and status sucess" falls flat on his face somewhat...but not to the extent that he gets legal financial support from me!!!!<P>I have got over my anger, a lot of my bitterness etc...it has taken a long time and I am happy with life for the most part.....will I ever forgive him...NO,, not until he acknowledges the mess he made and took zero responsibility for.<BR>Do I need to forgive him to move forward ....no, I do not believe I do.<P>Have I accepted this ...absolutely and I am a pragmatic and level headed person.<P>Will I take what I have learned in a very hard lesson with me in my future...absolutely....but nowhere is it scripted that I will have good feelings for this man and women as they parade through life as a couple!!!!!

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Bimbo is the right word.<P>I can understand having an affair. I can understand having an obsession for a married man. I feel empathy for those caught in this net. It's hard on all involved.<P>But I cannot understand or have empathy for a girl who takes a man right away from his children, whatever the circumstance. There is pathology and sickness right there. That is why I have a difficult time forgiving the OW in my case. She dumped her own child and then pleaded with my H to move in with her. He resisted, because he felt that he could not let his son grow up without a father in the home (forget his wife, me--but I have gotten over that. A little.) She said: "you divorce a spouse, not a child." When he still resisted, she said "I would raise your kid like my own, because he is a part of you."<P>Oh, boy, did I call her on that one. I was so mad! How dare she? Dump her own child and then offer to raise mine. Whatever.<P>Bimbo, bimbo, bimbo! And how could a guy be happy with a female like that? He's gotta be crazy!<P>Wish them lotsa luck, willbok, cuz they will be needing all they can get.

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Oh Lora,<P> Those counselers are a dime a dozen,I swear.I've been to two of them,and I think people who can't do anything else become counselers,or used-car salesmen!<BR> <BR>The first one I took the W to,right after her A started,didn't know Jack-[censored] about infidelity,or the symptoms of an affair.He told her to go ahead and move out,to"find out"what she wanted.The rest is history.<P> But I'm with you.<BR> NO,I don't want her to find TRUE HAPPINESS with BoyToy.I WANT her to discover just how easy she had it with me.I've talked to divorced women who left due to abuse,drugs,alcoholism,violence,etc,and it made me realize just how much I spoiled her.<BR> <BR>After everything else she got,she just wanted a new man,too.Frankly,I hope he cheats on her.Though it may put her over the edge,it would be a big dose of reality.<BR>Gee,I guess I'm still mad about the whole thing. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P> <BR>What goes around.........(We can only hope)<P><BR> ~~Murph/NextDoorNeighbor [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>

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Lora Offline OP
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Willbok, Tell us how you really feel. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<BR>I guess we are all in agreement then. We do not have to wish them a happy life. Although maybe we can get to the feeling that they desearve each other.<P>My counseler is usually better than that, when I explained my feelings she agreed with me, but I just wondered if i was the only one that felt that way. Maybe if I ever move on to a new relationship myself, I will at least not care what they do. Naa, I still think I will want them to fail.<BR>Lora

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Forgive and forget and wish them well...no I'm not there yet...and not sure ever will be.<P>There is understanding in me for the person who unintentionally falls in love with someone else while seeking to heal their own problems and, if such was the case with my H, I might...might be the optimum word here...be able to eventually forgive enough to move on with no resentment in my heart.<P>But the OW or OM who is basically on the make for a vunerable person...looking for someone to take advantage of...someone to manipulate...basically an animal of prey...this person I find hard to forgive.<P>And this is my H's OW...someone who came into his life with the express purpose of using him for her own purposes...in total disregard for his life, his career, his reputation, anything but what she could gain from a relationship with him. <P>No...I don't think I can forgive her...and I doubt that she would ever see that there was a need for forgiveness...she doesn't see the harm in what's she done...as long as she got what she wanted.<P>Maybe forgiveness is for me...but forgiveness for me begins when the person who has done the harm asks for that forgiveness and indicates that they realize the harm they have done.<P>Buffy<P>

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Forgive and forget and wish them well...no I'm not there yet...and not sure ever will be.<P>There is understanding in me for the person who unintentionally falls in love with someone else while seeking to heal their own problems and, if such was the case with my H, I might...might be the optimum word here...be able to eventually forgive enough to move on with no resentment in my heart.<P>But the OW or OM who is basically on the make for a vunerable person...looking for someone to take advantage of...someone to manipulate...basically an animal of prey...this person I find hard to forgive.<P>And this is my H's OW...someone who came into his life with the express purpose of using him for her own purposes...in total disregard for his life, his career, his reputation, anything but what she could gain from a relationship with him. <P>No...I don't think I can forgive her...and I doubt that she would ever see that there was a need for forgiveness...she doesn't see the harm in what's she done...as long as she got what she wanted.<P>Maybe forgiveness is for me...but forgiveness for me begins when the person who has done the harm asks for that forgiveness and indicates that they realize the harm they have done.<P>Buffy<P>

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This is YOUR marriage. Your H is breaking HIS sacred vows. SHE is not honoring YOUR marriage.<P>Wish them well? NOT!!!<P>Loved what TNT said (always do).<P>Another analogy would be a valued employee stealing from your business or someone kidnapping your child.<P>Would you wish them well? Unless you are a real screw ball, you would try to reclaim what is yours, plus expect them to pay legal as well as natural consquences.<P>Then, for your own mental health, you may try to come to a place of forgiveness and peace (that does not relieve them of the consequences of their own actions).<P>Wish them well? I would have had to breath into a paper bag if I heard those words from a counselor. <P>Lora, your thinking is just fine.<P>


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