I would like to apologize for "starting" this debate. I think you are right in that I was not looking for an answer, only approval. <P>I KNOW in my heart and my head what the right thing to do is - NOT DATE AT ALL RIGHT NOW. The "bad and disobedient" side of me says why not? WS didn't care about our vows, he abandoned his family, so why can't I do what I want as long as I don't hurt anyone? <P>But you all are telling me that there is a very big chance that I would hurt myself and worse, someone else. I am having the same debate in my head, between right and wrong, that is going on here.<P>Don't any of you ever get tired of the pain and want to do something to just feel GOOD again? There goes the childish side to me again...<P>Anyway, I apologize for my thread. I would like to ask all the BS's a question though. Have you become a martyr because of the infidelity? I spent time feeling superior to WS that I hadn't broken the vows, that I didn't quit, that I was a good role model for my children. <P>And you know what, life has a way of humbling you even more, if possible. I guess my point is that we as BS's shouldn't place ourselves in the position of being ANYONE'S moral judge - and I do not think that anyone necessarily judged, but there was some criticism and needless harsh words. And in the future I will remember that when I post to anyone.

LWM,<P>First let me say that I was out of line for callin gyou that name and I am sorry for it, I just let my anger get the best of me that day. I thought about it for the past couple of days and i do really feel bad about it and again I am sorry.<P>As for being or feeling like a martyr, no i do not feel like that, I feel like I am just doing the right thing for me. Yes I feel like doing stuff to feel good again, I hang out with my friends on the days i do not have my daughter. It is not childish to want to feel good again, it is human nature too want to feel good, i just remember the things I did before i got married and do those and do the hobbies I like it makes me feel good nothing childish about that ....<P><BR>I look forward to hearing your comments and I will not let my anger get too me anymore.....

Since I was the first to reply to your question, let me be the first to reply here:<P>You don't need to apologize. You asked a legitimate question, and the people who responded got into the exchange of urination!<P>What you need to do is follow your head and your heart right now. I've been through the betrayal, the separation, the loneliness, and the excitement at finding someone new. I often asked myself "what is the harm in having a little fun...she left me, so why can't I go out and get a lover for myself?"<P>I found my answer. I've realized that if I don't want to go through all this stupid crap again, I need to hold off on dating for awhile.<P>As to your question regarding martyrdom...yes! I feel like everyone I knew was saying to me "she left you, why don't you go out and get some action, after all, you're free!"<P>Yet most of the divorced friends I have never took the time to heal after their marraige ended, and thus ended up thrusting their bitterness and anger upon everyone they have met since, with predictible results.<P>The one exception is a guy who took plenty of time after his divorce before he got "involved" again. He took time to heal, and was very, very selective about whom he would get involved with. He's getting married to a downright fantastic lady next June, and I'm proud to be his best man.<P>Don't beat yourself up for having these feelings...they are NORMAL. But doing something just to "feel good" again is not always the wisest path. My Ex did what she did just to "feel good," and so does every other WS. What you need to do is delay that gratification for a little bit. Hold off on getting involved with this guy until you've settled into a stable place emotionally. <P>Here's a thought: Maybe he really is "Mr. Right." Maybe this guy is the blessing you have been looking for. Do you want to start a relationship with him while you're at "rock bottom" emotionally, or do you want to approach your relationship from a position of emotional strength and well-being?<p>[This message has been edited by cjack (edited May 28, 2001).]

Believe me I do understand the feelings of being alone in the world sometimes!! It gets very old in deed...<P>I do not feel like a martyr at all...I have gained the admiration and respect from everyone that knew "us" and me...I am grateful to for the experience in which I had to grow through...<P>I have learned that I can survive anything with my digaty and self-respect intact!!<P>I know much more about who I am and what I can take...<P>I am a survivor!!<P>Bill

Hi. The debate comes and goes. It is one of the many never ending cycles you see here. Everyone here, has been through the ringers. Everyone here has their raw points. Everyone here has different triggers that unleash that part of them that, in my opinion, should be kept from the world.<P>In regards to your question, regarding being a martyr... no, I have never felt like one. Right now, I am not looking for anyone's approval, accept that of my own. I work hard. I do my best to raise my son well. I follow the path that I feel is right. I try to be good. But I am human. I have all the same short comings as any other human. I admit that I truly wish that for once I could feel an honest and pure love from another human being without fear of being hurt. I admit that I have made mistakes in my life. I admit that there are things in my life that I wish I could change. But in all honesty, I can't change anything I have done in my life, BUT I can go forward towards the life that I believe is right. I can live my life knowing that I did good for my son. And that in the end, I did okay. I also know that in the end... there will be happiness for me. I just have to be patient. I will also be the first to admit that I HATE being patient!!!<P>As far as being tired of the pain... every second of every minute of every day I am tired of it. But the pain does fade. And eventually, it does start to go away. <P>You will be okay. We all will.<P>~Java

Thanks everyone!

You have nothing to apologize for. You asked a legitimate question.<P>It would not be "bad" or "disobedient" for you to date right now, but it might not be the healthiest activity for you to pursue at this time either. What you deserve is honest unbiased information you can use to make the decision for yourself.<P>We all get tired of the pain, but it fades slowly over time. And I do things all the time that make me feel good. By myself, or with my son. I don't "need" someone else to make me feel good. But a large part of who I was before, enjoyed spending time with her doing nice things for/with her. That is what I truly miss the most. <P>Am I a martyr because my wife is having and affair and abandoned me? Absolutely not! I contributed to her falling out of love with me and I regret it very much. I do not feel superior to her. I am disappointed that she chose to quit and I'm saddened that she's put a higher priority on her own happiness than our son & our family, but I know that there is nothing that I can do about that now. I can only work to improve myself as a man and a father and hope for a chance to share the rest of my life with someone I can cherish forever.<P>You will know when you are ready to date. I suspect if you have to ask, you may already know the answer to that question.<P>Take care...<P>------------------<BR>nick<P>it's only time that heals the pain <BR>and makes the sun come out again

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by c00ker:<BR><B>I suspect if you have to ask, you may already know the answer to that question.<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>That is a subtle yet HUGE point...<P>If there are enough doubts within yourself that you are looking for others to back you up on the position you want to take...you're probably not ready to go forward yet.<P>For me, I had to become comfortable with who I was and feel like I had something to offer someone else...not just be an emotional taker to fill an emotional void. My healing did happen to coincide with my divorce becoming final...but only because my idiot ex finally stopped delaying things. It took me this long to get here...and would've taken this long no matter what was happening legally.<P>Martyr? A martyr is someone who is willing to sacrificially die for their belief. While I believe I did sacrifice a lot to try to keep my marriage going, namely my self-esteem, confidence, trust, etc., I am no martyr. I am just a person who tried to do what I believed to be the right thing for my family...keep it together. I failed miserably at it...but I have learned so much.<P>Lisa<P><BR>

Lisa (O*O*O) states: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>While I believe I did sacrifice a lot to try to keep my marriage going, namely my self-esteem, confidence, trust, etc., I am no martyr. I am just a person who tried to do what I believed to be the right thing for my family...keep it together. I failed miserably at it...but I have learned so much. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>So, in hindsight... what would you have done differently if anything? I don't want to go down the martyr route myself... yet I don't really want to fail miserably either. Aaaah, such is life, isn't it? Who can know the future? Life's a journey. I've learned a LOT from you all!<P>Cheers!<BR><P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OvrCs:<BR><B>So, in hindsight... what would you have done differently if anything? <P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I would never have agreed to reconciliation without my ex getting counseling and then us getting counseling together...hindsight's a real pain in the a$$ <P>Lisa<P>

Hi Lisa... pain in the a$$ for you but immensely helpful to others that you've been willing to share your lessons. I don't know if reconciliation will ever be in my picture but I've learned from you and others on this post about what reconciliation means and doesn't mean. I've been worried about jumping through hoops myself, and carrying the weight of success or failure of the process based on my behavior. That's not right.<P>Thanks again for your insight... take care!<P>------------------<BR>We cannot do everything at once... but we can do something at once

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by On*My*Own:<BR><B> I would never have agreed to reconciliation without my ex getting counseling and then us getting counseling together...hindsight's a real pain in the a$$ <P>Lisa<BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Wow!! I have that same insight... spooky... and yes, I'm completely serious!!!!! <P>Those first few affairs of my ex should have sent us both to the counselor... sigh...<BR><P>------------------<BR>~Sheryl<P>And we know. We who have seen. ~Pellegrino