I posted about my fight with H over his cell phone, and now he is talking about moving out over this issue. I am so mad, upset, hurt - If I didn't have kids to take care of I think I would just get in my car and drive as far away as I could where nobody knows me so I could just disappear! I'm so tired of feeling hurt, of crying, of feeling betrayed. Why is it that the people who have the affairs and the OC expect SO MUCH from their spouses, but don't feel like they have to do anything uncomfortable or that they don't agree with to earn back the trust in the relationship. My H can be so stubborn, and so set on doing things his way. Did I agree that he should have an affair? Sleep with another woman when the kids and I thought he was working? Buy her gifts that he has never bought me? Destroy my self esteem? Forget to wear a condom - did I agree that that was a good idea? Getting her pregnant - I don't remember agreeing to any of those things. But if he doesn't agree to something that I feel I need - TOO BAD FOR ME. THis whole thing is so unfair. AS much as I want my marriage and my family, I am beginning to feel a lot of the anger return that I thought I was getting under control. Maybe it's because he is acting like he doesn't care about my needs/feelings. Having an affair is such a selfish act - do you think those people will always be selfish? Do you think that they will always have that capacity to hurt others without taking their feelings into consideration? Sorry for the long vent. I'm having a bad night and I just want to run away from my life so badly right now. I never realized how devastating an affair could be until I experienced this. It's so hard to imagine somebody hurting you so badly, and then not wanting to do whatever they could to help you feel better. I don't understand human nature. I wish I was never exposed to this ugly side of life.

fortheboys,
I completely understand the need to run! To just get in the car and go! But where? Ya know? It's such a feeling that happens to most of us when we are beyond frustrated!

Now I'm gonna sound like a broken record but....call the Harleys if you can and ask H to participate with you. He may not be willing, but ask.

They can help you so much with these issues.

Honestly he may be tired of it all. Ow may be driving him crazy. YOU may be driving him crazy too.

What I mean is to learn to negotiate in a calm manner.

Although if your H is willing to move over you wantingthe code for his cell and is serious,he may well be hiding something from you.

ALL CONTACT MUST CEASE to begin to rebuild your marriage.

If he moves then planB. It will be so hard to do. It will save any love you have for him and allow him to see life without YOU!

Prayers to you at this awful time in your life.

Calmly ask him if having the code to his cell is making him so uncomfortable that he'd leave home and is that what he wants?

Then call the Harleys!

love
Debi

Thanks for the advice Debi - I looked up how to contact the Harleys but their fees are very high - way more than we can afford right now with all the mess going on with OW. I just agot a collection notice from a law firm b/c my H is not paying all the bills on time (sending her $ every month is taking its toll on our finances). The joys of this wonderful life. You hit of my fear too - if he is willing to move out over this, is he hiding something or is it that he can't deal with the stress. I don't know and I don't want to be made a fool of anymore. I trusted my H with my life, never lied to him, kept every marriage vow I made in front of God and our family - and he threw me away without any consideration for my feelings or what this would do to our family and our children. Now he won't even talk to me, and says he will move out when he gets home in a few days. How can he care so little about my feelings? IF this is truly who he is, then maybe it is better if he leaves. But to make his phone and his privacy more important than me and his kids after everything he has done to hurt us? This is really scaring me and making me wonder who he really is. My fear all along has been that he will hurt me again. Although he says he sees how hurt I am and he would never do that to me again, he does things like this that still hurt me so much when I am still so insecure and vulnerable. I am tired of being hurt. I don't even remember what it feels like to be in a relationship without all this hurt, turmoil, mistrust. I used to feel so confident in myselft and my relationship with my H. Now I'm jealous of everyone around me because I know they don't worry about the OW, the A, the OC, if their husband would rather be with someone else, who is going to call him, who wants a part of him, etc. I want to feel that confidence that he is MINE and know that I don't ever have to worry about it. That is gone, because he gave himself to someone else - while I was home trying to work on our relationship by myself! Why couldn't he do this before we had kids - if our marriage meant so little to him at least then I could run away from my life and disappear, at least for a while. Sometimes this life is just too hard. I had a good life before. I didn't ask for this. Whether we stay together or not, my good life is over. My life from now on will be full of hardship and hurt, and my heart will be broken. I really am rambling now. It would be easy if I didn't love my H so much, but I do. And despite all this, I see so much good in him. He is such a good father to our kids, and he was a good H befor he got involved with this woman (he started treating me like crap from the time he started seeing her and our relationship went downhill from there). Thanks to anyone who had the fortitude to stick it out and read my whole rambling session - guess I could use a good counseling session about now, or a good friend (who knows about this situation - unfortunately nobody does) and a BIG bottle of wine.

fortheboys,
I feel for you.
If your H no longer wants to communicate with you about this it is better he moves before you lose all love for him.

Believe me, although my H acted remorseful, he was still keeping secrets. Although the physical A was long over we had to deal with impending oc birth. It was a truly hard time for us both.

This was when H moved out after revealing the A. On d-day no less, as he thought I'd want it that way. I never had a clue he was moving.

H moved home 3 weeks later, you know Christmas and all coming up. I received diamond earrings that year and was sure we'd overcome this. Well that's when he started not wanting to give me the codes and I couldn't understand it.

It came up in counseling sessions and he'd say he didn't want me hurt further when ow would call at whim. He would hang up on her cell calls, but I wondered if he was calling back (he was).

So after moving home in December, I asked him to leave in late March. He was reluctant. He moved out. I was a basket case for weeks. Oc was born in late April. H became a basket case, calling me and sweet talking me. I hired a divorce attorney and didn't tell him.

I was prepared to start a new life as I was so sick of it all.

H moved home unannounced in mid-May. Begged me to reconsider. Said he's do anything. I still saw the attorney. She said to stick around to see if H was serious and I did.

He did everything from that day on, pretty much, to make me start to trust him again. It took a long long time!

My long winded point is, plan B may be a necessary thing at this point if your H is still protecting/ talking to ow.

If he moves out do all your talking through a third party who is willing to help. Set up dates and times when he'll see children before he moves. Keep it simple and you stay a strong lady!

Plan B will let your H see life without you and allow you to start doing things for yourself.

Prayers sweetie. Vent here whenever. We hear you.

love
Debi

Oh my FTB, do you sound like me!! Actually, me and a friend of mine who has been through the same stupid crap. You're like our soul sista!! My stupid H had a 3 yr long A with someone 11 yrs older than him (and me) and their OC (now 3 mths old) is her 4th child, 3rd daddy. She's a real winner. She doesn't even work - and was on medicaid and decided to get pregnant by MY H!!! The whole thing grosses me out and I HATE HER! I'm sure you feel the same. And believe me...I'm starting to collect the corks from all the wine bottles I've gone through in the past 3 yrs - I should send you the instructions on how to make a really nice wreath out of the corks like I'm doing! ha ha! (not funny really, eh?) No, I'm not an alcoholic. Just a "nice girl" like you who put 200% into her marriage, believed in the vows I took and can't imagine ever lying to my spouse - just like you. Three years later, I finally found the courage to stand up for myself and tell him - EITHER HER OR ME by filing for divorce. Now it's all up to him - I don't have to make the decision anymore. He's got 60 days (we don't have kids.) Don't get me wrong - it was the hardest thing (as maybe you've read from my other postings) BUT as I've mentioned before - I finally feel a little respect for myself!! I think that's what you need ... do something for YOURSELF for once. STAND UP for yourself! Part of my problem with being so upset and crying all the time was that I think I was ashamed of myself for putting up w/ the crap for 3 f'n years. And it's horrible of them to put this kind of pressure on us - having to make a decision on something we did not ask for, didn't want, don't believe in. But ... you can't change it now - the worst is over, right? D-day was the worst, right? Now the choice is up to him. If he wants to be STUPID and leave - let him go!! It'll be hard, but you'll come to a point where you don't care b/c you'll be SO sick of dealing with the OW crap, Private Investigator crap (I know you know what I'm talking about) that you'll just say HER OR ME like I did. Believe me...it gets better...it really does. Neither H or OW can control you or your feelings or your life. Only you can, right? Sorry...I know I might sound a little cocky, but I just filed for D last week and it feels a bit liberating finally. He's squirming and was SHOCKED that I finally had the the balls to do something about it. Now of course he's crying his eyes out about wanting to "come home". ha ha! I'll let him have that stupid loser wh*re!!! I know I'm better than her - as are you! I can tell. Stay strong honey!! I'll keep my eye on you.

ShouldItry,
Slow down and do not do anything you'll regret later.

Wait at least 6 months before you allow a divorce.

Your H may well want you and you should read everything here to help that happen if you want it to.

Please just take it slow.

This is a horrendous thing to have happened but you can still calm down and deal and read and talk!

Prayers to you. Your anger is so new. Please give it time.

Now I may have posted before I read your story so I'll go do it now!

Debi

Gemini - Thanks for taking the time to respond to me. I'm feeling less angry today, now I'm just totally depressed. This isn't the same as sitting on the couch and talking, but I guess the computer will have to do. I feel so alone in all of this. This board helps a lot, and I do see a therapist, but nobody else knows - so who do you talk to? Everyone would think it was crazy anyway. I'm so tired of feeling insecure and being suspicious and untrusting. I wish my H would do the things I need to rebuild the trust in our relationship. He said something the other night that made me so upset. I told him that I thought eventually all contact with OW should end, and he said then that means I can't have contact with OC. I said no, you can have contact, but OW doesn't need to call you and talk to you about what is going on in their life. We could talk through a third person or a lawyer. He said that you have to look at this like an ex-wife situation - I would have to talk to her to see my child. I was so mad. He doesn't even see the difference! I told him that would be a legitimate, moral relationship - under God. An affair is immoral, sick, hurts everyone - no resemblance to a marriage and she will not be treated like that. He just doesn't see the full extent of everything he has done. To me, that woman is nothing more than a whore who wormed her way into my marriage. She know from day 1 my H was married, gave him her phone # first, and made him feel like it was OK to be friends - that he was "safe" for her to be friends with since he was married with kids and she was so beautiful that most men hit on her. What a joke.
ShouldItry - Sorry for your situation - I of course understand and sympathise. You are lucky you don't have kids - at least you don't have to worry about what effect all of this will have on your kids, how it will affect them, if it will ruin their childhood, if they will grow up to treat women the same disrepectful way their father did, etc? And if the OC comes into our life, will they they be jealous? Will they act out and become defiant? Will they hate us? Will they be embarrased to have their friends over because they don't want to have to explain who Daddy's other child is (how does a kid explain to their friends that their Dad had an affair, screwed another woman while married to their MOM, and now here's another kid)? Will my kids feel like they are not good enough, because Dad left us for another woman and had a daughter? Will their hearts break inside everytime they see him hug this girl, who shouldn't even be here except that Daddy was screwing around when he was supposed to be working? I could go on, but I'm sure you get the picture. Thanks for letting me vent a little.

FORTHEBOYS

I really do feel what you are feeling. I found out 11 months ago about my h oc, and I am still having a hard time. One day I am ok and the next day I just dislike him so much. I don't really know what to tell you, but to just keep praying.

FORTHEBOYS,
I know exactly what you are feeling and it has been 2 1/2 years since my D-Day. The only difference was that my husband's OC was 15 1/2 years old and he had never met her until this point, yet he was in the fog so deep after spending HOURS long distance on the phone to the OW after all these years, he couldn't see the pain it was causing in our lives either. He just kept using the excuse that since he and the OC had never met, the OW would have to be the mediator in every thing that went on, until she (THE OW) was comfortable that the OC could be worked into OUR family in the right way. But the OW had another agenda the entire time and by the time it was over, the OW had played all her cards and my husband still stayed with us, his existing family, forcing the OW to cease ALL contact on behalf of the OC. The OW said that it would be my husband's punishment for not choosing her. But it did all come down to this because I forced my husband's hand to realize how AWFUL this situation was on our then 16 year old son.....he had to face the fact that not only did his father screw around on his mother, his mother was 8 months pregnant with him at the time, so he feels to this day that his father went out on both of us. And our son wasn't about to begin to have to explain this situation to ANYONE.......NO ONE he knows has an inkling that our family is a Jerry Springer show in the background. Our son said that he had NO sister, NEVER would have a sister unless his REAL 2 parents conceived her. So, I went to bat in this situation more for this 16 year old boy who had to become a man overnight to deal with this mess his father created. And I still stand by my decision of making my husband see that he had to choose, he couldn't have both......yes, I was an adult and I was willing to try some visitation with this semi-adult OC, but after seeing the havoc that it wreaked on one of my children, I wasn't about to tolerate anymore, or what impact it would have on our son who was 8 at the time. And he is still totally clueless to this day about anything except Mommy and Daddy argued alot for awhile. I dread the day that this horrible huge skeleton falls out of the closet for his sake, but we all know dirty family secrets have a way of rearing their ugly heads no matter how much you try and hold them down. Look at my example, my husband kept this OC a secret from EVERYONE he knew for 15 1/2 years......but it eventually came out.
And I won't tell you that I still don't have days that are HORRIBLE because it just suddenly hits me in the gut what this man did to us and me personally. It was definitely one of Dr. Phil's life altering moments, to say the least. There is no way to explain to anyone the pain that drives clear to the bone, nor the fact that you carry it with you forever, even if it does fade somewhat with time. And I don't know if I will ever quit looking over my shoulder to see if "THEY" are in the picture....because the last thing the OW said to me was that "she'd wait another 15 years, but she'd be back again." I just hope and pray that NEITHER the OW or the OC ever try to enter our lives again.
And as to running away, yes, that was my first, middle, and last instinct.......and to run fast. But then I realized that no matter how fast or far I could run, that the reason that I had run would always be there; so I chose to stay and see what would happen. And yes, my husband has learned a valuable lesson and I know that he never realized this would cause so much pain, and he is committed to our relationship 150%, but I am still not to the point of being able to say that 150% will ever be enough to make up for all that has transpired. So, FORTHEBOYS, it just takes TIME, TIME, TIME, and lots and lots of it. I wish you the best with how you decide to handle your situation and like all the rest here on this board, I pray for you and yours......
Deltamoon

We're three years into recovery and yesterday I was im'ed by the OW in regards to her having to take OC to the doc's. (More money that we don't have down the drain---and this is after Lee Lee and I got over the flu!)

I am in a foul mood, because even with NC, this crap will never go away.

Sooooooo, hey....I'll try to get my truck to work and I'll swing by and pick you up FTB and we'll ride off somewhere.....Thelma and Louise style...(only we won't drive off a cliff and we'll change some things!)

Anyone else wanna come along for the ride? The wind feels good in my hair! Who brought the drinks? Oops...drinking and driving don't mix....we'll just get Mr."T" to get rid of the ticket for us when I get home...."IF" I get home....muahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaa

While we're dreaming of running away....where are we going to?

Hugs,
Twiisty

fortheboys,
I was in counseling post d-day but talking to my sister, my Mom, H's Mom, and a couple of friends.

No one told me to leave. Everyone supported me in wanting to work things through.

My H was not having contact after plan B. That was 6 months past d-day and a few weeks after oc arrived.

H pretty much was saying things your H is saying and I always felt the words were coming from an alien! H WAS an alien during and shortly after the A.

When I found out he was still talking to ow on occassion, I felt he really didn't want me, but everything....oc, marriage...selfish thinking. I had to plan B and it was terrible at first! I had a small army of supporters which helped me out.

Got a new job, felt more confident about myself, went out socially a few times and it made my H insane when he found out! Saw a lawyer to file for D.

See my H had to decide HIS next move as the ball was in his court. I simply wanted honesty. No more lies and he finally "got it".

Once his actions supported his words of wanting us versus all else, we came together in a calmer way and became re-united. We faced the situation together making decisions together. I felt safer and H became himself again.

We shared again. Unafraid to talk again.

So, FTB, all contact must stop before you'll gain any ground together. This is not an e-wife thing. I feel your H is still in the fog, as we here at MB call it. He needs to make a decision and quit acting as he did during the A, having everything the way HE wants it.

Remember, plan A only until you can no longer take the situation. Plan B before you lose all love for H and to help start concentrating on yourself and YOUR life.

Prayers sweetie.

Now Twiisty, so happy to see you back, I'll go for that ride with you!

Leave LeeLee home for a couple of hours and we'll take a drive to the beach, soak up some sun and have a few pina coladas! You look great in that black string bikini!

At sun down we'll grab a quick dinner then head back home fat and happy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Not too fat, just right is good!

We'll take a limo. No tickets allowed!

love
Debi