Good to hear that you and Ali are starting to recover. It takes time. Just be patient and take care of each other…. One day at a time.

A hint about being away a lot and then having chores to do when you get home. My H & I went through this. Our relationship and our family were more important than the chores.

Figure out what really has to be done. This mean eliminating most of the ‘wants’. Make some of it into a recreational activity if you can. For example we are landscaping our back yard… it’s pretty elaborate. No lawn .. all flagstone and gravel (we live in the desert) 4 levels of flower beds, 3 ponds… and a Jacuzzi coming up next. We made this a hobby. It’s something we work on together. So it gets done as we have time. Planning and shopping for supplies, etc are a date. We love it.

We even make painting the house seems like a date with pizza, soda, music… etc. It’s all in how you look at it. I’m one of those people who look at everything as an excuse for a party so this outlook is easy for me. When STL was traveling.. I was still working full time but I tried to make sure that the only things I asked him to help with when he was not traveling were our ‘hobby’ activities and spending time with our children and me.

Everything else we paid someone else to do. If I have to pay the kids to do it I will. There’s a hard working high school kid next door who is always looking for money. I found someone to come in once a week and do the deep cleaning, and so forth.

Right now this is a little bit harder for us to do ‘cause H has been unemployed since Oct. So I let him and the kids take care of everything except our ‘hobbies’. I only do the fun stuff. We now have even more time on our hands.

RandyR and Ali that's WONDERFUL! Putting on your Wedding Rings is very encouraging, thank you for sharing with us. We really were beginning to get a little concerned about you two.
Just one last thought - is there any reason y'all can give us why you two shouldn't take those pics of OtherWoman out to the back and have a 'bar-b-que' with them??? Why keep them? I can see no good coming of keeping those reminders around your house. Sort of like when someone quits smoking - they get rid of all evidence(s) they ever smoked: ashtray, cigarette butts, lighters, etc. Same with these pics - get rid of 'em!!
JMHO.
May the Lord bless you both on your Road to Recovery.
Harold

Randy,

I've been following your thread for a long time. You were unhappy in your life circumstances. You went for the OW who promised you the world. She lied. She broke your heart and in the rude awakening that followed, you realized that you, too, broke many hearts.

Your anger tells me you are still grieving for OW, for the way she made you feel. Your hate is a measure of how much she hurt you.

You last post shows a note of calm, a hint of "getting it." Perhaps now you will see that Ali, if given half a chance, can make you feel better than OW ever did.

Maybe that is why Ali feels she could put on her rings again. Maybe she thinks you are finally getting it.

Randyrail,
I have been reading your post for months now. I am kind of new here at Marriage builders because this is my first time posting.
I was in the same boat you were in. I had an affair with a coworker that destroyed my wife. To make a long story very short. I was working late hours with the ow. She always flirted with me from day one. She somehow arranged that we got assigned to same project together. From there she was on to me like a shark in a sea full of chum. We had to work late hours. And that is when it all started. Even after the project ended, I was still telling my wife that it was still on. I lied to her that I had to go out of town to discuss details with our client. It all back fired on me when there was a company party and she found out that the project was long over with and the biggest was the fact that she noticed my cell phone bills. She called the ow without my acknowledgment. The affair ended right there.
After months of therapy, the conclusion? I did it for a self gratifying adventure! She wasn't even my type. All I know now is that my wife and I are on the way to recovery but I will tell you, she is still hurting. I, as a husband am supposed to protect her from this kind of hell. I let her down and she still feel vulnerable and weak. I can see how much I have hurt her. I am so sorry for what I did!
Randyrail, after reading your posts, I think you were and are still confused about what love is. You mistaken that ow's needs for love. I have been following your wife's post as well and I am not sure that you are seeing her pain. She is crying out and still trying to justify what happened and why you let her down at the time she needed you the most!
All I am gathering from your posts is you. I am not reading how sad you are for taking your wife's feelings, trust, etc., and throwing it all away for someone who never cared about you! Look what your wife has been dealing with? I think that is more care and love than what that ow women could ever give you. Dealing with your situation, I think the ow would have been long gone given the crap that you are dishing out to your wife. I am sure the posters here at MB are trying to figure out why your wife is still with you. I am not here to dig on you, I just want to give someone advice who has been there!

Have you done anything nice for your wife lately? She is going to think it is all fake at first! But don't let that discourage you. Keep in mind what you had done to this women! (2) When she needs to talk listen! It is very important for her to understand your feelings about what happened and you and her. She needs to know that you still love her. Although, I am not sure you know what that is! Your wife definitely knows!
(3) Remember hugs heal. It is a physical and emotional connection. When you see her, hug her as if it was the last time or you were never going to see her again.
(4) Write down ALL the reasons why she is so important to you. from the smallest to the largest. Keep the with you, look at them and remind yourself of them.
(5) What made you spark when you first noticed her? Keep that in a journal with you.
(6) Be a romantic and write her a poem.
(7) Measure how much more she is to that ow. I bet you ow cannot come close to your sweet wife.
(8) Start to notice all her beauty. And don't you dare compare it to Pam Anderson.
I am sure she is beautiful but you are not seeing it! This will help you regain all the passion left.
(9) When in the bedroom, make her feel as if she is the only women! If you two are intimate, you better believe that ow is in her mind! Make her feel special, reassure her that she is the only one for you! You married her because you couldn't live without her right? well make her feel that way.
I lost touch with my wife because of selfish reasons. I did all of the above and it helped me get back to loving my wife! I regret hurting her. I see it everyday in her eyes!
Let us know if this helps. It is great therapy for people in your shoes!
Brian

Right on, Brian1967! You put into words the right stuff!!! Let's hope RandyR sees this and better still HEEDS it.
Harold

Do Y'all reckon that RandyR has some internet service availability in North Carolina??
Hopefully he's still hanging out here even though he's off to another state <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> to work...
Harold

Dear Chat Group:

One thing about recovery that is frustrating is the "peak and valleys" that you go through. The triggering of a memory or the asking from Ali about certain things during the affair.

Sad but the ramifications of having an affair is not realized until afterwords.And the repercussions are not worth the few hours of selfishness.

I never or "we" never told the chat group that we never listened to the some of the advice that was given. For example, Ali contacted 2 times the OW on the phone and both times wound up getting hurt. The OW lied and got a real "self pleasure" talking to Ali by laughing and telling her that I bought her things. In fact, the truth was, I never bought her anything. The OW got a real self pleasure talking to Ali about the things we did. Almost as if she was enjoying it?? What type of woman is this???

Our last contact to see if KARMA does happen, will come true came about two weeks ago. Ali found out the the OW is now going after a young "boy" (23 years old) she is 38, that just started at the company. He is engaged or is committed to another girl. But it doesn't matter to the OW.

ME???????

All of you have voiced your concerns that I need to show Ali how much I love her and how sorry I am for the affair. We are trying new things, trying to start a new begining but we go back, quiet often in relapses. Ali is not the same or hasn't been the same since the affair. We are still trying to understand the why's. What happens if there are many reasons as to the why's, not just one.

Sadly enough, we pushed KARMA, got the results we wanted but it did not make us feel any better in the long term. I guess you all are going to say "It comes from within". It's true.

Ali and I look now at the OW and we should feel sorry for her. 2 failed marriages, multiple sexual partners within months of eachother, both were married and both wound up losing their jobs. The reputation at work that she has (we found out that she just doesn't care) and the fact that it appears that the company has started to put a leash on her as she shares her office now with the HR Manager and he is taking all of her calls. Perhaps she is on her way out. NOT OUR PROBLEM.

We are trying to get some resembalance of a family together, day by day. I would like to know what the stats are on marriages surviving after infedelity.

I start my new position next week. Training in North Carolina for one week and then I come home and my new employer is only 50 minutes away. We hope this is a new start for us and and a hope that the new job will signal better things to come. For we have had to endure so much sadness in our lives over the past 12 months.

July 21st 2002-Accepted a postion in McAllen, TX-over 1500 miles from my famiy. My family could not relocate

Sept-2002- Our youngest son, 5 months old had his entire skull removed and replaced.

February-2003-Our oldest son is diagnosed with autism.

March -2003- The affair ends in McAllen and as a indirect result, I am fired.

April-2003- I accept a position in Chicago that I never had my heart into but used until something better came along. No new skills learned.

June-2003- After 6 interviews and a flight to St. Louis, Mo, I am offerred a position that brings me back to the food industry and the same position that I was doing in McAllen, Tx.

LETS HOPE IT'S A SIGN OF GOOD THINGS TO COME!!

One thing all should remember is the "bottom of the barrel" syndrom. This is what married men have to choose from to have an A. Women who are attracted to married men are unhealthy; no good woman would have anything with a married man.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I would like to know what the stats are on marriages surviving after infedelity.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Something like 98% of all marriages in which there is infidelity survive it. It’s a hard road as you have found out. Recovery generally takes 2-5 years. I think that neither spouse is ever the same afterwards. But that can actually be a good thing… most people seem to say that after an affair they learn to not take their partner and there marriage for granted. They have a better marriage because the affair was a horrible wakeup call.

Under the same token, only about 3% of all affair relationship ever go on to be long term relationships.. like marriage. Most last 6 months – 2 years then die a ‘natural’ death. This is why MB concepts generally work…. The affair is doomed from day one. It’s going to end. So if the BS can wait it out, put pressure on the affair to end, etc. percentages are in the favor of the BS.

Feeling sorry for the OW is about right. She sounds pretty pathetic. I hope someone warns that young kid. But just let all thoughts of her go. Focus on your wife and your family.

And congrats on the new job!!!!

<small>[ July 05, 2003, 09:54 AM: Message edited by: Zorweb ]</small>

I have found that the best revenge is living well. Be happy, be secure with yourself and live a good life. Nothing bothers miserable people more than seeing someone who is happy with their life.

Randy,

Your tone has changed, that is good to hear. Put your efforts and energy into rebuilding your M, not the past.

It's been a horrible road. Ali herself is unsure on if the marriage is going to survive. She is haunted by the memory and the why's.

We both are excited about the new job opportunity. We hope that I will be so busy that I won't have time to think about Texas and the OW. The pain and the "pit in my stomach" are going away. I wish a thousand wishes but I wish I hadn't accepted the job without having my family come down to relocate.

I also see Ali so much differently now. My best friend and I yesterday were just commenting on how well she looks.

Yes, recovery is happening. It's not great, it's a painful journey.

I don't ever want to go through something like this ever again. Betrayal, unclean, fake, it just is a horrible feeling after it comes out. The effect lasts a lifetime.

You know what???

Had I not been fired, I would have had to of resigned anyway. Very quickly. Maybe I wanted to be fired. Maybe sending the e-mail(s), I knew what I was doing.

Ali looks great now. She really is a very attractive wife!!!!

I am still missing pieces of the recovery.....like what the hell was going through my mind???

Hi Randy! What you just posted has been the most positive and mature-sounding post yet from you! It sounds like you're on the Road To Recovery and that you're ready to put some real PASSION, FIRE and LOVE in your Marriage with Ali.
Still praying for y'all.
I wish and pray for the best to you both.
Harold

{{BUMP!}}

RandyRail,

Well, it looks like you are coming out of the dark? I am glad to read it! I am not sure why I am so drawn to your posts. It is almost like you are crying for help but not sure where to turn. I am not a good one for giving advice. I think that is why I choose not to post. But since I am reading so much pain from Ali, I feel that I have to write something because I read the same pain that my wife was in, in Ali!

I think you better stop dwelling on this ow! You see what type of women she is and compared to your wife Ali, she is no match! You had your fun, you got dumped, but come on man, you were in a committed marriage. From what I read from all of your postings and Ali's too, is that you must have had a strong bond between you two in order for you to live out of state for several months. You said that things were rocky, not sure of the exact word you used but, you must have loved your wife enough to trust her to stay home to raise your kids and pay the bills and take care of the house! I am not sure what dwelling on this ow will exactly do for you. She is in the past! Why not leave her and that God awful memory of her there! Please stop writing about her. You need to start dwelling on Ali. I can read she is so much in love with you and is so confused. I can see that she is putting up a wall around herself again, and if that happens? I think you will lose her! Don't let her go that far into her pain! She doesn't deserve it! You caused it! So no more ow on this site! I don't care what type of person she is! Pana wrote "One thing all should remember is the 'bottom of the barrel" syndrome. This is what married men have to choose from to have an A. Women who are attracted to married men are unhealthy; no good woman would have anything with a married man." You were no better than she was! You have to remember that! The people that counts are you and Ali and trying to get your life on track!

Have you sincerely sat her down and listen word for word her pain? My wife Sarah, had hours of just talking about what I had put her through. What great therapy that was for both of us. I finally saw in someone else's eyes just how selfish I really was. Not just the affair but in other things too! I had no idea! It put me and my life into prospective. It has also changed my whole out look on life too! I Married Sarah because I couldn't see my life without her. But after all the therapy, we finally found the reason(s) why I did marry her and not just for the selfish reasons to have a wife and take them for granted! I kinda feel that is what you are doing to Ali! I can tell you that you two are wasting valuable years right now! You need to enjoy your life together as a couple!

Have you done anything for Ali? Don't loose the romance. Start small and build it up!
Start to courtship her like when the two of you were dating but this time never stop I promise you the passion will come back!

I read that Ali's appearance has gotten better! I can understand that we as men want our wives to look hot but that only goes so far! Have you taken my advice and look at the small things that make her beautiful? Have you written down at least ten things that you love about Ali? And that was at LEAST ten! You should have more than that!
Don't be afraid to share them with her.

I hope you check back with me. I took a lot of guts to come on here and post! I know you went out of town for your new job! Hopefully you will log in.

Well, I will check in later on in the week!

Take care,

Lots of healing for you and please dream about marrying your wife all over again!

Brian!
What does bump mean????

"Bump" is a way to post without adding anything, and it moves the post to the top.

Thank you Sue! I am still learning all of the symbols for MB!

RandyRail,

I just was reading Ali's post and is very confused by her comments. I know you are away on business, but hopefully you will be checking in. She mentioned something about you still being in love with the ow! I hope that is not the case! I thought you were coming to grips with everything! What happened? Where did she pull this concept from? She must be feeling it from you to be feeling this way?

RandyRail, I think you need to come to terms with yourself because you are not thinking of your wife! You need to make a decision out of fairness and not out of selfishness whether to keep your marriage working in an honest way or to end the pain that you are causing Ali. She didn't ask you to get involved with the ow and to break her heart. You did this selfishly! It is time to start thinking of her and not yourself... in anyway.

Words are cheap! I know! I used to use them to get what I needed from people! Particularly my wife. I used to tell her things just out of cause and not really thinking about her feelings. Our marriage suffered because she began to tune me out of her life and left me hanging because I would say things to make her happy without any show behind it! I was in shock because I wasn't getting any emotional or physical needs meet because of how I was treating her. That is how my affair began. I was the cause of this. If I had paid attention to her needs in the first place and realize how important my beautiful wife was to me, I wouldn't be on here lecturing you! Not only did I hurt her by ignoring her needs, I had slept with another women because I thought she was being selfish when in fact it was me who wasn't in tune with her emotional needs. So I ended up hurting her twice because of my own selfishness! I hurt her more than she could ever imagined!

I see a lot of you in me! And I know what a jerk I was. I do not see Ali's posts getting any better. She just seems to be more anxious and tormented by your dwelling on the ow. She is not going to heal unless you help her. YOU need to patch up the hole in her heart! I am so angry at myself and others who do not see the pain that is caused by Affairs. I am even more angry at people who do nothing about the pain they caused other people. But, I am in love with my wife and I stopped the pain from going on any further. Don't get me wrong, she is still hurting, but I am there for her just as any LOVING spouse would be!!!!

She mentioned that she is afraid of your presence being home every night! You need to make some time for her and start to make her feel special again. That is if you ever made her feel special. ?? Make her your first priority, then your kids. I do believe in the love deposits! If you can't do this, then I think you may really rethink what you want in your life and let Ali go! She is so confused and heart broken. I don't believe in that universe and astrology stuff, but I see us as a married couple paralleling each other. It is weird! I see Ali in my wife and again, I see you in me. Well, the old me.

One more thing, you need to let her talk! It is very important to her and her healing. And I think it would do you a great deal of learning about yourself, don't you think? I learned what kind of person I was by her talking about us and her needs. Ali posted on another thread a e-mail that you wrote to her (what a horrible e-mail you had written to her) and from what it sounds like you are not giving her time. You also mentioned that you are not sure what you want from you marriage. Well, it is time to figure it out. I can just imagine what you would be like if the shoe was on the other foot. Because you are so tuned in to your own world, you would be a case load and would demand her attention because you would feel a loss of self worth! That is just my thoughts on it!
Randy, time to wake up and either work it out or let her go. You are playing terrible mind games with her that could end up in a disaster. I know you are secretly comparing ow in your mind to Ali! If Ali is all that bad, time to leave her don't you think?

Regards,
Brian

I bet my mother would wish I would write long letters like this to her! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

RandyR, you are in love NOT with the other woman, you are in love with a FANTASY you had with her. She's G-O-N-E and will NEVER return. It's over. Done with. Finished. Drop it. Put it behind you. You might as well go chase the wind - you're not going to catch it.
What about Ali? You promised to love her forever and to FORSAKE all others. Forsake this Other Woman - she has already been enuff of a thorn in the side of your Marriage. Turn your back on her and run to Ali!
Run, Randy run! (paraphrased from the movie 'Forest Gump')
Harold
BTW, why do you still love 'the real pro/awful person' anyway????

<small>[ July 10, 2003, 08:05 AM: Message edited by: Mr. Harold The BiPolar Dude ]</small>

Yeah...this is neat stuff...I don't feel an ounce of compassion for people like you who hurt others...and you still love this OW?

I am repulsed...

"Dazed and Confused" doesn't seem to really add any good advice or positive suggestions, so I am going to move on.

My trip to North Carolina went well with the training and all, howevever I missed my family and it brought back memories of being alone without Ali. It was difficult at night in the hotel room by myself.

With the new, exciting position that starts on Monday and the reality that I will be home every night, I want to believe that someone upstairs is finally spreading some "happiness" in our lives. We will see.

Our marriage continues to go back and fourth between divorce and not divorce. Everyday that goes by, the stinging pain goes away. I am no longer waking up at 3-4am and I am concentrating on other things. I give encouraging words to Ali and I try complimenting everyday.

I have "my moments" though. I also cannot do certain things yet. For example, I cannot watch the weather channel and see the state of Texas at all. I cannot bear to hear anything about Texas. This might sound stupid to some and I am sure I will get an earful, but keep in mind I lost a job that made me finally feel good for myself.

This sounds selfish, the words I have said above. Ali lost so much more than that.

Ali knows me so well that I cannot hide my emotions and "spells" that I go through. But Ali puts me in check into making me realize that I wasn't always happy down there, especially before the affair. Which was 4 months prior to it.

Things that are really depressing me now is the hard cold facts that Ali really tried everything to make me feel special while I was down in Texas. Care packages, phone calls, cards, she tried!!!!

Well I have to go........we are grilling tonight. I am back from North Carolina and we are doing what we like the most.......grilling.

Brian!! Write Back!!