I'm lost, in pain, discouraged, hurt, ...

About a month ago I found out that my boyfriend of two years, the man whom I've been planning a future with, has been having another relationship -- he calls it an affair but it sounds more like a second relationship than anything else.

I don't know if I need to get into details of how and when and why, as I truly believe all these cases are similar and they pretty much happen the same way.

He's been begging, pleading, crying, and wishing for a second chance. He has been going to to a counselor. He's been taking full responsibility for his actions. He's actually improved his behavior a lot -- difficult to explain, but he's just seem more passionate and more available and more affectionate than before.
He claims that this was a mindless mistake and that it will never happen again.

When I found out about the affair (through the other woman), the news came with "too much" details. I feel like I know too much about what they did together and what was said and done between them. I know the sexual positions and the wheres and hows of it, and it's burning me inside.

I really love this man and I so badly want to believe him. I want to believe that he's telling the truth, that he will stay truthful, and that he will never repeat this again.

Having read some of the topics here, I'm not so hopful anymore.
I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to waste years of my life with someone who would do this to me again.

I would appreciate some advice and some rays of light into this horrible darkness I find myself in right now.

Yzzil

Many affairs are as you describe, a second relationship.

If you were the one who had done this how would you expect to be treated. And how would you want to be treated?

A book that could really help you is "Surviving an Affair".

There is a huge difference between marriage and non-marriage situations. There are more reasons to give a wayward spouse a second chance. I am not sure I would give a person I was not married to this chance. A couple can recover from an affair, but it is a long and painful road. And your marriage has not even started yet.

Yzzil ,

I have to agree with Zorweb. Recovering is the most painfull experience I have ever went through, but since I am able to look back to great years my H and I have shared, it was worth going through this.

I don't know how old you are but is "HE" worth the pain???? This pain is going to last a "life time" (it will get better but it never disappears) and you'll never forget it. You might be able to "forgive" but you will never "forget".
So really consider this, is he going to be worth the "pain"?

hugs
bb

If he did it before you were even married. I would have to say get ride of him.

While you are "planning" this future with your boyfriend he has had other ideas. Look, dating is the easy part. Carefully consider what you yourself are planning, because he is enjoying himself, albeit sorry for getting caught cheating. Major red flag prior to marriage. Consider yourself lucky to know now and get on with your life young woman.

Are you familiar with David Viscott? He used to tell female callers to his radio show to send the other woman a huge bouquet of roses as she helped you find out what your boyfriend is made of before you spent more years of your life with him. Then move on with your life without him.

Oh it felt so good having so many replies. Thank you so much for sharing your opinions.

If this situation was reversed, I would want to be given a second chance. If I had an affair and realized it was a mistake, I would try to hide it (I would think what he doesn't know won't hurt him) and if it came out, I would beg for forgiveness and a second chance.

What makes my situation a bit confusing to me is the fact that we're not married (don't even live together).
My mind is pulled in different directions.
I wonder whether the fact that we're not married makes this situation worse or better?

On one hand I tell myself that he couldn't stay faithful even before we were married -- his actions are therefore "unforgivable". On the other hand I tell myself that just BECAUSE we're not married, this could be "more forgivable" than if we were. If we had made a promise and a commitment to stay true to each other for the rest of our lives, wouldn't that be a bigger betrayal?

I have conflicting emotions and I can't tell which is the dream and which is the reality. Am I in denial or am I thinking clearly when I try to convince myself that "we're not married therefore I should consider forgiving him"?

Did he and you discuss seeing only each other? If he made that promise then he does not take his own word seriously. I would be very careful about going back with him.

If on the other hand you only assumed that he would not see anyone else, then you have a problem of creating fantasies. I get the impression that this is not the case.

Read the MB books, starting with Surviving an Affair. They will help you make up your mind of this. Is he willing to do the necessary work. Radical honesty is an important part of a healthy relationship. I find it interesting that under the same circumstance you would have tried to keep it secret too. The both of you could use a revamping of your ideas about relationships and to learn some good relationship skills. Does not matter if you stay with him or not. It will help you no matter who you are with.

Yzzil ,

the "betrayal" is big no matter what. It's a choice that one makes, so it doesn't really matter if you are married or not.

It "hurts" no matter what. The pain remains forever......

I don't think it makes a difference if you are married or not. The partner that is "unfaithfull" is not honest, it's as simple as that. He has made a choice and he knew it would "hurt you".
He knew it wasn't right and yet he went for it, thinking you would never find out.

True "committment" comes within "ones heart" and not just when it's written on paper.

Are you trying to convince yourself that if you were married, it would "hurt you more"?
Are you saying that the pain you are now experiencing isn't as bad but if you were married, it would hurt you more???

There is and there never will be a garantee for "faithfullness". Sad but true and no one can give you the answers.

Have you been able to speak to your boyfriend "Why" this happened in the first place???
What are his reasons for being "unfaithfull?"

bb

Zorweb: Thank you for the book recommendation. I already placed the order and can't wait to receive the book.
I'm already seeing a counselor and that's helping, but they never give you an answer, only guide you towards finding your own.

I honestly don't know what I would or wouldn't do if the situation was reversed because that just isn't the case and everything else is assumptions.

blondblossom: The hurt is great and I can think of very few circumstances where it could be "worse" -- marriage is not one of them. I was married once and I believe that the pain is only as strong as your feelings for the other person.

Initially, I refused to talk to him and were in constant contact with the OW. Talking to her was just adding to my pain and agony (have to assume it was the same for her) so we decided not to do that anymore.

I thought about how I wanted to handle him and what my next step should be. It was tempting to "punish" him by continuing to refuse his phone calls, emails, etc. but that, too, was too painful to bear and left too many questions unanswered. I finally decided that it would make me feel better if I started communicating with him, expressed my anger, heard him out, and just took it from there. I knew this would put his restless mind at ease, but I was willing to grant him that comfort in exchange for mine.

We have talked about everything ... actually, it's more like I talk/lash out/cry/write and he listens/cries/and asks for forgiveness.

I realize that if I was to ever give him a second chance, it will never be the same. My trust could be earned again (I suppose), but it will never be as flawless as it once was.

He says that he's been lying for so long that he didn't know how and where to stop and turn around. He's also seeing a counselor who's helping him in his journey.

In addition, now he wants us to see a couple's counselor. Is that a good or bad idea? I guess I figure there's no harm in it, but then what do I know.

Normally, I don't have trouble ending a relationship that is not going anywhere, so this is not about that. I never thought I would ever even consider staying with someone who would cheat on me. Now I am, and that confuses the hell out of me.

<small>[ June 23, 2003, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: Yzzil ]</small>

I never thought I would ever forgive my CLH for cheating on me but I did. I always said to my friends I would castrate the guy that cheated on me and that I would feed him his... on a platter. Only you have the answer and only you can know if you can live with this the rest of your life.

Yzzil,
I am going through a similar situation, but with a twist. I've been married a little over a year, and just found out my husband did his old girlfriend (who was ugly, to boot) while we were engaged. I am asking myself the same questions you're asking. I think you should email me through this site.

Yzzil ,

just a thought that came to my mind.
I think I would see a chance in your relationship but only if your boyfriend and you became familiar with the concepts of Marriage Builders.

If both of you would be willing to educate yourselves through "reading here" and understanding what Marriage Builders is all about.

In fact I'm sure that if my H and I would of known what we now know, we could of prevented all the pain. We could of prevented so many things in the past that we are now aware of.
Maybe this would be a good thing for your relationship.

It would be very important for both of you to become very open and active and I'm actually quit sure that your partnership would be "prepared" for the battle of marriage, once you understand the concepts of MB.

I'd also suggest for you to get the book "His Needs, Her Needs". Read it and also give your boyfriend a copy for him to read.
Once he gets to understand this, I'd then take the next step and talk about what needs you both have and then you could give it a try.

Then it's a gut feeling thing. You will have to judge for yourself whether your boyfriend is serious about this or not. If you feel that he is "half hearted" about these concepts, you will know then what you will be up for in the future.

He's going to have to "really want to work on the relationship" and not only now but for the rest of his life and the same counts for you. It will always be a 100% from each of you.

If you feel that you have to push him to get him working, let it be, it'll always be a battle otherwise, go for it.

Express your feelings and your beliefs and don't leave anything out. Let him know exactly "Who" you are and what he can expect and I'd ask him to open up completely.Let him know that it is safe for him to express his expectations and to show himself as he really is. He shouldn't hide anything from you because you want to love him for who he really is.
And you wish for the same from his side.

This is probably something that will need alot of "working on" but it's not impossible.
I mean it isn't what most people would "dream about" finding out the "Personality" flaws when a relationship is only 2 years but maybe it's better now than later and if you find a way to work through them, maybe your relationship has a great chance.
Marriage Builders has honestly saved my marriage and it's better than ever.

I wish I would of known these things a long time ago. But better "almost too late" than never.

take care
bb
bb

<small>[ June 24, 2003, 05:13 AM: Message edited by: blondblossom ]</small>

orangecrush, I'm sorry to hear about your situation. I think I know how you feel. I wasn't able to send you an email but you might want to give it a try on your end.

blondblossom, thank you for your advice. I've placed an order for three survival books, and will add your recommendations to the list ... heck, I might as well read up as much as I can!

One of the reasons why I started having second thoughts about putting him behind me was the fact that he started coming out clean. A day or two after he was "found out", he emailed and told everybody (his family, friends, business associates, and even the owner of his favorit Chinese restaurant) about what he had done.

His motivation was that he felt so ashamed and disgusted by himself that he wanted everybody to know how horrible he has been. It doesn't quite click for me, but I guess in his mind he was putting himself down and inflicting emotional and social pain on himself as a punishment for what he had done.

There are two issues to be concerned with. One of them is whether or not one has the strenght to figive an act such as this, the other is whether or not it will be repeated in the future. My only concern is the latter.

I believe that he is sincerely sorry and I believe that he really means it when he says he won't do it again. What I worry about is whether or not he will still be sorry about what he did to me 10 years from now, and whether or not he will remember the promises he's making today and stick to them.

Thank you SO MUCH for sharing your thoughts. It's a horrible feeling to feel alone, misunderstood, or not understood at all.

Yzzil,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I believe that he is sincerely sorry and I believe that he really means it when he says he won't do it again. What I worry about is whether or not he will still be sorry about what he did to me 10 years from now, and whether or not he will remember the promises he's making today and stick to them. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think that if you both are able to understand and live in a relationship knowing the concepts of Marriage Builders you will be able to prevent "future pain".
It's not a matter of him "promising" anything, it's a matter of living this concept to "prevent" this from ever happening again.
I'd advise you to read, read and read again. Everything that Steve Harley has written makes so much sence to me and is so logical.

I think that this should be tought in school actually. We get educated about almost everything but when it comes to "Marriage & Relationships" we seem so "underqualified".
Share this with your boyfriend and see what his reaction is.

If you want to stay in your relationship you both have to make some important changes.
It's important to see what the "problems" were that lead to this situation and it's important that you both become aware what changes both of you have to make.

But be sure to get your BF involved and let him do his share of "getting educated", let him work together with you!!!!

take care
bb

Yzzil,

I don't like the side of this that I'm on, but I can speak from the cheater's point of view (just admitting that in writing makes my hands shake). You said:
"There are two issues to be concerned with. One of them is whether or not one has the strenght to figive an act such as this, the other is whether or not it will be repeated in the future. My only concern is the latter."
I think your concern should be more for your forgiveness. If you can find it in your heart to truly forgive him, then marry him and enjoy your lives together. Life is too short and unsure to let someone you love go on without you. I was divorced prior to my current marriage. I had never felt pain like I did when he said he had given up on me and our marriage. Until now. I wouldn't give up my history - it makes me who I am. The pain I feel because of what I've done to my H is so much more painful than what my ex did to me. We're struggling, but we're dealing with it and I sincerely hope that we come out on the other side of this with a stronger, more solid relationship than we've ever known. Maybe this is what it took for your boyfriend to finally realize what you mean to him. Now he knows how it would feel to risk losing you. If you can't forgive him, then handle any unfinished business and put it behind you, because neither of you will ever be happy if you can't get beyond it. If you can, you might find that your relationship with him is stronger and more meaningful than you ever imagined.

gr8fulwife, I really appreciate your comments.

As great as it feels to talk to people (my friends for example) who sympathise and understand my position and would "shoot him on the spot", the entire source of my confusion seem to be from the fact that I don't quite understand the "other" side of the story. It's confusing to think what goes on in someone else's head when they give in to a sexual/emotional temptation and STAY IN IT for as long as they sometimes do. (Although equally painful, I can understand a moment of weakness better.)

Forgiving is difficult for me but I think I'm capable of it. Forgetting it is beyond me. I can't choose to block out certain sections of my memory.

I realize that at some point this has to be put to rest, and at some point in the future, I will have to stop "bringing it up" -- whether it's a year from now, or a bit later.

I wonder if that's possible?
Is it possible to forgive, not forget, but not hold on to it either?

Yzzil,

I don't frequent this site much at all any more but today I find myself here reading your story. I relaly felt a need to respond to your posts.

My H had an affair from 1997-99 with my best friend. He told me 6-1-99. The A started on my 40th birthday :-( I know your pain all too well. I don't know how long it has been sicne you found this out but I can tell you are in a very awkward and confusing situation.

My heart keeps telling me to tell you to not rush anything-not the marriage and not the break up. I do believe it is possible for anyone to have a one time mess-up-and hopefully learn from it. I think each and every one of us is capable of an A given the right situation and the right place and the right time-if you know what I mean. Even those of us who have been so hurt-no one is affair proof.

But I also think it is a choice we make and I agree with your thinking a one time goof up is so much betetr than a month, 6 months, a year, and more. The longer the more the hurt as it all takes sneaking, hiding,lieing, planning...........the list goes on and on.

My hurt was immense and still is after 4 years of knowing. I hate each birthday-I hate the reminders of things that make me think of the OW. But the pain does subside a great deal after a great deal of time. Life does go on. But it does take time and I would not rush a thing in your life right now. If your boyfriend is truly sorry then time will tell.

My H did take full responsibility for his choices and actions and has spent the last 4 years being an even better H than he was before-and he was indeed! I know he is sorry and I wish it were that easy to fix but the memories linger forever. Remmeber this when you make the decision to do whatever you will be doing with the rest of your life.

Best wishes for always-

Yzzil,
I'm new to MB, about a week or so.

I will tell you as the WS (you can read all the details in my post Her TRO is gone, abd I'm still out of the house.
there is no way I would ever cheat on my W again. When I think of the pain I have caused her, and myself, I can't/won't do that again. I'm hoping and praying that she will give me a second chance, because I am ready to Love,Honor and Cherish her; and follow the concepts of MB.

For you, I would say go to MC, buy the books suggested by the posters here (I'm reading HNHN and I ordered Surviving an Affair) and work with your BF. After you done that, check your heart to see if you really want to marry him. Check and get that he is sincere about his remorsefulness for his actions. Feel that he understands that you expect nothing less after how he hurt you. If you feel any apprehensions after the both of you have done the neccessary work, let him go.

Good Luck and God Bless,
TTSMM

You guys are so wonderful. I feel much lighter inside and much more clear in my head after having read your postings and your responses to mine...

I just want to say THANK YOU.

I hope that we all get what we deserve, whether it's a second chance or a new life.