I noticed you were up early today.<BR>I just wanted to see how you are.<BR>Have you gotten any closer to agreement with<BR>your H? <BR>You are in my thoughts and am sending best wishes<BR>your way. Take Care!!!<BR>Hope to talk with you again.

Hi Fluke,<BR>Thanks for asking about me. I get up early every day but don't post too often.<P>As far as my H and I he's adament I should trust him to go to ow to get child. Says A over a long time ago. Says he feels indifferent toward ow. Hates her decision to keep child but cannot turn his back on own flesh and blood.<P>She's due May 1.<BR>We haven't discussed seeing an attorney over what to do. We don't know what she's gonna do.<P>Says it won't interfere with my life.(?)<P>He's on a golf trip w/league till Sunday night.<BR>Parked his work truck here for duration.<BR>We have only established we are miserable without each other. But H said he'd understand if I leave because he doesn't want to ruin my life over this.(?)<P>I am very confused and change my mind 20 times a day on whether to stay and allow him to come home or move on alone.<P>Maybe when the prozac(Sera-fem) kicks in I'll be more stable. Dr. upped it to 20mg. Tuesday.<P>If I focus on him and "us" I want to stay.<BR>If I picture him w/child I still get physically ill....jealous....of a little baby! Then I picture him w/baby and see it non emotionally! I'm f'n crazy!!!<P>We're gonna talk sometime next week. I hope I don't turn into sybill again.<P>I wish I had the grace of cd. Acceptance. I only do sometimes. Other times I wish the nightmare would go away.<P>I still have a long hard road w/birth and dna....ohhhhhh!!!!<P>I'll let you know when I know more Fluke.<P>Debi <P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Gem,<BR>I hope you're doing OK, I know how bad you feel and sometimes wish that I had taken some type of antidepressant when I was at your stage in the game. Fortunately though, it does get better and you WILL be fine. I can't remember if you had ever had counceling with the Harley's, but if not, I would suggest it to get a good idea of what your next step should be. They don't tell you what to do, just offer suggestions and good reasons to back those suggestions up. Is your H totally agains the POJA? Sounds like he is, but hopefully he'll come around. Take care.<BR>Floored

Hi Gem,<P>I understand what you are feeling... <P>Your mind is trying to deal with it from every<BR>perspective it can come up with...and none of it<BR>feels good. That's why so many should not be quick to<BR>judge women in our situation. The circumstances are<BR>somewhat different for all of us. <BR>How can the ow give up her own family to bring yet<BR>another child into the world? I just dont get it.<BR>It must be that our H's are better providers and they<BR>feel this is their free ride. I know for a fact that<BR>if my H had the choice After the Fact then the oc wouldnt<BR>be here today. Your H feels the same but now feels <BR>obligated since the ow's h is out of the picture.<BR>It's obvious he loves you very much - it goes to prove<BR>how heartbreaking this is. It is a f'n nightmare.<BR>At one point I felt that my H should be more concerned<BR>if indeed he had a child out there - but he explained <BR>he looks at it as putting the baby up for adoption.<BR>I think its "easier" for him because the op remains<BR>married with other kids. I wish in your case the ow<BR>stayed with her H and raised the child as their own.<BR>That's what would be best for ALL.<P>I thought I read that the ow lives near you?<BR>The same is true for me. I didnt know at first (after DDay)<BR>but when that came out I really flipped out. So now I<BR>go out of my way to bypass her place, where she used to<BR>work, and where she worked when I found out only to end<BR>up at my H's shop where the thing happened. So I can <BR>never really get away from IT.Just remember you are not alone. <BR>A while ago I scrubbed his office, put family pics up <BR>and a little sign on the door "NO Whores Allowed".<BR>I guess you could say its cathartic. Its still not easy.<P>What if after all this the oc isnt your H? <BR>The op in our lives said "I know exactly who the father is"<BR>unfortunately for you and I its not thier H.<P>I hope the meds ease things for you. Im interested in<BR>that myself.<P>Im always up early too. I've been meaning to ask how<BR>your son was handling this lately. You are in my prayers.<BR>I hope you have a productive discussion with your H next <BR>week. Im sorry you feel so misreable, I wish there were<BR>something I could say to help. Take care Gem<P>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Your H feels the same but now feels <BR>obligated since the ow's h is out of the picture<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Fluke he'd still want to father baby in some way as it's his baby not her h's. <P>He's said so.<BR>I don't know what she tells her 3 kids. 12,8, 7 yrs.<P>I'm sure they miss their dad.<BR>She lives 1/2 mile from us and I see her coming and going like a proud peacock. Saying hello to our common friends knowing they'll tell me. She's a bold ,sassy, spoiled ,rich girl.<P>The only way it wouldn't be my h's is for her to keep being preg. all of may! Or until the last week anyway. She and her H were in a wedding early sept. If she has it late may it'll be his. My h was with her end of july early aug. Can't remember.....Felt sorry for her. she cried...he came...literally!<BR>Just got off the phone w/my mom who was crying and saying she hates to see me in so much agony. Wishes she could make it go away. I hung up and cried after. That felt better.<P>Floored, I have given my reasons not to have him go there.<BR>He puffs like a proud turkey and says he only loves me and would be w/her if he didn't realize what he had all along. <BR>It's not about her (maybe for him) it's about seeing the baby.<BR>He says w/o trust we have nothing.<P>My son is ok w/a few visits a year too. Not really...he said he just turns his mind off to it all.<BR>Now he's angry somewhat with me that dad isn't here. I haven't decided to let him back. Son thinks "love should conquer all" Then ow would know we are still together. With out his truck here last few weeks she knows he's out I'm sure. Well the trucks here while he's gone anyway so let her guess!!!!!<P>I want to let him back...he said he'll be the best H.<BR>Without the baby issue I'd be a lot better now at almost 5 mos. ugh! I honestly don't know what to do minute by minute.<BR>Time to pray again....for God to show me the way I should walk.<P>Read 1st corinthians 4-7. I try now to read THAT every day to see if I can begin to live like that.<P>Debi <P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Gemini1,I feel for your situation. I am so close to the same place as you, although my OW has no husband in the picture. When I did not know of the affair and OC, Husband did try and be a father to OC and had some contact with baby. I found a xmas card from child that OW wrote and in it she wrote: love, daddy. It about killed me. She also wrote a note card to husband saying she knew she needed to let my husband go (back to his family) but they would remain friends and coparent the OC.She actually sent me an email apologizing but stating she saw no reason her innocent child be denied a relationship with her father( my husband) and my kids as her half siblings! I could not imagine her impudence, but when my husband first told me of it all, he originally thought I would accept OC and accept visitation at our home. I could not believe it. I really thought he underestimated my reaction to OC and the threat of it all. Do I think he would reconnect with OW? I do not think so, she emailed me she "learned her lesson" and would not rekindle relationship with my H as they coparent, but why would I believe her? Further, even if that is true, I told my husband continued contact with OC is so threatening to the integrity and safety and security of our life and our kids' lives I cannot do it,regardless of how he felt about it. I cannot even deal with him having contact with OC himself, without my involvement, because again it is him in a life separate from us,a nd that is how this mess all started. AT first he was furious, and we realized in therapy divorce may be our only option. After a lot of my tears in therapy, I think my H finally understood the pain he caused me,and the child is painful for me. I cannot deal with OC, and I do not think you should feel bad for having similar feelings. It is damn tough to accept, and I cannot imagine telling my kids about their half-sister. My husband thought they would "understand" and I could not believe it. I think my husband was in some state of denial of the effects of this, and only when he saw how I reacted, how it affected m y health,how I lost 10 pounds in 1 week did he even start to see the damage he was continuing to do with me. I am sorry.Although I can see his need to see OC, our therapist actually wondered if that indeed was meeting his needs and maybe not even the OC's. She actually suggested that in this awful circumstance, having no contact with OC may be best for OC too, as well as for us. My husband discounted that, saying CPS at paternity hearing gives you info on how fathers are important on being involved in kids' lives, but she said, that does not take into account this type of situation.Anyway, right now he claims he will not have any contact ever with OC-for me. I do not know if he will resent me for this in future, he may,but right now he says he won't and I hope that is true. WE go to therapy again on Friday, and I am hoping he has not changed his mind again. I know he is conflicted about OC, but as i told him, to have me accept his contact with her is more than I can do. I was prepared to enter divorce even after 25 years marriage if he persued it. I think us betrayed spouses cannot be expected to do more than we are doing, and right now justgetting through the day is tough. I am here for you gemini, I hope your husband comes to his senses, as I hope mine continues to do so.

ISB you are totally correct in stating how similar our problems are.<BR>My H said "no contact" at a family counsel session in early January. Then he changed and always had a look of anguish on his face.<BR>A few weeks ago he hit me with how he can't turn his back on his baby. How it didn't ask to be born.<P>We talked at great length and I said he could see it a few times a year but we need a go between. Now I think he thinks that is too hard and may upset ow! He said she'll have all the control.<P>Through all of this he's come to the conclusion if I leave him he deserves it and won't be causing me any more pain. It's like the 27 yr marriage means nothing compared to his wishes to father this child.<P>I am truly experiencing the pain of the A all over again. That the child will take over my H and I lose. No matter what.<P>I read your posts and think it is me 4 1/2 mos. ago. When H got comfortable w/me and "us" he told me of desire to father C. I agreed to a point. Then he overstepped the boundaries.<P>I am scared to read birth in the paper. I check each night to see. It could happen any time , it's her 4th.<P>I'll be ok in a long, long while and then I'll be an old maid. That's how I see my future if I don't accept his wishes. Old and alone. Marriage vows meaning nothing.<P>OHHHHHH!!!!<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Dear Gem,<P>I didnt mean to imply that I know why your H feels the<BR>way he does, heck I dont even know what mine thinks some<BR>of the time. I just thought maybe with the other H out<BR>of the picture he felt more obligated. Its such an<BR>awful situation. I hope I dont say anything that will<BR>cause more grief. <BR>My problem is I keep thinking as if these ow have the same<BR>conscience as I do. I just cant find answers to why they<BR>would WANT to cause so much turmoil. <BR>Again, I hope you know that I wish the best for you.<BR>When my H first told me he said alot of stupid things.<BR>Immediatley he said well I'll have to have his last name<BR>changed to ours...over my dead body I said. <BR>Then there were a few weeks that he tried to sugarcoat <BR>it hoping I wouldnt take it so hard. I also feel that<BR>he underestimated the horrible impact this would have on<BR>us. He sees now what it has done. <BR>I know this waiting in limbo is horrible for you.<BR>Its good that you are praying for guidance - it does work.<BR>Thank goodness you have a supportive mom and sister too.<BR>I hope your H will reevaluate his decision.<BR>Love, Donna

Dear gem,<BR>I am not posting much at the moment - mainly lurking because I have a lot of family stuff going on (grandmother in the hospital, injured son, etc.). But I read how you wished you were more like me in having grace about the situation. Good grief. I am a freaking lunatic half of the time. The only reason that I am not exactly where you are at is that my h has never felt compelled to do ANYTHING regarding oc without my consent/approval. He has no big desire to play daddy to oc unless I am willing to go along with it. If he was pushing for oc visits and expecting me to tolerate him seeing ow-even if it was just to pick up oc- I would be reacting much worse than you are. I am afraid that if he said that I should be ok with him seeing oc, I would just go ballistic. "Acceptance" is easy for me because my h is willing to play it any way that I want. so I have all the choices regarding whether or not we pursue visitation. That makes a world of difference. I just wanted to let you know that I think you are doing far better than i would in your circumstances.<P>I think that you will do mmuch better once 20 mg of prozac is coursing through your veins! And, I think you are being completely reasonable in expecting your h to put your needs and your marriage first. He needs to get his priorities straight. I don't know what made my h get his priorities straight - the grace of God, I guess.<P>Anyway, just wanted to let you know I think you are doing super, given the circumstances. <BR>with love,<BR>cd

Gem., I am with you. I know our situations sound so similar, and I envy the women who post here whose husbands want no contact with OC. I want my husband to be in that category, after all, had abortion or adoption occurred, he would have been in that place too. I am still hurting, wrote my husband a long letter telling him I do not know when I will heal from this, I think the only thing worse that could happen in my life would be having something serious happen to my kids or their death. I think my h is slowly getting how hard this is for me,a nd will continue to be. I told him in letter that I may never feel for him what I once did, but I am trying to get back with him, because the thought of being angry and sad for the rest of my life is equally unbearable. I am staying for now because our children deserve an intact home despite the mistake their father did.But if he becomes like your husband, and down the road changes his mind about the OC, I may have to leave him, although how I would explain that to our kids I do not know.As I remember your son is 21 and he can't accept what father did, how does my h think our kids ages 8 and 4 would accept it? I think these men really confuse responsibility/obligation with true love and where their priorities should be first. Even the therapist asked my h why wasn;t he begging and groveling to see what he needed to do to keep me in marriage, and at first he said he had to live with himself too and not being a father to OC would damage him in 10 years too. He said that in therapy session, she said she understood but then said then you are looking at possible separation and divorce, as I was adamanat about no contact. I do not think he really would consider no contact if he did not see how convicted I am about this, although he knows I do not want divorce either and it would be extremely painful for me to break up our family. I feel his desire and needs to have a relationship with another, and the OW desire to keep child, now must take a back seat to our healing, and giving up child must happen for him to have any life with us.We go to our next therapy tomorrow, I will fill you in to see if he still is saying no contact. Good luck to you.

thanks cd. How did you come to WANT visits? If I could erase that I'd heal. I'm only agreeing to visits because he's in so much turmoil over this and I want to help him.<P>But in denying my WAY of doing things is killing me. He really thinks because HE says A is over I shouldn't worry.<P>Also I'm scared it'll escalate to him wanting more and more time w/child. I think he is thinking I will love C too.<P>At this time I don't want ANYTHING to do w/C.<P>I wonder why I'm willing to take so much just to stay married?<BR>Only thing I can tell you is when we spend time together it is wonderful. I can't see starting over ever.<P>Yes, what is wrong w/these women keeping a married mans child who begged her not to? Then the H's just go because they feel sorry. Like the statement...."the baby didn't ask to be born" That to me is pity. Forced fatherhood.<P>Fluke I know what you meant. I'm not angry.<BR>Thanks for checking in on me in the first place. I needed to unload.<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....<p>[This message has been edited by gemini1 (edited April 05, 2001).]

Dear gem,<BR>In answer to your question about how I came to WANT visits with the oc:<P>To be very very (painfully) honest, I guess I have to say that it was originally just because ow told my h something when she first found out she was pregnant that ticked me off. She said, "You can see oc anytime you want, but your wife will never ever be allowed to see our baby." And I thought, "like hell!" so in the beginning, I have to admit that it was mostly just to show ow that she didn't have as much control over the situation as she liked to think she did. Not the purest of motives, I admit. but, I did really become fond of oc in the short time we had with her, so my motives this time around are a little more on the up and up.<P>Also, I have to admit that it was a relief for me to see oc. i'm the sort who can take just about anything that I know about. But the unknown is horrifying. For me it was much easier to deal with the oc of reality than to deal with the oc in my imagination. Does that make any sense at all? I guess I also needed to see for myself how h would react to seeing oc. I had terrible nightmares about him seeing oc and deciding right then and there that he would rather be with her and ow than with us. going together to visitation laid those concerns right to rest.<P>Also, I gotta say again that i wouldn't be able to handle visitation at all if h was pushing for it without my consent. I am very secure in knowing that if i said i didn't want to see oc, he would NEVER pressure me into doing it, and he would NEVER suggest visitation without me present. My h is COMPLETELY committed to us doing things as a team unit. That makes it so much easier for me to be "accepting" of the situation. I feel very blessed that my h is sticking true to the POJA, even though he's never really read about it, per se.<P>I am probably so stubborn that if my h INSISTED on this visitation, I would most likely say no to any of it. But since he is willing to play it any way I want to, I am ok with it. I am pig-headed and stubborn, I know, but I have always been that way. H knew that when he married me.<P>I sure hope your h comes around and realizes that the only way to work things out is to be fully committed to the POJA. <P>Praying for you, gem.<P>cd<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Praying for you, gem.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Thanks so much cd. I appreciatr your honesty.<P>I know if I didn't agree to some sort of visits H would do it on his own. He feels that strong about not turning his back on his flesh and blood.....no matter who the mother was. He's told me. It hurts. He tells me he will make it work. All the control...you know? Just trust him....he loves me.<P>I'm so mixed up I've been in a daze this week. <P>BTW the prozac is calming me but my thoughts are still horrible. My fear of birth of C is almost shutting down my breathing. I don't want H here when I read it for fear of my reaction....then again I want him here so he doesn't go to the hospital. He said he's not but who knows if he's not here?<P>I'm really messed up and was hoping by now I'd be calmer....3 1/2 weeks on prozac. 20 mgs. started on Tues....4 days....makes me tired too. A tired messed up woman. <BR>I'll check in later.<BR>Thanks to all who try to help.<BR>It's like death...I have to do this alone...eh?<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Hi Gem,<P>It's a quiet morning so far,kids went to bed late.<P>Just letting you know that you are not completely alone.<BR>I keep you in my thoughts during the day, as do so many<BR>caring people here.<P>Im sending all the positive kharma i have your way!<BR>sorry, its not much...<P>Have you considered getting out of town for a couple<BR>weeks? I know it doesnt change anything but may give<BR>you some relief.<BR>Take Care.fluke

Fluke, I have considered it but have no one to go with who would be lots of fun.<BR>My mom wants to take me to a resort up near lake erie for a weekend this june when it's warmer.<BR>I don't want to make plans yet as I think it'll be during the worst of everything...dna ...etc....<P>It's like I'm petrified to make a move one way or the other.<P>I feel sad thinking H will have a seperate life going at the same time he's with me. Have I said he's a contractor? It would give him plenty of opportunity to visit the baby when ever he felt if ow agrees. I fear it'll be that way. Maybe not....but if she says come anytime...it will.<P>I'm also scared it'll be a boy and she will name it after my H. Her other boy is named after her H.<P>I'm scared what it will do to my son if his parents want to see it. He is the first grandchild on both sides. He's very close to H's parents and has gone to them for comfort through all of this. If they see and accept C over a period of time it'll break my son's heart. I know it will.<P>Honey the unknown is slowly diminishing my ability to feel anything. I know God wants us to live a day at a time. I wish I could feel his arms around me more at this time.<P>Maybe like the prayer "footprints" he's carrying me at this time as I only see one set of footprints.<P>Thankyou Fluke.<P>I read your story under tigger's thread.<P>How awful.....all of our h's had no self control.<P>Mine said it as a joke to ow to call if her h gave her any more grief.(he was doing an addition at her house). He said she called and it flattered him so much...he gave in.<P>Oh well... I think I could never do that but who knows? I never flirt....I do now but I still don't like the attention when all is said and done.<P>Talk to you soon.....thanks again.<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

FOR MY H AND I HE TOLD THE OW THAT HE IS STAYING WITH HIS WIFE AND FAMILY AND WOULD TAKE CARE OF THE CHILD/AND GET HER EVERY OTHER WEEKEND IF IT IS HIS. THE REASON WHY I DIDN'T DENY THAT WAS BECAUSE H AND I DIDN'T WANT HER TO TAKE H TO COURT FOR CS.H TOLD HER HE WOULD GIVE HER A SET AMOUNT EVERY MONTH WHICH IS LIKE $225.00. YOU ALL CAN DECIDE WHAT YOU CAN AFFORD ALSO AND PRESENT IT TO HER. SO BY H TELLING HER HE WOULD TAKE CARE OF THE CHILD SHE HAD NO PROBLEM WITH THAT. DON'T GET ME WRONG IT HURTS LIKE H*** AND I STILL CRY SOMETIMES BUT I CAN'T LET THIS OW THINK SHE IS GOING TO WIN.AND BY YOUR HUSBAND INCLUDING YOU IN ALL DECISIONS IT EASE SOME OF THE PAIN.<BR>WHAT WORKED FOR ME KNOWING THAT H WANTED NOTHING TO DO WITH OW. TELL HIM IN ORDER FOR YOU TO HAVE A PEACE OF MIND AND NOT GO CRAZY AND WORK ON YOUR MARRIAGE THEIR ARE SOME THINGS YOU WOULD LIKE HIM TO DO FOR YOU BEFORE AND AFTER DELIVERY:SOMETIMES I FEEL JEALOUS OF THIS CHILD BUT THEN I THINK SHE IS ONLY HERE FOR THE WEEKEND.WHEN WE GET THE OC FOR THE WEEKEND MY H DOES EVERYTHING FOR HER(SHE IS 4 MONTHS)HE CHANGES HER DIAPER,BATHES HER,FEED HER, GET UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT EVERYTHING US MOMS DO I MAKE SURE HE DOES THEM FOR HER. I TOLD HIM HE WENT OUT THEIR AND MADE HER SO YOU TAKE CARE OF HER AND TO ME THIS TEACHES H THAT I AM NOT PLAYING STEPMOM YET NOT UNTIL I CAN COMPLETELY LOOK AT THIS CHILD AS A STEPDAUGHTER BECAUSE NOW SHE IS MY H DAUGHTER.<P>1. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES WILL YOU BE AT THE HOSPITAL AT TIME OF BIRTH.<BR>2. ONCE TEST HAS BEEN DONE LET H TELL THE OW THAT HE WILL TAKE CARE OF THE CHILD AND THEIR IS NO NEED TO TAKE HIM FOR CS.<BR>3. IF YOU AND YOUR H ARE GOING TO ACCEPT THIS CHILD YOU AND YOUR H NEED TO DECIDE HOW OFTEN YOU WILL GET THE CHILD AND WHEN H TELLS HER WHAT THE TWO OF YOU DECIDED THAT LET'S HER KNOW THAT HE IS NOT LEAVING HIS WIFE.<BR>4. WHEN TIME TO PICK UP/DROP OFF CHILD YOU AND H GO.IT IS GOING TO BE PAINFUL BUT IN TIME IT WILL HEAL. AND IT WILL GIVE YOU A LITTLE PEACE OF MIND KNOWING THAT IT IS REALLY OVER BETWEEN THEM.<P>THIS ONLY APPLIES IF THE MOM DOESNOT GIVE YOU ALL A HARD TIME ONCE CHILD IS HERE.<P><BR>

Sweet C you are truly a generous woman.<P>I won't have a baby here.<P>We have a "baby free" home as our son is 21.<P>H isn't going to hospital. Never planned to.<P>He called me from his golf trip and said he doesn't want a divorce and he loves me and wants to "work something out".<P>I told him I stand firm on after dna proves him bio-dad, He can see C 3rd party visits only. Never go to her house. Our priest said he'd be go beteeen.<P>I can only put up w/a few visits a year. After all his big kahuna was to have C know who he was. I do not want him to co-parent a child w/ow no matter how he feels about her.<P>The child brings only sadness to all involved. More contact than that would be like I lived w/a man who had a whole other life.<P>It is not a child of divorce and I don't want him involved as if it were.<BR>C doesn't know anything yet and has 3,1/2 siblings, a mom, and a grandma....that's going to have to be good enough. My son and I want nothing to do w/C.<P>C isn't only innocent here....we are too.<P>H said he agreed w/what I said but doesn't know what to do.<P>I am prepared to divorce him if he continues to want to father the C. <P>It would bring me more pain in the long run.<P>I'll keep you posted.<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Dear Gem,<BR>It is amazing to me that both your h and the priest can't see that 3rd party visits would be extremely detrimental to both you and the oc. What are they thinking?<P>How much kinder for all involved if your h would just realize the damage he would be doing to your marriage AND to the child's psyche by playing "daddy" like that.<P>Please don't think that I am emphasizing the child's well-being over yours - really I am not at all. But SOMEBODY should point out to him that the only "needs" he would be fulfilling is his own, and I doubt he could even accomplish that satisfactorily.<P>He is certainly not thinking about your best interests or the child's best interests. <P>I think your priest has a couple of screws loose. Couldnt you have h talk to a child psychologist about this? Surely somebody ought to be able to point out to him how stupid he is being, thinking that once in a while visits would help the kid in any way.<P>And somebody ought to be able to point out to him that his PRIMARY concern is the marriage. The baby isn't even born yet for heaven's sake! Nor has it been proven that it is his child! <P>I am sorry but I just feel like coming over and boxing your h's ears for putting you through this.<P>Or giving him a swift kick to the derrier. <P>with love,<BR>cd

Good Morninig Gem!<P>I've been wondering how you are...<P>Glad to hear that your h never planned on being<BR>at hospital for birth...and that he called while he<BR>was away telling you how much he didnt want a divorce.<P>If only he could see that in the long run it may be<BR>better if he didnt have contact. I know its a hot<BR>issue whether or not the fathers should be completely<BR>involved in the oc life - everyone's circumstances need<BR>to be taken into account, because there is not ONE clear<BR>answer for any of us. We have to do what is right for<BR>our own, first! The ow can figure out how to raise<BR>the children since ultimately it was her choice.<P>Just want you to know I'm sending you a hug!<BR>I've been meaning to ask you about your surgery-<BR>I'm interested though my H says Im fine, I've always<BR>wished I could keep my Nursing breasts!!! <BR>Congratulations on doing what you need to do for you!<P>Take care!fluke<P>Hi Cdcollins,<P>Hope your little boy and granny are getting better!<BR>They are in my prayers.<BR>Take care!

Gem,<BR>Relieved to hear h called you. Maybe me and c.d could get together and both come over she has just echoed what I have felt like doing for some time. About 3 more weeks isnt it and hopefully one way or the other you can get some answers more clearly as to what h is thinking. Hows the weather been there? We are in for some possible tornados this afternoon. I have got to batten down the hatches. It was 70 here last Sun the warmer weather really seems to help if you can get outside and get your mind off things for a least a little while. <P>c.d., How is your little boys wrist doing? I have been thinking about your family and wasnt sure if you said and I just missed it. <BR> <BR> with love flowerseed