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#703970 09/20/01 10:27 PM
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This is my first posting here. I was the WS - I had a "one-nighter" with a coworker in June. Before that I had a few other encounters with other people that I didn't count (in my WS fog) because they didn't involve full-blown sexual intercourse. There is no OM, I do not love this coworker and am not emotionally involved with him at all - we "used" each other.<P>What I did I did out of pure stupidity and selfishness (our sex life had been terrible for many years). My husband figured out something was up in June, and I ended up being completely open and honest with him for the first time ever. I broke off contact with coworker in June (took leave of absence), ended up leaving my job for good. I'm in therapy and realize all the ways in which I contributed to the problems in our marriage.<P>The day I told my husband about the affairs, he took a hammer and smashed his wedding ring, demanded I give mine to him, and smashed a wedding day picture. He boxed up most of my personal belongings. As of August 1st, he wanted a separation. I moved out. As of September, he wanted a divorce to protect himself (he brought most of our financial assets to the marriage and didn't want me to get half). I gave him a divorce, and I didn't go after him financially.<P>All these things I did because I felt I would lose him for sure if I didn't go along, and I felt certain that we would work things out, and the divorce was just a technicality and we'd just get a prenup and get remarried soon.<P>Now he is saying he sees all sorts of insurmountable problems in the marriage, and doesn't want to be in a relationship with me. He says it's not just the affairs, it's more. He was married once before, and his wife had an affair, and he stayed married to her for four more years, trying his hardest, but it just didn't work. He doesn't want to do that with me (just end up divorced four or five years from now). I think he is very afraid of being hurt again, and he is still very angry with me. He has not even come close to accepting what has happened or forgiving me. He says he just is not interested in re-investing in our relationship.<P>So here I am, divorced. I know he still loves me, and I love him and miss him terribly. I know he misses me too, but he's just not willing to take a risk with me.<P>Do you think there's any hope? I grapple with that, do I keep hoping that with time, he'll get past the anger and fear and realize he wants me after all? Or do I just accept that it's over, and try to move on. I have been trying to do the latter, but it's just so difficult and SO painful. And I just can't let go of the hope. But it's driving me crazy. And it seems the harder I try to hang on to him, the less interested he is in trying to work things out.<P>I can't decide whether to Plan A or Plan B. I know I can't change him, only myself, so I am working on my own self-improvement, and making changes in myself that are for the best regardless of what happens with him and me. I am tired of begging him, and trying to convince him to let me come home. I know he has to come to that decision on his own, not because I persuaded and pressured and convinced him.<P>I feel so discouraged because I've tried to do all the things I should - I cut off contact with coworker, I've been completely open and honest with my husband, I'm in therapy, I've apologized over and over again for hurting him - I don't know what more I can do. Any advice? Thanks in advance.<P>By the way, this website has been a Godsend. I was bawling my eyes out tonight because we talked on the phone and didn't end it by saying "I love you" like we have for the past 10 years and it just hurt so bad. But I calmed down by reading some posts, and realizing I'll make it through, regardless of what happens. Thanks to all of you for sharing your stories.

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Hi FeelingHopeless,<P>What an amazing story!!<P>You know, there is ALWAYS hope.<P>I think your best course of action is to begin a solid Plan A effort. <P>You have done many of the right things, it seems, by letting him know of your sorrow, remorse -- and by quitting your job -- and going to therapy. I'm sorry that those changes didn't slow down or stop the divorce process. As an aside, it never ceases to amaze me how quick some divorces happen.<P>One thing you DON'T want to do is hang on to him, beg him, talk about "us" (you). Be a friend to him now. Be a "safe haven" for him to come back to.<P>Continue taking care of you. Plan A is as much about you as it is about the two of you.<P>Only time will tell if you need to let go and move forward without him. It doesn't sound like it's time yet, though.<P>Do you have children?? You didn't mention any, so I assume not.<P>Also, this board has been having some severe technical problems over the last several days, so don't be discouraged if you don't get a lot of replies right away. <P>I wish you peace, and a restored marriage.<P>And welcome to Marriage Builders.<P>------------------<BR>~Sheryl<P>And we know. We who have seen. ~Pellegrino

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I usually don't have sympathy for WS. But I feel for you. You are doing all the right things. The important thing I think is you are making an honest effort to make amends. You cut off contact , you admitted your wrong doing, you are getting counseling and you are working on yourself. I have found in life this is all you can do, the rest is up to him. I think you have to understand that sometimes you can not make amends to people and it becomes there problem not yours all you can do is make the effort and you have done that. I think you have great depth and you are blessed to see what you have done and then do something to change it. not all people are capable of what you are doing. I think he is so deeply hurt and angry, he feels so betrayed and probably will have a hard time trusting, I think you should give him space kinda plan B but with plan A going when there is contact, let him know you love and care show remorse ask forgiveness then just leave it with him, do not begg him or push him, he will see changes and you can slowly rebuild trust, this is going to take you sometime but if you are commited give it time, I think there is great hope for you and if it doesn't work out, you will still be a better person for all the time and effort you put into yourself. Take care of yourself<P>

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FH,<P>Yes, there is always hope I suppose, but lady, your post sure suggests that you left yourself a pretty tall order to fill. It was very tempting to leave this alone, but then I thought maybe it would be helpful for you to see my reactions. I don't want to put you down, I'm only posting this so you can get an idea of the reactions you might face. They are similar to the reactions I had when my wife found another man. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FeelingHopeless:<BR><B>This is my first posting here. I was the WS - I had a "one-nighter" with a coworker in June. Before that I had a few other encounters with other people that I didn't count (in my WS fog) because they didn't involve full-blown sexual intercourse. There is no OM, I do not love this coworker and am not emotionally involved with him at all - we "used" each other.</B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>There is a text book example of minimization and denial. Your H must have had a crystal ball to figure out "something was up" after a one nighter. The paragraph seems to imply that since YOU did not love this coworker, what YOU did wasn't really all that bad. That sounds a lot like my ex wife: "It was only ------ etc., and it was only ----- etc., etc."<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Contrast that with this quote:<BR><B>The day I told my husband about the affairs, he took a hammer and smashed his wedding ring, demanded I give mine to him, and smashed a wedding day picture. He boxed up most of my personal belongings. </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Sounds like your H is a horrible, terrible, no good, very bad person. Doesn't seem to be much discussion about you smashing your H's heart. Was that any problem at all? You seem more concerned with your husband's reaction to the affairs than you are for your own infidelity. You very neatly switched the reader's focus from your infidelity to his reaction. What bothers me, is there is very little remorse and virtually no repentance reflected here. (That is perfectly normal for wayward spouses.)<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><BR><B>I ended up being completely open and honest with him for the first time ever.</B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>First time ever? Bullllll. Sooo, why get honest now? Sounds like you expected your husband to love you no matter what you do. That's not the way love works sports fans. Your admission sounds like you did the right thing for all the wrong reasons. It smacks of selfishness, selfcenteredness and immaturity. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> <B> What I did I did out of pure stupidity and selfishness (our sex life had been terrible for many years). </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Sounds like you want the reader to feel sympathy for you. Well OK: <B>Oh, You poor baby.</B> <BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> <B>(he brought most of our financial assets to the marriage and didn't want me to get half). I gave him a divorce, and I didn't go after him financially. </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Sounds like YOU were in total control, sounds like YOU see yourself as a martyr. It was very nice of YOU, not to go after him financially, but why would he want to give half to you? Anything he owned before the marriage, he still owned after you married. You may have a right to half of any assets acquired during the marriage, buy why should he give you half of what he owned before marriage? What did you do for him that would make him owe you half of what he acquired before marriage?<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> <B> All these things I did because I felt I would lose him for sure if I didn't go along, and I felt certain that we would work things out, and the divorce was just a technicality and we'd just get a prenup and get remarried soon. </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>This quote seems to come out of nowhere. It reads as though you have very little comprehension of just how serious infidelity is. Please, go back and read some of Dr. Harley's columns on infidelity. Infidelity is probably the cruelest form of spousal abuse.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> <B> He says he just is not interested in re-investing in our relationship. </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Question: Why would he be? What is in it for him? What do you have to offer him? That's a big part of Plan A, but the post that you wrote doesn't seem to deal with these issues. Many of us here have learned the hard way, that in order to build and keep a marriage, love just isn't enough.<P>Please understand that a divorce isn't the death of a marriage, it is only the funeral ceremony. The odds are stacked against you, eighty five to ninety percent of remarriages following divorce end in a second divorce. Once again, you are hoping for a pretty tall order. If you really love him, why would you want to risk putting him through that again?<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> <B>I'll make it through, regardless of what happens. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>That you will. I'm sorry if these observations are brutal, but they are also very real. At least it will give you a chance to see what you are up against.<P>If you really love him, let him go.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper <BR><p>[This message has been edited by Bumperii (edited September 21, 2001).]

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Whew Bumper, rely on you to tell it like it is!!! BUT have a little sympathy here, this is her first post, so she may not have read all the stuff yet. So I'm gonna go find faithful wife's welcome and get back to you FH,<P>BTW I am a BS...I agree with a lot of Bumper says, but I think if you want to find out what you can do about this, you need to read, read, read. And then DO the stuff that is recommended.

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Nina,<P>You are right, she needs sympathy as well as truth. I'm hoping others like yourself can provide that for her, and she will get the best of both.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper

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Nyneve and jabber - Thank you for your responses. I feel better knowing some people do see hope for me. (BTW Nyneve, we do not have children, thus much of the reason the divorce was so quick and easy to get).<P>Bumper, I appreciate your response too. I do have some things to say in response.<P>"This is a text book example of minimization and denial." - I minimized things at first, but now I do understand that what I did was just as bad as someone having an emotional and physical affair for years. I said that I am not emotionally involved with my coworker so people would know that there is no OM in the picture at this point (as opposed to a lot of situations I've been reading about on this board).<P>"...there is very little remorse and virtually no repentance reflected here." - I may not have reflected that in my post, but believe me, I have great remorse and have told my husband that. I have seen how much I hurt him and have wished thousands of times that I could turn back the clock and do things differently.<P>"Sounds like you want the reader to feel sympathy for you. Oh, You poor baby." - Not sympathy, but at least some understanding. I have and am experiencing a lot of pain too, you know. I came here for support, not sarcasm.<P>"Why would he be [interested in re-investing in the relationship]? What is in it for him? What do you have to offer him?" - I know all about Dr. Harley's concepts - the Love Bank, emotional needs, love busters, etc. And I know I can meet my husband's emotional needs. After he found out about the affair and before we were separated I was totally in Plan A mode and he saw it. But he pretty much told me not to waste my time, that it wasn't making any difference. I have tried to stay in Plan A and keep meeting my husband's emotional needs, but it's very difficult when someone is not receptive to that.<P>"If you really love him, let him go." - I don't get it. So many people on this board have WS who have expressed no remorse, are still seeing the other person, have treated and keep treating their spouse like dirt, yet the BS don't "let go" of their WS. And they don't want their WS "letting go" of them. Do you believe there's little or no hope for them? Why is it different for me? Is it because my husband is not Plan Aing me and is not interested in being in a relationship with me?<P>I'm just very confused. I love my husband, I believe we could be happy together, and I'm just trying to figure out whether or not to fight for us and how to go about doing so if that's what I choose to do. And I am considering my husband's feelings and happiness in this too, believe me. I have made a huge mistake, but I still have a lot to offer as a marriage partner and I believe if given a chance, I could meet his needs. But I sometimes do think he'd be better off without me, and I should just leave him alone to find someone who deserves him. It's just very difficult.<P>Mary<P>Nina, I wrote this before you posted, but thanks for your response too.

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As promised, and it seems to apply to you:<P>quote:<BR>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Originally posted by FaithfulWife:<BR>Welcome…<BR>This is my general welcome post for all new people.<P>This greeting is geared toward people whose spouses had an affair (A), but since it’s general, good advice, it can help your situation as well!! <P>It has a couple of links to many of the most important MB (Marriage Builder) sites.<P>Click here ==> General Welcome for All New Builders(Newbies) <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html</A> <P>About your post... <P>Plan A... <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html</A> <P>Check out this post Plan A - 101 (2nd ed.), by a very wise, good friend named NSR (Jim).<BR> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000176.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum30/HTML/000176.html</A> <P>Plan A is not just for trying to win back a spouse. It is what you should be doing to build/rebuild yourself first... and then your marriage! It is about becoming the person that you have the potential to be-—the person that God intended for you to be! It is about becoming the very best spouse you can be, whether or not your spouse is the best spouse they can be. <P>If I were to give an intelligent guess, I would say that your spouse's lovebank is empty. Imagine a pitcher of water that is constantly pouring water OUT but never getting a refill of water. It can't keep pouring out forever! Eventually, the pitcher will run dry and it will have to stop pouring out. That's what has happened here. Your spouse poured and poured and poured and finally ran dry. Now your job is not to give up--it is to think of your spouse and REFILL THEIR PITCHER. <P>You will probably have to fill the pitcher for a while without getting anything back to you to fill your pitcher, so be ready for that. It will take some time for your spouse to believe that it's true and that you are sincere, so pace yourself and rest and take care of yourself, and come here for your gripes and for some encouragement. Okay?<P>If you have drifted away from your faith (whatever that may be)consider rediscovering it. This step too, has helped countless marriages and marriage builders. <P>You are in my thoughts and prayers tonight.<P><BR>CJ<P>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<P><BR>Some has been edited by me.<P>

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Welcome to Marriage Builders...<P>I, too, am a betrayed spouse, but I welcome you to share and learn like the rest of us. There will be no flaming from me.<P>I have been divorced for 4 yrs now because of my ex's affair. I can understand your husbands anger very well. The bottom of my world fell out when he told me about OW. I, too, had much anger--I threw my wedding dress [that I had saved for my daughter to wear] in the garbage can along with our wedding album. I packed up all his things and put them in the garage. I was so physically and emotionally distraught that I lost 14 lbs in 2 weeks, I couldn't eat, and had to be put on anti depressant medication. It got where I couldn't stand to be in the same room with him,because I was so upset. I am telling you this, because the pain is so hard to deal with and it takes some people longer than others to accept what has happened and get to the next stage.It took me almost two years to get passed my expreme anger and hurt!!<BR>As I said before, we have been divorced 4 yrs now, and we are now good friends, which I never thought possible when going through the divorce. He is still with OW, and I understand she lurks here on MB frequently--that doesn't even upset me ! Time heals a lot of the wounds and then you can start the rebuilding process if that is what he wants--right now everything will have to be on his timetable.<BR>My point to all of this--it is going to take a lot of time to repair the damage done to your marriage. It is going to take a lot of time for your husband to work through his issues with this. What is needed here is much patience on your part--when he is ready to start healing, he will contact you. Use this time away from him to read all you can about affairs. It doesn't make any difference if it was a one night stand or ongoing affair. Something was missing in your relationship with your husband to have allwed the one night stand to have happened.

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><BR><B>"If you really love him, let him go." - I don't get it. </B> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>FH,<P>This an easy one. The idea is to make returning to you attractive to him. Simply put, one person cannot save a marriage. It takes two. Certainly you are convinced that you can meet his "emotional needs". At the moment, it sounds like he isn't quite so sure. So, let him go. In the meantime work on yourself. Be good to yourself, and be kind to him too. If he comes back to you because that is what he really wants to do, then there is hope. <P>I am a betrayed spouse, a wayward spouse, and a divorced spouse. What we tried didn't work. It is a long story, but we've been divorced for nearly seventeen years, and we are still dealing with the ugly after effects. I firmly believe if Dr. Harley had been around in those days, we might have saved our marriage. Most marriages don't break up because of a single act of fidelity, most men, and even more so most women try to save their marriages. The MB ideas have helped thousands of couples to deal with it.<P>You are not alone. All of us are subject to infidelity, we all have the required parts and we all have the required wiring. We all get tempted. Everyone has the power to cause the pain of infidelity. <BR> <BR>Then comes the hard part. As you already know, that pain just doesn't go away by itself. How does one relieve that pain? At least how does one make that pain easier to live with?<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper<P>PS. If you think my post flamed your thread, say the word and and I'll delete it. <P><BR><p>[This message has been edited by Bumperii (edited September 21, 2001).]

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Please visit <A HREF="http://www.restorem.org" TARGET=_blank>www.restorem.org</A> <BR>It has helped me during my stand.


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