Well now, as many of you KNOW, I'm the Grande Poohba of pre-divorce dating these past several months. If ya want my story to critique, just ask. I am candid and open about it and accept flack with only the occasional subtle barb back. Er, I THINK I'm subtle. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

wiffty and AGG in particular tackle each other to wave the soccer flags at me. I'm behaving improperly, it's too soon, I don't know myself, I can't function alone, tsk tsk. And ya know what? I appreciate it. I am learning. I want to hear ALL advice. I've noticed I tend to grow MORE by hearing advice I don't like! I will stop to ponder it, then either adopt it or file-13 it. The thing I most appreciate is that they took the time to post to me. They listened to me. They are trying to help.

We have so many different personal beliefs here. It's a potluck plethora (say that 5 times, real fast). And we all learn at our own speed. Just because someone is doing it differently than we ourselves might doesn't mean they're not interested in MB concepts and striving for a healthy relationship. I'm glad Lxya is posting his dating experience and NOT because I agree OR disagree. It's his candor I admire.

I also very much appreciated reading gentle's post. She has a lovely way of communicating her opinion based on Christian belief. Thank you, gentle and I mean that sincerely. Exceptionally noteworthy post.

Gawd how I love that word "plethora". <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wift....

My opinion...I would say yes that is dating and yes before you were divorced...

Also, from your conversations on MB you still have someone in your life...whether it's just talking to them on the phone every night or seeing them....and I don't believe you went very long without having a gf in your life...so what's your point here? To me that's not being alone at all!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Anna,

if i spend more time on MB than talking with my GF, am i dating MB? and i have been.

if I see my mom once a week for dinner, am i dating my mom? yes, i am dating my mom

geez, i have no one here to go out on weekends, i have no one here to help me clean up my house, i have no one here to have sex with. . .

if you go out with a prostitute, and have sex, am i dating? no, but that's a different definition

really, it comes down to definition. . . .

to go out on a single encounter with a person of the opposite sex is not "dating", which to me is actively seeking out time with the other sex on a regular basis. was it a date, yes. did i consider myself dating after moving out? no, because once is not a pattern. I was invited to a friends house for dinner to meet her sister, i went, they are parents of a kid that was one of my referees. was that dating? no, not in my book, it was going out to a dinner party, entering alone, and leaving alone.

I am not dating, i do not go out with anyone on a regular basis, i do not spend time with the opposite sex on a regular basis. i am not actively asking people out on a regular basis. If you were here and showed up at my door on any random weekend or night, i would be here or with my kids, or playing sports.

If the kids have a sports activity, i go to it alone. If there is a recital, or lessons, i go with them alone. on weekends, i am alone with my kids.

do you want to know what i have learned by living alone? That i suck as a house keeper, and that my X made a big deal about my lack of it, but she was no where near perfect, but she seems to think that it was totally my responsibility, and criticized me when i did contribute to housekeeping. So, my biggest challenge for the next serious relationship is my housekeeping.

second, that my lifestyle is one of a basic hermit. i talk with a sailor BF and visit him as much as i go out with my GF, and do you consider me dating him?

lets not go overboard with definitions. I admitted to going out on a date. . . but i don't consider that i am actively seeking out women to have encounters with, nor do i feel any need to spend any time with the opposite sex.

i would tackle AGG and wave the flag at lucks, because she is spending regular free time with BF. AGG dated, with regular activities with GF. he learned from several encounters, i learned from one encounter for fun, not for a relationship, that I was not ready for steady, regular time to spend with someone.

i would not make the definition so narrow that having coffee once with the opposite sex for fun is considered dating. . . .

wiftty

Maybe, just maybe, "Dating" can be defined as:

"Allowing someone of the opposite sex to meet any one of your emotional needs"

Maybe? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Jo

OHMYGOSH Wifft!!! You sound like Bill Clinton! You crack me up!

Jo, You crack me up too...you are just a cutie!

ANNA

Hey All,

I haven't read all of the posts... just wanted to chime in since I'm dating as well... I'm divorced though, and I have been before I started dating... but this looks like an interesting topic with all kinds of diverse view points from what I've read so far.

I'll check back in and see how it's going when I get some time (something I'm sorely lacking at the moment).

Good topic Lyxa, I'll bet you didn't think you would get so much coverage... LOL

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Anna2000 says:WhenIFindTheTime says: I'll just tackle Laura all by myself, I think it would be fun!

Anna2000 says:WhenIFindTheTime say: I'll only tackle her once so that will only be .0000001% of my time over a period of one year which will actually be spent tackling someone for fun so it won't count for tackling anyone at all.

hehe...Wiffty, I had to rib you a little... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> You made that one too easy!

ANNA

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by WhenIfindthetime:
<strong>So, my biggest challenge for the next serious relationship is my housekeeping.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Heh, heh. You too, wiftty? Is it an INTP thing perhaps?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by justthewife:
<strong>She must be as amazing as my Romeo..... isn't it wonderful how they can just grab you like that?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wonderful? It's horribly disconcerting is what it is! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

This is a woman who isn't interested in dating right now; she's focused on other things. Our interactions are brief and no more intimate than my interactions with other friends (both male and female). I thought that would suit me just fine, since for me even to contemplate "dating" requires major adjustments to the beliefs and values I have held onto for the last several years. So when a series of odd coincidences compelled me to take notice of this woman despite my longstanding disinterest in getting "involved" with anyone new, I expected that her disinterest would offer me the time I needed either to make those adjustments or else to determine that my hermit hole was the right place for me after all.

I did not count on "falling in love" so quickly. I am a very deliberate person, and I never let my heart stray too far from my head. The problem is, the better I get to know this woman, the more difficult it is for my head to come up with plausible objections - not because my heart is distracting my head, but because this woman keeps demonstrating that my concerns are misplaced, and she keeps revealing more things to admire about her.

(I also think I am very close to achieving a relatively stable reconfiguration of my belief system. Although the relevant threads do run deep, the overall effect on the weave is less pervasive than I had anticipated, and so in this area also things have moved more rapidly than I had expected.)

The result? Disorientation and frustration. Can you imagine how much more frustrated I would be if I were still emotionally and legally entangled with my (can I bring myself to say it now without putting "ex-" in parentheses?) ex-wife?

Ugh.

And here's the moral of my story...

I am (I believe) an unusually self-controlled man, and I don't make decisions or do things without very careful consideration beforehand. If something like this can happen to someone like me, then it can happen to anyone. And it can happen just as suddenly and unexpectedly.

So be very, very careful...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Disorientation and frustration. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If we're going with the -tion words, may I suggest masturbation? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

If you still have that same old email .....@...ex.com I'll be sending you a line as soon as my folks clear out on Sunday.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Anna2000 says:WhenIFindTheTime say: I'll only tackle her once so that will only be .0000001% of my time over a period of one year which will actually be spent tackling someone for fun so it won't count for tackling anyone at all.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LMAO!!!!!!!

that was a good one anna!

wiftty

GDP,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Heh, heh. You too, wiftty? Is it an INTP thing perhaps? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">actually, its an xNxP trait, and if you think about the characteristics of those two letters, you will understand it. . .

wiftty

hey, we can talk till we're blue in the face about the "right" time to date. However, IMO, I personally would not want anything to do with a someone who would "date" anyone who was still married. You might as well set yourself up for a future infidelity! oh hey, this person thought it was A-OK to "date" me cause I said my marriage was over. Then, I guess they will think it is A-OK to "date", socialize, blah, blah with someone else before their marriage (maybe to me) is over. Does this sound familiar Lynx? How exactly did you hook up with your STBXW?

Last but not least, I have no doubts that the person having an affair thought it was fun at the time too. Fun does not equal common sense. You wanna play russian roulette with your future? Be my guest!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Student, this is the last response you're ever going to see from me to one of your posts - You don't know what you're talking about on this or the other threads we've crossed on. I find your posts extremely self-righteous and arrogant. I feel like you have appointed yourself Avenger of Hypocrisy, when you should probably aim your smoking gun at yourself... or at the very least delve a bit more into the topic at hand before pulling the trigger.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by WhenIfindthetime:
<strong>actually, its an xNxP trait, and if you think about the characteristics of those two letters, you will understand it. . .</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yeah, I understand it. What I understand less well is why my xNxJ ex-wife was no better at housekeeping than I was (and am)...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by justthewife:
<strong>If we're going with the -tion words, may I suggest masturbation? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Go right ahead, but the bulk of my frustration derives from the lack of opportunity to talk. There's so much I want to say, and so much I want to know...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by justthewife:
<strong>If you still have that same old email .....@...ex.com I'll be sending you a line as soon as my folks clear out on Sunday.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That email address should still be good. I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

Lucks,

Thanks for your kind words.

Just my belief, but to me keeping the morals laid out in God's word is the practical answer to life. I wish I had know this years ago. Would have saved me a lot of pain. But then again, I wouldn't be who I am today. So, I am thankful I have learned this truth.

gentle

Personally, I tend to think of a date as anytime you do/ or could potentially end your time with that person with a kiss. Whether or not it happens is immaterial. If the situation would be complacent with one, then I consider that a date. If you see a group of women (in my case) friends, I am not going to be kissing them when we go home. But if I ask one specifically out with the potential (and I am not just saying anything can happen kind of thing) of a kiss, then the stakes change.

I don't know, this is just an off the cuff definition for me. It could change shortly, or end up carved in stone... who knows the future... If I did, I would be typing this from a beach in the Caribbean.

<small>[ May 11, 2003, 12:52 AM: Message edited by: Formerly Confused ]</small>

Hey Formerly Confused...

I agree. It's only a date if there's a kiss. If there was potential and the kiss didn't happen... I'd call that a "frustrating date". ;-)

Some interesting stats I came across on askmen.com...
- Women form their first impression as to a man's desirability in 9 seconds.
- If you ask out 10 women, only 3 will actually go out with you. (assuming you make a favorable first impression, of course).
- Of the 3 women, only 1 will have potential to turn into a relationship.
- Of 10 women with potential, only 1 will last longer than 60 days. So, you need to (statistically) make 100 favorable first impressions and ask them all out to find The One.

The take home lesson IMO is that you need to always be expanding your social circle and don't get hung up on gold-diggers, mercenaries, people with excessive baggage, and people you don't mesh well with.

Huh. As someone who believes sex outside of marriage is wrong, I wouldn't consider trying a kiss on a "date" until/unless the relationship had gotten pretty serious.

I guess the definition of a "date" I would prefer is a pre-arranged one-on-one activity with someone I viewed as a marriage prospect. The problem with that definition is it's too one-sided. I may be thinking along potentially romantic lines, but my "date" may have a much more casual attitude.

Personally, I would prefer to avoid the reverse situation entirely: I don't want to find myself inadvertently "leading on" someone who might be thinking romantically when my own interest is entirely platonic.

My solution is simple: (1) I won't "date" unless I have already developed a strong interest in a woman, and (2) I will communicate this interest before "dating".

I realize that this is a highly unconventional approach, and that it makes for a very small number of dating prospects, but that doesn't bother me in the least. If a woman finds adherence to convention more attractive than openness and honesty, then she's not the type of woman I want to pursue.

Good Gracious look at this thread! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Hey, to each his own. I did go out befor my divorce was final.....Im very, very happy I did. I met a beautiful woman who is super to me and my children. They love her. My parents love her. My friends love her, and I love her. She is the best thing that has happened to me in years. I went from a selfish, materialistic, bitter person to someone completely opposite. What is so wrong with that? I still stay its your choice Lyxa. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Wow, I was just rereading this thread. Interesting how it turned out. There's one last set of observations I want to add...

- Whenever you do start dating... expect people to come out of the woodwork with all kinds of advice, tips, tricks, misgivings, suggestions, and whatnot. It's amazing. This thread kind of shows that... but c'mon this is a forum for this kind of thing. I'm talking about people you know socially and from across the width and breadth of the spectrum. A good example, my parents were totally supportive of my starting to date again, until I went out with someone the 2nd time. Now they're vehemently against it and full of concerns.
- Expect to feel a bit more lonely than you may have up to this point in your dv/separation/whatever. Getting back out there, while intoxicating, kind of rubs your face in everything you probably miss about being married... and brings back a lot of memories.
- Unless you're a woman, don't bother with dating sites. And if you do, be careful.
- FC is my hero. You should all search on his posts. Regardless of anything he might have said... his best point is that the outcome is less important than the PRACTICE.