WH picked up our son at 10 am this morning.

Remember last friday & sat when he wanted to reconcile & was going to move in with friends while we counseled? We had slept together, making plans for the future, all the while he's telling me he loves me. Then on monday leaves me a note in my mailbox saying he didn't want to reconcile. I called him monday night and he acted like he didn't know what I was talking about.

Since then he's brought me a card and another 2 page letter about why he feels we couldn't be together. I asked "You never did tell Cheryl it was over and had until monday to get your stuff out did you?"
He said "We had some difficulties but have worked through them and are back together now."


I asked him this morning if he felt nothing at all about what happened this week. He said to chalk it up to the fact that the divorce is about to end and he had last minute jitters. !!!!

He said we would only fight and he and Cheryl don't even raise their voices to each other.


I am so knocked for a loop all over again.
He left with OUR son in HER vehicle.
Plus, she has no idea that he tried to reconcile with me and slept with me. I want her to know but she doesn't believe me and my WH is such a liar.

I cannot stand that he's moved on with her!!!!
It is sickening. He moved in with her 3 weeks after our child was born. Now he acts like even after living with her for 6 months everything is still just wonderful even though he had those last minute second thoughts.

Now he's trying to go after my son everyday first shift while I work to get more time and alleviate daycare costs!

Can my heart be broken any further?

Why can he just use me and end up living happily with her?

Yeah, she doesn't realize that he's a liar right now or that he's slept with me 13 times since he's moved in with her.

But ignorance is bliss right?

Right now I would rather be ignorant of what he's doing and be happy then to be here alone crying my eyes out.

I need hope right now.

I need their relationship to end. He never should've slept with/moved in with her.

I don't know how I'll heal over all of this!!!!!!

I'm totally wasting this time I could be using to get things done, but I just can't seem to pull myself out of this emotional prison today.

My eyes burn from crying for so long.

Oh sweetie,

(((((((Tess W.)))))))

My heart is with you. It does feel as though we BS's are simply the fuel that feeds their happy new life, doesn't it?

I am not entirely familiar with your situation right now, but are you in a plan? The reason I ask is this:

"he's slept with me 13 times since he's moved in with her."

Why are you sleeping with him if he is living with OW? Even in a hardcore Plan A (with a conscious choice to meet ENs despite an ongoing affair and a known end date), this would be extremely difficult for you.


"Right now I would rather be ignorant of what he's doing and be happy then to be here alone crying my eyes out."

This is Plan B. In Plan B you get to be totally ignorant of what looks like WH's "happy little life" (even though it isn't) and you don't have to be a first-hand witness to the carnage it creates.

You are right, they should not have moved in together. As their relationship continues, it will hit more bumps in the road. When they come, your husband will think of you. If he thinks that "all" he has to do is come to you with talk of reconciliation and plans for counselling etc. and then you will sleep with him, he may continue to bounce back and forth between you.

Meanwhile you get your hopes up and have them dashed when, in his directionless wanderings, he decides that he would rather be with OW today despite what he said to you yesterday.

You do not have to be the victim of his instability. If he wants to return and you want him back, well and good. But I would suggest that you have some clear and concrete actions that he must demonstrate before you go down the "I'm willing to talk about reconciliation" road (much less the sleeping together road). Make sure that he knows what they are (i.e. a Plan B letter), and then remove yourself from his hurtful behavior.

I don't want any of this to sound harsh - I just hate to see what this is doing to you, having been in the same place myself.

Blessings,

Gris

Dear Tess,

I am so sorry to hear your story. I can feel your pain. I am new here so I am not full of MB knowledge (to the extent that I want to be yet). However, I felt compelled to write to you and help you try and gain some peace of mind.

I know that sounds impossible right now. If I were in your shoes (and I may be some day?), knowing what I know after going through relationships, this is what I would try and do. However, I encourage you to see if there is reason in my approach and, if it's not for you, that it is entirely your choice.

I would begin to recognize that I've been focusing and expending all of my energy on the girlfriend and the behavior of my H. I would go to therapy and begin to focus on ME. I would start to recognize that I am a person who deserves love, honesty and a healthy relationship. I would soon learn that my relationship with my H was not healthy and that, regardless of how hard I try, he will do what he will do. I would realize how powerless I was and how important it is for me to immediately start focusing on me, my life, my child, and my future, regardless of my H.

I would also recognize that my H only has an interest in me when he is not in good with his GF and that he seems desperate to secure a position with at least one of you vs. being alone (all of the wrong reasons to reconcile with me).

You are a human being and you deserve to treat yourself kinder by ending the torture of constant thoughts around his life. Love you. You need YOU right now. There are plenty of great websites that offer excellent and convincing information about why we need to love and care for ourselves before we can be there for anyone else.

It probably hurts and feels like tragic rejection, which we humans are very impacted by. However, a change in mindset and a brand new commitment to be there for YOU by taking care of your thoughts and yourself will surely bring you:

</font>

• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The ability to be there for your son. He needs you and he needs you to take care of YOU.</font></li>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
</font>

• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The beginning of acquiring much-needed peace of mind and relief by letting go of the thoughts of others (H,GF).</font></li>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
</font>

• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The strength to get through this painful time and the opportunity to grow personally and be available for the much-deserved healthy relationship.</font></li>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
Please stop beating yourself up. You can make a decision (even for one-minute intervals if that's all you do initially!) to dismiss ALL thoughts of the others and replace them with self-supporting thoughts with the same level of conviction that you expend on the H&GF! You can rechannel the energy.

My hope for you is peace, one day [or one minute] at a time.

Remember, "This To Shall Pass". I love that phrase. It never feels that way when you are in it, but it always is the case!!!

Sincerely,
DW

Thanks girls. You know I thought I might have been getting stronger - but I was just in denial.

I in the back of my mind or being or whatever still believed he would leave Cheryl and want us to be a family.

I pray a lot and part of that is having faith. So on "faith" I was believing somehow that God would soften his heart and change circumstances around him and somehow his heart would change fully.

Then when he came home wanting to call off the divorce and told me how much he loved me etc. then agreed to move in with friends while we went through counseling, it was like an answer to prayer.

It's almost like I went back to square 1 - but worse.

Our court date is this friday at 8:30 am. It is so scary. It still hasn't fully hit me that I'll be divorced in a week.

Maybe sleeping with him was my one little way to still hold on. He would tell me that it was much better with me then with Cheryl, so it was like the only thing I felt I could use to somehow have him still hold on until his heart changed.

Griselda, dear please help me learn how to do Plan B. How did you do it? I can't seem to let go. It hurts so much and I just want our family to be a family. I just can't seem to not think of them together, what they're doing, how they're affectionate, etc.

He had told me once that she chased him for a year and a half. I believe that's why he didn't want me at his shows. Cheryl is a rock photograper and took pictures of them at their live shows.

How do I not think of them? Especially when I'm alone on the weekends that they have my son?
This hurts so bad.

I've gotten nothing done today. I was supposed to do lesson planning for next week today. I did nothing but cry.

I can see how self destructive that this behavior is. I mean really. I wasted a whole day crying and talking about this whole thing. My eyes hurt. My face hurts. My head hurts.

"This too shall pass."

That is a good phrase DW. I just hope that when it passes I'm better off and not worse.

This truly right now is a minute by minute thing DW. Really.
Oh my word. How do I make myself truly believe that I will get through this ok? I know in my mind I need to be whole and healthy for my son and not in this totally incapacitated state, but how do you force yourself through it?

Your posts are very wise. I just don't really know how to do it. How do you take control?

Hi Tess,

Hang in there. Please don't think that I believe it is easy. I FEEL YOUR PAIN . I just want to reach out to you and tell you that you are NOT alone. If I can be a friend, I would like to. You need support and friends...AND YOU ARE! I feel your heart through your words...

I'm trying to help you see your inner beauty and worthiness, as I believe that coming "home" to ourselves is the key to peace and happiness, and frees us from dependency on others in order to claim it.

How can I help? Please let me know. Please KNOW that you are not alone and I'm so proud of you that you've spent the day in and out of this site because that tells me that you DO care about you. Don't judge yourself for crying all day. Sometimes we need to go through the tunnel of pain to arrive at a better place.

I DO believe that you will although I entirely understand why you are not certain of this. I can only speak from experience. My experiences of the past, when my faith was intact (we are human and we have our days <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ), ALWAYS land me gifts of wisdom that strengthen my ability to be happy. I just feel that this is what is in store for you and, although your not feeling it or believing that the outcome will be better rather than worse - IT WILL BE if you make that commitment to yourself as noted in my prior post.

Please keep writing and know that I (and, likely, many others here at this supportive forum) want to be here for you as you go through this difficult and painful time in your life, which "too shall pass" and you WILL prevail through some self-discovery, reading, seeking support and knowing that others care about you.
Think about it. Griselda, myself-we don't know you but we CARE about you.

You do not need to take on individuals that do not serve you in your highest good.

Please hang in there. I used to run from pain because I thought that it would kill me. Through prayers, tears and life experiences, I'm learning to actually go through it, label it (as if it were an external entity), feel it (as bad as it is) and draw strength through prayer. I've only recently learned this and WOW! It does work. It's amazing how strong you really are and just do not realize it due to a tremendous cloud of negative thoughts (totally understandable - been there and sometimes go there). It's just another chapter for you and YOU WILL win if you continue to share, reach out for support and try and consider forcing yourself to learn about how to love yourself enough to FIRMLY REJECT behaviors that will not serve your highest good(e.g. thoughts).

I'm rambling and I'm feeling like I want to take away your pain. (Sure, slight codependency on my part. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Just breathe and give yourself periodic "breaks" from all of these thoughts of pain. Our mind is an amazing tool. It can also be [solely] responsible for our inner torture. You can choose to reflect differently at any point and at any moment. And...when you find yourself strolling back into the painful thoughts, make another decision not to. If that decision fails, try again...and again...and you will see!

This kind of pain may require decisions every 1/10th of a second initially. Then, maybe every second. Then, perhaps every minute, hour, etc... and then it's like magic after enough commitment and practice. The thoughts of torture, you notice one day, are far and few between. It's life and our challenges. It does help to "label" the thoughts in an effort to define and dismiss them at will.

I'm here for you as are many others. Don't be discouraged initially if the feedback is slow today (I learned that weekends on the site tend to be light participation during my introductory reading of how this site works).

Hugs and support sent your way ((())))

DW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ March 12, 2005, 11:09 PM: Message edited by: DefeatedWoman ]</small>

Thanks for your support.

It does help to come back to a thread and see that somebody out there cares enough to respond and try to help, especially when you're the BS who's sitting at what's left of "home" alone & down.

I'll try to separate myself and feel then get through it. I'm glad it worked for you.

I hope it can work for me too.

I can't continue to go through this utter hell.

Guys, Is it wrong to continue to pray that they are absolutely miserable together?
Am I focusing too much on them by doing that?

And what about when I SEE him?

How do you detach?

It's like I just want to grab him and shake him and make him wake up. He lies so much that I don't know whether to believe that they're happy or not.
If he was truly happy with her why then would he still sleep with me?

Could he possibly be actually happy with her and yet at the same time still have a love for me and that's why?

OK, now I'm thinking about them again........

Oh, and I forgot to ask -

How the heck do I get over the facts that he was with her at a bar playing a show as I was giving birth to our son? (15 hrs!)

&

His band's 1st music video has a shot of them kissing at the end!!!!!

Dear Tess,

Your best bet to finding out more about Plan B is to read, read, read on the site. I think I've seen you over on GQII, but if you haven't been recently, there are a bunch of folks doing it right now (or getting ready to do it).

Given that your court date is this Friday, things are a bit different for you.

I've sooooo been where you are. The inability to think about anything else. The mental pictures of them having the time of their lives,with your son there, too! (they're not, you know. It just seems that way.) But it's still mind-numbing and excrutiating.

The less contact you have with your husband, the less you will have reason to think of them. If all the financial dust is settled after Friday, then the only thing you need to discuss is your son.

Try to limit those conversations to email (some people here do text messages - I'm a Luddite, so I refuse to learn <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> . If it's possible for someone else to be present when he picks up/drops off your son, so much the better. If he calls, stay on topic. Do not veer off the topic of your son and the things you must discuss to ensure his best care.

(Please note, I'm not trying to encourage you to be hostile. I believe that separated/divorced parents should act respectfully toward one another and should not speak ill of each other in front of their children etc.)

As far as what you do when you're alone? I'm a firm believer in self-care. Try to think of things that you enjoy doing. Preferably ones you have always done independently, or did before you were married (so they don't bring up any unpleasant associations).

They don't need to cost money (although I do find myself buying new clothes pretty often <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> . Go for walks. Listen to music that you enjoy. Cook. Garden. Buy the real parmesan instead of the fake stuff. Put real cream in the coffee instead of skim milk. Exercise. Spend lots of time with friends.

Whatever it is, treat yourself. Do things purely for the pleasure they bring to you.

I will say as well that when I started saying the things you are saying (i.e. this obsessive thinking is rendering me ineffective as a mother and the anxiety is diminishing my quality of life), I chose to go on anti-ds. They're not for everyone, and I wouldn't have done it if I had not had to go back to work full-time and therefore wouldn't have the time to journal/exercise/relax that I had before. But they were enough to stop the constant compulsive thinking.

Also, if you are not already in counselling, I would strongly encourage you to do so.

The idea is to put the focus on you. It's tempting to spend all your time thinking about him. Try to replace those thoughts. It's easier if you don't have constant reminders of him.

I hope this helps my dear. I know this will be a tough week for you. Try to be extra-nice to yourself this week. And after Friday, cut yourself some slack, too - it's okay to be sad and you have every right to hurt.

Stay strong for yourself and for your son.

Hugs,

Gris

Tess, I have been in the same situation as your WH, so some of my story may well help.

We seperated, after a year I moved in with someone else, which lasted a year. Throughout this I continued sleeping with my W. When the OW ended, we just continued in the same pattern for another year till my W had had enough and told me so, unfortunately by this time my treatment of her had resulted in OM being in the picture.

It's a horrible situation to look back on. I cannot imagine the pain that it caused my W. I now truly understand what "the fog" is, it was a classic have your cake and eat it situation. At the time I did not spare a single thought for my W feelings. My memories of the last few years are so dim that it seems like it wasn't me that did those things.

When she told me enough was enough, it brought me to my senses overnight with an incredible bang, and I have now spent the last year trying for forgiveness and another chance.

Unfortunately for us, by the time she said it, she really meant it. I often wish she had done it earlier. Of course it may not have had the same effect at a different time, but we may also have started on recovery before I destroyed so much.

What it did for me was to open my eyes to seeing my W as a real person, admiting my mistakes and where I really wanted to be.

He needs to see you as a real person with feelings, and to do that you have to stop allowing him to use you.

Hi Tess -

I'm so sorry for the situation you're in. It's incredibly difficult. I really only have two bits of advice. First, YES, write the OW a note letting her know what happened with your husband. She deserves to know that the man she's sleeping with is sleeping with someone else. She may not believe you -- but put in enough details that it's difficult not to believe. Not the juicy stuff, just a factual account. He arrived at this time, we discussed these things. I understand that you and he had some difficulties, and I want you to know that we also slept together. Here's how it began (who kissed who, etc.). In the morning we talked about these things, and he left at that time.

If you're really factual about it, rather than emotional (do not say you love him or that you want to reconcile -- that's not what this is about), it'll rock her world.

The second thing that I would say is that it is ALWAYS better for a child to be with his parents than in day care. I know it's very upsetting for you to have your baby spending time with the OW -- and you can fight that part in court and/or in your custody settlement. But try to keep that separate from whether your husband can take your son while you're at work. That part is actually, in my view, a very, very GOOD thing. The connection between parents is built with time, care, and effort. Every moment that you're not able to be with your son should be a moment when your son's father has the opportunity to be there for him, supporting him and building their connection with one another.

Tess W,

just file the divorce papers against him, and tell him that you deserve better than he will ever be. . . .

sorry that you are another one to go through this, however, he appears to not be a very responsible person, emotionally or otherwise,

and you do deserve better than this behavior, and do not take it personally, HE is the one that is screwed up, completely, and the action of serving him papers, with a monthly $ requirement will sort of wake him up, or not. ..

if not, there is very little that will. . .

good luck

wiftty

I too am going through the same situtation that you are! I moved out because Wh would not give up Ow, that lives approx 3 blocks from where we lived! She called the house all the time to talk to him etc....and we have 3 boys! So, about 6 months ago I moved out, about 8 houses away, so the older boys can go back and fourth...which is my tortoure!!
I now live in the middle of them two! In January I found a "love note" from her to him, telling him she "can't wait for him to be free"...etc...less then 2 weeks after her note, I was served with divorce papers! When I found the love note, we working going to MC, working on "our marriage"! It didn't even faze him!
My divorce date is coming ever closer, and I also cannot do a plan a or plan b!! I bounce back and fourth! I hate the thought of in less then 2 months I will be divorced, Wh will be with Ow, my boys will be around her, etc...I have many of the same days that you do! In fact, friday was my day to cry all day! I find it's hard to focus on anything else!
So, If you like, email me anytime, and any "helpful" things that you find out please share!
I live in a small town, so everyone "knows", I can't go walk which I enjoy because of this "neighborhood" that I'm stuck in - const. seeing "her" around here...
So, just to let you know, I'm wishing you the best! Will keep you in my prayers also!

Tess,

First of all, from the other thread.... feel free to use "Hotel Tess!" It's a perfect way to describe what WS is doing in these kinds of situations. When fantasyland with the OP starts looking less-than-fantastic, they like having somewhere else to go, a hotel to stay where they have ALL the amenities. As long as you let him, he'll keep doing that. You might find that even after the divorce, he tries to do the same thing, and essentially tries to turn you into the OW! Crazy, huh? But that's the way they act in the fog.

I know I've talked before about how I handled it when my now-XH walked out. But I'm not sure I told you about his note. He left while I was off at church for band practice, and left a note for me. It was essentially what we call a "no contact" letter around here. Yes, an NC to his wife! Talked about how we had some really good years, but he just didn't feel "that way" anymore, and how he needed to go be with her to see if she was the one. But the big thing is, he said at least three separate times in that note that he didn't think our relationship was over. He basically said that he wasn't sure, that he really thought we might end up together, but that he just had to go find out how it would be with her.

This was a miscalculation on his part. I recognize it as the same kind of thing that so many other WSs do - holding out hope, trying to make me think if I just wait it out and let him get it out of his system, that he would be back and everything would be fine again. I way it was a miscalculation, though, because instead of giving me false hope, it really, really ticked me off. My translation of it was "ok, so you expect me to just sit here and wait while you go running around sleeping with whomever you want, and I'm supposed to just keep the home taken care of, the bills taken care of, and generally be the responsible adult who keeps everything ready for you when you're done acting like a horny teenager and ready to pretend you're an adult again." I was supposed to sit and wait for him, that my feelings and what I wanted didn't matter, that he just expected me to be good-old reliable wifey hoding down the fort so he had someplace to run to and someone to take care of him when things got too rough for him. Once I saw it that way, I knew that no matter how hard it was for me, I had to protect myself from him. Because he sure wasn't looking out for me - he was only out for himself, and what he thought would make him feel good and secure.

Whatever you do, don't buy into his fogspeak. Sure he would have been ready to reconcile if you'd just let him come home. At least for a day or two, until he decided he just couldn't keep from going to be with her again, because after all, she's his soulmate. At least, she is until the next time there's a bump in the road with them, at which point he'll realize that it really was you all along, baby.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again - how will you know if he's sincere? As many others here have said, watch his actions, and not what he says. But even what he says can tell you a lot too. If he were sincere about wanting to fix things with you, he'd be extremely apologetic, and willing to do whatever it took to build trust with you again. He would realize the harm he's done to your trust, and recognize that it won't come back overnight, that he's going to have to deal with not being trusted, and do whatever he can to help you fell safe with him again. If the reason he didn't want to try and reconcile is that you wouldn't let him come hom immediately, he wasn't sincere, he was just looking for a hotel room and amenities for a few nights. And got mad that you didn't let him have it.

He IS going to get mad if you hold some boundaries. Why? Because they weren't there before. He's gotten used to doing whatever he wanted, and how dare you tell him he can't have it his way anymore. That's the sure signs of fog. If he's really sincere, he'd say "whatever it takes for you to believe in me again," and then would do it.

Giving SF is especially problematic in all this. He may be addicted to the adrenaline rush of keeping things secret. When he's with her, he wants to sneak around with you. When he's with you, he cheats with her. He needs that fix so much that he keeps bouncing back and forth that way. It's the only way to keep things feeling like a big secret.

Ah, another rambling note from me. Still, I hope you get something useful from it. And Tess, I did see one thing (it was on the other thread of yours, I think) that is a big, big red flag for me. That's the physical abuse. Even if you say he didn't really do that much, it is a huge concern. These things don't go away on their own, they just tend to get worse. One of your boundaries with him, if you do decide to give him a path back to you, should be that he must get IC about the physical abuse and anger issues. No compromise on that. You saying that he pushed you in the face really, really concerns me. As does the fact that he's adamant about you saying you overreated by calling the police. There's no concern there that his actions scared you, just that you need to "admit" he isn't an abuser. Those are really bad signs Tess.

I know all this is tough, but you aren't dealing with the wonderful guy you fell in love with and married. You're dealing with a scary and possibly violent stranger who has shown he has no real concern for your well-being, only for his own gratification. Treat him as such!

Amen to that.

NC unless he commits to life changing...he's an abusive cake eater...who is only worried that one of his addictions will be out of his reach after friday.

NO more sf. No more contact. Nothing. Go dark. The whole reality of what he has done has not yet hit him...kinda might be making him think a little, but unless he is WILLING TO MOVE HEAVEN AND EARTH TO CHANGE AND TO SHOW CARING AND DO WHWATEVER IT TAKES TO MAKE YOUR M WORK, IT IS IN VAIN.

I want this to end differently. We all do. But the reality as of today is....he has NOT changed. He is still living with, eating with, and sleeping with the OW. The D may very well go thru...But what you have to keep in mind is why on earth do you want him like this anyway?

After I left my ws, I was very sad about everything. I had the mentality of a victim. I was used to his treatment of me. Only when I got more independence and set life on my own terms did I realize how little I had settled for in my past. Could this be the same with you? He's been a cruel and abusive jerk...and hardly any semblance of a H. So what's there to miss as of today? He has only himself to blame for this. If any real and lasting change is to come around, then he is to be the one to do it.

I don't think him coming here initially would help either. He needs to decide first if he wants OW or the fog...he needs no pressure. The decision of which road to choose needs to be his and his alone. And if he allows OW to influence him, then he's also spineless and we can add it to his negative fog list as of today.

I say he's this way as of today because it is his choice today to be a WS. If he stands up, looks hard at himself, looks inward, he may decide he no longer wants to be a WS.

Look at it this way...time can change things. It can heal in ways you never thought possible...either yourself or maybe one day later together. Just be positive.

What made me feel better was realizing I was divorcing not my H, not the man I used to know, but a very very very WS. And nobody wants that kind of person in their life.

Stand up and don't settle. Life is too short...and our children look to us as role models and one day they will form their relationships based on their ideas and what they have seen and learned from their parents. Give them nothing but positives.

Amen to that.

NC unless he commits to life changing...he's an abusive cake eater...who is only worried that one of his addictions will be out of his reach after friday.

NO more sf. No more contact. Nothing. Go dark. The whole reality of what he has done has not yet hit him...kinda might be making him think a little, but unless he is WILLING TO MOVE HEAVEN AND EARTH TO CHANGE AND TO SHOW CARING AND DO WHWATEVER IT TAKES TO MAKE YOUR M WORK, IT IS IN VAIN.

I want this to end differently. We all do. But the reality as of today is....he has NOT changed. He is still living with, eating with, and sleeping with the OW. The D may very well go thru...But what you have to keep in mind is why on earth do you want him like this anyway?

After I left my ws, I was very sad about everything. I had the mentality of a victim. I was used to his treatment of me. Only when I got more independence and set life on my own terms did I realize how little I had settled for in my past. Could this be the same with you? He's been a cruel and abusive jerk...and hardly any semblance of a H. So what's there to miss as of today? He has only himself to blame for this. If any real and lasting change is to come around, then he is to be the one to do it.

I don't think him coming here initially would help either. He needs to decide first if he wants OW or the fog...he needs no pressure. The decision of which road to choose needs to be his and his alone. And if he allows OW to influence him, then he's also spineless and we can add it to his negative fog list as of today.

I say he's this way as of today because it is his choice today to be a WS. If he stands up, looks hard at himself, looks inward, he may decide he no longer wants to be a WS.

Look at it this way...time can change things. It can heal in ways you never thought possible...either yourself or maybe one day later together. Just be positive.

What made me feel better was realizing I was divorcing not my H, not the man I used to know, but a very very very WS. And nobody wants that kind of person in their life.

Stand up and don't settle. Life is too short...and our children look to us as role models and one day they will form their relationships based on their ideas and what they have seen and learned from their parents. Give them nothing but positives.

Amen to that.

NC unless he commits to life changing...he's an abusive cake eater...who is only worried that one of his addictions will be out of his reach after friday.

NO more sf. No more contact. Nothing. Go dark. The whole reality of what he has done has not yet hit him...kinda might be making him think a little, but unless he is WILLING TO MOVE HEAVEN AND EARTH TO CHANGE AND TO SHOW CARING AND DO WHWATEVER IT TAKES TO MAKE YOUR M WORK, IT IS IN VAIN.

I want this to end differently. We all do. But the reality as of today is....he has NOT changed. He is still living with, eating with, and sleeping with the OW. The D may very well go thru...But what you have to keep in mind is why on earth do you want him like this anyway?

After I left my ws, I was very sad about everything. I had the mentality of a victim. I was used to his treatment of me. Only when I got more independence and set life on my own terms did I realize how little I had settled for in my past. Could this be the same with you? He's been a cruel and abusive jerk...and hardly any semblance of a H. So what's there to miss as of today? He has only himself to blame for this. If any real and lasting change is to come around, then he is to be the one to do it.

I don't think him coming here initially would help either. He needs to decide first if he wants OW or the fog...he needs no pressure. The decision of which road to choose needs to be his and his alone. And if he allows OW to influence him, then he's also spineless and we can add it to his negative fog list as of today.

I say he's this way as of today because it is his choice today to be a WS. If he stands up, looks hard at himself, looks inward, he may decide he no longer wants to be a WS.

Look at it this way...time can change things. It can heal in ways you never thought possible...either yourself or maybe one day later together. Just be positive.

What made me feel better was realizing I was divorcing not my H, not the man I used to know, but a very very very WS. And nobody wants that kind of person in their life.

Stand up and don't settle. Life is too short...and our children look to us as role models and one day they will form their relationships based on their ideas and what they have seen and learned from their parents. Give them nothing but positives.

Hey Tess -

Just checking in with you.... how are you doing?

Today was very busy which I think helps. When I'm so busy I can hardly see straight at least my mind is off of THEM.

I so appreciate all of your responses. I came back to the thread to re-read them for encouragement.

I sort of can't wait for Friday to be done and over with Kim, ya know? So it won't still be hanging over my head. Unfortunately according to my lawyer it may not be the end of all of this. He's contacted a mediator over in Lansing. My husband hasn't disclosed all of his secret credit card information and asset information and my lawyer wants to force it out of him.

The problem is: I have no $. I can't afford for him to keep digging and digging. Realistically I don't think my WH was smart enough to not just blow all of the $ on stupid crap.

Even though he had a secret bank account and stashed thousands and I paid off thousands of HIS credit card debt for his stupid toys. I've already racked up 6k in atty. fees. I don't want to spent 10k to recoup 5k. You know?

I just want it to be done with and maybe just maybe I might get a shread of honesty from my husband.

Thank you so much for asking how I'm doing. It made me smile <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Like I said, it was a grueling day and it was nice to see.

(We just lost a few more kids from the program and my boss is talking about shutting down [i.e. me out of work] if we don't pick up in numbers by summer.)

Then of course there's the $ aspect and the fact that my WH is now fighting to get my son 7-4 during the day even though he works all night.

What would that leave left for me? 4pm-8pm bedtime. That is not enough! I am the custodial parent. He's the one who left. IF he wanted to be around our son more, then Maybe he shouldn't have left when our son was only 3 weeks old to play house with his OW. He was with her at the bar when I was in the hospital giving birth for 15 hours and now he's father of the year and want's custody????

Ugh, like I said, I'll be glad when it's not hanging over my head.

Thanks again for checking in! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />