Hi friends,<P>A brief update since I posted last. My STBX has quit his job to go back to seasonal work. He will no longer be driving to and from work every day with OW. He fired his attorney, because he didn't like what the attorney had to say. That puts our divorce on hold right now. I have had some strange things happen in the past week and I am sure my STBX has doubts, if not many. I am not too concerned about them. I am still at the point where I refuse to even consider he and I to reconcile. I don't plan on changing my mind either.<P>Last night, my daughter was dancing and cut her foot on the cold air return vent. I had to take her to the hospital. It seemed routine enough at first. Then we found that it was very bad. I needed to call STBX and have him come down to make an important decision together. I called back later to see if he was on his way, as we needed to hurry up. <P>I reluctantly talked to OW. She was actually very kind, despite the fact that my close brother in law and my STBX mother in law were there too. OW went on to say that she loves my kids very much and would never do anything to harm them or my STBX. She said she takes good care of them while they are here. I thanked her for that. SHe asked if I would give my D her love and she was very worried. (this D is the favorite of STBX and OW). UGGH, I passed on the message and was becoming over ridden with sadness.<P>My daughter had to be basically put "under" to have the stitches, it was very bad. It was odd to see my STBX so compassionate and just a great dad to her at that moment, he was doing way better than me. He took us home after and tucked D in for bed. I asked him if he wanted to call OW and let her know he was on the way. He said no thats ok. He called her from the hospital at one point , there was a phone in our room. When he hung up, he sounded short with her. Even though he and I had trouble, he always said "I love you" to me at the end of every call. Problem was, his actions were always so terrible, I didn't really listen when he said that to me.<P>OW called me this morning, and later STBX , talked to both very civil. I can see we may have hit a turning point. A lot of you on the divorce forum, remember when I was fighting my kids to even go there. I can't believe I am going to say this, BUT maybe the OW isn't so bad after all. Maybe it truly was my STBX that was the major bad guy in this. I don't know. I have no plans to become best friends with OW, or even friends, but we discussed that we have to start communicating sooner or later, and it happened last night.<P>My question is how on earth can I sit here and say, "well, I guess she is not that bad". Am I crazy or losing my mind? On top of it all, I know for a fact, my STBX was very concerned about me last night, another very uncommon thing from him. Is it possible they are having a fight and thats why she is so nice?<P>She also told me if I ever needed her to watch the kids, even if STBX was unavailable, or if she could do anything for me, she would. Part of me thinks, she is just trying to look like the good guy when she knows she may not be. Part of me thinks, maybe she is better than me and thats why STBX left. Part of me thinks, hell I don't understand her any better then my own ex. <P>If anyone has experience in dealing with the OP in your destruction of your marriage, please let me know how you dealt with this, and what your opinion is on it.<P>Thankyou to all. Prayers and Hugs, Dana<BR>

Dana,<P>I really don't have any experience in this matter, but I can empathize with your mix emotions. You sound so much stronger. But if you don't mind, I must correct you.....<B>THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT OW IS BETTER THAN YOU!! ABSOLUTELY NONE</B> Your H was a fool to leave YOU!! You are a damn good woman! Keep on doing what you're doing. My prayers for you and yours are continuous.<P>------------------<BR>"If you can learn from the mistakes of others, you won't have to make them youself."<P>lady_divine77@yahoo.com

It depends...<P>Is your STBX going to marry this OW? If he is, then you can be "civil" with her for the children's sake. But don't become close to her.<P>

Dana,<P>I got your email and I hope your daughter is doing better! <P>Now about the OW, I guess it can be done. I've seen it happen before. But that doesn't mean that she is better than you. I hope she truly does have the kids' best interests at heart. She sounds sincere but it is hard to say. <P>I know in my case there is no way I'll ever even be civil to the OW. As long as I have life left in me, she won't be around my kids. And not just because she's the OW. She truly is trash.<P>Oh, guess what?? H called the kids this evening. First time he's talked to them since March 5th. I didn't talk to him but he asked my oldest if he could see them tomorrow. I guess we'll wait and see if he wants to.<P>Hugs to ya,<P>Mitzi

I am sorry that your daughter was hurt and hope that she (and you) are feeling much better tonight.<P>I feel that you must do what is in the children's best interests....in terms of ow. While she might not be trash and genuinely like your kids, and be ready to help you with them, try to find those who you feel are more in line with your morality, values etc.<P>In time if H continues his relationship with her and they do marry, then you should and must reasses this as she will be a permanent fixture for your kids when they are with H. Until then, be glad that she is a caring person towards your kids, but do not have them spend more time with her than when they have to be...if H's relationship with ow deteriorates, then they will just "lose" another adult in their fragile and confused lives, so do not take up her offer to help out if H cannot. <P>If you feel that she is more understanding of kids needs than your H, then by all means communicate with her about kids issues, but do not merge the boundaries of your relationship with her. Does she have children and can really "parent"? or is it all fake?<P>The reason I am so sceptical about her readiness to help out is that my H's ow is a bimbo/sl@t who found her sugar daddy and does not have a clue and has buttered up to the kids and they have had to find out that she is just a fun floozy and nothing more.<P>This is just my half cents worth and hope it makes sense

Dana,<P>BEWARE of Greeks bearing gifts!<P>Decent women do NOT get involved with married men...end of story. Nothing has changed with who she is, except her tactics. Remember, the adulteress's lips ALWAYS drip with honey.<P>Certainly be civil with her...but do NOT ever let your guard down with this woman.<P>I hope everything is healing nicely with your daughter.<P>God bless you always.<P>~skye~<P>

Hmm. Sounds fishy to me. I bet those are the same lines she used on your STBX. Not to say your STBX is a victim or anything, just that it seems like the OW has a way to "make nice" that tends to lower people's defenses.<P>She is playing a huge part in the breakup of your marriage. No way in HELL she is better than you.<P>My sister's ex married one of his affairees, mostly cause she doesn't seem to mind him cheating on her. She was all sweetness and light with my sister and my niece. Turns out she had a hidden agenda. Ya see, my sister's ex has NO intention of having anymore kids, and as a result this piece of *rap has insidiously and continuously tried to replace my sister in my nieces affections. Has gone so far as to sign herself in as "mother" at her school when she picks her up. Requested my niece call her "mom" when she is at her place. How confusing is that to a 6 year old!!<P>Here's the deal. You will always be your kid's mom. Any woman your STBX chooses to spend time with will never be their mom. If he trades her in for another one down the road (marriage or not), she is history. <P>So, don't buy it. I agree with the rest. Do whatever you need to do to insure the well-being of your children, however, keep it strictly business with the OW. Heck, if she really cared about your kids, she wouldn't be trying to split up your family, correct?

Dana,<P>I agree with the others. There is no way this (fill in the blank) is better than you, she got involved with a mm and refused to end the relationship. How can compare yourself to that.<P>As far as being kind to the kids, count your blessings, it could be worse.<P>God Bless,<P>Bob

Being a betrayer, I remember very well the place I was in when I cheated on my husband. Alot of us here (including me) have bashed the OW/OM, with some justification. <P>There is a difference between forgiveness and acceptance. You can forgive your STBX and the OW, but you don't need to accept their new lifestyle. You can be civil to the OW without being her "friend". Your kids will learn soon enough the difference between acting good and actually being a good person.<P>At some level, I feel sorry for the OW/OM's of the world and spouses who dump their commitments for them. Out of loneliness and their inability to deal with personal responsibility they are throwing away the greatest gifts imaginable. It is easy to hate them (and myself too) for the actions they do that cause so much pain.

TS,<P>I also feel sorry for my spouse and the OW. The reason is because they are both on a path that leads to self-destruction. I hate to see my H mess up his life this bad. It was bad enough to begin with. He is the father of my children. And I do still love him some.<P>And you're right, at least in my case. He has lost the best thing that ever happened to him! <P>Mitzi <BR>

Dana,<BR> This woman is no friend of yours.Don't ever think she is.She's a homewrecker.She'll never be better than you...period.Just my unprofessional opinion. --Murph

<B> Jamie Lee, Murphy, Skye </B> Thanks for your encouragement and reminders! <P><B> Mitzi </B> Hey girl, glad to see you, daughter is doing a little better. Wow, I'm surprised that he called, I know he hasn't been around much lately, make sure you keep me posted thru email how your doing <P><B> Willbok99 </B> You bring up a good point about the permanent fixture, I do agree completely <P><B> The Student </B> Thank you for taking time to reply. Although we vary on opinion at times, I do agree with what you have said here and you do bring up a very good point. In my case, I'd say that right now, I can't say I'll ever forgive my STBX. I know it sounds selfish, and I hate to be that way. I certainly don't want to accept their lifestyle, the fact that things are the way they are now, are because I was sick of fighting the visitation issue so hard. I also would hate for OW to sign herself in as MOM, that would totally tick me off. <P>Here is an update. Easter Sunday, I did invite OW and STBX into my house. Uggh, it was like being in the twilight zone. I met her son, (the little boy is actually very cute), met her (she looks different up close), and I could see my STBX squirming a little. WHen they left , OW carried my D out, because of her injury and STBX turned to me and winked and blew me a kiss. I was so mad at him, I had half a mind to speak up out loud, but decided against it. <P>Later STBX dropped D off to my gram's where myself and two other d's were. STBX came in the house (left OW and her s in car) , hugged my whole family including me and then left. When he looked back I saw a tear in his eyes. Then my whole family started to cry. It was basically very sad. Yet, I am angry with him for doing that to my family. <P>My family immediately went on to say that they would support me should I want to work it out. I was angry that his charming ways could let his horrible ways be forgotten <P>I gently reminded them, that he chose this divorce. He chose to leave me for OW. He chose to take this path in life. Although when it happened, you all may remember me as very frightened and sad (and lonely), , I am no longer frightened and no longer lonely. I think a part of me will always be sad.<P>I have come to the conclusion that I did not do anything to deserve the way he treated me. No person should be subject to the emotional trauma that he put me through. I have adjusted to the fact that "we" are no longer a "we" anymore. "we" are through. It was his choice. I tried to fight it. I lost. <P>If someone told me I'd be where I am today, just four months from Discovery, attempted reconciliation, to almost divorce, I'd never believe I had the strength to get thru it alone, but I did. I made it so far anyway. <P>Its time now for me to move on with my life and follow my heart where it takes me. In my heart, I know I'll always care about him and not wish him any real harm (ok except to see them split), however, I have no trust for him, I have no respect for him, and I have no intentions of ever taking him back.<P>Prayers and hugs to all who have replied, and those who watch my story and reply to my privately by email. I wish we all weren't here, on the divorce forum. I wish I could remember what I talked about in life that was so damn important before all this "affair" business came into my life. But I AM starting to remember what it feels like to be alive again. <P>Best wishes to you all. <P>Oh and Jim if your lurking, these smileys and bolding are a lot of work. <BR>

Dana,<P>I would encourage you to definitely keep things civil. Also, don't give up on your H quite yet. Who knows...he might just end up doing a 180 and becoming that guy of your dreams. Keep doing what you are doing. You are a good person...much better than her!<P> <P>TB

TB <P>Hey girl! Thanks for the encouragement, however, too much has happened for me to ever take him back. I don't think I would EVER want him back at this point. I can see how badly he treated me, things I didn't see while we were together. <P>I am moving on in life and much happier than I have been in a long time. I can't see ever going back, but I'll always remember the good times we had. Unfortunately I have way more bad memories than good, and nothing he can do will ever make up for what he did to me the past 4 months.<P>I am watching you by the way,things seem to be changing, don't forget to email me when you need to.<P>Prayers TB, Dana<BR>

Well, any news on the new guy then? How are things?<P>Things do seem to be changing for me! I just hope I am not playing with fire here. <P>TB

TB, email me

Lonleymom: Interesting question. I'm kind of at that same point - how civil should I be? I don't ever want to get to the point of sharing recipes or doing lunch but because of my kids I know I will eventually have interaction with her. I really enjoyed reading the other poster's comments - gave me some great advice! Thank You all! I don't think I would ever allow her to watch my children while my H was out of town. I wouldn't think that was right, although she has offered. Right now I am trying to decide whether to move to the state they reside in. It isn't so I can be closer to my STBX but so that the kids can have both parents in their lives along with the fact I really would like to start over somewhere and the state they reside in has much to offer. My H is praying night and day that this actually goes through but I don't know that now is the time. I'm thinking perhaps I should wait a year more. <P>But, in answer to your question, I have been in my H and her home a few months back to visit with the kids for a few hours. It was a tad awkward but okay. I don't want to do it every weekend that's for sure. It was actually fun to watch my H squirm! He actually looked like a sheak and his harem! What was really wierd was to see how comfortable the kids were with it all but then they are quite young. <P>Enough rambling - I wish you well!<BR>Missy2

Missy,<P>Thanks for replying. It was noticeable that my ex was squirming too. Although I guarantee, he'd squirm if he ever had to go thru what I did.<P>I agree, we'll never share recipes. I'll never trust her completely, and the more I think about this, she did play a big part in the destruction of my marriage. What woman could feel for a man who left his wife and 3 daughters on xmas day. That has to be the lowest thing anyone can do. Not only to me, but really to the girls.<P>I do hope that all works (and me too). That has to be a tough decision to move to be closer to his new life. I don't know that I'd do it, I'd almost prefer HE move away and leave me alone. I have thought seriously about moving myself. Right now, my life is too complicated to think about one more thing, but its always a possibility if things don't get better after a year of this whole mess.<P>The more I think about the OW and this question, in my case, the reason we are getting along is that my ex owes me some money. I think he wants to trick me and also, if she plays a part in it, its more money at her household. I also think that this might be her sweet and charming disguise that roped my husband in at that time. But from what I have heard about her, from my now soon to be ex husband, and others I know who work in the building , she is a rotten person .<P>All we can do is hope that our kids, know right from wrong. I will be civil to her in front of the kids, that doesn't mean that I like her, or approve of her relationship or accept what she and my ex have done to me. When my kids are old enough to understand, I will sit them down and tell them the truth of the matter and hopefully they will one day realize how hard I struggled to keep things peaceful for them.<P>GOod luck Missy and to all who replied.<BR>Dana<BR>

lonleymom: Thanks for replying! I go to court today and what happens today will determine if I move this summer or put it off a year. It seems odd in spite of what my husband did to me and the kids but I can't be mean and bitter. For me it takes more energy to be that than it does to be civil and friendly to him. My goal is to have a good working relationship with the kids if this is the way life has to be. My kids have many, many years to endure in a split life and my goal is to make it as smooth as possible. I hope my H and I can achieve that goal. My mother died when I was 6 years old and I never new her. To this day I wonder what life would have been like had she been in it. I don't want my kids to go through life with that feeling. Granted I can only lead a horse to water and can't make it drink so just because we may live 45 minutes away from him doesn't mean he will fulfill his end of the bargain and be a part of their life. But, I really like where they live, my folks are gone now and I have nothing keeping me back here. I really am looking forward to a new break. 90% of my friends (which I don't have many) think I'm nuts and crazy but I have learned you haven't walked in my shoes and this is my life and no one can live it but me. Heck if it is really, really awful I'll pick up and move back or move to where my brother lives. I look at it as an adventure. <P>Thanks for letting me ramble. Have a great Tuesday!<BR>Missy2

Missy,<P>You have to do what's best for you and the kids and what makes you happy. This journey we are on, always has ups and downs. I find that many people in my life don't agree with many of my decisions. However, I worried for too long about the wrong things in life. Now I am going to do what feel right in my heart, and so should you. There are a lot of positive factors in your decision and you are definetly being the bigger person here.<P>TB- Still waiting girlfriend!<P>Dana<BR>