My wife is in AA and came home from a weekend away in June and told me she filed for divorce. (We were married 7 years)She moved out 1 month later. All she kept telling me is taht she didnt love me , hasnt for 10 years, has wanted a divorce for 6 years, real nasty and defensive. Turns out she has been cheating. She has been avoiding me and trying to hide her Boyfriend from everyone. It is a man from her AA program and they have been friends for about 1 year and involved for several months. She wont admit it to me or any of her family, she even has him park his auto in her garage so that people wont see it in the driveway( I drove by the other day) We have a 13 yr old son (my step son) and she has him going to stay overnight at friends alot now. It's been 2 months and I have been working on plan A, being nice not expecting anything in return. My couselor tells me that the relationship is doomed since it is built around lies and that they are both in a program (AA), it just can't work. I am frustrated and feel like I am enabling her affair. I want to scream, however I know that would only make matters worse.

Is this hopeless or should I stick it out.. I still love her and if she ended the affair I would love to try and work on our marriage. ??

sometimes 2 months is not long at all for Plan A, other times it would be time to move on to plan B.

I say stick it out a while longer. It does get easier with time. You will find that plan A turns to your normal behavior and takes very little effort anymore.

If plan A doesn't get you to where you want to be(End of A) then you will be best if you move on to plan B at some point.

WIWH

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> My wife is in AA and came home from a weekend away in June and told me she filed for divorce. ...Turns out she has been cheating. She has been avoiding me and trying to hide her Boyfriend from everyone. It is a man from her AA program and they have been friends for about 1 year and involved for several months. She wont admit it to me or any of her family... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">wondering,

I have two thoughts for ya:

1. Expose her affair to her family, her pastor or spiritual guide, her AA program leaders, her sponsor, his sponsor, etc. When I say "expose" I mean tell those who might possibly provide encouragement in ending the affair and recovering the M. When I say "expose" I mean being as factual as possible and saying something like: "This is Wondering and my W is Mrs.Wondering, and I have reason to believe that she is involved in an affair with AA-Man. I love my W and want to support her in her AA recovery and in reconciling our M, and I'm asking for your support in helping me to end the affair, encouraging her to continue AA in a meeting that he does not attend, and praying for us to recover our M." THAT'S IT. I'm not telling you to gossip or talk ill of your W or OM...I'm telling you to make it impossible for them to enjoy the naughty fantasy of sneaking around. Let sponsors know and AA know because there are rules against interacting with a member of the opposite sex within the first year of recovery. Don't give them the chance to keep covering it up--expose it to the light of day.

2. When a person is in ANY kind of addiction recovery, it is most likely the first time they have felt anything in a long time. It's also very common for the people in a recovery program to feel "close" to the other folks in their group because it's the first time they ahve been honest with anyone for a long time...and no matter what they tell their AA group, they are still accepted and forgiven.

That's why there IS that rule about having a romantic relationship in the first year...because when you have been numb for years and trying to avoid your feelings for years--and then suddenly you FEEL again--it is often mistaken for being "in love." Ditto with suddenly telling the truth to someone and having them forgive you and accept you anyway. It is often mistaken for being "in love." (As you know, wondering, very often the reason a person has an addiction is because they are desperate to be accepted, and they don't "feel" accepted--so they numb out with their drug of choice.)

Thus, take heart!! Most likely this is just the first time either of them has felt feelings in a long time!! They are not very mature in knowing what "feelings" feel like, so once they mature a little bit in their program, they have a good chance of recognizing that this is a mistake.

BUT...you can see why it is important to tell the AA program leaders and sponsors about this. There is no way they can work their AA recovery and realize that it's just a new sensation if they are not exposed.


CJ

<small>[ August 16, 2004, 10:40 PM: Message edited by: FaithfulNewCJ ]</small>

Secrecy is part of the Alcholic syndrome. Many alcoholics are in denial about aspects that are building blocks to their dependencey.

Whaot about saying, "Well I have suspicions about your following loving Boundaries, so since you say that my suspeicions are not founded, you won't mind if I discuss my suspiciaons with others wil you? Your family, your AA Groups, your friends?"

You should first be a Boundary Loving spouse yourself. Bargain about keeping a secret.

"Well if you want me to keep this secret, then I want you to disclose the affair to your group."

"Well, if not to your Group, then to the AA Administrator."

Running your mouth about your Wife's affair, without her agreement is a boundary violation agfainst your wife. You want your wife to be considerate of yoru boundaries, be considerate of her.

If you need to make apower play, consider that carefully, and do it in an up front manner.

"I have asked you for information about my suspicions about a possible affair with X, for several weeks (days). If you cannot convince me with sufficient info by Wednesday, ( A few days), I feel I have the rignht to ask questions of ____________."

Use Loving Confrontation. Boundaries by Cloud and Townsend.

Blessings

Once again the wise (short-legged one) CJ is right on the money with her advice.

It’s all about experiencing and expressing emotions that were stunted in growth when addictions began. They are new, fresh, young, and appear so innocent and real. Why? Because they haven’t allowed themselves to feel anything for so long. For someone who is not an alcoholic/addict this is almost too confusing to comprehend.


Hugs, Thoughts, & Prayers

Thanks to all for the insight.. The common theme is that the relationship she is in probably will not last since it is built on dishonesty and with another addict. I will sit tight and be nice, working plan A for a few more months or until I wake up and have no desire to recocile with her. Thanks for the feedback

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wonderingwhatsup9504:
<strong> I will sit tight and be nice, working plan A for a few more months or until I wake up and have no desire to recocile with her. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know if that's the best plan of action. I'd give some serious thought to CJ's suggestions realizing that you are dealing with an addict who is comfortable with your Plan A....

Just remember, if you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got. Because nothing ever changes if nothing ever changes.

Problem is that she Filed for divorce already and she moved out.... I need her to realize they Guy she is involved with is not meeting the needs I was meeting and that their deal is built on lies and dishonesty... If I confront her as I did when she was drinking, I dont think it will work... I am trying a different approach.. Time will tell

DIVORCE BUSTER'S INFO:


Website: divorcebusting.com
MB Thread on 180 Degree Divorce Busters


180 Degree Divorce Busting, by Michelle Weiner-Davis, divorcebusting.com

Internet Search Words: Divorce Busters

Michelle Weiner-Davis's divorce busting 180 degree list, here it is:

Article by Michelle Weiner-Davis on Divorce for Longevity.com, Divorce Section

lovegevity.com, 180 Degree Divorce Busing Articles by Michelle Weiner Davis


Stop Divorce Website
Stop Divorce website

Thanks for the Divorce Busters info... It is like Plan A just more in detail and I like the possibilities.. Will try anything at this point..

Dear What's Up,

What communication have you tried? What communication is working?

What is special about W, that makes this worthwhile?

Blessings

Wondering,

I'm going to agree with CJ--

EXPOSE THE AFFAIR!!! Expose, Expose, Expose--

And by not exposing you are enabling the affair--

If she get's mad or angry GOOD let her--those will probably be new emotions for her too--that she'll have to figure out how to work through and handle SOBER from now on--and your certainly not doing her any favors not allowing her to face the consequences of her actions--

and if she get's angry and starts drinking again, at least then you'll know she's not completely recovered--

Dealing with addicts you've got to use tough love-
and that includes allowing them to face ALL the consequences of their actions--even the one's they don't want to--

whaler said: Running your mouth about your Wife's affair, without her agreement is a boundary violation agfainst your wife. You want your wife to be considerate of yoru boundaries, be considerate of her.--

TR--I disagree--exposing the affair IS NOT a boundary violation--it is bringing the affair to the light of day--and allowing both of them to learn what APPROPRIATE Boundaries are in the confines of marriage--having an affair--is not one
of them--

<small>[ August 18, 2004, 10:43 PM: Message edited by: ThornedRose ]</small>

I have been staying out of contact iwth my W , however I do see her at the gym once in a while and say hi. I have been using email to communicate when we have financial issues, however she doesn't really respond. I know the affair is still in full swing, and I did exspose the affair to her Dad and brother, however, I stopped there since I figured that it would spread.

The one thing that i still cannot figure out is that her son (my step son) who is 13 yrs old, realizes it, I believe she knows that he knows, however we see each other often and he keeps telling me that Mom still hasn't said anything about her friend from AA. He vents to me and I think that is healty for him so I just listen and reinforce to him that his mom loves him very much, but it seems that he is getting frustrated with her since she tells him things like she is going out to meet a friend from the program. It seems to me that she is not only using her program for Romance and a social life, but she is hiding from the outside world. She does not really interact with anyone outside of her program.

The other things that my son has said is that he is not allowed to answer that phone unless it rings 2x's so that mom can check the caller ID, she got upset with him when he attempted to answer her cell ph and when he ask's her who is on the phone or where she is going, she tells him none of your business. He did say that if it is Heidi or Erica (AA Friends) she tells him. He is to smart. The other thing she told him this week was that Saturday was Adult night and her time to go out, he was perplexed and hurt by that statement. Her routine is to leave at 5 and come home at 10:30 on Saturday's.

I feel bad for him, but I told him not to take it personal, that is what I was told at the beginning. I also road by her apt. the other morning (Son was at an overnight) and she had her car parked in the driveway and the OM's in the garage. I don't know why she is still trying to hide it, maybe she can't come to grips with it ??? This is messed up and she is behaving like what some people call a DRY DRUNK.

Any advice, I am running out of patience, especailly when she is treating her own son that way.

Dear What's Up,

Power is understanding what is important to your spouse. Secrecy seems to be important for W. You say that you figure word will spread.

Thorned Rose seemed to feel that I was saying do not expose. I was saying use the power to threaten exposure.

I did not mean that you should absolutely obey the boundary of not disclosing secrets about your W. I personaly believe it is a boundary violation to expose the affair further. But I never said never violate any of a spouse's boundaries. But it is not a Boundary violation to threaten, or bargain, to keep the boundary. Keeping boundaries can have a price.

You seem to be completely without power. You have no idea how to pull your wife's levers.

You mention that W is not much concerned about money. W seems to be concerned with hoodwinking her son. Use what W is concerned about, and threaten to pull some levers.

I further distinguish my postion from Thorned Rose, because TR is saying epose willy nilly. I say only espose to the extent that you need to convince W that you will expose furhter. A good general gets concessions from his enemy without firing a shot, but just juxtapositioning his power. You don't describe what your powers are, and you don't describe how to use your powers. W's son may be a key. How can that battle be played out?

A Broad scope Reference:

911 for Marriages, Articles Books, Forgiveness, Recovery

http://www.surviving-infidelity-kit.com/freearticles.htm#16


Blessings

<small>[ August 29, 2004, 01:59 AM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>

Thanks for the response.

I am at a point 2 1/2 months since W told me she filed 1 1/2 months moved out. Still no additional info from the lawyers???

I am still in plan A , however very little contact and I today became a little angry for the 1st time in a while. I realize that she is not thinking very rationally with numerous things she is doing, however, I think she is moving on and it may be time for me to as well. I desire to Try and reconcile, However many Love units are being withdra3wn, and today I asked myself if I really did still love her ?? I am no longer 100% clear on that issue.

As for using Power of disclosure, I really feel that I am more inclined to be happy and move on. I may even start to date someone who has shown interest. If it works out for me and my WF great, I don't NEED it to any longer. I am at the end of waiting I think.....

Dear What's Up,

I am trying to keep my own marriage going, so I usually post to people from the perspective of trying to stay together. But I respect your decison, to split, if that's what you decide. One question I asked a few posts ago, that you did not fully answer was, what has W got going that attracts you? Emables you? Inspires you?

My wife terrifies me when I have my friends around. She is often overly friendly and overly indulgent.

With your W, how are you ever going to have friends over for a few drinks? Your W has completely obliterated your boundaries of fidelity. I read swap and swing boards sometimes. Even for couples into swinging, consideration of boundaries and feelings is considered important for the spouses. Your W indicates she is completely disregarding your wishes, and the truth of reality to others.

What is W inspiring for you? What relationship would you hope for from her? How are you with keeping Alcohol under control? Will W help you with your own challenges?

In the past, it is possible that you failed to do some little things for W, and by overlooking little things, W was susceptible to OM. But now you have to be feeling less than fully willing to do alot of little things for W. You also may have some resentment, which is going to make it more difficult to do more little things for W.

W's son seems to concern you. Have you been up to speed with W, as to how she wants to handle her son? Is it possible that W has some resentment or feelings that you have undercut her realtionship with her son? My wife and I personally got along better after taking parenting courses together. We took 3 courses over the years, for different ages of youngsters.

Will W go out to lunch with you?

Blessings

<small>[ August 30, 2004, 07:34 AM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>

I again think that my plan of moving on is more acting as if I have moved on. I am still confused and am not going o make any rash decisions. I am taking care of myself right now, because the more I think back this past 8-10 months, I realize how she has manipulated me. The alcoholism is all over her current behavior. I looked at her email last night (I still have her password) and I see that she is getting daily Horoscopes for Romantic Couples in Love. She is obviously IN-Love.. I look at it like this, she is acting as though she is a teenager and based on her Alcoholism, I am told it is normal. As in an earlier response from ?? He is in Recovery, It seems to me my W is head over heals for a guy from AA and I will interested to see how things work out forher in the future as things are exposed. I think she will do it on her own soon since all indications are people see what is happening.

I guess I am at apoint where I need to take my time and make a decision, not based on emotion. I feel that I am going to MOVE ON, however I am not closing the door completely.

I am still attracted to my wife physically, and I remember alot of the Good times. Trust is a big issue, Can I ever trust her ????

I just red something about Patience and not rushing to Judegemnt. I will follow this path for now. One day at a Time.

Dear What's Up,

The formula I try to apply when something goes wrong, is to try to identify what I could have done differently or better.

You have not really described sequences of events that led up to W starting an affair.

Pershaps there was nothing you could have done differently. Perhaps there are things you could have done, had you known, but they would not be reasonable. Maybe some of the lessons for W, would not carry over for experience in your next realtionship.

When things go wrong for me, I can usally identify things I could have reasonably done better.

Do you feel you are ready to profit from your experience for your next relationship?

<small>[ October 03, 2004, 07:37 PM: Message edited by: Whaler ]</small>