Generally speaking H has been just as kind and considerate as I have been in my plan A. Twice in the last week he has called and literally chewed me out over care decisions re: our son.<P>Last Thurs. I left S with H's sister for 3.5 hours and went to place (H works there) with some friends (also his friends). Drank, had fun, H came out and talked a lot, made me some dinner - I didn't even ask - he just brought it out. You all probably remember that OW's H (who was with us) showed up at my house that night and the fiasco that turned out to be.<P>H called next day very angry I left S with SIL. Said I need to make better decisions about his care - not have people over all the time, etc. Said it was about time S started coming to his apt. I told him that was his decision if he thought S was ready and I thanked him for his opinions and advice on the care of S and apologized for angering him.<P>Now - H's mother needed me to testify for her in court today - long drive for me and SIL. We left kids with their other aunt. H finds out and calls me at midnight to YELL at me about leaving S with other aunt. I reminded him he offered her as a suggestion in our previous discussion - he said he didn't mean OVERNIGHT. Berated me for not calling and asking him first. I told him I was doing the best I could and the last few months I have tried to make it easy for him to see S. (Letting him borrow car for weeks at a time, cancelling plans to be available for him, etc.) He said he appreciated that - then went right on yelling. He told me he left ME not S. I again apologized, but told him it wasn't practical to call him for EVERY decision and didn't understand why he was so angry. He hatefully said, "Well I guess I'll just have to get over it - Bye."<P>Now, I know this conversation took place in front of OW. I know my H is temporarily insane. I know and have lowered my expectations. But I do not love this man. I do not even know this man.<P>What scares me is this - say Plan A works, he comes home. Will I be so far into withdrawal that I can't contribute what I need to make it work? I just don't know how to handle him right now. I want to talk with him - I think it is time I told him I love him and want our marriage to work. But I know he still doesn't want to hear it. I feel like if I don't tell him now - I might not even mean it later.<P>PLEASE GIVE ME SOME POINTERS HERE!!!! I'M BEGGING - how do you all handle your unreasonable, hostile spouses in Plan A??????<P>Cali

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cali:<BR><B>PLEASE GIVE ME SOME POINTERS HERE!!!! I'M BEGGING - how do you all handle your unreasonable, hostile spouses in Plan A??????<BR>Cali</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Hi Cali,<P>Well, Plan B, Steve Harley reiterated to me last week on the phone, is chiefly to save YOUR love, when constant negative contact is draining your lovebank.<P>Cali, since I've been talking to Steve I realize the need for so many here to get true professional advice and not the inexperienced opinions you'll gewt here (with 6 or 8 veteran exceptions who will probably get it right 99% of the time, like Karenna, JL, Lostva, K, NSR, etc.)<P>Plan B is a big step. The benefit would be that lovebusting discussions like you repeat above would be stopped, saving your love for your husband until he commits to rebuilding the marriage. He will also get a rude awakening as to what his rights will be in the upbringing of his child if he proceeds on the path he is setting for divorce (hint: they willnot include input to daily decisions like he seems to assume now).<P>Cali....call Steve Harley. You've done a great job in Plan A, and have had the patience of a saint. Yes a slip or two, but we are all human. <P>And, c'mon now, don't say that you can't afford the $95...you wouldn't press on support saying you had plenty of bucks <BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>What scares me is this - say Plan A works, he comes home. Will I be so far into withdrawal that I can't contribute what I need to make it work? I just don't know how to handle him right now. I want to talk with him - I think it is time I told him I love him and want our marriage to work. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I'm pretty much where you are at now, except I can honestly say I do not love my wife & I do not know her anymore. However, I have chosen to "play the game" for 2 years. I told Steve Harley I would do this because of everything I have read, his advice, his fathers advice that affairs end, love can be rekindled & marriages can be rebuilt stronger than ever.<P>I'm sorta scared to death right now that she <B>may</B> decide to want to come home!<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Cute, Mike - real cute. <P>I'm about there - I have an appt. with a child psychologist Tues with my son. I am going to invite H to go with us if he wants. This is to learn how to proceed in introducing S to H's new apt. and OW.<P>I have a business trip end of next week. When I come back I'm making the appt. with Harley. Worst case - it doesn't help and I spent a RELATIVELY measley $95 to assure myself of the right things to do.<P>I'm afraid to move to Plan B. Guess that's one of the things I'll talk to Harley about. I feel like if I can stand calm, respectful and kind in the face of the adversity he seems to be swinging at me - then maybe THAT will get through to him. Maybe all the little Plan A "niceties" are lost on him right now. But it does seem to baffle him when I'm calm and supportive in an argument he's trying to initiate. Definitely doesn't follow my past track record.<P>Time to psyche myself up for those anti-deps if that's going to be my course, huh?<P>So, Mike - I read your post after your session with Harley. I hope he's the all-powerful, knowing OZ that everyone believes him to be. I need some tangible direction.<P>Thanks for your insight. I do think I'm eventually going to have to go for Plan B. He doesn't seem to want to get off the fence - I know it's only been 3 months . And I told myself I'd Plan A for 6. We'll see what Harley says.<P>Chris - question:<P>Have you been in Plan A for 2 years? Or is that the limit you've set for yourself? Where can I find your story?<P>Thanks!<P>Hey EVERYONE - anyone know if Lostva had to deal with anger and irrational behavior from her spouse? I always see the notable posts logging her actions and efforts - but very little detailing what she was up against.<P>And HEY! Where's JL and Kathi? <P>Thanks again everyone,<P>Cali

My Story is still messed up in this version of software. [b]HOPEFULLY[/], Steve will get it fixed within a few weeks. They are supposed to start a new version of the MB website in Sept.<P>Anyhoo, my wife (married 20.5 years, 2 daughters 15 & 9) had an affair starting in Aug 98. I found out Christmas night, 98. OM had just left town (construction worker) before Christmas. Wife went on vacation to see old girlfriend and om was working in same state.<P>She left on 17 Feb 98 and has not seen the kids since May 98. She took 2 suitcases with her. I have the kids, the house, the dog, the cars, etc. Everything. She usually calls about once a week but recently she only calls every 2-3 weeks. Today, my oldest daughter is 15 (Happy Birthday Michele!) and she hasn't called for 4 weeks. She did send a card with a $100.<P>Basically I have been in Plan A since a month before discovery. Very difficult actually have any influence since she does not communicate with me. I last spoke to her early July. However, I do send her a card every week or so. Just a short note, hope everythings okay, kids start school next week, yada, yada. Nothing too deep.<P>Most people say affairs die within 2 years of discovery, so this is my time frame. We'll see what happens in the next few months.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Cali:<P>At 3 months, I'd suggest that you get on those anti-depressants. They can help you in keeping your patience with Plan A. I went on them about 2.5 months into the process, and they really did help.<P>Mike is right on target, Plan B is to save your love for your wayward spouse. You may be getting close. I know that I went through the last couple months of Plan A wavering. One minute I felt as though I could do it forever. The next day, I was ready to leave. I did counsel with Steve through that---and although I wouldn't call him OZ, he was collecting data on my mental state and my love for my wife (through the love bank inventory form), and he helped me with the decision to go to Plan B. I though it might have been too early at the time---but I think he made the right call. A huge mistake is staying in Plan A too long---you can end up in plan D(ivorce) right away.<P>And speaking for Chris---he's been in plan A for most (all?) of this time, but his wife left him very early on. Plan A is somewhat easier to endure when you're not faced with daily contact from the affair; and Chris and terri are prime examples of long-term Plan A'ers.<P>And speaking TO Chris---hey, you're feelings are completely on-target and very natural. Just remember to give Steve a call should she decide to come home---you're going to need behavioral modification techniques to keep from thottling here (or drowning her in Pepsi...)<P>

WOW - do I feel silly bi#^%ing! <P>Do you have other posts on here somewhere?? I need to read read read. Where do you get your strength? What about resentment over the way she's treated her children? <P>Does she comment about the cards you send? How do you do this without ticking off the OP? For which the WS will simply start telling them your psyco? (I perceive that's what would happen if I tried the Lostva weekly happenings report).<P>I truly admire your endurance. Wow, you must have loved her so much to be willing to go through this to have a better life together. I'm simply amazed - how do you keep going? That's what I fundamentally want to do - I just don't know how.<P>Still stunned and in awe,<P>Cali

K,<P>Since you & me are both <B>not</B> posting here... hehehe<P>I talked with Steve in June and discussed what to do. Keep sending cards/letters to keep me "in front of her" so I'm at least in her mind a bit. Also, in the next month or so I should try to set up a face-to-face meeting with her and discuss everything, everything, everything, <B>except</B> my timeline, which is sometme early next year. I can at least sorta judge where she is in their relationship.<P>Cali,<P>I do have posts, but the search on this forum is not the best.<P>Strength comes from God and this forum mostly.<P>No she does not comment on the cards. Hasn't since day 1. I send them to wankboys (term of endearment for om) parents house since she is always on the road & have no residence. I make sure I put a Chris & Donna return address label on it.<P>I did show up at their house back in April when the kids were on break, but they weren't there. I let his mom know I was her husband & she was my wife, but she didn't bat an eye.<P>I don't care if I tick off the op. It would be kinda fun if you ask me. <P>Love is grand, isn't it? We have 20 + years together so I can't just toss it away. Let's see what happens.<BR>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A><p>[This message has been edited by Chris (CA123) (edited August 30, 2000).]

K - <P>Thanks for the perspective - much needed indeed. You're right, 3 months isn't long and I'd hate to quit if I could have done it so much longer and BETTER with the anti-deps.<P>I think you're on target about the daily contact. I've noticed myself slipping into these depression/anger/poorme/frustration phases when he comes around or calls frequently. He has either called or come over every single day for almost two weeks. I think I need a break from him! <P>Harley sounds like a good coach. I know these decisions will be hard - hopefully he can provide the expertise I need to make the best guess possible.<P>Thanks for your insight, I still have so much to learn.....<P>Cali

Hi Cali,<P>Just a guess, but his outbursts may be that guilt is starting to get to him. But he can't take it out on himself right? So you get the blast, but it seems to me you are definitely having an impact on him.<P>Plus does he know about you and OW's H? If that rumor is rattling around, then he maybe getting a little angry and afraid of losing you.<P>Listen to K and Chris, they are the pro's. But as usual time and patience, T&P Cali.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

OK - so you all know I used to think that JL was really Steve in disguise.....<P>Well now I know - I finally figured it out:<P>JL, tell me straight, you're my Dad, aren't you?<P>Thanks - I've been waiting to hear from you all day. You're probably right (gee, big surprise ) - just didn't want to get into wishful thinking. <P>BTW - how do you manage to say so much with so few words? You're so efficient. While here I am running onnnnn...... and onnnnnn.......<P>and onnn........<P>Cali<P>

Cali,<P>Well, it easy to be succinct when you follow Chris and K. And sadly am old enough to be your Dad, I suspect. But sometimes it is best to apply the KISS technique to these things Cali. Don't over analyze, just look for the obvious.<P>By the way, did you know that is one of the definitions of genius? The ability to see the obvious. <P>So you are getting there (genius status) . You may ultimately need to go to Plan B, but if you are seeing him daily, and he is grumbling ) don't you love it, then it seems to me you are getting his attention.<P>I believe it was K or NSR that Harley stated that said 3-6 months is when things start to turn around, up to two years for full recovery. Well, you are starting to see changes aren't you? <P>Hang on for the rollercoaster ride, but do get the counseling with the Harleys. I suspect it will provide you much more confidence in what you are doing.<P>God Bless,<P>JL