My H and I have been married for 20 years, and we have two children. My H had an affair 13 years ago which I never knew about, but surprise, last January(2000) he was served with paternity papers. He hired an attorney, and the DNA testing, which we paid for showed that the 12 year old boy was his. Support negotiations were handled by his attorney and the State's Attorney in the county where the OW lives. The Maryland Child Support Guidelines were used to determine the amount of suppport. We have been dutifully paying the very large monthly support for a child we never knew existed.<BR> Needless to say, this has been an extreme strain on our marriage, but we are trying to work through it. Sometimes I think things are better than ever and other times, I honestly don't know if we are going to make it. <BR> During the negotiations, my H and I were numb, in shock, and dealing with thousands of emotions. We did not question much, and the case did not go to court, but was handled between the two attorneys through phone calls and faxes. We trusted his attorney, and my H signd papers when necessary.<BR> Now that things have settled down (or at least to some degree), I question the amount of support he is required to pay. I understand and fully agree, that through his arrogance and stupidity helped produce this child, and he has an obligation to this child. But Oh My Gosh!!this is a lot of money! (it is more than I thought we could afford to pay for our daughter to go to college)<BR> I have researched the Child Support Guidelines of Maryland, and it appears that the straight formula for support was used to determine the amount without considering other factors. The guidelines state that when parents split up,(these parents were never together) the child should suffer no change in lifestyle. These parents were never together to establish a lifestyle, and when I am bitter, I liken it to the OW winning the lottery. We have a lifestyle established over our twenty year marriage that was not considered. We have a mortgage and other expenses that were not a factor. <BR> The guidelines also state that subsequent children are not to be a factor since support obligations should have been considered before having children, but what about previous children? We have two children, 17 and 15. They were there before the OC. It doesn't appear that they were part of the equation at all, and we are facing college expenses next year. <BR> I know that I sound whiny, but this year has been very difficult, and this financial strain makes it even harder. I am trying to deal with the infidelity, and I have a monthly reminder. I am not trying to get us out of paying child suport, but I do feel that the amount is too high. We have had to sell a car, and are considering downsizing our house to reduce our mortage. It seems to me that the State of Maryland in its zeal to protect this child has forgotten about the other family. The one that was first, and the one that has suffered a great deal. <BR> I guess what all this comes down to is, do we have a reasonable cause to request a reduction in child support, and do we stand a chance of having it reduced?<BR> Thanks for listening.

Calamity:<P>What a horrible, horrible blow. I hope you were not ordered to pay retroactively. What a rotten OW to drop this on you out of the blue. It certainly was her lottery. She must regret not getting the support for the past twelve years since this was so easy.<P>When the OW is treated as if she were a wife of several years instead of a one night stand or an illicit affair of weeks or months and finanically rewarded for her destruction of your family and creating a financial hardship for you and your children and the courts ignore your family's needs, I can only say it is time for child support reform across the board, in every state in this entire country.<P>We have a member here, Bystander, who is active in seeking reform in the area of child support and finding ways to fight the unjust laws that extract large income shares from the families of the wayward spouse. It will be a long time coming and is only in the 'awareness' stages and probably won't do either you or me any good for years to come, but at least there are men's rights groups being formed to addressed this evil and corrupt system that would turn a blind eye to the family of the WS.<P>I am sorry this is happeneing to you. How are your children taking this news? Are you and your husband going to have contact with this child?<P>I know what you are going through. My husband and I have filed bankruptcy and divorced to protect me from loosing to the OW and her spawn.<P>You've come to the right place. <P>Catnip =^^=

cj,<P>how terrible that the OW waited so long to pursue child support. i pray you don't have to pay arrearages, that would be unfair.<P>it is sad to say that the courts don't give a hoot about the "first" family. it is whoever files first. for example, some of the women here had to file for their children for support so they would be first in line and the OW would get whatever was left over. it is sad that someone who never was part of the family can get more respect than the actual family.<P>i don't know much about law, there are some here who do, maybe bystander will be along to help. i just wanted to say hello and sorry you are here.<P>happy_girl

First of all I am so sorry that you are in this situation. I am glad that you found our group. <P>I will tell that the courts don't care. My own husband had a drunken one night stand, and we pay out the nose for that OC, and our child was never considered. They could care less. If we didn't make it, my daughter and myself would get our share after she gets hers. and she gets all of this for one night, maybe 15 minutes, before they both passed out in a car. Is this fair? No! Do they care? NO!<P>I am one of the biggest complainers about hte child support. We have had to change jobs and move from our home just so we could break even again. And in two years, like you will learn the OW can request an increase. So once you think you can handle the payment she can go back and ask for an increase. Which in our lives means, that she will get what ever raises he might receive and more. <P>This is a cruel world who thinks by handing the woman the check that the child is cared for. I mean this woman does this after twelve years, she must have needed the money. Cause we all know that a 12 year old does not need a child support payment. I mean young children need diapers, and clothes, and baby food. I mean it is the first years that are expensive. By 12 you might buy them school clothes once a year, and pay for a school activity. Obviously she already had a roof over their heads if the child is 12. That is really upsetting. <P>I am so sorry. I know for a fact that the courts don't care. We tried to appeal our child support amount, got a big tuff luck attitude. And if you didn't have to pay back support, than the courts would tell you that you shouldn't complain since you got out of the first twelve years. Your only small blessing is that you only have 6 years left. I know that doesn't sound good right now. But most of us have 16-18 years to pay the OW, and that seems like an eternity. you are in my prayers.<P>babstr.<p>[This message has been edited by babstr (edited February 06, 2001).]

Dear cj,<BR>I am also one of the people for whom the outrageous amount of support is a big issue. I am so frustrated by the laws lack of respect for or acknowlegment of my children, two of which were born before the oc. Right now, I am writing letters to my state representatives regarding the injustice of the support laws. maybe this will accomplish nothing at all, but at least I feel like I'm doing something. And i read that if the representatives get one letter about a specific situation, they estimate that there is at least 100 more people out there who feel the same way but didn't bother to write. May I suggest that we all do this. Some of the members here are extremely eloquent in their postings, and I can imagine powerful and persuasive letters hitting our elected officials right and left.<BR>By the way, I am so sorry that you are going through this with us. Babstr is right. consider it one small blessing that you have only 6 years left. We have 15, and everytime I think about how much I want those 15 years to be over, I feel as if I am wishing my life, and my kids' lives, away.<BR>-cd

Thank you everyone for your support. I guess it is some comfort that I am not alone in this. There seem to be so many tales in the naked(ha ha) city, and I am grateful that we do not have 17 or more years to pay. I am so sorry that all of you are going through this too.<P>No, at this time my H and I do not plan to have contact with the OC. I can't imagine how awkward. What a horrible legacy for a child. To be the product of a sleazy, meaningless affair. I wouldn't even know how to begin accepting this child.<BR>I wonder how the OW explains the sudden increase in income. Does she tell him about the affair, does she tell him she is probably the highest priced hooker in the USA? <P>I have not had any contact with the OW, and your revelation that she can come back for more, makes me feel that I should lay low and not attagonize. I hate to admit it, but I did do a "drive by". In a period of deep depression, I drove an hour and a half just to drive by her house. It was well kept in a nice neighborhood, and there were two cars in the driveway. One was a new Miata--makes me really wonder. My H and I are driving cars that are at least 3 years old. Needless to say, I had to pull over to cry before I could skulk back home. I will try to be good, but believe me, I am composing the letter I plan to send on the day the OC turns 18.<P>I was really interested in the comment about divorce. I would consider divorcing my H. He is retired and I am entitled to half of his retirement. With child support for our two children (who were first) there wouldn't be too much left. Is that a realistic option?<P>I would also join in contacting my representative. Please tell me more. <P>You all are great! Thanks.<P>

Calamity:<P>Absolutely! To protect your assets and your husband's SS from predatory OW, a 'faux' divorce is just the ticket. Your children would come first and receive the lion's share and the OW would get left overs.<P>The divorce has not negatively effected my husband or me or our marriage. In fact, we are better than ever. We stay close to one another and reassure each other and he is willing to allow me to divorce him to keep me from loosing what little is left. We just continue as we always have. I promised him I would not leave him provided things keep going as they have been for us. he agreed.<P>I am suing the OW for Personal Injury in Texas where the OC was conceived. She has no money, and I don't expect any but it is the prinicple of it all. My attorney is handling this on contingent knowing full well he will not be paid because there is no money, but he wants to start a precedence to change the laws to protect people like you and me from OW's looking for a meal ticket. I will keep you posted as we progress. We're a little stalled right now but should have some momentum built in a couple weeks or so. So, start by writing you representatives.<P>Catnip =^^=<P>

I am so sorry to hear about this 12 yr old being dropped into your life. What is his mother thinking? This is just an obvious attempt at now getting in on the cash cow. She was able to support this child up until now. Geeezzz.. it just gripes me. <P>I am another of the very vocal ones on CS laws. The OW in our case had baby last summer. Her lawyer actually told her that it was to HER advantage for my H and I to stay together, since then my children would not be getting CS and her CS would be larger! Can you beleive that! OW actually told my H that too. So I simply went and filed for CS. My H was in agreement to protect as much income as possible for our sons. I get 33% and then after THAT she gets 20%. But if I hadn't raced to the court house FIRST, well, the my 33% comes after the 20% she gets. It is incredible. Once again, this child never had a lifestyle of living in a family that needed to be protected. My sons lifestyle will suffer, but the law basically says "well that is because you H is stupid and did things to cause them this harm". No one tells the OC that. Just the kids and BS get to suffer both the indignity of all this and then the financial loss also. There goes their vacations. There goes college savings for them. I will still manage to pull vacations & college off for them, but it would be a hell of a lot easier if the $1,000 a month she gets was going in their college fund. <P>My H makes good money. OW knew he was married. She struck the lottery too. It will cost us over $200,000 before this kid turn 18, and that is just at the rate he is paying now. If he gets a raise, she gets more. <P>I am also peeved that my state (TN) struck the Alienation of Affection laws off the books 10 yrs ago. My lawyer basically said that that was old law intended to protect women back whent hey couldn't support themselves. Now that women can support themselves there is no need for that law. I was livid hearing that! So after 10 years of marriage and raising his D by first wife and raising his sons and helping him build a career, all I have the right to do is divorce him and go support my self and raise my sons in a single parent household! What kind of family friendly bullcr-p is that! There is NO respect for families and no law that assists in the presevation of families. If all the OW thought that they could get their butts sued, well maybe some of them would go back where they came from. As I have said before, if she hit my car in a parking lot, I can sue her for damages. But she marches in and starts an affair with a married man who she KNEW had children and puts their home and family life at risk... and there is NOTHING I can do but divorce my H. I cannot take action even on my childrens behalf and sue her for negligence and willfull misconduct. <P>I have sent email to legislative members, but received no response. They don't want to touch this one. I promise you that. They would rather sit around saying that they are "protecting children" with the wonderful CS laws they have on the books. I could scream. I live in the state capital. Maybe I should go start a sit-in on the capital steps. With a BIG picture of the OW and another of my two cute sons and beller out my story. <P>Ok, I am calming down. Normally I try to be a nice person on this board. I just have subjects that make me TYPE IN CAPITALS. <P>Take care. Hang in there and keep posting. You have already had a year under your belt with CS and OW. Hopefully that is the worst of it. Carolyn

calamity, So sorry you had to have this bomb dropped on you. I had to laugh about the highest paid hooker. I asked the ow a while back if she felt like a prositute she said what ya mean he never paid me for sex. I said oh really you get a paycheck every week. It still feels good to have got that one in. I wonder if the sleeze is getting divorced and that is why she is doing this after so many years. They sure are a sick bunch. I dont think they ever think about what this will do there kids when they find out how they were concieved. They probly are not able to think that far ahead.with love flowerseed

<BR>calamity jane,<P>State laws vary in how they calculate CS, and offhand I don't know how MD does it. babstr is also right that some states have the rule that whoever files first wins.<P>You're probably wondering how the laws have gotten us to the point that we essentially reward unwed women to have children by different men. Its a good question.<P>Years ago, especially in conservative areas, lawmakers and some family court judges would deny child support to illegitimate children. These laws and rulings were attacked on equal protection grounds, where the plaintiffs (rightly, IMO) argued that illegitimate children need support as much as children of marriage.<P>Later, starting in the mid 1980s, the federal government began pushing for a uniform system of calculating child support. This was raised in the face of perceived injustices where some noncustodial parents were paying less than other noncustodial parents, even though their incomes were equal. Now, to me that doesn't necessarily indicate injustice, but I confess to believing that all parties should be treated equally. Perhaps one person had higher debt, etc.<P>What arose from this move to standardize child support amounts were the notorious guidelines we see in place today. Originally, the guidelines were to be rebuttable in court, so if a person could demonstrate why the guideline is in error, an adjustment would be made. In practice, this never happens and the guidelines are de facto law. <P>The problem is, the guidelines are based on some very bad assumptions. First of all, state legislatures have adopted the economic fiction that a child of a divorce should not have to endure a lower standard of living. This is tantamount to saying that the mother (who always wins custody) should not have to endure a lower standard of living, for all practical purposes. Why? Well, the guidelines are based on the costs of a single INTACT family, so the underlying fixed costs assumptions are grossly in error. The net effect is that the noncustodial parent must bear the burden of ALL of the fixed costs of the second home, in addition to the income shares portion of the fixed costs on the first home.<P>This substantial fixed cost component is a large part of why the first child in the guidelines costs so much more than later children. The remainder is the notorious "standard of living" component designed to assure that the child enjoys a standard of living commensurate with what would be enjoyed had the marriage not ended. I personally have reservations whether the standard of living component should apply for the illegitimate children of affairs. If you run the numbers, the standard of living component increases rapidly after household incomes exceed $40,000 a year or so. This is why highly paid NCP's get hit with such ridiculously high CS bills. And what's truly remarkable is that there is no accountability for where the CS money (or even just the standard of living component) is spent. I know of no other fiduciary agency where accountability is non-existent. Its truly unique to child support.<P>Btw, the guidelines further ignore the tax implications of the policy enacted, and the tax deduction, child credit, EITC, etc. can amount to many hundred dollars a month of additional income that flows only to the mother, and is not used in calculating income shares.<P>In my view, we should treat all parties equally. CS should be computed considering the number of children that exist, regardless of when they were born, or who filed for CS first. But the courts have made it very clear that we, as a society, are willing to violate equal protection by discriminating against later born children,<BR>specifically the children of second marriages. I'm left concluding that if we are going to discriminate against some children, we would be a lot better off decreasing CS for illegitimate children to the level of bare necessities (i.e., totally eliminating the standard of living component). What we are doing right not is a mockery of marriage, and I think its wrong.<P>Bystander<BR>

I have just read these responses and I feel kind of lucky. My h's cs seems to be low compared to all of your responses. We are in Ga. so I quess the laws are a little different and maybe lower on oc cs. I'm not really sure but when our lawyer told us his cs would be set at 28% because we had the 2 g's they were figured into the settlement someway. It was lower than we thought it would be so we agreed to it. I quess we were fortunate in that respect. We even had it set up so that h paid babysitter instead of ow just to keep her from hetting her hands on it and using for herself. Just to remind you of how greedy she is, we bought all of oc christmas for him. At the time we were unaware of it. H called gp's to see what oc thought about the gifts we had gotten. h asked what else he got and gf told h what we had gotten him was all except for a few things they had gotten for him. Ow claimed she didn't have the money but come to find out she had $250.00 to buy boyfriend a new tool box for his truck. How pathetic can you get. With her there seems to be no limits. I hope that oneday she gets what she deserves. I am affraid it is coming alot sooner than she thinks. Got to go. We are getting reay to pull out for our weekend getaway. Check on everyone when I get back Sunday. I will be thinking of all of you. <BR><P>------------------<BR>lost24