Why does he do this. Today. He called me at the garage sale. It was a hard enough day, with my aunts funeral, and garage sale. Got up very early to be at the garage sale to finish up what we were too tired to do yesterday.

He called to see about working at the garage tonight to get stuff ready for the garage sale. Nothing today about how I felt about the funeral. Nothing on are you tired, or we could wait till next garage sale. He has had 3 years to clean out the garage. I know he knows that I am good at this, and organizing. But where is the consideration and thoughtfulness to me. Where is the wondering how I am doing emotionally.

He lied today, to his mother. He said (not asked) for me to call his mother to have her ready for all of us to come to the garage (which is at her house that she is evicted from). Why do I have to call? Why do I have to do any of this, answer this question? I called, and she went on and on. Then he is late getting going, and she calls to ask where is everyone, and more on and on I get. Then we get to the garage, and he had the nerve to tell his mother that he asked me how his mother was feeling. More lies. He didn't say one bit to me about her health. Then he said, that he told me to ask her if she was ready for the garage sorting. He didn't say one iota to me, just to make sure she was ready. Just make sure she is up to go through the stuff. I told her it was not the truth. I told her I was sick of the lies, and at one point I put my coat on and was ready to walk home. I am so sick of this crap from a deceitful man, who hasn't been telling me the truth for 3 solid years. I am sick of this man pretending to be a kind considerate man. I am sick of this man, not considering my feelings. I am sick of this man, only looking out for himself. I am sick of him being an unthoughtful person, and yes SNL I am hurting, but do you care. Hell no, just you again, sweetheart, just you. Maybe one day you will see what you have destroyed, and how your lies and deceit have caused major damage in this house.

I am so upset, and so burnt out on this mans selfish attitude, and unthoughtful ness. I hate his actions, his words, his lies, his deceit, his unthoughtfulness. I wish to heck he would get his semi-trailer and leave and go to Arizona to be with his Mrs. Whore.

Faith. Let it go girl. Let him go. You still have expectations and when they are x's they are just that. Inacapable of meeting any of our expectations or they wouldn't be x's.

Let it go. Let him go once and for all. Build healthy boundaries ok? He can't just walk up or in when he feels like it.

You're still wanting to have him treat you with wifely respect and kindness. He doesn't have to anymore. Know this.

I expect the worst from Jethro adn that's what I have gotten. Thus, I will expect basically nothing for him. If I want respect, I will demand it. And the men I will choose to be around will respect me.

If SNL doesn't respect you, then cut him off. Say no more. Those days are gone. If he disrespects you, then don't allow any more contact or limit it. When he disrespects you, end the contact at that time. Over a period he will learn this. It is an equation. if 1) I treat Faith badly then 2)she will immediatley end our contact then 3)I will not see or speak to her.

So he has to earn your respect and will not be allowed around if he's gonna be a jerk ok? I love you and don't want to have to stand for this anymore.

Guess in my liberation today...I wanted to pass some of it to you my friend. Hugs. Don't take it.

He has to be taught. Dr. Phil says that we teach people how to treat us.

just peachy - just got home from the garage sale. Was kind of slow today, but maid some money. Will help pay for summer taxes. I am so beat, maybe I am severely depressed or something. My neck is throbbing, and my back is spasming. Just decided to take a quick look here, before I sit in the tub. I used to beable to do garage sales, and still have energy to do somethings at home. Not today. Maybe I am getting old, and worn out. Maybe I am just sick of living. I don't know, just so tired.

Yes, I still want the respect of SNL, and I really want the lies to quit. I want him to be respectful to me and the kids and his mother too. Why does the wayward spouse treat us all like this, and his spouse the worst? Why, does he have to be so much of a selfish bully? Why does he have to not show feelings, or remorse? I just don't understand any of this anymore. Maybe I never understood it, and maybe I just don't care anymore, who knows. All I know, is that I am so sore tonight, and I ache and my neck is really spasming.

If life is going to be like this the rest of my life, what is the use of living. Like my dad said for about 3 years before he died. Why live, if life is like this, he was in so much pain, with his arthritis, and stomach. Then of course his last 1 1/2 years were awful. If life is with so much pain, why does God allow this? Why doesn't God just take a person in pain to his home?

My neck is jammed again, can't turn it much to the left. Guess the spasms are strong on the right side where the injury is, and the tendons are tightened. Where SNL gave me whiplash injuries, plus the rotator cuff tears.

Well, I am going to sit in the tub, and take a pain pill. Just needed to cry here. I am crying now, cause I guess I'm at a low point. Pain causes depression, and spiritual loss.

Ahh... feeling a little better this morning. I think the pain got to me last night. I took medications, and feel better. Just the neck is so stuck, try to turn it to left and can feel the muscles on the right. They are tight and short right now. Hopefully, by the end of Sunday I will be better. Used a Homemedics massage unit on neck and upper back last night. Think that might of helped some.

Life is worth living, life is worth moving on. Was down last night and sore.

Well, another day at the garage sale. Today is final day, and pack rest up to give away to charity. That way I can get a deduction at the end of the year.

Oh yeah, SNL was over yesterday, taking things from the garage sale, wanting this and that. He has had many years to do this, but maybe this was easier for him to pick and choose, since it was all laid out. At one point, I was so dissapointed in him, he called me over to the side. My mother was upset with SNL, and SNL told me in the horse trailer, that he didn't give a rats a$$ what my mother thought. I know he doesn't like my mother, but that was disrespectful words to me. He asked if I wanted him to help sort some things out. I did appreciate the help, but the discourteous words are hurtful. I get upset with his mother, and really at times think she should be more aggressive and attentive to her money. But I don't knock his mother down to him. She is a good mother, but is a compulsive buyer. SNL is a compulsive buyer, and I realize where he got this habit from. Wish he would just be respectful. I could demeanize his father, he was a selfish, unthoughtful man. He had some good qualities, and he is now with the Lord. I don't demean his father and I don't criticize a parent to their children. So unthoughtful and hurting to the child.

Anyways, that is the difference between him and I. I am a kind person. I am thougthful towards others. Words hurt people, and unthoughtful words hurts the heart.

I know SNL doesn't like my mother, I know he hates her, like he hates me. When will he ever grow up in that regard? And you could say he doesn't care about his mother much with the unthoughtfulness he has said to her. I don't understand how a human could do this, and know that his mother gave birth to him. His mother could of aborted the pregnancy from the start like all of us. But his mother knew that this pregnancy was out of wedlock was not the babies choice and knew the right thing to do. Give her credit for that beginning. And raising 2 boys on her own, because of SNL's father being a selfish man.

Life is not a bowl of cheeries. I love my mother, I don't like some of her actions. And I am expressing to her some things that I have never before. She realizes the pain I am suffering. Realizes that I am a different person than her. Like my motherinlaw, she and I are talking about emotional difficulties. And she and I realize we are 2 different people. People are different, and need to express their differences. Makes for a better relationship.

Anyways, time to go. Last day of garage sale. Then I can enjoy tomorrow in Gods house, and talk and pray.

Hi Faith4me,

You do sound better today!

Faith4me, have you noticed a pattern with what happens when you are in a lot of physical pain? It's nice to see you bounced back pretty quickly this time!

Hope your garage sale is a huge success!!

Take care

faith4me,

when are you going to STOP expecting him to be the way you think he should be???

Once you stop expecting it..you won't be as hurt--

So he lied..so expect him to lie..he's proved he will do that over and over again..learn to expect everything out of his mouth will be just that..
A LIE!!!

from everything you've said...He is not pretending to be " a kind and considerate man"
your just expecting him to be that...so stop expecting it..

Faith4me,
I know how you feel with the x. I have taught my children to respect their father and his new wife regardless of our past, but it is not reciprecated. I learned to accept him as he is and expect bad behavior and it became easier, and I never spoke with him unless absolutely nessessary. If I do talk to him, it's as though he is out to ruin my day. Thats why we are divorced so I don't need to allow him to affect my happiness.
Your x's father probably lowered your MIL's self esteme and your x watched this. Unfortunately my grown sons sometimes walk away when I am speaking to them just like their father did. It's a learned behavior. Your MIL is probably a very decent person, but has been disrespected by the men in her life. You can learn from her by not allowing your x to affect you this way. I know it is hard, but if he does something inconsiderate-just laugh it off by saying"Atleast I am not the woman that has to live with him anymore!"
I give you credit for having a garage sale. I went through it one time and now just donate the things that I don't want anymore. It took alot of time that could have been better spent.
Take care of that neck!

Ezra - garage sales are not bad, as long as you have some help. And when things are as low as they are for me right now, I will do the garage sale. SNL my x-husband, doesn't see where I am hurting physically, emotionally, and financially. He lives with his dreams, money, material things, and having people around him do what he wants, when he wants, and how he wants.

I will have another garage sale. But if SNL wants me to conduct it, he will have to hire me. I am not doing anymore for him for FREE!!!!! I worked for him since 1990 for free fulltime, and many hours overtime. What did I get in the long run, a kick in the A$$ and goodbye seniorietta, I found me a new babe!!!!. Yep, no more working for free. He doesn't respect me, and therefore, I will no longer give him the pleasure of putting me down.

What hurts, is the lies continue. He lied to me today, about a matter that I expressed to him. He came back with his usual justification. And stated he will find another way. I didn't marry a man that lies, that feels deceiting a human is okay. I didn't marry this man this way. And this hurts, cause I judged poorly this man that I thought was truthful. I am finding more things that he is doing that are not truthful and if he got caught, he could be in deep trouble. But this is the life he wants to live. Just I wonder how I thought he was a nice, caring man. A man that I wanted to have children with. A man that I thought would be a mate for life. A man that would treat his children with respect. And a man that whould treat his mother with respect.

Anyways, it still hurts. And I am just soooo..... glad that I don't have to live under the same roof as he does. Maybe one day in the future, SNL and I could talk. But now, conversation is of no words. Critical evaluation, and he reduces my self esteem. He doesn't even realize what he says at times, at least that is what I feel. And that is a sad situation. He still has not told me since his affair that he loves me, without me asking. So there is no love for me his wife. Therefore, he is to move on, and I am now moving on. I don't hurt like I used to thinking about that he couldn't say he loved me. Cause I have moved on and making a new life without SNL.

He will move very shortly, out to his Arizona land. I will stay here in Michigan, and be around my family and friends. My children are all going to move. And on another thread I read, my children will never beable to say, goodmorning or goodnight to their parents at the same time. That hurts. But in reality, it was too happen. SNL is in a midlife crisis, a severe one. He talks crazy, acts, irresponsible, and seems to be all into himself. I provide for the 3 other kids living with me, and they argue with me. But now I have shown 2 of them the papers to show what are the bills, the spending of food. And they are starting to realize that what I stated is the truth. What their dad is telling them is not totally correct. Instead of arguing with them now. I show them the notebook, I have another child stating the facts, and it is getting easier to state to the kids, I am not going to make it on the little bit of alimony and childsupport. Also, I told them, and showed them, the report of the Dr. for the injury SNL caused to my shoulder that I am to be off work for at least another 3 months. They realize that I am battered. I talked about how the interaction went, and how a husband should never lay a hand on his wife. How dad came an hour later and gave me the key. I said, it was control, and power. There was no other reason for him to do what he did to me, but to show that he was bigger than I, and he injured me. Of course I say, your father won't admit it, never will. But I told them, it only takes one physical abuse, to make a man an abusive man.

No more, comforting the children, and protecting their father. No more. The truth comes out, and the lies are to end. At least the kids are being told and shown the truth. I am teaching my one child to do my back for me. Because I don't want SNL around at all. I don't want to talk to him. I don't want to interact with him.

When I saw the lies are continuing, as clear as today. I hate his actions, I hate this devilish man, and I am sorry I married this man. I am sorry that my 25 years were wasted with a liar, a man that continues to lie. I realize that he lied to me before the affair. I have done some real deep trouble thinking. And I have asked my boys to not ever lie to their spouse, or their children, or their mother or father. I state what your father has done, is a man that is out of control. There is mental instability in the family. So maybe that has something to do with SNL's behavior. Or it is the FFIOOGGGGGG!!!

Going to bed, have to go to the Dr. tomorrow morning. Goodnight. Took my pills and drowsyness setting in.

Faith,

Like suggested, how can you expect anything but a lie from a liar? Love from a man who committed adultery?

Like water from a rock. You won't get it. It cannot happen.

He is not willing, i repeat, not willing to make life changes. Unless someone changes, their behavior probably will not.

It's hard to accept but you've endured this crapola from him for years. And what has happened? He's controlled, been abusive, cheated and lied.

Just like my xH, it's all about control. Cut off the control somehow. Stand up to it. But have NO CONTACT WITH HIM UNLESS IT IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY. Your healing depends on it.

You are probably depressed clinically btw. That's ok and is understandable because of the recent happenings and abuse from this guy. And the life changes brings upon depression. I had situational depression. It's ok and is treatable. When I got better in control, understood what I COULD and what I COULD NOT control everything got better overnight almost.

While I am also dealing with a control nut freak, I have to remind myself whwat I AM IN CONTROL OF. I am the parent with majority of custody. I am the parent who will get son involved in sports. I am the parent who takes child to church and has taught son about morality and values. I am the parent who will be there for my son and didn't walk out on him. I am the parent who didn't expose son to adultery and overnight trips and didn't shack up with anybody. I am in control of my parenting time and that's that. He may have control as far as medical payments, but I am equal in control with that. I can change medical records to any physician I choose.

He may be in control when he attempts to take son to a new school he is paying for. But I am the one who will read to my son, study with my son, and teach my son about our faith. He doesn't. Not part of being Jethro.

And I expect fully the worst from him. He's lied, beaten me, cheated on me, stolen from me, and only when the microsocope of legalities are focused upon him, has not attempted to be a moral or a decent dad.

I understand that this is all a "legal maneuver" and will fade away with the passage of time. Soon he will go back to his playboy ways. Our son and his incessant focus on control will change with his playboy lifestyle going back into full swing. I am biding my time until he focuses on something else...After all he can't focus on ANYTHING AT ONE TIME FOR LONG...he is diagnosed as ADDHD. That's a medical fact. So it is a matter of days/weeks until he's back in his old routine. This is one time I can say, thank God for his ADDHD! It's untreated since age 13 and will take its toll. Already has. Probably been one major reason why he couldn't be faithful, follow through in 2 marriages by age 35. Very sad. But the other is a testament to either being plain mean or a sociopath. Very possibly NPD as well. But Jethro will NEVER get in front of a psychologist for fear of what they would indeed find.

Yes, I am depressed and part of the problem is that I am still hurting with my shoulder and neck. That causes severe depression in itself.

SNL doesn't see it, doesn't care, and would probably rather have me die, then to be here everyday. I see his actions. I see his arrogant actions. But there is nothing I can do with disrespect from your once husband. I give him respect and I tell him he does a good job. Just like the kitchen that he designed for his mother. It does look nice, she picked out the colors, and they look great.

I talked with someone today about SNL. And there is the evident sign of low self-esteem in SNL. As you know he has shown his words in many posts. A man that shows little respect and doesn't acknowledge his wife or children, has a hard time being a caring compassionate man.

Once SNL gives up the control, and lets a person be who they are, then he can see that the person for their value. I was not allowed to be myself. He would control me in many ways. I gave up my art, cause it was so difficult to find the time. So difficult to find room to paint. SNL took over everyroom in the house. Just like the house he is living in now, that is suppose to be his mothers. We are to unload her storage unit which is the biggest unit and packed. SNL has spread his stuff all over the house. Just a problem he has had, and I was willing to help. But if I moved anything, or tried to organize it and get things in piles he would get so upset. Yell, and tell me not to do that again. Our kitchen table would hardly ever be clean. Cause he would put his papers all over and have parts and tools on the table. SNL knew it bothered me, and knew that I wanted a clean table. But like the counselor we were seeing, said SNL was doing it deliberately. Even if he didn't think so, he said it was deliberate. If my husband cared about me. He would of taken extreme measures to make sure that the table was clean.

Just more of the stuff a controller does.

One day, I hope that SNL will be the man that I married. I hope and pray for him. I have my congegration praying for this man. We are divorced. And if we were to ever get back together, he would see me as me. Not as a controlled woman. I want to be happy, and have the best life with God. Right now, I am depressed and having a hard time. Since I can't work, and finances are extremely Low. SNL makes darn good money, and after this year, he probably will have close to 50K in the bank. I won't have anything. And he used my money to buy the house in Arizona for him and his other woman. Hope she enjoys it as much as he does.

WEll, off track. Getting in to bed. I hurt my shoulder today, and it is spasming. Got my pills yesterday, so will take it shortly, after sitting in the tub for awhile. Thanks for your words.

WEll, found out last night that my clothes washer decided to quit working. SNL got nasty with me. But I said, then I guess the kids won't have clean clothes. Cause I am not going to fix it, no money, and I will just go to my moms to wash my clothes. SNL doesn't care if I have clean clothes, but he makes sure things are okay for the kids. So the kids can go do laundry at his mothers house, which is the house that SNL is living in since over a year and still not done.

SNL suggested a job this morning. Only pays $7.70/hr. Working for the airlines. Says, you get perks to fly at a discount. I said, to him, before he didn't want me working for less than $10/hr. Now he doesn'tmind that I am on my own that I work at minimum wage. But he says you will get flying perks. How in the h*ll am I going to beable to fly, when I can't afford to put food on the table. Makes sense, nope not to me.

Also, he doesn't even consider, or want to consider that the Dr. wrote me a note no work for 3 more months. Of course, he doesn't follow the rules, cause he doesn't feel the pain ,and have to take drugs like I do. But of course he didn't cause the injury to me. Like he tells me, he is not a batterer. WEll, all I know is that it takes one time, and he is a batterer.

Make me so upset, that he would consdier me working at almost minimum wage. But he said all the kids could fly really cheap. So I feel this was an advantage for the kids, and to heck with wife. She can fend for herself. This way, he won't have to pay for any of their flights. Cause mom can provide. WEll,I see that I am taking all the grunt work here. SNL sits in his hovel, with his room air-condiditoner running. All summer last year and during the winter he said he was working on the ductwork. Well, I guess now he wasnt', cause he bought a brand new air-conditioner for his room a window unit. I talked to his mother today, and she said the central air is not working. I said that is what the kids are saying. Choice of words and she said what is she going to have to do, get a window unit for her room too. I said, probably.

See the lies continue. We both knew he wasn't working on the ductwork. The aircontidioner, isn't even hooked up. And he bought the new unit last year. So that might sit there for how long. I am about ready to turn him in to social services for his mother. He is making me so upset, and he doesn't even see where he is doing anything wrong. Just doing his own thing and not caring one iota about his mother. About the kids, and me. Da*n man. Why can't he just realize that he is screwed in the head.

Yep - tomorrow I help my MIL clean and organize the many many boxes and stuff at the house SNL is living in. It is such a mess, will take many many days to just organize. What a mess, a big mess. A still no air conditioning. SNL has a window unit inhis room. So is his mother to buy a window unit too. She has to be out of the house by Monday night.

I told my oldest daughter tonight, no money to live here, she is going to have to leave. I am only expecting $100 to live here from the oldest 3. Not that much rent, considering they have all the amenities of a home. Let her live somewhere else, and she did for awhile and then came back. But no consideration and respect for me. Part of the manipulation that her father has set in her head. One day she will see in those rose colored glasses the truth.

The only way I would ever trust this man, is examples. But he still is doing the same crap over and over.

I am doing okay. I am setting boundaries.

Goodnihgt for now.

<small>[ June 27, 2003, 07:10 AM: Message edited by: Faith4me ]</small>

Faith,

Know that I luv ya all right? Here comes the tough love part.

I loved the man I married. He's dead for now. It's outta my hands. I gave it to God. I really did. He may LOOK like and talk like the man I married but it's like an alien invaded his body. A really mean and nasty one.

Give up. There's a book called "When your lover is a liar" they suggest when a divorce or split happens, to have a memorial service and lay it to rest.

You need closure. Identify the payoffs (ie Dr. Phil) that SNL is getting from continued contact iwth you and what payoffs you are getting from continued contact with him.

If there's no impetus for him to change he never will. And your being around him is doing nothing. He's a liar and a total cakeman.

You need to get away from him period. I mean it. Stop contact for your sanity.

And don't wish for reconciliation. Your'e barely divorced. Work on you only. Don't even consider him living as he is not really. The man you loved is gone now. Focus on healing you and nothing else. The kids, you and your future. That's great.

Those are also the only things you can change. SNL will not change, thus he has to be cut out of your life like a gangrenous wound. It will continue to poison your life.

Let go of the unrealistic expectations. Instead of saying "wish SNL would treat me with respect and love " say "why should SNL tret me with respect and love???" Allowing him to continue to have contact with you and letting him treat you this way just confirms the fact HE CAN TREAT YOU ANYWAY HE WANTS TO WITHOUT ANY RECOURSE.

Thus, slam the door. No contact. Send the plan B letter. But just pretend he's dead ok?

Hi f4m,
I know that right now forgiveness is the furthest thing from your mind, but perhaps it is the knife that will allow you to slice the rope that ties you to SNL's mind control for once and for all.

Basically it's not our right to be loved, respected, and protected by anyone on earth, not really...

We respond in anger to feelings of injustice BUT was it our right to have our expectations met in the first place?

Not really...

We have a right to hide ourselves in Christ. All offenses that come--we give to Him--immediately. His motivation for dealing with the offender won't be the same as ours.

I am doing better with cutting myself off from SNL. Or whomever he wants to be. Yesterday was my birthday. But I didn't need him. I had many frineds call me, and cards are still coming in today, as well as e-mails. That was great. My kids gave me a bouquet of flowers, a book, and a really great card.

There is a lot of tension at this house. My oldest daughter like her father. After me today. I told her to leave. And she said, if you won't help me out in this time of my life, then she will let me starve in the future. She is so much like her dad. And dad is filling her mind with crap.

Part of the SNL game and part of the manipulation. I told daughter the way it is going to be. I told her, she is to pay me $100 month. Like the other 2. If she can't, then I said move out, and I will find a renter for $400 a month. I really don't care, if she leaves. Let her. She can move in with her dad. She is going through electric $$$, gas $$$, etc. I said you have all the amenities, plus someone here who takes care of the animals.

She went into you can work anytime you want. You have so much free time. I said, yep, that is why I have a Drs. note no work for atleast 3 more months. I said I have all the time in the world. And so much freedom. No money, no child support, no alimony right now. She went on you choose, I said I choose to go through the government, cause I don't trust your father. No more talk about it. Ended it. And she just like her father went on and on. But of course, she went to her father to get money for grain, and other things. She is checking into taking piano lessons. She is going to have dad pay for the piano to get tuned. Yep, ask dad. Dad bails her out, gives her money. And I won't give her money. I don't have it.

I am so sick of this crap. And sick of her attitdue. I laid it out. Said I am not going to pay for comcast. So she is suppose to run her business from the computer. She is telling me no computer for you. I said, fair enough. I don't have the money, things are going to go. No cable for TV. CAlling that on Monday. No more cable. I said, get the money from your father. Comcast will be cancelled.

I don't need it. And I can go to the library and use it there.

She is trying to put the blame on me, and I am not going to accept it. I am sick of her sticking up for her father. I think it would be best if she leaves. And told her today. I think it would be best for you to find somewhere else to live. Leave me and my son Jeff alone. Leave if you are not happy here. Leave if I don't provide you with enough. Espeically $$$, and I will take care of myself. I don't need you to take care of me when I get older. If that is the way you feel, it is better to see it now, then later.

Bye, leaving for the night.

Well, thought I would leave for the night. The arguments continue. Now my oldest daughter is telling her brother he is full of crap. And of course this daughter is using foul language. Part of everything is okay with the kids by SNL or whomever he is. Foul language is a sign of anger, and resentment. Oldest daughter will not listen to me, will not give me a chance to talk. Son told her to not swear and change her listening technique. He told me the same, and I said I am trying, but daughter won't let me finish a sentence. Kind of sad situation has ended up this way.

But I talked to oldest son, and I am going to cancel comcast. I said, I can live without it, and go to the library to use the internest. No more TV cable, just regular TV. Told daughter, but she is so upset. SAid, why does she have to pay for anything. More of daddy gives her everything, she has gotten everything she wanted all these years, and now she isn't getting it from me. But daddy will give to her, so I said go ask your dad for your share. I told her she has to pay me $100/month to live here. Oldest son believes that is a fair price. He even told her that my youngest son will be in the same position summer of 2004 when he graduates. He explained to her, and she said if that is the way she is going to be (mom). See, she can't take that I can't pay for everything. I told her, I am having a hard time. The boys are starting to see, that I am having a hard time, and therefore are backing off. But she wants her ice-cream and cake and icing and the candles. Sounds good doesn't it. But does she have a job that pays regular. She could of gotten a job at McDonalds. One time SNL was telling her to get a job, and she wouldn't budge. Now he is not forcing her. She had to borrow from daddy to buy grain for the horses today. Had to borrow from daddy for the farrier yesterday. She had to borrow from daddy for gas money. She can borrow from daddy to pay for her part of the rent here. Heck, he pays for everything else, let him pay for her rent. I don't make money and I don't see why I should support 3 older kids on my little sum of $12,000 when he is making at least 50-60K a year. But part of the fffoogggg....! I am not asking for a lot. And I have been told by you all to ask for more than $100 a month. And that is all I am asking for now.

But the one who is screaming the most is the oldest (daughter). She has gotten everything she ever wanted. All she had to do was ask daddy. And now it is different. I talked to my youngest son, who gets child support. We made an arrangement. So he is fine with it.

The other thing, I talked to two of the kids, the oldest doesn't want to listen, so let her go to her room. Is that I am going to put the house up for sale now. I have been thinking about it. And I am going to seek advice through church. I don't need such a big house. And if I can get the other house I have been looking at great. I also, looked into a nice condo. Talked to the son about it, and he is fine with that too. Anyways, I am thinking about putting the house up. Who ever comes into the home to look will have to see the place as it is. If I had a garage at least I could pack things up and put in the garage. But don't have a garage.

I am ready for a move. School starts this fall for me. And maybe I will beable to work parttime. That was another disrespectful comment by oldest daughter. She said you have all the time in the world to work. I said, I am on doctors orders. And I told her you are showing no respect. I don't appreciate your disrespect. Once again, I said maybe you should move out. She is one angry young woman. And this is reality, hon, divorce is ugly. Daddy has made your life the way it is not, difficult. Accept it hon, I am moving ahead. I told her today. You can sit and waddle. But I am moving on, and I am feeling good about going to school and seeking assistance. As for you and your job, you have to do something and make your ends meet. Otherwise, it isn't going to work. Get the money from somewhere. But rent will be $100/month. Even her brother told her, ask dad for the money. And pay him back. He has it, and he will lend it to you.

Boy, this is going to be a rough summer. I told my son, be lucky that you are going to band camp. Be lucky that you will be out for a week. We talked about him going away for college. He wants to get out of the house. And I agreed. I said, the stmosphere is to thick, and I said, I will be in school when you graduate, and this will give him a chance to live on his own. I told him, my home will always be open to him and his siblings. Always, but there will be respect, and willingness to help. Otherwise, I am not going to be one that gives and gives, and no one helps.

We will see how this turns out. But comcast will be cancelled Monday, and I won't have the computer, and I really don't care about TV. Don't watch much TV. And I can use the computer elsewhere. Will be too busy with homework, and working. And hopefully, moving, if it works out, or if God decides that I should move.

Goodnight. Been a rough night, and SNL has really manipulated the kids this time. I gave my opinion, and it is good to finally see that some of the kids are seeing the truth. Thank you Lord for hellping them see the truth.

Take back the power.

I have been reading and listening to you for some time now.

Here are some ideas that need to be dealt with asap if there is to become some resolution to this situation:

1)kids: sounds as if there's displaced agression due to divorce and other issues regarding parenting. They need counseling asap. The disrespect may be coming from the mixed signals they are getting from you and SNL. You openly seem to blame SNL and when he's the one "getting dumped on" by you, the kids will always go his way. I sense alot of agression and displacement about this divorce and seems the kids are angry and unsure who to be angry at so they lash out at you. Keep SNL's name out of your discussions/arguements. You're only generating sympathy for him when you do this. I am leaning about this myself in my own way ok?

2)Deal with the kids by yourself. You're the sole primary parent here. There is your way and the highway. Teens are notorious for (from my divorce recovery class this was common) "if you don't give me my way, I will go and live with x...who loves/gives/ better than you." this is a usual game played. It is a manipulation game.

Like Dr. Phil says , "if something is broken and you keep doing the same things over and over again to fix it and the problems just aren't getting fixed then you better change how you're trying to fix things".

Can't keep doing everything the same way over and over and expect results to be different. Just doesn't happen.

3)cut off contact unless it is between the 2 of you for kids. This is plan B. He has shown over and over to be domineering, liar, abusive, etc. You have to cut the cord so to speak now. There's nothing tying you to SNL except the kids and this is a problem you need to find solutions to. Somebody in the fog isn't about finding solutions. They're all about self-gratification ok?

Stop subjecting youself to the what if's. You posted the other day about getting your church to pray for reconciliation and for SNL.

The whole deal is this. With the way things are and chaos reigning as of now, what would ever make SNL want to come back? Be honest about it. What would? Seeing a fiercely determined and independent woman who is in control of her life and her kids. And definitely a woman who doesn't give a flip about somebody who doesn't care or give the time or energy to treat her anything less than a princess.

That's a fact. But you also need to realize that also you are DIVORCED NOW AS I AM. The reason WE ARE DIVORCED IS BECAUSE THEY COULDN'T KEEP THEIR VOWS AND WANTED GREENER GRASS AND CONSTANT SELF GRATIFICATION. Ok? They don't want what we have offered. Doesn't mean we are bad, just means that they are the ones with the problems mainly.

I believe that several incredible and dynamic things will happen when you simply change the workings of your life. I believe that counseling with only YOU and the KIDS will help with the problems regarding communication, work around home, and finances. And when you cut off contact with SNL, the jerk he is, the kids will see you standing tall on your own. They will see you standing tall and NOT TAKING ANY MORE CRAP FROM SNL. We learn how to treat other people and ourselves. Dr. Phil pearl of wisdom again. And the kids have LEARNED how to treat or should I say, disrespect from SNL. So the dynamics have to change.

I'm not saying turn yourself into some kind of warlord/nazi overbearing mom...I am saying to not argue with them and be a mom. Get them into therapy so they can deal with this displaced agression that I believe is brewing within them. And also you need to learn some techniques to deal with difficult teenagers. Heck, it's hard enough raising teens but dealing with teens who's wounds are fresh from divorce is very hard to deal with.

And you keep wishing SNL will change. As they say on the Sopranos..."Forgedda 'bout it." That's what I have done with Jethro. Forgot it. That's like you wishing over and over for a tiger to lose its stripes and get spots like a leopard. It ain't gonna happen...They won't change stripes to spots unless they WANT TO. And it is huge if that happens. So I am saying to quit focusing on the "what if's or "I wish" syndrome. I bet 100% of everybody here wishes their x didn't cheat, lie, steal, or abuse them either. That they wish they were the person they fell in love with and that their families would be intact. But man has free will. Sad but true. God loves us enough to give us our choices. And some sadly make horrible ones.

Take SNL totally out of the equation. Only and I mean ONLY converse with him (and do it away from your home)about the kids and finaces related to the settlement or kids. When he (and this should happen regularly based on what you say about him) is disrespectful, hang up phone immediately. Or click off on the computer. Like what Dr. Phl says. If the outcome isn't what you want, to get something different you gotta change the approach. The foggy people know this firsthand ok. They didn't like some part of their life. Maybe they thought it was boring and the same day in and out. They wanted to spice up things so they cheat. Bingo! The WS has learned this huge idea and concept.

The WS know that if they want to be "happy" they have to change something. Thus they spiraled downward just so their egos or drives could be temporarily satisfied.

So knowing this, use this on SNL. If he is disrespectful, say "No you don't. This is not the way it's gonna be. Either respect and kindness or bye bye SNL and hang up immediatley". If he wants to get a different response or have any contact with you, then he's gotta play by the rules. YOUR RULES OK?

And you can do this with kids too. Be kind and loving but don't get pushed around. You are needing 100% from yourself right now.

Try doing these two things and see if life doesn't immediately improve. \

Since having the law step in and make Jethro have no contact with me, I sleep better. I am happier. I don't worry near as much. And I know that my happiness depends on me. Not on him. And I don't expect anything from him except for child support and the alimony. That's it. I expect nothing from him and that also protects MY emotions which are precious. He broke my heart. I am not giving the man who broke up my family carte blanche to keep hurting me for the rest of my life ok? He isn't worth it the way he is now.

Sure I pray for him and always will if he keeps on living the life of a playboy. But I realize that's nothing but like the movie "Shallow Hal' and isn't permanent. And he will have to deal with his soul one day and I am glad I won't have to be around to deal with his own conscience or guilt at that time. Not my problem anymore.

He's FV's problem ok?

And she has got her little lingerie model hands full.

So this is independence day week. Liberate yourself. I want you to. You deserve this really. You deserve real heaing to begin and I am praying for you.

God gave us independence from unrepented adulterers, abusers, and liars. I am glad I'm an independent woman and know some guys here are glad too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Just Peachy - SNL still is not staying away from this house. I left the house yesterday, cause he comes makes him self at home. Doesn't even ask for permission. One of the things he states, is that the kids live here. Yep, they do. By their choice. He is arrogant, by the way read about the thread on INTF and etc. You will see a lot of the words he uses there. I think it was GQII.

I am going to talk to someone about putting the house up for sale. I talked to her at church today. I gave her my reasons, and we are looking into ideas. I would like to put it up for sale by owner only. There are 3 houses on my road now. It is a buyers market, and I think this house will sell, but I am not going to go for the lowest dollar.

Plus getting the house in my name this week. Now that I have the divorce papers. Get him off the paperwork. Banking account changed to my name. Took divorce papers in.

Talked to kids and am going to get comcast cancelled. I don't need it, kids are all agreeing that if they want it, they can pay for it. Just the oldest is giving me a hard time, cause she got everything she ever wanted, and still goes to daddy. But oldest son told her that is the way it is, tough love. One day she will grow up and realize the situation that her daddy has created.

I feel great today. Doing things for me only. No one else. No food to make, left over spaghetti, and they all can make their own noodles. And salad leftover.

Tomorrow a busy day, with son Dr. and another appointment. I am going to get the kids in counseling. Talking to someone in AnnArbor for me and the kids. No SNL, he is not invited. He said everything is fine, it is not fine by any means. Enough listineing to him, I am taking things in my hands. The kids will see that I am doing this for us 5, Only us 5 (4kids and me).

Bye for now.

Great!

And encouragement for the kids is great. And since SNL is NOT YOUR HUSBAND, use the law to your advantage. He is stalking imho. He is breaking and entering into your home. He can't do that. What if God forbid, something happens or better yet, goes unnoticed like the absence of my 10k rolex which went missing? We couldn't prove Jethro was in the home and it was only when the neighbors caught him were my suspicions confirmed. Too much room for abuse.

I don't go in his house thus he doesn't go in mine. Are you going in his mom's house? Maybe that should change so the dynamics change. Your MIL would understand.

And don't disucss SNL with the kids. You deal with your issues with the kids. Try saying "well who wants cable? It eqals 30 bucks a month. Two babysitting nights and then son cutting grass twice should equal the cost...whatta bargain!" Make them think it's easily solved instead of complaining to them "this cable costs too much and I am not paying for it unless you two get some kinda jobs." Present it to the kids in a positive way. Try that.

But please don't let sNL into your house anymore. If he does it, call the police. Have him arrested. I never had Jehtro arrested. He did it all by himself. Stupidity breeds stupidity. And you can be sure if SNL just walks into the house, he may do so when you are not there.

Get locks changed and basic alarm.

I am looking at townhomes. Have you thought about that? Less upkeep but you can have a nice small backyard that could look gorgeous with little work. And less housework for you. Thus you have time for more important things.

Possibly find a psychologist for a counselor. I am not a huge fan of the "christian counselor" as noted in my posts. Found that through div. recovery and meeting lots of divorced people that counselors, even the christian ones, just push divorce ahead and don't fix the problems.

Behavioral psychologists and therapists do that. find one with a focus on behavioral psychology. They are the ones who are really committed to changing the actions and behaviors of the family members.

Think this is important. If I find son really needs counseling or I do again, will find one of those.

I don't need anybody to listen to me, validate what I say and parrot it back to me. I need somebody to say "well Peach, that's nice but you know by not applying for those jobs that one's not going to land in your lap right?" Like that I need somebody to be firm with me and show me what positive actions and behaviors I would need.

Faith--
I've been reading your posts off and on, and I have to agree w/ peachy--once the house is entirely in your name, change the locks PRONTO! You can get basic locks and keys at Home Depot and warn the kids that if they give their key to dad, they will be booted from the house, and you will rent their rooms out to someone else. Daddy can put them up or pay for them to rent someplace else. I would also tell oldest daughter that if she can't abide by the rules to not let the door hit her on the way out. Take her key and give her her clothes and possessions. You keep the furniture because your next renter might need it for their stuff. He is no longer your husband, and he no longer has the right to free access to your house. If he enters thru the garage, find someone who can change the code for you so he can't get in. Do not give this man access to your life any more!

Better yet, get a restraining order to keep him off the property. It should only cost you your time to go to the magistrates office. Check it out and see if that can be done, or see if there is a free legal clinic that can help you. You can do this. We believe in you, now it's time to believe in yourself too! You are alive and kicking, and you've made it this far, now it's time to make it further and better!!

<small>[ June 29, 2003, 12:36 PM: Message edited by: JobieMom ]</small>