I'm going through a D and my WH is supposed to pay $960/mo. in child support.....he makes quite a bit of money, a lot more than me. The thing is he is agreeing to continue to pay the mortgage and let me and my S remain in the house. I will be giving up my ownership to the house. While I won't have a mortgage payment, I'm worried to agree to less on the CS because I make only 1/3 of what he makes.

My S is expensive. He is into every sport there is, eats like a maniac, and enjoys doing things with his friends....all of which cost a lot of money and which will be coming out of my pocket since he will be living with me. I believe firmly that the style of living he has become accustomed to shouldn't change because his dad had chosen OW over me. Doesn't my H need to suffer some financial consequences because of his actions?? As it is, I am paying the attorney because he fence sat for so long that if I didn't take any action I would still be in limboland today. He isn't helping me to pay and he doesn't have his own.

My lawyer is concerned that if I don't compromise on the CS some, he won't pay for the house. I offered to go down on the CS by $100 and take on two extra bills that he is paying (maintenance on the house). I just didn't want to budge on that number too much.

He is proposing to go down $360 on the CS. I don't think this is right. Any advice? I haven't consulted my attorney yet since he just gave me this number tonight.

wontgiveupyet,

Talk to your attn, he could tell you which one is better for you. You need to protect yourself.

-rh-

I want to be sure I understand this.

Your STBX is supposed to pay $960 in CS.
You are supposed to support yourself and your son on your income and the CS.
You have agreed to give up your ownership in the home.
Your STBX has agreed to continue to pay the mortgage and let you and your son live there.
In exchange, he wants to pay you $600 in CS.

Am I missing something???

In the "real world" you would get 1/2 equity; he would pay $960 CS; the house would be sold; and you would have to pay rent in your new house and support yourself and your son on your income, the equity, and the CS. Right??

Soooo...you lose equity, but get to stay in the house for no "rent". STBX is also proposing that you lose CS, but get to not have the upheaval of moving.

If your equity is...oh, let's pick $30k for your portion ($60k equity total)...that means you would have to live at his house "rent free" for two years for it to be equitable--if he continues paying 100% CS! It sounds to me as if the "giving up equity in exchange for two years of free rent" may be a reasonable exchange. But why in the world would he pay less CS?? I don't see how that's equitable AT ALL!!!!


cj

I believe firmly that the style of living he has become accustomed to shouldn't change because his dad had chosen OW over me.

While I totally agree in theory with your statement, reality for most people who DV is that the standard of living does usually have to change. I only get $400/month for one child. And I kept the house and the mortgage that went with hit. My XH pays nothing but the $400 plus 1/2 of DD's orthodontia.

I also carry the family insurance on the two kids.

I don't even bill him for 1/2 of doctor bills or other minor dental orher therapy because the hassle isn't worth it. Hard to squeeze blood out of a turnip. XH has always been a poor money manager (not that I win any awards myself) so is now broke, because he doesn't make all that much and OW was not working until a couple weeks ago.

XH is supposed to pay for part of our son's college, but has yet to send more than $100. So, in addition to taking out a student loan for spring semester, it's looking like I'll have to cosign a private loan for my son, since he has no credit on his own.

So....if your attorney thinks you can get more or do better, go for it. Just keep in the back of your mind that you probably WILL have to make lifestyle adjustments, for both your son and yourself.

LL

RH, I will talk to my attorney Mon. He doesn't want me to lose the "living rent free" deal. I'm not concerned about losing equity because there isn't that much as of yet. We're trying to disrupt our S as little as possible by not having to sell the house, change schools, etc.

FNCJ, you summed that up pretty well! He wants to pay less in CS because he says he can't afford the mortgage, his rent, his truck, CS and all his other bills. He says if we want to keep our S in his home, then he needs to be able to make the mortgage payment. I feel like its a threat....either accept my deal or you lose the house.

LL, wow, I think I may be getting a better deal than you....I'm sorry for your situation. I guess I should count my blessings???

One big thing that bugs me is that I feel like STBX is trying to control my life. He says he wants a stipulation in the decree that I can't have any other person (namely a man) come and move in with me or even sleep over. I'm sort of dumbfounded because I'd like to think that I wouldn't set that kind of example for my S. And he wants this in writing because he doesn't trust MY word.....that's a laugh coming from someone who has been lying to his spouse for 2 years.

I think he's trying to do the right thing, but my trust in him is pretty much non existent.

What I have learned in this whole process of divorce is that usually it is an awful mess, and your standard of living and the kids standard of living will be affected by a divorce.

My ex was supposed to pay me $1600 a month for child support for 4 kids...which would drop by a hundred dollars each time one of the kids go back to college.

He was also supposed to pay for 1/2 of all medical bills not paid for by insurance. He was to pay all of the health and dental insurance for the kids. He's not.

I assumed the home loan and the home equity loan that he charged up before moving out. I also assumed the vehicles that still had loans on them.

I received no alimony because I potentially could make too much money as a teacher (he was a pilot for Northwest airlines). I received no money for getting my masters (I lost all my hours moving around for his career--even tho we paid for his masters when the AF could have paid it.)

He is supposed to pay 75% of the kids' college tuition. He's not.

I pay all four of my children's activity fees, car insurance, medical bills and tuition at this time.

He is sending me $415 a month and has just filed a motion to modify our divorce decree to just having to pay me that much. He has been out of a job flying since March after 911--though there have been many things he could have done--he has chosen not to work at all.

I have had to go back to my lawyer and respond to his motion to modify and bring him up on contempt of court charges. He now owes me more than $22,000. The Dept of Family Services will not prosecute him because "he has been attempting to send me some money each month"--so much for helping families get what is owed them.

So far, my lawyers have said it will cost me another $3,000 to take him back to court again. That is almost 2 months salary for me.

In the meantime, my van has broken completely down, so I have had to buy another car. My garage door opener broke, my 2 girls' tuition is due for this semester, and soccer, dental and vision costs will be incurring soon.

My ex shows no remorse for his lack of paying...and does not even see the pain or turmoil his life choices are causing us. It is a daily struggle to figure out how to pay and do everything.

My advice...take what you can get now...and hope that it lasts awhile before your ex feels like he is paying too much and quits. The farther they are away from the actual costs of raising a child--the less understanding they become. Best of Luck to you. Pat

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wontgiveupyet:
<strong>I feel like its a threat....either accept my deal or you lose the house.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Smell like a threat ... it is a threat.

Listen, this is the reality of DV and it is up to you to make the decision. This is what I would do. You have to understand that he is also up against the wall on his expenses. You have to give him some thing in return. Use the to sign that you would not bring any man sleep over or move in any man except if you M to him in exchange for the fix CS.

It is about time for your S to face it too. S needs to face the reality too. If you take his deal, you have to bring your S into this. Cut down expenses ... and tell S the truth, you can't afford it.

I don't know your finances but couldn't you buy him out since there is not much equity ?. Couldn't you rent out rooms to females to help out mortage ?

-rh-

Hi nid - I think you need to separate the "standard of living" thought from the other, purely economic decision - although many would equate the two. In other words, think of this decision as a purely economic.

What's the best long term deal for you?

Think long and hard before you give up ownership in the house. It could be the best long term investment you ever have. What is real estate doing in your area?

Depending on the amout of equity and what % of ownership you retain, sacrificing some on CS may be a good deal. A straightforward cost/benefit analysis should show the best decision, depending on variables we don't know and you'll have to estimate.

Keep in mind the tax implications - if he pays the mortgage, you get no deductions.

Here's the deal I ended up with - it has applications to your sitch. I describe this to illustrate some of the considerations:

(Note: WS moved out and I stayed in the home in Aug. 2000.)

I took on full mortgage obligations and had to refinance to get the WS off the deed/mortgage. Per our legal separation (which became the structure of the divorce), WS "retained" 30% of the equity over the mortgage debt that existed at the time of the signing of the separation document. So, even if she wasn't on the deed, she still owned 30% of the equity, and this equity appreciated as the home value appreciated as long as I owned it. She agreed to let this "ride" until after our son finished high school in 2006, at which point I had to either buy her out or sell the property to pay her off. In the meantime, home values skyrocketed. She was making a killing as her 30% went up, up, up, even though she wasn't paying interest and I was taking the full tax deduction. Of course, she wasn't getting any of this money at the time. I was payng the full mortgage, but seeing my 70% portion appreciate. I sold this past summer ahead of schedule to cash in. She got a HUGE amount of money tax free since I'm the sole "owner" of record when it comes to capital gains.

So, there is much to consider on the house deal. You might want to consult with an accountant/tax man along with your attorney, but the decision seems to be solely an economic one.

Thanks, movinon.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> My advice...take what you can get now...and hope that it lasts awhile before your ex feels like he is paying too much and quits. The farther they are away from the actual costs of raising a child--the less understanding they become. Best of Luck to you.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You know, just him being out of the house for the past 5 mos., I don't think he remembers exactly how much our S costs....I should have done a better job of keeping track. He thinks I'm getting the better deal here....he says I'm the one coming out ahead....oh, yeah right...I'm gonna make a killing on a teacher's salary and $600/mo.


RH, I've already tried this:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You have to give him some thing in return. Use the to sign that you would not bring any man sleep over or move in any man except if you M to him in exchange for the fix CS.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It is HIS way or no way. He says he's trying to protect himself. From what? Sounds more like trying to keep me under his thumb.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It is about time for your S to face it too. S needs to face the reality too. If you take his deal, you have to bring your S into this. Cut down expenses ... and tell S the truth, you can't afford it.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This has already been happening. Many times I've had to tell my S, "No sorry, I don't have the money." or "You need to wait until I get paid." He's been handling it well, but he also knows that his dad probably does have the money....I really want to avoid him building resentment against his dad, but I'm sure its already happening.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I don't know your finances but couldn't you buy him out since there is not much equity ?. Couldn't you rent out rooms to females to help out mortage ?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No....its only a 3 bdrm. and the extra room is the office. Plus we are loaded to the brim with my son's "siblings"....2 cats and 2 dogs. Its a full house.

Thanks, WAT. Our house has appreciated by about $15K in the past two years. I don't know if thats good or not. I have a wonderful friend who is a financial guru and he is helping me a lot. I'm also going to let him take a look at my budget and what my STBX is proposing and get his opinion. He'll be ticked because he wants to see me get the whole CS + living in the house <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> . I just can't afford more attorney fees and if he and I can't agree on something, then its going to cost me a lot more and I'll lose the house to boot. What a mess.

On another note, I've been thinking I should trade my car in because its past the time of warranty. If something were to go wrong with it, I'll be in a mess. Do you think this is a good idea now?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wontgiveupyet:
<strong> On another note, I've been thinking I should trade my car in because its past the time of warranty. If something were to go wrong with it, I'll be in a mess. Do you think this is a good idea now? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Again if both of you most likely end up in court and re-calculating CS, you might want to trade in. Why ?, they will include your new expenses in the calculation. You need an accountant that understood the marriage law and probably it is cheaper than a lawyer.

-rh-

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He's been handling it well, but he also knows that his dad probably does have the money....I really want to avoid him building resentment against his dad, but I'm sure its already happening.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As hard as this is sometimes, remind yourself this is your STBXH's problem, NOT YOURS!


As for the trading cars issue, are you making a car payment right now? If so, how much longer do you have to pay? Would it go up if you traded?

In my state, living expenses such as car payments are not taken into consideration in the state's child support laws. They take both spouses income less taxes, the person carrying health insurance on the kids gets to subtract that from the calc, and you are allowed a very small amount of out-of-pocket medical on yourself. Then they apply a formula to the two net pays and decide how much child support one is going to pay the other.

So it doesn't matter to the state what my XH or I pay for housing, car payment, etc. when it comes to child support. So, I own a 1998 car that has around 100,000 miles on it. I plan to hold onto it and pray it doesn't shell out for a LONG time.

The reason I asked if you owed much on your car is that, if you have it nearly paid off, you may be better off getting it paid off, then banking as much of your "saved" car payments going forward as you can for a while. Chances are the repair bills would be less than car payments on a new car.

If, however, you have a long time to pay still, and getting a different car that is under warranty wouldn't significantly affect your car payments, it might make sense to go that route.

LL

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As for the trading cars issue, are you making a car payment right now? If so, how much longer do you have to pay? Would it go up if you traded?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LL, yes I am and I have about 18 months left to pay. I can probably find a new car for about the same payment.

Well, I told him that the $600/mo. didn't seem right and I didn't want to go down so much on the CS and that if he paid the full amt., I would give him a "rent" payment for the difference. That way, if I were to move out for whatever reason before my S is 18, I would still have the $960 in CS which I would definitely need if I were making my own mortgage pymt. He says no way, but the most he'll go to is $700/mo. I don't know if its worth the fight....I just want to get this over with. Any more advice anyone?

{edited ubervent}

Sorry, didn't mean to vent all over your thread. I really should have fought harder at the time.

<small>[ January 04, 2005, 07:24 AM: Message edited by: xpButtercup ]</small>

Buttercup, I guess I've got it made compared to you, huh? I probably need to stop b*%$#ing to him. But he wants to control who I have in the house, even if my S isn't home....he says no one is to spend the night and he wants that in the decree!! Is that insane? My lawyer said, "So does that mean you get to have a say so in who sleeps over at his place?" Finally, I've just given up and said....whatever, put it in the decree. I just want this over with.