Wife and I have been separated for 4 months. We've had problems with communicating. We have both done and said things that have hurt eachother. I am trying to change my ways when it comes to control and not listening, being affectionate and supportive. I am going to counseling and reading books, etc. I tell her I don't want a divorce. Her reply is that she doesn't love me like she used to and doesn't think our marriage will work anymore. She has not yet filed that I know of. She is very cold and doesn't like to share her feelings. All she keeps telling me is that she won't let herself get hurt anymore. I love her very much and want our marriage to work. What can I do to get her to understand? She won't do counseling and doesn't really want to work at our relationship. I need help before it's over.

SORRY TO HEAR ABOUT YOUR TROUBLES YOUR WIFE IS A VERY LUCKY WOMAN IF YOU ARE WILLING TO WORK ON THE MARRIAGE ALOT OF GUYS ARE VERY SELFISH AND WANT TO HAVE THEIR WAY THEY DONT LIKE FOLLOEING RULES OR BEING TOLD WHAT TO DO PRAY AND ASK GOD TO FIX IT HE BELIEVES AND HONORS MARRIAGE MAYBE YOU CAN GO TO COUNSELING BY YOURSELF AND WHEN SHE SEES YOUR SINCERITY SHE WILL FOLLOW I AM GOING THROUGH FEELING LIKE I ALWAYS COME SECOND WITH MUY HUSBAND THAT HIS FRIENDS COME FIRST AND HE STAYS AWAY OVER NIGHT FOR WHOLE WEEKENDS WHEN HE WANTS TO HANG OUT WITH THEM.

Rolanda,<BR>I would like to respond to your posts and know you are new but, would you please unlock you "caps lock" and please use periods so your replies are not one long sentence. It makes it difficult if not imposible to read and understand.<P>Thanks<BR>Sammi

\<p>[This message has been edited by HollyAnn (edited July 07, 1999).]

Thanks for the advice. Infact, last night I read the chapter "Can a Marriage Be Saved by One Spouse?" in Dr. Harley's book Your Love and Marriage. It had many great idea's. All the experiences that were talked about - seem to be just like what's happening to me. <P>I love my wife -- my family is so important to me. If only she would have talked to me sooner about her feelings - I'm sure much of what's happening wouldn't be today. The most difficult thing about all this is the fact I am being thrown around like a YO-YO. One minute she is nice -- and can turn on a dime the opposite direction. It's hard to know where I stand with her. <P>My next question is: How can I work on being a better husband and show her I want and am willing to change -- yet she is not willing to let me actually show her? I'm lucky enough if I get to talk to her once a week if anything.

JP - I know just where you are coming from. I am trying to save my marriage as well, but my wife is making it almost impossible.( my post is under emotional needs) At this point we hardly talk and when we do, she is cold as ice. I know how hard it is to hang in there but you have to believe that it will all work out in the end. Have faith brother, it's the only thing that she or anyone else can't take away from you!! Hold on until you think there is no hope and then hold on a while longer!

JP,<P>I know exactly what you are going through. I'm in the same position now. Through my actions in the past I have managed to hurt my wife deeply. The sad part is that I never knew that I was doing it. She had to create a crisis situation in order to see what I was doing. Since then I have turned my life completely around. I am no longer the person I once was. Now I am doing everything possible to save my marriage, but she is not willing to talk to me about it or even try to work on the problems. <BR>All you can do in a situation like this is to do all you can. Let her see that you have sincerely changed. Try to be the best man you possibly can and continually try to get better. Sooner or later she may see you sincerity in all this and give you a chance to try to make it right with her. Until that day comes it hurts. I know. There are nights that I cry all night because of the pain I have unintentionally inflicted upon her.<BR>Just hold in there and become the best man you can. Study the subject of marriage and relationships thouroughly so that you will be more prepared to handle this if she does give you another chance.<P>Good luck and may God Bless you always.

Hi guys........<P> I have read all your posts the last 3 that is. And being famale may I ask a ? Why is it it takes a crisis for the husband to see how bad he has been hurting us for years. Is it that we are taken for granted so bad year in and year out that you don't see what you do to us? In my situation he was a drinker. Don't know about how all yours came about. But it took me to get attention on line from a male to see what I did not have at home. I saw how I got ignored through the years and how I never really felt like a wife that I got put aside in the shuffle. Between kids,drinking and his friends. You know how I felt when i actually realized this? I felt like I just wasted 16 years we have been together. Now he wants me. After I gave him everything all those years as a wife but never really was a wife. Understand? I just wish I would have seen it coming. Its my fault yes because when we were dating he drank then too. But hey I was young and guess assumed it was just because of our ages thats how he was. Well it stayed that way and eventually got worse. But when you start having kids you don't see alot of things because your to busy taking care of little ones. After my thereapist explained that part to me it made since. Thats why I did not see it getting worse. Well I finally got attention from another man thats when I saw what I did not really have a good marriage. No I did not have a affair unless like some people consider a emtional one is the same which I don't beleive it is. Actually this person and I now are best friends. We kind of filled each others needs we were not getting at home emtionally. I do thank this person now cause if it were not for them I would have never had the guts to say what i did 2 years ago to hubby. So in away I think God had me meet this person for that reason. Funny they always say you meet people for certain reasons. I tend to really beleive that now. But my feelings have never come back for my husband like I once had for him. I know all those years I did love him or I would have never done all I did for him. I hope you get where I am coming from being female. I hope this helps you three out in some ways at home. Keep me informed at how you are all doing.

Wonder,<P>I know what you're saying to well. I often wonder why I couldn't see what I was doing. I have kicked myself daily because of this. I guess that men are just not as in tune to a womans feelings as he should be. We can be a little on the slow side when it comes to affairs of the heart, and often it is too late when we do see what is happening. In my case I had been dealing with a failing business which I owned. It consumed all my time and thought. I did eventually close the business, but it had already taken its toll. I tried to protect my wife from all the problems that I had. That was a mistake on my part. She should have been included in on the day to day operations of this business. I tended not to tell her too much of the problems we had. I suppose that would classify me as a protective liar. I never meant to hert anyon, but in my effort to protect her from all of this, I alienated her to a point where she thought I was ignoring her. That only got worse because I became short-tempered with everyone I came in contact with. I take all the blame for my situation. I know I was wrong, but that's all over. The only problem now is that I am going to lose the woman that I love so deeply because because she does not want to even try to work out the problems we have with trust. So my answer to you is that men for some reason or the other tend to try to hide their inner feelings when a woman needs to have them the most. I'll admit it. I'm slow to see things as they are happening, and because of this I stand to lose everything that is so dear to me.<P>May God be with You always

GGreene..........<P> Well like my house you saw what happened and now it might be to late to get it back. But then again maybe not. Men have a tendecy to keep things from us when your right they should not. But now you know this. I'm sorry it has gotten to where you think you might lose her. For me emotionally and physically he has. Like I said been 2 years and nothing I feel nothing. Actually the best way to describe it is I feel empty and hollow. I try and keep busy and not think about what I am missing from not feeling in love anymore. But its so hard. I do pray everynight that I will get a hand to lead me the direction I should be going but nothing there yet. Sometimes I feel gulity but I think you cannot force feelings that just are not there. People drift through there marriages. Some drift and come back to each other. Some drift so far there is no beginning to go back to. I have kids that makes a big difference for me also. If I did not have my kids would have been gone when I realized no feelings were going to return. Thats another reason I pray everynight. I don't want to hurt anybody but then again I deserve to be happy everyday someday again. I sure hope its soon not sure how much longer I can feel like this. Take care G Let me know how its going.

Thanks again for the replies. It's good to know that I am not in this alone -- Not that I want anyone to go through this. It obvious I can't do this alone. My wife is making it very hard for me to wait. She still is in the mode that nothing I do will change the way she feels about me. She is now saying that she no longer wants to try. She is even to the point of saying that we will no longer have sex. <P>We never communicated. She never told me what was happening. This is both our second marriage. It was eight years before between marriages. I been used to caring for myself. When I married her, I also became and instant daddy to her three children from her previous marriage (all boys under the age of five). There father wants nothing to do with them -- yet she insists that she will get the money he owes her. I was very frustrated and stressed with all my new responsibilities -- I couldn't be perfect and change overnight. Yet she says she gave me enough of a chance -- and I'm all out of strikes. I'm trying to be open with her -- but it's very hard when she is so closed up and unwilling to work this out with me -- by giving me another chance. I've changed so many things and it's not good enough. <P>I'm really scared to lose her and my boys. They are my life. I don't want a Divorce. I'm the only one trying, putting my life on hold for a hope that will get back together. She has a husband that loves her, a Dad who loves her boys -- I want the world for them -- yet she is willing to give it all up. She keeps telling me that she doesn't know what she wants or if she'll ever let me back in her life. <P>I pay for everything, am their when she needs me. She talks to me as if our marriage might work -- then at the end of every good weekend or move forward -- she knocks me down by saying it will "Never Work". I am kinda feeling used and abused now that I am sorry for my mistakes and trying to change. I'm damned if I do -- and damned if I don't. Anymore advice? This has nothing to do with drinking, drugs or abuse of any kind. Were a young family, working alot, and have money problems. Me personally, I am not very good with sharing my feelings -- which doesn't help. But with my counseling -- I'm getting better. She has told me all the things I have done wrong -- I make the changes and it's still not good enough. I'm to late - should have done it a long time ago. But at that time I had no idea -- because she never talked to me.

Wonder - <P>I've given a lot of thought to your question, but I don't really have a good answer - other than to agree that you're correct. Like the others, I never saw it coming. I'm sure the warning signs were there, but I didn't know how to distinguish those from what I thought were the normal differences and issues within a marriage. I never understood how different her needs were from mine until I read Dr. Harley's books. The role model I saw from my Father was the faithful husband and good provider. Dad fulfilled that well but affection was not displayed in public. I thought the "affection" I initiated in the bedroom was affection. I couldn't have been further from the truth. Only now do I understand what a woman's true needs are. But as you asked in your question, it took a crisis to wake me up. Only when my wife became involved in an internet romance did I realize that I was not fulfilling her needs at home. She had quit work recently to stay at home with our 4 year old son. In hinesight it became obvious that her need for conversation had previously been satisfied at work and now switched to the internet chat rooms. I guess the only answer I can give is that men don't have an intutive understanding of the emotional needs described by Dr. Harley - for either own or their spouses. They just assume that the needs are the same. It's been 18 months since my wife's on-line romance and after diligent studying to figure out what happened, I've finally learned the fundementals of each others needs which I should have learned 19 years ago. But now it's too late. As you feel about your situation, my wife no longer has any feeling for me and wants me out of the house and her life. I've spent the last 6 months trying to meet every need I could identify, but only made her feel "smothered" and further pushed her away from me. Now, with her as the foundation for everything I've done in the last 20 years it's all being swept away. But to answer your question - we just don't know any better. I have an intuitive grasp of mechanical things, but I don't for emotional issues. That's not to say I can't learn, as I'm light years ahead of where I was just last year. But not understanding the basics, we just don't recognize the warning signs. I just wish there was a way for the women to understand this and give us a second chance when we're trying with all our heart to change the things that caused the lack of affection and attention in the first place.<P>------------------<BR>Prayer doesn't change things for you - it changes you for things.<BR>

Stardust.........<P> Your wife sounds just like me. I thought maybe I had a twin out there. I mean by sounding like me her feelings. I am sorry you are going through this also. I don't know why we cannot look past it and give you second chances. In someways I think for me its because I gave him so much for 17 years been together and wondered why it was never given back to me. It took me to sit him down 2 years ago and say you quit drinking or thats it. Well he did quit but for some reason my feelings still did not return. I too learned what I was missing through an on line romance. He was the most romantic man I had ever meet. He needed the same from me at the time. It just happened I was not looking for it. Now we are best friends and I can still tell him anything. I can be more open with him then I ever could with spouse. Maybe because from the start he never judged me and actually apprectiated what I had given him. This lasted about 4 months BTW and now have been best friends with him for almost 2 years. I don't know why he is so easy for me to talk to. He tells me alot of things to because I don't judge him either. Thats when I wonder why God has us meet certain people for certain reasons. He will always mean the world to me. I know that might sound like cheating to some people but if it were not for him I would have never seen what my marriage was doing to me. He probably would still be drinking so if any good came from it all he did quit. He lost me though with it the love I once had for him. Right now we are roomates and in time I need to think of what I really want for ME. Thats where my praying I hope helps me. I know one thing I cannot live like this to much longer. That closed door has to come open soon. Keep in touch all. Stardust let me know how your doing please. If anything I will listen and help if I can.

\<p>[This message has been edited by HollyAnn (edited July 07, 1999).]

\<p>[This message has been edited by HollyAnn (edited July 07, 1999).]