I have been married for close to 20yrs now, we where seperated for the last eight months, and in that time I got to realy know myself. You see my W liked to control things and people and for the most part all I wanted was to make her happy and so I went with things, relinquishing my opinion on all kinds of things from the raising of our children, from what I wanted to do as a carerr to where we would like to live.<BR>In our seperation I received some counciling and started to discover things about myself and started to live life and enjoy things, she tried to get back with me and I told her that I love her but I am not in love with her, she started to display emotions and cry, things she really never showed me before, we have 4 children together, but for so long I felt like it was me and then it was them, never a whole family, things where a constant fight, aguements, never a momments peace.<BR>Now I've moved back into the house, she tells me things are going to be different and we are going to work TOGETHER.<BR>However I realize that I don't want to be here with her anymore, my heart is heavy and weighed down while she smiles and remarks how happy she is that her H is back home, I mean we don't have good conversations together and I am avoiding from becoming the House Husband trained and conditioned to do all the house work and secular work.<BR>Screw that!!!!!<BR>What do I do.........................?<BR>

Nevman,<P>Seeing that you went to counseling, will your wife go? Glad to see you found youself, now that you have do you not think that you should at least try and findyourself within your family enviroment. You have this wonderful opportunity to enhance your marriage, do not give up on it now!! You say you love your wife but are not in love, to be honest with you that stateemnt i hear makes me so sick to hear it. <P>Just a thought, were you in love with your wife when you frist meet her? Remember all the wonderful things about her that let you fall in love with her and talk to her about it, maybe with a counselor if she is willing to go. Loook most of us here look for an opportunity to have something lie this happen to us and I for one would hate to see that your opportunity might get squandered away. educate yourself and more importantly educate your wife about your needs and wants.<P>Just do not give up......

Hi Nevman,<P>For a minute I thought you were my ex until you said you had four kids. This is a very common complaint by men. I think this is more about a midlife crisis than anything. Your wife is the same as every woman out here and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find another one that's any different. Maybe different in looks and interests, but we all have some things the same, and that is that most of us are very tough and do want to take control, and even tho you don't realize it you probably also have control on other things. Take the home for instance, that is almost ALWAYS mostly the woman's choice. That's her nest for crying out loud. What men don't understand about women is that when the children come, something goes off in our heads and everything revolves around the survival of these new human beings. We try to make the best environment for them and that means the house, where we live because of the schools and maybe crime situation, and even what you do for a living too! My H wanted to be a consultant. Well, we did that and found him out of work most of the time. Babies need to eat. It's just nature, women are about the children's needs and survival and I don't know why that sometimes supercedes the husband, other than those babies came out of our very bodies, but it's the truth and that's life. It does get better when the kids grow up and we discover who we are again. You will get your wife back if you are patient.<P>When it comes to men, women know how to work them. It's the truth. You might find another cutie pie, but be assured she's in control too shaping your thoughts and actions without you knowing it. Maybe I'm trying to find a way to say this without just coming out and saying women are all manipulative. We all want our way. Hopefully, the one you have loves you enough to bend things your way.<P>Maybe it's just the rut that's got you down, don't make it the end of your family! You have no idea how horrifying and devastating it is for a woman to be abandoned with children - I mean really, four children. I have two and am worn out beyond belief. There are no breaks. No peace. Zero freedom. I can't just go to the library and disappear into a book for a couple hours. As an experiment, I want you to take your four children and strap them into your car, go to the grocery store and do a week's shopping. If you can survive an hour or so of that, you'll know what your wife has every minute of her day, every day of her life until they go off to college. You didn't mention if she works, but if not, add a job onto it - along with the house, cooking, cleaning, homework, afterschool sports. It TAKES two! It's not fair to dump it all on her and go your merry way, free as a bird. It is heartless and gutless. All I can say is if she didn't love you, she wouldn't have pushed four of those babies from her body for you. When we have children, we do it for our men whether you know it or not.<P>Geez, maybe I'm taking things out on you because of my own POS ex-husband. I'm very sorry. It's just that, as is often the case here on MB, it's the same old story over and over with just different players. People willing to take the path of least resistance, thinking the grass is greener - when truly there are more rewards on the other side of a little hard work and doing the right thing (not to mention the lessons the children learn are priceless, as opposed to what they learn from a divorce).<P>Take care. I hope you think carefully about your marriage and your family.<P>------------------<BR>Kathy<p>[This message has been edited by weirded out (edited May 28, 2001).]

nevman,<P>It is great that you have "found yourself", but does that mean it needs to be "all about yourself"? It is so, so easy to look back on a marriage and rip it apart because without love, marriage can be seen as a very unfair endeavor. You as a spouse are asked daily to bend, to give-in, to sacrifice. But keep in mind that applies to "every" spouse - even your wife - even if you can't see that now.<P>Being "in-love" is a feeling and like so many other feelings it too sometimes changes... Love on the other hand is much different - it requires putting your spouse first in your life. The most successful marriages in my opinion are the ones in which "each" spouse puts each other first. Then there is balance. From what you say it sounds like the balance of your marriage was tilted for many years, and that is wrong.<P>But, understand that now that you both realize the problems (or are beginning to realize the problems), you have such an opportunity to make a great marriage happen. Don't let your mind overrule your heart. I will make a bet that you still love your wife a lot, but that love is probably hidden deep under the pain, anger and frustration you feel you endured over the passing years. But the past is over - it is "history".<P>No one said that marriages were ever to be easy (as I am sure you know). But just because the feelings of being "in love" may be absent from your heart right now, does not mean that they will never return. If you can find it within yourself to focus on the love you have for your wife and focus on bettering your marriage, I can almost assure you that those feelings of being "in love" will return ten-fold. But it will require dedication, sacrifice and hardwork on BOTH of your parts.<P>You even say that she has begun to show changes in how she treats you - do you not believe they are for real? Maybe now it is time to try to "trust" her again that they are for real.<P>Finally, no matter what you think, say or feel, you need to understand that the problems you had came from both of you and are in some degree "your fault" as well as her's. Once you come to terms with that, you will be able to begin to forgive her and with her help, the two of you can begin to rebuild your marriage - NOT TO HOW IT WAS, but rather to HOW IT SHOULD BE...<P>Trust and have faith. If you have God in your life, this is by far the best time to rebuild your relationship with him as well.<P>Good luck and God Bless,<BR>Mike<P>------------------<BR>God always waits for the right time to do the right thing in the right way.

Nevman<BR>Tell her just that, in those words! Do what you haven't in your 20 yr M. Stand up and be counted.<P>Hidden in what you say is your desire to be home with the family, and appreciated. Tell her.<P>Strength<BR>muzohead

nevman, you need to be careful not to be so afraid of being "controlled" by your wife that everything you do (or don't do) becomes a reaction to that fear. It sounds like that's about where you are right now, and if so you really <I>are</I> allowing yourself to be controlled by your wife, even without her involvement!<BR>

I guess my post looks like I went off the deep end the other night!<P>I think that there's just a difference in what women and men consider to be control. Women want perfection in the lives of their children - perfect home, school, neighborhood, financial situation. Mama bear is not going to have starving or needy babies if her life depends on it. It's that striving for the perfect life for the children that creates the atmosphere where a man feels he's being controlled. I think it's very unintentional. At least in my case - because I was accused of it too and the complaint was after the kids came along, that I wasn't like that before. So, I guess this is my analyzing (and hopefully not my justification). But I agree, you have to stand up and be counted. If you don't offer an opinion or a preference or a compromise, your mind won't be read. You will probably be surprised to find that your opinion counts when it is offered. I would have LOVED some kind of an opinion!! I think too many times men just go along when they don't need to, and wives really DO value their input, just rarely get it.<P>Of course, my X was a cheater from day 1 of being married so the situation was different here, but that was one of the complaints. I just wonder if we (men and women) will ever figure out how the other thinks.<P><P>------------------<BR>Kathy