Just wondering if divorce signals the end of Plan-B? Especially where kids are involved, shouldn't XS's re-open communication after D for betterment of DD's and DS's?

FR

FR...
Hey! Well to answer your question. Even after I divorce I don't plan on talking to my WH. I will only discuss issues about my son with him for the rest of my life. He's a jerk and I don't need people like that in my life. My son will always have a relationship with his father...as long as he chooses to. I will never bad mouth his father but will let him know what his fathr did to me and him when he is much older.
Maybe one day when I've moved on and I'm much happier things will change. I guess time will tell.

Hey Trish:

As you know; I've followed your sitch for a while now. I'm sorry that you and DS have to go through all of this - it's completely and totally unfair. My saving grace is that I completely understand my WXW will never, ever find what she's looking for and neither will your WH. My WXW is as whacko as your WH and I often times wonder what I ever saw in her. For 15 years WXW bought into the "family" theory until OM convinced her otherwise. I'm doing remarkably well as my bitterness has passed and the only feeling I have for WXW is saddened compassion.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I will never bad mouth his father but will let him know what his fathr did to me and him when he is much older.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">DD13 is having a very hard time with our entire sitch and what you described above is an issue for us. DD13 considers me her "rock" as I will not allow my values to be altered through all of this - which includes not bashing WXW personally. Instead; I have learned that we can separate and discuss the improper (adulterous)actions of WXW w/o making it personal. It was tough, but here's how we made it work: (Note: Fortunately; DD attends private/christian school and they recently discussed adultery/divorce, etc. in bible-study so DD fully understands what her Mom did and continues doing.) I asked DD what she would do if she was at the mall with her best-friend and she noticed her best friend shoplift an item. (Would be highly out of character for this to happen). DD said she would either approach her friend about it or tell me or her parents about it. I asked; "How would you tell her parents about it w/o talking bad about her?" DD said that it would be the "action of shoplifting" that would upset her and she would want to help her friend by telling her parents. BINGO! She just realized what I had been saying about her Mom's actions, not about her Mom. It was like a lightswitch with DD and we've had no problem since. She clearly knows and understands that she can talk to me about her Mom's actions and not feel that she (or I) am personally bashing her Mom. Hope this helps you with DS! Good Luck

FR <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

FR,
I'm sorry you are going through all of this too. Thank you for sharing that...I will use that concept and see if my son can understand that.
I find myself wondering what attracted me to my WH also. I would never be with him the way he is now....NEVER!!! I'm not the kind of person who lets people push me around. My WH is living with the OW now so I'm hoping that his "fantasy bubble" pops soon. I don't want him back but I admit it would give me great pleasure to see him crumble. I do believe in the end...they will get what they deserve.
Hang in there...

Hey TR:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I find myself wondering what attracted me to my WH also. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Several months ago; I made the decision to stop questioning myself about being attracted to WXW, marrying her, having DD with her, etc. She was/is attractive; was fun to be with and at the time had strong values. It was a classic "romantic love" that I am not sorry for experiencing. The fact that she chose to have an A has nothing to do with me or my ability to choose a decent wife. The only way I could ever know that is to experience it. I gave her my heart & soul (which is the proper thing to do with our spouse) and it was her decision alone to destroy all that we'd built. My consience is very, very clear and I regret nothing. It has everything to do with the old cliche that "We can only control our actions; not those of another..."! Once I made that stark realization; my new, single life changed for the better.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My WH is living with the OW now so I'm hoping that his "fantasy bubble" pops soon. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It will!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't want him back but I admit it would give me great pleasure to see him crumble. I do believe in the end...they will get what they deserve.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You're still hurting pretty badly - understandable! Eventually, you'll get past the hurt and will actually feel sorry for him. It will be one of the strangest emotions you've ever felt - but it will happen. And yes; they will get what they deserve. You must keep in mind that WH is still your DS's Dad so when it all blows up; it may be quite sad for you - and DS. No matter; you have obligation as a good, honorable person and parent to help DS deal with WH (Dad) when the facade falters and reality hits. WH will be an absolute basket-case! I urge you to begin preparing for this day as it will happen and it won't be pretty!

FR <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> CAUTION: For some reason this became a wandering, philosophical post!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hey guys-

This whole topic has actually kept me away from the infidelity boards. I have started to feel that I don't belong there anymore. Upon my reading, Plan B appears to in some ways mean that the BS's goal is to keep the hope of reconcilliation alive. God is great, and He can do all things. I am just walking in His light for me, but I honestly feel that the covenant of my marriage is ended. Against my will, not my choice, but never the less, it is severed. At first I felt like I was trying to live with WS choices. But I am not there anymore. Now I have all the choices.

I guess I am no longer on a plan...at least I don't know what to call it (Plan G, Plan Me...LOL, at myself). My WS is so lost that I honestly don't even recognize him. He is an addict (not substance abuse, sex/instant gratification is his "high" of choice!) and therefore is all about justifying his fix.

I don't question why I was attracted to him originally and our love grew. What I wonder now is does that attraction still exist...I still love him, but the woman that I have become would not have chosen him, then or now.

Anyway, that is a long post to say that my Plan is all about growing my relationship with God, myself, and others. Yes I love my WS, yes I care what happens to him, but it is mostly with pity and a detatchment that is new. So whether you can still call this plan B...I have no idea. Will take someone more intune then me to figure that one out.

So I guess for me, I hame starting to form a new plan...it's really about new boundaries. It is about detatchment. Not really in contrast to Plan B, just in a different manner. Tina

Boy this post became really wandering. I will add a warning!

Hi Doc:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Boy this post became really wandering. I will add a warning!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your warning is well taken. You'll find that often times a post in this section will not receive a lot of attention. No problem - the subject matter may simply not relate to many. In these cases - it is common for a few MB-ers to allow the post to spread into other areas. The intent is not to threadjack; it's only to expand on a given subject. Treereich and I do this occasionally as our sitches are similar. Now that we realize you have interest in the original topic; we will default back to the original issue and help as we can.

Your post is similar to my experience so I'll offer what I can.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Upon my reading, Plan B appears to in some ways mean that the BS's goal is to keep the hope of reconcilliation alive. God is great, and He can do all things. I am just walking in His light for me, but I honestly feel that the covenant of my marriage is ended. Against my will, not my choice, but never the less, it is severed. At first I felt like I was trying to live with WS choices. But I am not there anymore. Now I have all the choices </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sounds like you have a good understanding of Plan-B. (And it's good that you have God in your life!) One important point to Plan-B is that the BS establishes clear and strong boundaries for the relationship - if there is reconciliation.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess I am no longer on a plan...at least I don't know what to call it (Plan G, Plan Me...LOL, at myself). My WS is so lost that I honestly don't even recognize him. He is an addict (not substance abuse, sex/instant gratification is his "high" of choice!) and therefore is all about justifying his fix.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">At this point; you are still firmly in Plan-B! Your WS being still "lost" is very common in these sitches. It is commonly referred to as "being in the fog", "foggy", "an alien has entered his body & soul", etc. The addiction is very real and adds to his "fogginess".

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> don't question why I was attracted to him originally and our love grew. What I wonder now is does that attraction still exist...I still love him, but the woman that I have become would not have chosen him, then or now.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is a very important statement! Obviously you would not have chosen/or now choose the man that he is now. The big question (and point to Plan-B) is do you want to wait and see if WH will end the A, come out of the fog, stay within your boundaries for M, do whatever is necessary to move past the A, and help you create a M that is healthy for both of you. In the most basic sense - it is about faith and desire.

You may have already determined that D is the best course for you. (FYI: I had to make this determination and am now divorced. WXW remains foggy trying to convince OM to D his W of 30 years.) However I should tell you that there are success stories from sitches similar to yours. So please make this decision carefully.

Good Luck! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

FR

Fishracer-
Sorry away at a conference! Wasn't able to get on the board from the hotel.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> This is a very important statement! Obviously you would not have chosen/or now choose the man that he is now. The big question (and point to Plan-B) is do you want to wait and see if WH will end the A, come out of the fog, stay within your boundaries for M, do whatever is necessary to move past the A, and help you create a M that is healthy for both of you. In the most basic sense - it is about faith and desire.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is what I have been doing. It is obvious to me that he is not my husband, he is a WH and is so buried in his own lies, beliefs, addictions...ie the "fog." I enjoyed being married to him, at least at some times. I have not been a perfect wife. I have not been as loving and respectful as God has wanted for me. In all my soul searching during this time of growth (ie the last 6 months), I am becomming the woman that God wants me to be. That means becomming a better wife, among other things. But I have also learned to love and respect others. This includes myself. I guess these things make me love my WH enough to let him go.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You may have already determined that D is the best course for you. (FYI: I had to make this determination and am now divorced. WXW remains foggy trying to convince OM to D his W of 30 years.) However I should tell you that there are success stories from sitches similar to yours. So please make this decision carefully.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess this is what I am struggling about. He has filed for divorce. I have determined that I will not try to "hold him" against his will...not like I even could. But I won't try. So I guess how do you know when plan B in my heart becomes plan D? Some days I pray that my marriage be restored, but lately I have been praying for us as individuals. And in my thoughts, I feel like my marriage covenant has been destroyed. Could God restore a Holy Covenant of Marriage between him and me...absolutely. God is wonderful. But at this point I feel like I am moving forward on God's path for me, my WH is not doing that. So I will walk on alone.

I am not dating. I am not even divorced. (I did take off my wedding ring. For me...I felt like it was a wrong signal to my WH. I had kept it on because it felt like what was right...I took it off for the same reason, all after prayer.) I am so far from being in a monogamous dating relationship. I am trying to rediscover myself and grow my relationship with God...which naturally grows relatinships with others.

I will say I am ready for the sea of emotions to calm a little. But all in time...Tina

Hi Tina:

Welcome back from conference. Hope it went well.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I enjoyed being married to him, at least at some times. I have not been a perfect wife. I have not been as loving and respectful as God has wanted for me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Probably 90% of BS's on here say the same thing. It's normal for BS's to look in the mirror and question their (our) actions during M. HOWEVER - these actions have nothing to do with WS's decision to have A! It's important for you to have a grasp on that!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am becomming the woman that God wants me to be. That means becomming a better wife, among other things. But I have also learned to love and respect others. This includes myself. I guess these things make me love my WH enough to let him go.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ideally, you become a Godly wife and H becomes a Godly H. Then it's a can't miss M! Glad that you're learning to love & respect yourself and others. Not sure I understand the last sentence though. How does letting him go - show how much you love him?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He has filed for divorce. I have determined that I will not try to "hold him" against his will...not like I even could. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Good decision!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So I guess how do you know when plan B in my heart becomes plan D? Some days I pray that my marriage be restored, but lately I have been praying for us as individuals. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I feel that you should remain in Plan-B at least until D is final. Miracles can - and do happen so you should be prepared. Praying for you and WH as individuals is correct at this point. I am unsure about after D.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But at this point I feel like I am moving forward on God's path for me, my WH is not doing that. So I will walk on alone. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Remember that a big part of Plan-B is to pay attention to - and take care of yourself! Looks like you're doing that.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am not dating. I am not even divorced. (I did take off my wedding ring. For me...I felt like it was a wrong signal to my WH. I had kept it on because it felt like what was right...I took it off for the same reason, all after prayer.) I am so far from being in a monogamous dating relationship. I am trying to rediscover myself and grow my relationship with God...which naturally grows relatinships with others.

I will say I am ready for the sea of emotions to calm a little. But all in time...Tina </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Not dating is good for now. Many on here believe that BS's should wait at least a year or more after D to date. I personally feel that each case and each person is different. My suggestion: One thing at a time. Wait for D to happen, continue doing what you're doing and look for signs. If/when D happens - then make decisions about dating and other activities. As to the emotions - I remember them well. Up-Down-Up-Down. Good time to read scripture though. That always calms me. You're doing well. Good Luck. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

FR

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Ideally, you become a Godly wife and H becomes a Godly H. Then it's a can't miss M! Glad that you're learning to love & respect yourself and others. Not sure I understand the last sentence though. How does letting him go - show how much you love him? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess I was referring to the fact that our relationship/marriage has been very codependant. In making healthy boundaries, I feel like I was trying to honor our marriage. Grovelling or begging or trying to rescue...all of those things are unhealthy patterns in our relationship that was really about control, not love. So I am trying to honor him, he has made his choice...does this sound strange? It doesn't sond weird in my head!

Dating is not for now! I went through that teen temper tantrum phase (ie "He's having fun why shouldn't I!"). But God protected me and convicted me to honor myself and my relationship with HIM (God). I am blessed to have great friends that hold me accountable and a wonderful support network at my church. SoI keep walking! Tina

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess I was referring to the fact that our relationship/marriage has been very codependant. In making healthy boundaries, I feel like I was trying to honor our marriage. Grovelling or begging or trying to rescue...all of those things are unhealthy patterns in our relationship that was really about control, not love. So I am trying to honor him, he has made his choice...does this sound strange? It doesn't sond weird in my head! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OK - think I've got it now. By attempting to develop a "healthy" marriage that was actually "unhealthy"; you had to "grovel, beg, etc." which of course - doesn't work. But I understand where you were and why you did what you did in trying to create a God-like marriage. Sounds like you had to try to assume some of the husbands responsibilities to lead your family and a control battle ensued. Am I close now?

I agree with your decision to release him. Very mature - and loving I might add. Please keep me informed as I am interested in your journey. God's plan is sometimes so unpredictable and I'm interested to see where he takes you (and WH)! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

By the way; look for and read a book called "Why One Way" by John MacArthur. It's a quick read - only 5 chapters long and does not talk about marriage, divorce, etc. The topic is about "truth" and the message is awesome. I think you'll enjoy it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

FR

I have wonder about this question too sometimes.
I don't remember reading anything in the info here about what to do if the divorce is final and the BS needs to use Plan B to try to get the WS to end the affair and make a committment to the marriage.

Support is settled, property divided, visitation at daughters' disgression, and he now lives in another state. So there's not much reason to have contact with him anyway.

During our separation (even when there was a restraining order in effect WH demanded to se me, even wanted me to come along for visitation with daughters! A year and a half after we separated, after restraining order ended, I did agree to spend some time with him in order to do a Plan A. Then he agreed to delay the divorce for another year because I said once the divorce was final I would not spend any more time with him, he could pick daughters up out front but could not come in and watch videos with us, etc.
(His idea of divorce would be that he could still hang out in our home with us for parties, holidays, etc. LOL) WH delaying the divorce so he could continue to see me flipped out OW and converted her into jealous control-freak. They fought, broke up and made up for a year before (I think) a final split.

Anyway I told WH that after the divorce I would start dating and I would not have any private communication with him behind my future husband's back.

So when the divorce is final I will continue Plan B basically for the rest of my life.