?.<p>[ April 17, 2002: Message edited by: max ]</p>

My Lord Kevan,<P>I can't believe all the sh*t your W is putting you through. I must say that you are a much stronger man than I and I certainly applaud your efforts to keep a family intact which I assume is for the sake of the offspring. However, you should remember that sometimes it is best for the kids if you get a dysfunctional parent out of the house (your W fits into this category). To me she sounds like she is the sole cause of the disharmony in your family and she should shoulder the entire responsibility, not that the weak little bit*h ever will though. Yes, write the scumbag with whom your idiot W is having (had) a sexual tryst a letter and let him know just what a major problem in the morals department he has and that he should please take your psychotic W off your hands. Perhaps they will be a perfect match. I'd give her have a copy of the letter also along with a deadline for her to be out of the house and into the a**hole's arms. She is destroying your son and it is your responsibility to protect him from the damage her lack of values is doing. She does not care for you nor your son's well-being. The sooner you rid yourself of this miscreant the better. BTW, the size of your penis isn't a factor in pleasuring your wife or anyone else for that matter. From what I've read I'm surprised that you could even get it up for the bit*h. Graphically speaking, perhaps it would have been proper for you to have told her to pack some of her well-used pu**y around your penis if she didn't like the slack she felt. Ditch the evil one before she causes any further damage to you and your son.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Noggin:<BR><B>My Lord Kevan,<P>Ditch the evil one before she causes any further damage to you and your son.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Oops - wow - some anger there ok.<P>Hey hang on there - I love the lady - yes, I do - I may sound like I'm crazy, but I do.<BR>She is a good hearted person - that sound ridiculous to you?<BR>She's got lots of hangups - thats for sure, so, why cant we work them out?<BR>Do you think I have been married to her for 23 years for nothing?<BR>Do you think I am just going to give it up right now - no ways, I will stick this out to the very end - you may think I am stupid.<BR>Yes, I get your point loud and clear - and, yes, I have often thought the same of her more than once BUT I still love her and know we can have a life together, even through all of this.<BR>I love your expletives - arent you a courteous fellow?<BR>Divorced maybe? Certainly sounds like it !!!!<BR>A bit bitter maybe? <BR>Yes, I am bitter too, yes, I am angry - but I know there is love inside there and lots of hurt and guilt.<BR>Ultimatums could come soon.<BR>I tackled her about her cellfone bill again tonight - laid it out very straight to her - she mustnt expect me to believe much she tells me if she still hides her cellfone account away from me.<BR>Would you believe she is a good caring mother? That she loves her kids?<BR>Wow, now I am defending her - you must think I have lost my mind - well, maybe.<BR>I know who I married, I know who I have now and I know who I can have in the future - its just going to be very hard work getting thru her very obstinate mind.<P>If I had heard somebody with a bit more decency telling me that I should write a letter to the pig of an OM - I just may consider it - I just may do it anyhow, why not, what do I have to lose?<BR>

Hello Again Kevan,<P>Looks like I need to apologize to you for my last post. I certainly didn't mean to be indecent. Guess I've been hanging around to many dirty cockpits and jet pipes too long and that has fried my brains. Anyway, I apologize for being crass.<P>I just spent an hour and a half writing a reply to you and then my computer broke lock and wouldn't send it. I will break this reply into shorter sections in hopes that I can defeat this problem.

You are partially right in that you guessed I was divorced. However, it was not a bitter divorce just one that we agreed needed to be. I was the guilty party and take full responsibility for the divorce. Following the divorce I did a lot of soul-searching and discovered that I wasn't a very nice person. I suppose from what you reaped from my reply to you, that still may be the case in your eyes. After a couple of years I screwed my wayward head back on, got my rather crappy act together and re-entered the world of the living. Do I think that your W can be good-hearted and still act the way she is acting? Certainly; I believe that deep, deep down inside I was a "good" person in my first marriage - just not a caring, loving and devoted husband. It took a divorce and a few other happenings to jolt me into taking a look inside and finding that good person. I have now been married to my present wife some 20+ years and plan to devote myself to this marriage for the rest of my life. So I do see hope in your pursuing your goal of regaining your wife's love.<P>I know that I'm probably preaching to the choir when I say that your problem is not with the OM but with your wife. You may gain some bit of short-lived pleasure from writing him a caustic letter laying out how much harm and pain he has helped create but I doubt that he would really understand what you had to say. Better, I think, that you direct your letter to the true cause of your troubles, your wife.

The anger I erroneously displayed was not a holdover from a previous life but rather an over-reaction to the pain I sensed from reading your posts and knowing the frustration you are feeling while you are the one doing the right thing and yet the one being hurt. You are not crazy in your pursuit of a happy marriage with your wife and I apologize for telling you to loose her. I know that if you succeed the rewards will justify whatever the costs you have expended. I only wish that I knew how to get this across to your wife because she is missing out on so much from you. I do know, and I'm sure you know also, that without her strong commitment to your marriage, a commitment as strong and as determined as yours, success will probably not occur. How do you break through the horrible stonewall she has built? Have you talked to any of the phone counselors for their input? Surely they have had this problem many times before and may well have an answer or plan of attack for you. I sense in you a very able husband capable of giving to your wife all that she needs. She must take responsibility for meeting you in creating the marriage you both desire and deserve. She will have to put aside any outside interference and concentrate on working with you to this end but how you get to her through the stonewall you describe is, of course, the question that must be answered. Hopefully for her it will not take what it took for me to finally see the errors of my ways.

Do I think that your W can be a good mother? Heavens yes! In my first marriage I never felt that, in spite of being a horrid spouse, I was anything but a good father. Having a pilot's salary and the ease of traveling, our children never lacked for anything save my continued presence and that was probably a blessing. They have grown up to be outstandingly good and loving adults and contribute well to society. We never, ever burdened them with our problems and they knew they were wanted and loved. You and your wife will have to see to it that the problems you have are not allowed to spill over and negatively affect your children. You both should agree to protect their well-being at all costs and this means ridding them of having to deal with the knowledge of the OM.<P>Hopefully this will shed some light on where I was coming from with my angry outburst towards your W and again, let me apologize for my crassness and let me wish for you success in winning your wife's love once again.<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Noggin:<BR><B>Hopefully this will shed some light on where I was coming from with my angry outburst towards your W and again, let me apologize for my crassness and let me wish for you success in winning your wife's love once again.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Fully understandable - and hoping that it will not come to what you have been thru before she wakes up - I actually think that right now it is more guilt than anything else that is surfacing - and of course the stubbornness of not backing down a bit - I guess we have to treat different people in different ways - some prople you just have to "chip" away at that rock wall until it crumbles, bit by bit - just takes a lot of patience and frustration, doesnt it. Determination I have - patience, well, that varies <grin>.<BR>Sorry, for me, love means endurance too.<BR>I have been venting a lot of my frustrations on the discussion board - better than venting them on my wife, dont you think. Have also received a lot of excellent information and guidance too.<BR>I have been for counselling - but of course, they were interested only on working on me as a person, and not that interested at that stage in our marriage.<P>Thank you for your reply....<BR>

ok, here i go....hope this info can help you.<P>I am a woman who will tell you that size does not matter...as long as it is not grossly small, whereas there might be a medical term for it!<P>Yes, everyone has an interest in something different from time to time...we all wonder what it would be like with someone different and sex with a well-endowed man can be different, but its not just becuase of the size of his penis. It's more along the lines of how he uses it, and how he makes a woman feel emotionally.<P>I loved a man that was very well-endowed, and he was a fantastic lover on top of that. My point: he was a fantastic lover, who happened to be well-endowed.<P>I am now married to a man who is average, and probably the smallest of all of my lovers, if you want to be technical. And I don't care about the size of his penis. It is how he uses it...and how he makes me feel. I do stay away from saying such things as "you're big"...why blatently lie. <BR> I wouldn't want someone to focus on how big or small my breasts were....you get what you get. its a whole package...not just a one item shopping club. How do i know he isn't thinking I'm a little too "loose" after 2 kids?<P>I tell him what I feel: I don't care what size it is as long as he satisfies me and enjoy himself. <P>Making love goes much farther beyond the physical equipment for me. i'd take a smaller man who could connect with me over a well-endowed man who couldn't any day<P>If you don't know how to use what you've got, then what good is it???<P>Stop torturing yourself. I have a hard time believing that the BIG difference between the OM and you is the size of your manliness... and that all her problems or yours would just go away if you were bigger. This is not the underlying problem i can assure you.<P><BR>Give her the space she obviously needs right now. when the time comes, offer her love and compassion....

Your wife put her finger in another man's mouth and back in yours and you want to satisfy her<P>Give her the boot <P>Let her go back to her dirty filthy bed where she wiped her feet off on your face and stepped on your nose to get into his bed<P>Go to <A HREF="http://www.dating.com" TARGET=_blank>www.dating.com</A> <P>Have a shower and go out and leave her behind<P>How can you possibly honour her<P>Why does she deserve nice treatment like that from you<P>So that she can feel good and do it to you again<P>How can you let her insult you like that and can you imagine her being in the bed with another man<P>What if she gives you an sexually transmitted disease that only manifests itself later on in your life<P>That will be your reward for taking her back<P>Get involved in a local Christian Church<P>And let her go her own way<P>You deserve a clean girl and better than a woman that has no respect for you behind your back and gets under the sheets with another man not worrying about if you will get hurt<P>Can you stand it if she does it again<P>Get stone cold towards her and reject her<P>She deserves only that<P>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CarolBo:<BR><B><P>And let her go her own way<P>You deserve a clean girl and better than a woman that has no respect for you behind your back and gets under the sheets with another man not worrying about if you will get hurt<P>Can you stand it if she does it again<P>Get stone cold towards her and reject her<P>She deserves only that<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You have a warped image of Christianity - ever heard of the word "Forgiveness" ?<P>If she is willing to repent of what she has done and love me again - I will not refuse her.<P>You sound like a very bitter and twisted person who has not fully experienced the hardships of true life and love - for better or for worse, in sickness and in health - thos ewere the vows I took when I married.<BR>If she wishes to break them and not repent - then she can go her way, I cannot stop her - but I cannot kick her out if she does not do so, can I ?<BR>

First, I would like to applaud your commitment to your marriage. You are obviously a very forgiving person who takes his marriage vows seriously. I also wanted to express to you that size really does not matter. No one could ever turn me on more than my husband because of the special bond we share. No one knows me better than he does. It is who he is, and how he feels that turn me on. Without the emotion behind it - the physical would mean absolutely nothing to me. Also, it sounds like your wife is experiencing some serious emotional problems right now. I think that maybe she doesn't even know what she needs right now, and that may be the real reason she hasn't told you what she needs from you. She doesn't know. Can I suggest a book by Dr. James Dobson? It's called "What Wives Wish their Husbands Knew About Women". Some things in there are a little outdated, but he touches on how you may be driving someone farther away sometimes by doing what you are doing. you may need to just tell her "Hey, I love you, and will always be here for you. I accept you for who you are, and will be ready to listen when you want to talk". Then you should go about your business, and let her be. You have opened the door, and it is up to her to walk in, but she will fight and fight if you try to drag her in before she is ready. Also, attitude is everything. A man who exudes confidence is a huge turn on for many women (not looks). I know it's hard to have any kind of confidence with the rejection you are feeling, but try to remember you are a great person! She is so fortunate that you care so much. For the moment, don't let your whole existence revolve around her. Be there for her, be willing to listen and learn, but do your own thing. I hope this helps a little. God Bless!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 4given:<BR><B> Be there for her, be willing to listen and learn, but do your own thing. I hope this helps a little. God Bless!</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Thank you, you are a very sweet person<P>

Kevan, my condolences on your struggles. I'm impressed with your perseverence. I'm also glad to see you rejecting the harsh advice of some of these posters. Marriage Builders isn't about strangers name-calling a beloved spouse or urging someone who is clearly in love with their spouse to "give her the boot." Our goal here is to offer the betrayed spouse moral support in a safe and helpful environment, not bash "evil-doers." You are trying hard with a difficult situation, and I very much hope you succeed.<P>Sad

Please visit this site for a little advice... this is the same message I mentioned earlier in What Wives Wish...<BR> <A HREF="http://www.family.org/married/newlywed/a0011760.cfm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.family.org/married/newlywed/a0011760.cfm</A>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 4given:<BR><B>Please visit this site for a little advice... this is the same message I mentioned earlier in What Wives Wish...<BR> <A HREF="http://www.family.org/married/newlywed/a0011760.cfm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.family.org/married/newlywed/a0011760.cfm</A> </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Thank you very much, all you good people out there, you are really a great help. My wife even refuses to look at MarriageBuilders - she says I am just giving everyone in the world a view of our dirty washing.<P>I am sorry, I cannot do it alone - I need the support.

i feel as though size doesnt matter either but that how you feel about your self does. and if you cant please yourself them youll never be able to please her. do you feel good about yourself. also what i would do if my husband was like you . she doesnt know how lucky she is. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kevan:<BR><B>I am sure you have seen my name elsewhere.<P>Ok, please all you good ladies out there.<P>I amdoing my best to please my wife who has had an affair, as you all know, with a man who is much better endowed in the sexual equiment than me.<P>I have tried everything to please her and put things right, wined, dined, loved, cleand, vacuumed, but still get treated like dirt - where am I going wrong.<P>All I want to do is love her and her love me again.<P>I have been told:<P>"There's other ways of tantalising and satisfying a woman"<P>Help me out here.........</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><p>[This message has been edited by hoplessnlife (edited September 02, 2001).]

Kevan,<P>Haven't seen a post from you since around the 12th and I was wondering how you're doing. Hope the lack of posts is a positive sign that good things are happening in your life.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Noggin:<BR><B>Kevan,<P>Haven't seen a post from you since around the 12th and I was wondering how you're doing. Hope the lack of posts is a positive sign that good things are happening in your life.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Well, cant say much has improved really. I found out on the 2nd of Sept. that she had been speaking to him again. Believe it or not.<P>What ensued was a pretty heated discussion with her calling me ridiculous and "snooping" - I found out because I checked her cellfone and saw a call logged to OM.<P>I was also accused of only thinking of my feelings all the time and not hers. She said it was just a "casual chat" about their previous company. <P>I told her I didnt care less what it was about and that I was very tired of the dishonesty and her refusal to see reason and the total disrespect for me.<P>I also told her in no uncertain terms that her continuous attitude of resistance had gotten completely out of hand and that her refusal to stop contacting OM would never help resolving our marriage, despite everything I have been tryng to do.<P>She ended up throwing a tantrum, breaking the 1/4 inch glass-top on the coffee table with a coffee mug, storming out the house and coming back an hour later. Then accusing me of putting my children's interests before hers.Then I was threatened again that she will be moving out as soon as she returns from her weeks holiday in Europe.<P>The evening was ended by me telling her that it really didnt matter to me anymore, she had gone one step too far again and that she may do with her life now as she pleases.<P>I then suggested that she go to bed as it was already 1:00 am and I settled down for the night on the sofa.<P>She proceeded to turn all the lights on in the house, turned the TV on with the sound as high as it would go, demanded a drink from me, and stormed up into the bedroom and broke down sobbing on the bedroom floor.<P>I picked her up and put her to bed and gave her a sleeping pill to relax and lay close to her to stop her sobbing and explained to her that there is nothing further I can do unless she is willing to continue and that I cannot dictate what she must do in her life and she is now free to make her own decisions on whether she wants to stay or to leave.<P>If it wasnt for the fact that she had broken down into a nervous state like she did, I would have started Plan B immediately.<P>She has now gone on holiday this week. <P>From now on I am keeping my distance from her and will stop any attempt of intimacy with her.<P>If she does not decide to leave at the end of this month, I will continue to treat her with civility and politeness and no further.<P>I do now feel that it is totally up to her to change attitude or ask for assistance before I will show any further willingness to heal our marriage.

Kevan,<P>Sorry to hear about your continued trials and tribulations. I must say that I think the step you are now taking is the correct one. There is much to be said for freeing up a spouse who seems to not want to be bound in a loving relationship. Given freedom perhaps the wayward one will reconsider her position and the light which once shone brightly in her heart, now dimmed by who knows what, just may flicker to life and begin to shine once again. It is very possible that once she realizes that she has the option to make an unfettered exit she will come to the conclusion that she really may not want to go afterall. In giving her the ability to make the choice with neither positive nor negative influences from you, placing the onus to act upon her sholders, making her responsible for seeking her own happiness, you give her the freedom she may need to relax into a correct decision. Certainly if you remain resolute in your decision, if nothing else, it will stabilize your personal life and you will become stronger in your resolve as time passes. I think it was Gibran, my aging brain fails me, who said something to the effect that love neither possesses nor can it be possessed. I also remember something about a phrase or poem that went something like, if you love someone you must set them free; if they love you they will return. You cannot force or coerce a person into loving you. Obviously love was there once and for a reason. By removing all barriers to her leaving you are now letting her know that it is up to her to leave in peace or return and join you in a rebuilding program.<P>For what it's worth Kevan, a burden shared by a friend will seem lighter and easier to bear. My heart hurts for the pain you are in; be strong and know there are many who are with you.<P>Noggin