Hey, we are both simultaneously editing the above two posts!

Hi Karenna! Yes, we're both here thinking of each other! <BR>

Karenna, just wondering...have you read my posts since the way back beginning when I first came here?<P>

Yes. But not re-read recently.<P>How about you?<P>Bet you haven't read all mine!

Renae:<P>You mentioned Dr. Rinck in the book talked about "Covenant Separation" which allows the wife to heal and have peace while the husband gets help/deals with his issues.<P>This is what I have advocated for the past few months in my responses to you.<P>You mention getting Pastor T involved in this to see if your h would be agreeable....in my opinion, you should forget h and simply think of yourself and leave.....<P>[censored]<BR>

Knowing how revengeful he is, I've been afraid if I leave he really will just divorce me as he threatened. I've had to reach acceptance of that as a likely consequence before I leave. <P>He's on this kick now of accusing me of being unwilling to work on the relationship...he preaches and shames me for this. He can't imagine how burnt-out I am...<BR>Instead of doing "emergency loving" & his own self-work to rescue us, he just kicks me more!! Can you believe this man? He's so "shame-based"! UGH!!!!!!! <P> <P><BR>

Is that the worst that will happen?!!<P>Is that why you are waffling?<P>Unbelievable.<P>

Oh, I've been waffling for lots of reasons, Karenna, but those reasons are losing hold as my level of inner pain on a daily basis is becoming more than I can stand. His verbal attacks on me yesterday, the day before, etc...are just sick! There is no emotional safety in his presence.<P>I need to meet the new counselor for support,talk over the options I have, and get a plan of escape going. Kids will be out of school by June 2 and I should be able to break free of him soon. <P>The Itsfixable.com tapes are good. H walked into the room and listened to parts of them yesterday, surprisingly. At first he scowled at me for listening to this "digging into the past junk" (he has to pre- & mis-judge everything), but then it caught his attention and he stood there listening for quite some time, probably trying to find real fault with it but it was just too good! I will play more of these tapes when he's around....It is the only way left to get truth into his ears before I'm gone.<P>Your prayers are so appreciated as I'm untangling myself from this web!! <P> <BR>

What do other women in my situation do at this point to offset the terrible feelings of loneliness? Yet I feel so withdrawn like even trying to interact with people is hard.<p>[This message has been edited by Renae (edited April 24, 2001).]

Many people join a support group. You most definitely ought to find a class, workshop or support group for victims of domestic violence. Don't worry about "qualifying" for it. You do. Later on you can go to a "divorce" support group if you end up filing for legal separation.

Today I had a phone consultation with my new counselor (recommended by Pastor T and attends (& enjoys!!)his church even though she originally came from a very conservative background (so can understand H). <P>Unlike my last counselor, she believes in "separations" for abusive situations but with ongoing therapy with hopes of reconcilliation and avoiding divorce. This is what's needed-- sounds great for our situation!!! Her husband coaches too. Pastor T can join us also if we want. We set a tentative meeting time for next Wed. eve.....<P>Now I need to ask H. He was very "low" today, ....so perhaps he is ready to try??? UGH!!... <P>[censored], Karenna, bleubelle...and all, please pray for H's cooperation this time: that he will go to counseling, cooperate with separation, respond to therapy, etc.!!<BR>

I'm awake in the night. Can't sleep cuz stuff is running through my mind. If H won't get this counsel I found and agree to separation, I must just go anyway...I can't take it!!!!<P>Yesterday we were cleaning out whats left in a huge machine shed before the buyer of the building comes to disassemble it this weekend. H looked very distraught...said he doesn't feel like working, wishes he could run away! He's tired of the overload of work and perfectionistic expections his dad & brothers put on him, he works around the clock and yet his elderly dad acts like H gets paid too much though it is a far cry from enough. <P>H thinks I just want to place more expectations on top! He sees himself as a victim of this and our marriage problems all due to this and circumstances. I said, sure circumstances affect us but we still have choices and need to make better choices!<P>He can't see that I'm out not to encumber him as they are but rather to free him from this sick life-- helping him set better boundaries, free him of erroneous beliefs & sick patterns of behavior, etc. and I have a team of loving, grace-oriented people just waiting to help him!! <P>They and I want him to get through his chaotic circumstances, pain and woundedness to change his life to health and joy and to gain a real marriage for once!! <P><p>[This message has been edited by Renae (edited April 26, 2001).]

Renae, you seem to have such a good heart. This man doesn't know what he is missing out on.<P>I have no clue where you live and what community resources are in your area but I do have a suggestion for finding a support group. The YWCA, not the YMCA, in my city has a variety of groups including one for abused wives. I called them at one point in my debacle and they told me I did qualify for the group. That all I needed to do when I was ready to attend was call and let them know and they would tell me where the meeting was- they protect this information. There is no charge for this support group.<P>If you need help in finding something similar, e-mail me at MBbleubelle@yahoo.com. I will get you a telephone number for either the YW here or for our Council of Community Services and they can possibly help you find a referral source in your area.

Thank you so much, bleubelle! <BR>

As soon as H woke this morning and found me in the kitchen, he started in verbally, angrily attacking me...I could tell he was suffering deep pain and didn't know how to ask for caring/comfort. Suddenly he stopped, slumped into a chair, and started to cry, telling me how he wants to quit everything! I held his head close to my chest lovingly.<BR>He's very despairing, to the extent I've rarely seen... Is he coming to the end of his ways? He needs help. Maybe now he finally will admit it? I will ask him to see the counselor....<P><BR>

Miracles happen when you do not tolerate the intolerable.

Wow!

H is TRYING to "play immature games" about not going to the Counselor. Same old games. I'm not tolerating any of them. >>>IT IS TIME TO GROW UP!!! If he's not going, then I'm going!!!!... When he started redefining me like abusers do, I gave him a good strong wack of truth...it shocked him to silence!<P>Just prior to the toughest exchange with H....I had been listening to the Itsfixable.com seminar tape...WOW! They hit the button exactly to how H is; if that man can grow up (out of a worse past)so can H, but he's got to make up his mind to do it!! After hearing this man, I looked H in the eyes with more confidence than ever!! <BR> <P>

Renae, you are finally starting to sound like my kind of woman!

Yes, I think I'm in this for God to build me stronger.<BR>Karenna, it's not been my nature to be this tough, which<BR>is why I got run over by this man to begin with! <BR>My position of strength now is the only stance I can take with a man in such a cloud of spiritual deception and emotional immaturity. The worst part is he chooses to be unteachable! <P>By comparison, the man on the Itsfixable tape was willing to gain knowledge and inspite of his horrid past (abuse, neglect, etc.) he learned new habits that transformed himself, his marriage, etc. He said this is the very essence of real Christianity, is recognizing our damaged state which produces animalistic tendencies (emotional, spiritual, relational dysfunctions)!! Wow! That's so true!<BR>All my H has is religion if he isn't treating his wife right and doesn't have a teachable spirit!<P><BR> <P> <BR>