I have been doing some reflecting on my life...my faults...my personality...me.
I came to the realization a few months ago that I have and still do display some (actually a lot) co-dependent behaviors.
I had always thought these behaviors were good.
To try and make the people I love happy, to try and not do things to upset them or make them mad, but then again...
I've always understood it to bad to be co-dependent
so that brings me to today...
I read the actical "How the co-depency movement is ruining mariages" by Dr. Harley.
What he says makes a lot of sense.
The behaviors that in effect make you a co-dependent are the behaviors needed to create a good and loving marriage...
If and this is a BIG IF both partners are behaving in that way...and IF they are both mentally and emotionally healthy.<p>The example Dr. Harley used in the artical was if one partner is display co-dependent behaviors and one is an alcholic then it is not good...
The "co-dependent" partner is an enabler.
In my case, Arik was abusive and my "co-dependent" nature enabled him to continue to abuse me.
Because I strived to make him happy...because I wanted to try to not do the things that made him mad...then when he displayed these behaviors (deep sadness, extreme anger), it must be my fault so I would try even harder...I would comfort him, I would apologize, I would "reward" his abuse.<p>So...where do I go from here??<p>If being "co-dependent" isn't bad in itself and may even make a healthy marriage thrive...
What do I do?<p>I know there was another thread along these lines several months back...but I don't know if it answered this type of dilema...<p>I want to be in a healthy marriage someday.<p>I want to feel peace and love and respect and and and...<p>Can I have this??
knowing my history is it possible??

Hi Nic,<p>Well, let me be very honest with you. Our histories are very alike, and as you know, I am married to a healthy man now. Let me tell you what I've learned:<p>Yes, it's possible to find a healthy loving man.<p>Yes, it's possible to find a man who will love you without ridicule, without hurting you, without using you for his personal verbal punching bag.<p>Yes, it's possible to have a conversation with a man without you ending up in the fetal position with him standing over you.<p>Here's the problem I've seen, Nicole>>> I don't know how to handle it.<p>As you know, I moved too quickly into a second marriage. BIG MISTAKE. I needed time the grieve the first marriage, and to WORK ON ME without a man around. I thought I'd had enough time, because David had moved in and out over and over for about a year. But I wasn't doing any *real* work until the last time he moved out. I'd been alone, but mostly I cried and ached. That's not exactly helpful.<p>You will need to learn your WORTH and work on your self-esteem. <p>I didn't do any of those things fully, and here's what I do. <p>I sabatage my marriage, over and over again. I'm asking, "Do you really love me?" and "Don't get mad at me, but..." or "Can I have this?" when we go to the store. Finally my H stopped me and held my shoulders and looked me straight in the face and said, "Sheryl, I am not David"... I wanted to crawl in a hole. I don't know how to act with a healthy man!!<p>So, yes, you *can* find all that you're looking for, dear Nicole, but it will take some work on YOU to begin the process.<p>Love you,

Sheryl,<p>Thanks for the insight and the words of encouragement.<p>I think your problem is my biggest fear.
How do I funtion in a "normal" relationship?
Arik is my "first and only". I have never dated, kissed or been with anybody else. I wouldn't know how to act with anybody else. I have no idea what it is like to come home to someone without regrouping myself before walking through the door because I don't know who will greet me when I enter. I know what it is like to come home now without doing it...just not coming home to somebody (if that makes any sense [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img] )<p>I am taking time and trying to examine all my issues, and I am not in any rush to move on at any rate. <p>I guess I'm looking too far ahead...fearing sommething that isn't even here yet...maybe by the time it is here I'll be ready for it...only time will tell.<p>Thanks again Sheryl, for sharing the wisdom you have gained through experience with me.<p>Much love to you.<p>God bless [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ January 24, 2002: Message edited by: Patient Love ]</p>

Hi Patient,<p>Read "Co-dependent no more" by Melanie(?) Beattie. Also read "The verbally abusive relationship" by Patricia Evans.<p>Personally (being one), I think co dependents people are some of the nicest people on God's earth. We are always conscious of other's emotions, and careful of other's feelings. We are warm and sympathetic and empathetic.<p>Where we fail is in not knowing and not bringing forth our own desires and wishes. Not speaking up. POJA never enters the picture, because we are too focused on what the other person would like to have, rather than what WE would like to have. I think we know how to give, we just don't know how to take. Among other things.

I am dealing with the co-dependency issue. It took my xh to walk out on our marriage and our two children for me to see the reality of our marriage. He left because he wasn't happy and didn't love me anymore, he also was having an affair that I learned about after he left. I had to somehow pick up the pieces after he left if not for me then for the children. I started counseling immediately and I have been able to pick up the pieces for me AND my children. I never knew I could be this strong. My xh walked out 8/01 and our divorce was final 1/02. Me and my children are better off and I know that for a fact.<p>I learned so very much about my xh and our marriage after he left. It took counseling for me to see how bad things really were. The verbal, emotional and mental abuse goes back to when we were dating. My xh has alot of baggage from his past, he won't talk alot about any of it, but me and my children got to pay for it. It never became physical but now I believe it was a matter of time. He would get so angry over such minor little things and then he wouldn't talk to me for days. Every day that I came home I had to prepare myself for his mood that day. If he was sad, so were me and the children. If he was happy, so were me and the children. We became so dependent on his mood swings and that is very bad. It came to the point that it was like walking on eggshells at home. I never knew when to talk to him or how to talk to him because I didn't want to be yelled at or to make him angry. When we argued I said nothing because somehow it would always be my fault. I lived like this for 8+ years. I thought this was normal........everyone has their problems, all marriages have problems. This was very unhealthy for me and my children. No, I didn't want the divorce. I still believe that if he wanted to try we could have made the marriage work but he is still in denial about everything. He filed, I didn't fight it. I feel like I made the best decision in my life. I feel free since he left, a feeling that I can't explain. There is peace in my home and I can see the difference this has made on my children. They were suffering as much as I was. They are so much happier, the peace that generates off of them is so wonderful. <p>I know how hard all of this is but through my faith in God I have been able to keep my head up and get through all of this. I am still working on my life and will be for a long time to come.<p>My counselor told me that co-dependency is good and bad. What I did was bad. But, my xh was the one that caused it and his behavior is not normal.<p>Hope some of this helps,
Kathy

I just spent the last year in counseling because of my co-dependent behavior. Co-dependents think they are in control of everyones' emotions and try to fix themselves so other people will like them and be happy. If someone is mad its the co-dependents fault, its their job to fix it. Its not fun at all being a co-dependent. They also have no boundaries, they let people walk on them thinking that they themselves are at fault and not the other person who is stretching the boundary. Co-dependents think it is their fault their marriage is ending, they think it is their fault their spouse has chosen to cheat on them. There will ALWAYS be rough times in marriage. A co-dependent is usually addicted to things and has a pattern in their life with relationships. Co-dependents are not healthy and normal. Healthy and normal is setting boundaries to protect yourself from getting hurt and not feeling guilty about them. Their are books from the Minirth Counseling Clinic that are wonderful at helping people thru co-dependency. Yes, I started acting like a normal healthy person which was setting boundaries with my husband thinking he was mature enough and healthy to work with me, i.e.. I asked him for more help with things around the house like decision making (all my H did was mow the lawn and vacuum upstairs-thats it-I did the rest-I mean everything...) on bills and budgeting it was me. I asked him to call a roofer, I asked him to get groceries once in a awhile-thinking the whole time that he would still love me and never leave me-so he found another woman that will take care of him and he will not have to make decisions and help out-in other words he won't have to grow up like most men do.....There is alot more to co-dependency thank what I have listed and alot more behaviors in my marriage but like I said at the top it took a year to see it all...I don't think you want to read it all. I can say now, a year later, that I am worthy of someone who will sit and talk to me about problems and circumstances and I will not worry if they walk out because of one little problem-I know now that they have the problem and not me. I have confidence of who I am and how I am and I am worthy of being treated good and if someone has a problem with this healthy behavior its their problem not mine... [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ January 25, 2002: Message edited by: White Dove ]</p>

Well, you all have certainly given me a lot to think about.
I do realize that all of this will be difficult to work through on my own and will look into some type of counselling in the neat future. I guess I need some sort of direction...
I will definetly look into the books that you all have suggested. I think that would be a good start.<p>I think the biggest problem with co-dendency is not so much the giving part as the not feel good enough to have part. Always beleiving you must deserve to be treated this way, and never feeling you have a right to ask for anything. That may be the area that I need to focus on.<p>Thanks again for all the insight and advice. I appreciate it a lot.

That sounds like a good place to start..<p>Why do you feel like that is ALL you deserve..<p>Why do you struggle with feelings of guilt for
wanting and needing more from a relationship?<p>The harder part is..when you do find out WHY you feel this way..is figuring out HOW to change that
way of thinking..which is where I am..How do I change this thought pattern? Without it sounding/feeling selfish..but normal..and dealing w/ the guilty feelings it arises inside when I do ask something..when I know it's what I 'need' and not just a 'want' ...even that is hard..

TR,<p>I am not sure why I feel this way.
I always have, I think to some degree.
As a child I tried so hard to be the "perfect daughter" so as to "earn" my parent's love.
I never felt good enough for my mother. I had over-heard her saying that she wanted a boy for her first born...(she didn't even have a girl's name picked out...my dad had to come up with one.)
I was a colicky baby and so my mom had a hard time with me then and may not have connected with me because of that...dad was of the old school he was the bread earner...he was a logger and was hardly ever home while I was awake. It's hard to connect with somebody you don't see very often.
When my brother came along he was a very easy baby and he was the boy that mother had always wanted.
I always felt "second best" from that time on.<p>Also, when I was young (from the time I was 6 until I was about 11) I was sexually molested by my uncle.
I hated myself for years after that...I thought I must be a pretty horrible person for that to have happened to me. I didn't really think I could be worthy of "real love" becuase I was so ashamed of myself.<p>I have worked through a lot of those issues...
but I think I still have some work to do on it.<p>So maybe that helps some of you to know where I am coming from and where some of my "co-dependent" feelings come from.<p>I'll be in touch...<p>Thanks again.

Oh Nicole, <p>Isn't it awful how those sexually-abused, icky mother, tormented childhoods come back to haunt us again and again? <p>Once again, we share a bond. A sad and life-changing bond. <p>A few months after I was born my father died, and my mom didn't want me. She took me to my grandparents, and lived there herself, but ignored me. They raised me for the few two and a half years until my mother married again. She told me this, in the interest of honesty, to say that I *might* have some abandonment issues. Um, yeah.<p>Sexual abuse in my past. Check. Mine was with a girl - a young woman. Blocked it out till was around 25 or so. I can't even remember when I remembered, but it made me sick when I did.<p>And of course, Arik and David. Those good looking poppie heads who can charm their way through life and cause us untold pain and confusion.<p>Yep, I hear ya.